-It's Wednesday, June 5th, 2013.
This is The 404 Show on CNET.
I'm Jeff Bakalar.
-I'm Justin Yu.
-I'm Aunt Jill.
-I'm Ariel NuÃ±ez.
-Welcome to the program.
-You know, I like it when I say--
-You know, I like it when I say Aunt Jill, you smile.
-He just smiles like a little kid.
He's like that's [unk] Aunt on the show.
-It's like a show and tell.
-I love it.
-For a kindergartner.
-I'm so glad to be here, you know, it's just my third day back from vacation.
-I'm a little foggy, amazed, I didn't feel any jet lag at all and then this morning I woke up and like, little foggy today.
-So, this should be an interesting show.
I know-- you know, jet lag is like one of those weird things where you just don't feel like yourself.
-You know, it's amazing that--
-It's like my junior year of college.
Like you're experimenting.
I didn't know, I would feel like--
-You were just experimenting.
You were young.
-It's just a different experience.
actually-- when I came back from my trip to China, I remember saying to Wilson, "How long is it gonna take me to adjust?" and he looked at me, he's like, "Not gonna be good."
-And it took me-- I'm not kidding you, it took me three weeks to like feel like myself.
Three weeks just seems crazy because a lot of people do--
-major international traveling like that.
-And it wasn't bad when I went over there that time.
So, my flight there was not bad.
So, I went to Europe and you know, it's crazy because we went there and we traveled overnight.
I woke up-- I felt pretty good.
-Because I slept on the plane.
-You know why?
-Because you went to Italy in a mattress.
-I went to Italy and Jeff, before the show is totally making fun of me, 'cause he said, "Well, you know, what do you mean?
How did you like sleep on the plane?" I said, "Oh, well, that's weird.
-Right because they gave you a--
-Business first I think it's called
-They gave you a king-sized bed and a butler.
-They gave you a thing, it goes flat.
-So your seat, it's really cool.
-It's totally flat.
-What airline was this?
-It was Delta.
I'm gonna look this out.
-So, it was a Delta from
JFK to Venice.
-So, here's the deal.
If you have an American Express Platinum Card, you can purchase it.
-Which is none of our audience.
-I understand but if you do, you can purchase a business or first class ticket internationally.
-And you get the second one for free.
-See, I just don't understand, is it because they overcharge so much on the first one?
-Yes, yeah, yeah, exactly.
-So, this is what it looks like.
-What is going on?
pods that go straight out.
-It's like out of Minority Report or something.
You have your own little pod.
-Does it have like your own little like--
-You have your own entertainment center.
You could watch movies.
-Your own little refrigerator?
-You have the oxygen?
-No but they are always giving you stuff, you know, it's pretty awesome.
-Anyway, it is an incredible luxury.
I know that most people think I'm crazy but I'm tall, you know, I'm almost 6 feet.
I feel you.
-Justin, you know.
-Well with you.
-You're tall, yeah, I get it but--
-Yeah, it's a waste.
It's a waste, okay.
It was a big
special birthday and I was taking the girlfriend for her big birthday trip.
We just grew busting balls but it's still like--
-Best trip ever.
-But it was ridiculous.
-It's totally ridiculous.
I have to work a little bit hard.
I'll do work an extra year.
-It's an absurd amount of money.
-It is an absurd amount of money, there's no doubt and-- but the only-- the time you feel like it's so worth it is you arrive there, whatever, at 11 o'clock in the morning and you're like, oh, I actually feel good 'cause I slept for 7 hours.
-And that's when you're like, oh I didn't just waste a whole day of my vacation being exhausted and feeling like
-So, it was great.
It was awesome.
It was an eat-a-thon, it was like ten days of eating and drinking.
Also, drinking wise, you know, we don't live our lives and have wine at lunch and wine at dinner just like every-- and three courses at every meal.
It's like Game of Thrones.
-It really is the best thing.
-There's just wine in everyone.
-I have to say in the flight back, I was like a kind of a done eating for a while.
-You know, like you get over it.
-I feel like every vacation, everyone would come back from some place as simple as like Vegas.
-It's like, Jesus, what we can do in--
-Yeah, detox right?
-My God, there's enough fillet in me to, you know,
-choke a horse.
-So, anyway, it was an awesome trip and there was a little bit of flooding in Venice because it's like crazy.
I love when people are like, there's no global warming.
Go to Venice and if there's a full moon, the water of the canals spills over into St.
Mark's Square, so much so that there's a like a whole subculture black market guys who were selling rubber boots to dumb tourists who go out in their fancy shoes.
-Like these chicks walking in their Manolo Blahnik's through, right.
-Oh, my God.
-And they're like-- and you buy the boots to get back to you hotel.
-It's kind of sad.
I mean, the city is amazing.
You should go see it before it disappears.
-Yeah, in [unk] hundred years.
-Wait, so how high does the tide get after a dinner when it gets [unk]?
-Well, I-- I mean, probably if you, you know, you don't think it's that much but then there was like a foot of water--
-which is big deal.
-So, what did you do?
Did you take off your shoes?
-I took my shoes off and walk there barefoot and Jackie is like, that is so disgusting.
She like, was like wanted me to be like in, you know, somehow like put to a chamber.
-Right, like a--
-Because she figures it like the water is disgusting, right?
Well, it's just like, you know, is it--
-It's not fresh water.
-It's a salt water, right?
It's probably not good.
-It's better than the freaking Hudson River.
-That's probably true.
-It's gotten better but it is-- you know what's so disheartening about it, is you go there and it's this romantic, amazing city and you see these like massive cruise ships coming and it's so weird 'cause you see like this big huge honking thing coming.
-Doesn't look like it should be there.
-And then it's like an anachronism.
-Yeah and the Venetians can't stand it 'cause it's like all those cruise ship people, they don't come and spend money.
They just come, walk around, leave their litter.
-Take a photo, yeah.
-You know, get a piece of pizza and walk out.
-But anyway, it was great.
-With their fanny packs.
And thank God for technology as much as, you know, I know that Justin is dissing technology on his hike.
-If I didn't have a GPS on this trip, I don't know what I would have done.
-Yeah, I felt that way in Europe.
-It was amazing.
-It was so great.
We drive in in the back areas, we got to see where parmesan
cheese is made, got to go to the--
-All the parmesan cheese in the world?
-It's made from Parma, so we were in Parma.
-And said to be officially parmesan cheese, it has to come from Parma.
These Italians are so funny.
They like stamp it with a special thing, same thing with balsamic vinegar.
You cannot get balsamic vinegar unless it's from Modena, this one part of Italy.
-I'll just devour that country.
-I mean, it is an eat-a-thon.
It is unbelievable.
I should show to the-- I showed like the-- they showed us like, oh, this is where we have our Culatello.
-What was the
best thing you ate?
-In Venice they made this like, this unbelievable pasta and fish dish, that was like the cuttlefish, which I don't think I've ever had it before.
-They call it Scorfano, I think.
-And it was just perfect.
It was just perfectly done.
It was great.
-I'm so hungry.
-When we arrived in Parma, that we've stated this is like kinda cool converted farmhouse,
-the guys are there and they had this like beautiful parmesan cheese and Italian cold cuts on a-- like just on a
platter and wine that they make there.
And they would just like, "Here, welcome to our inn." I was so blown away.
So, the simple things are amazing there.
And I will say the gelato was gosh darn awesome.
-That's like the Bergen--
-It's ice cream.
-It's just ice-- you know, it's amazing.
-You can bring any--
-You were kinda telling us that you were-- you kinda went off the grid with your social networking while you're there.
Let me just say it was awesome.
I did check my e-mail but like, who cares?
Like I say that-- I say to radio and TV I'm going away.
Like unless the market
-I really don't plan on talking to you.
-So, and I felt so great not looking at Twitter, Facebook, Google Plus, LinkedIn, not once.
-It was great.
So, I get back and there's like all this trash talk like where have you been.
Oh, I can't take a vacation?
-Is that like-- is that not cool?
-What's the social more on social about that?
-Aren't you allowed to disconnect?
Am I supposed to announce like I'm not gonna be on?
-I mean, maybe if you--
-No, I'm with you,
I feel like, you know, I don't know, some people take it upon themselves to be like, I'm gonna be gone for ten days.
See you when I get back.
-Do you have auto reply thing on your e-mail?
-Yeah, I do on my e-mail but on social--
-Like work mail.
But you know what's weird, so I come back and I write this nice blog post for LinkedIn 'cause I'm now an influencer.
-I know, you told us last time.
So as [unk].
-It sounds important.
It sounds important.
Anyway, so if you're on LinkedIn, check it out.
And the funniest thing is
I write a blog post and I-- you know, whatever.
I was exhausted.
I'm doing a zillion things.
I put this blog post up.
They sent me a note.
Oh, the editor is here.
Oh, send us a picture because I said like what I learned about the economy in Italy.
Right, that's what I write about.
-And some idiot writes a comment that there's like a spelling error in the first--
-It's always the freaking grammar Nazis.
-And I'm okay with that like I get it, it's not-- but he was mean about it.
Also, he sort of like I wouldn't even read past the first
paragraph because there was an error.
And I was like, oh my God.
So, I-- my first inclination is to write a nasty gram and respond to him and say like you're horrible and this is why people hate social media and this is why people don't like anyone online and you're a weeny, right?
-Instead, what did I do?
I mean, this is like it took this too far because I wait too much--
-It already sounds like you took it too much.
-I took-- 'cause I took too much time to deal with it.
So, I'm like, what's he's e-mail address?
-Now, I gotta get hooked up with him via LinkedIn.
-But then you can't 'cause I have no connection to him, right?
There's no way for me to claim a connection.
So, I figure out his name of his business.
-I Google it.
-If you're answering--
-Wait a minute.
I Google it and then I got his e-mail address and I sent him an e-mail.
Oh, my God.
So, you basically stalk the dude online.
-When he gets this e-mail from you, was he like, hey, this is weird?
He did not, he hasn't responded.
He's a weeny.
-Oh, he hasn't responded.
Because that's what we need to do but--
-That's what weenies do.
-That's what they do.
They complain and then, or does it like the people who send me nasty grams to the radio show,
-and I invite them to come on to debate something.
-He's not mad at you.
He's mad at something else.
-Yeah, that's life.
-No, you know what the mind boggling this is that when you-- when I hear this story, I thought it was maybe like a 15-year-old teenager in his parent's placement.
No, it's not.
-But it wasn't.
You want to-- we don't have to name names but you just did.
-No, no, don't say anything.
I'm just gonna say, Kevin is--
-Yeah, Kevin is not a teenager.
-No, he's a mad.
-He's a business executive,
-that holds a pretty high position it looks like--
-It looks like--
-he's a responsible
-[unk] this website look like shit, crap.
-He just sounds like a dick head.
-And it's not insane.
-What-- there's something else going on there.
-What is propelling you?
-Like take a step back for a second and like, yeah, you're just a freaking troll and you're just, you know, because it happens all the time.
Like why do that?
-Like I had something that was a typo and people on Twitter were like, you should get better proofreading skills and stuff like that.
Like get over.
We're doing 50,000 things in once.
You know, I mean, I'm sorry.
-I mean, yeah, come on,
It's not like this is, you know--
-and a printed novel that's gone to press.
-And even then like--
-You know, people don't understand that.
They can't separate the varying degrees of publishing.
-And oh, you're gonna say tape it, like let's see you didn't make a mistake.
The New York Times has a whole section that is--
-here's the mistake that we've made.
Like big deal.
-But no one reads that for some reason 'cause no one cares.
-I love that.
-Because it's not on the front page.
But I do.
I think that people like this are just angry people.
I agree with you.
-Very small quality ego.
-Well, we're not talking about necessarily, you know.
-And other things.
-We're not talking below the belt, I guess, but like--
-I mean, it probably could be though.
-It could be a penis thing.
-It could be an indication.
It could be.
-It could be a small penis thing.
-It could be.
-But you know--
Let me look him again.
-No, but like-- it's just.
I don't know.
I just think people--
-Dudes from Denver, you're supposed to be all laid back and stuff, right?
-I just can't-- there's like something else is going here.
It's like that scene in Big Daddy.
It's like you're mad at your father
not me, you know.
-It's something like that.
-Something else is going on on these people's lives.
-Anyway, and like-- so, of course--
-And they take it out on you.
-And they take it out on me and that was a pretty picture of me.
Put that post up for a second.
Look at that nice picture, how nice it looks there.
Isn't that nice in Venice with a gondola in the back and everything?
Do you have to wait for one to go by to take the photo?
Or is that just the fortunate--
There's like all over the place.
-That's from-- check this out.
That is from my hotel room.
We have terrace, they upgraded us.
-I know, right.
-Freaking-- you get a gondola view.
-That's what-- to Aunt Jill, you always want a rich Aunt Jill.
-I'm not that rich but you know, it's-- I really went crazy because I love to travel in style.
-As opposed to someone else in this room, or perhaps we'd like to travel by not spending any money.
So, I would rather-- See, the thing is you're--
-Are you sharing your financial advice?
-The thing is I would rather not go,
-than go the way that you would go.
Well, ours were two different types of occasions.
Two different experiences.
-Yours are sort of a relaxing kind.
Mine was the working kind.
-Yes, that's right.
Jill travels in style and Justin travels in [unk].
But you know, you know there's a nice in between and you have to know any of the--
-I took the back of a truck to my vacation.
-And wait a minute, when I was traveling, I was like, I don't-- how old are you again, 20s?
-And you're like--
And Ariel is much older than I ever think.
So, I'm not asking him, right?
-Ariel is 48.
-I am 45.
-I always think it's a totally amazing.
I was like, you're not 30.
-Yes but what's funny is in your generation, did kid go backpacking through Europe
-Yeah, because they don't do that anymore.
-Stacy did that.
-They don't do that, hostiles [unk]?
-Oh, you're fool.
-No Americans don't because there's no one have money.
-Well, that's, I understand no one have money.
-You know what I mean?
-But like in 2004, Stacy did it and she's--
-Yeah but that was before the financial crisis.
-Yeah, that was almost ten years ago.
-You know, so, I went to Europe when I was--
-So, there's a hostile bubble now, is that what's happening there?
It's a hostile crash.
I was-- I asked if there's a lot of tourists and Americans that they're sending and they said they used to have tons of college kids or kids who just graduated from college.
-They don't get that as much anymore.
-Not so much anymore.
-You know, the--
-Because that's-- it's like a rite of passage that people should be afforded.
-I mean, it is still on the, you know--
-More luxurious side of things even when a lot more people could do it.
-But I asked my father, I spent a semester in London and my semester in London from my junior, first semester junior year, my father said it was cheaper than my semester, my regular other semesters for the 3-1/2 years.
That's number one.
And we were
trying to go back and figure out how much money I spent 'cause I like went around with my girlfriend Alicia for, I don't know, like 2 months, 2-1/2 months.
-And my father swears that I spent $1,000 total for 2-1/2 months.
-That's unbelievable, right?
-That was a long time ago.
I don't wanna say a long ago.
-I wanna say how much you spent this time around.
-I don't wanna say how long it was but it was very long time ago.
-That is a great thing.
-Yeah, what else?
-So, what was like the big, you know, had you been to Italy before?
-I've been to Italy before.
I have not been-- oh, this is so mean to say
on the air but I think I'll say it.
-Yeah, do it.
-Because you know, I don't think my exes are really 404 fans.
-I've never been to Venice with someone I was really in love with.
-It's a romantic city, isn't it?
-It really is.
It's a pretty cool place.
I mean, it's just-- it's startling to walk into any of these, you know, old European cities where there are churches that are from you know, 12th, 13th, 14th, 15th century but there is something so wild about being in this romantic city and you know, looking around and seeing
water everywhere and you know--
-I thought that way in Brugge for sure.
-Yeah and it's a similar--
-It's a similar city, yeah.
And there's [unk] and if you're out there with someone who you really love, what you end up doing is fighting about getting lost.
-That's-- you know, and I remember a lot of that.
-That I do remember.
-So, it was great.
I love that and I loved-- I love going to a new place and you now, driving around and we went to Lake Como which is the northern part of Italy, the border of Switzerland.
It's like a movie set.
astounding, how beautiful it was.
So, it was a great trip.
-What was the biggest-- I have never been to Italy.
Stacy's been there.
What's the biggest like cultural sort of difference did you find there?
-I thought it was interesting but not in the big city, it's not in Venice but in many smaller cities.
They still close down for 3 hours in the middle of the day, or two hours.
-I was bummed and I was like, oh, my God.
I got to Parma and I was like, what?
The church is closed?
Like I came to Parma, I just drove here and it was really
interesting to me that so much of the culture is still kinda shuts down.
-The other thing, just from an economic point of view.
-You know, with obviously the country is in terrible shape, but the people don't seem that freaked out.
I mean, their unemployment rate is ridiculous.
Their youth unemployment rate is like 26%.
-Wow, that's scary.
-Isn't that crazy?
-Is ours that much for youth?
Well, 7-1/2% is-- and the youth is probably 9-ish, maybe, yeah, probably 9, 9 [unk] change.
-I thought-- okay.
-But the thing that's weird is they don't see that freaked out and I was sort of surprised by that and so I asked one of our guides like, why do you think that is?
And he said, you know what, we have health insurance.
-And so, like no matter how bad it gets--
-So, no matter how bad it gets, people-- that's like one big worry that people don't have, right?
-That you're safer now, yeah.
-And I think that's a big deal.
-So, that was really interesting and you know, so many people are like, when is the good economic stuff from the U.S.
coming over here and like good, it's not that good.
they're a mess.
The people who are parents there encourage their kids to move away.
They really don't want them to stay there because they think there's no opportunity there.
-Yeah, I would imagine like seeing that with the flooding too, it's just sort of dark, right?
-Well, I mean in Venice I feel like you didn't even see it because it's sucha tourist city but in-- when we were in this region called Emilia-Romagna, which is like Parma and Modena and Bologna, what you start to-- they were telling us stories that you know there were these family
businesses, there are you know, let's say the family business that made balsamic vinegar.
-And they couldn't survive during the downturn and so a lot of family businesses were shattered and that's kind of a sad thing.
I think the big-- the survivors are always the big guys.
-And they are very wistful about their government, you know, Berlusconi is crazy nutbag.
He used to be the prime minister.
-That's what I hear, yeah.
-And they hate him and they say this is a corrupt government and-- but nothing changes.
-So, that's it.
I'm ready for my next
-I'm going-- I gotta go to Portland, Oregon for a wedding.
-Oh, that's-- no, Portland is cool.
-You know what's cool about it?
-When you talk about laid-back, that's a laid-back city.
-It's a laid-back city and--
-I'm going to a wedding where my two friends who are super duper laid back and their daughter is getting married and they are like, literally saying to me like, okay, like this is not a wedding in New York, so we need to talk to you about what to expect.
There's not gonna be a 4-hour cocktail hour before, yeah.
-No-- none of that.
-What do I
wear to that?
That's the thing.
I don't know.
-You've got suit, it's probably super casual.
-Yeah, I think.
-Oh, it's awesome.
Rock and roll.
Let's bring things--
-the states side.
-I wanna talk about a gaming economical thing.
-A few like last week, I wrote something about what the next generation of console gaming is gonna be like on a more cultural and perhaps economical level with potentially the elimination of used games.
And one of the biggest I guess
martyrs out of all this whole thing is GameStop.
-Which is a depressing-looking store no matter what you say about it.
-Yeah, I mean, you know, it's-- I don't know.
When I was younger, going into like an EB games, which is now GameStop as well, there was something kind of awesome and culturally exciting about it because it was like, oh, you go in, you rub elbows with fellow gamers, you talk about this, you are all in the same boat of like very enthusiastic about the industry and you know, it's similar to like the barbershops sort of atmosphere I would
And now that environment seems to be going the way they baffle up and I think the problem is-- I mean, obviously, you know, if there's no used games, GameStop can't really make a lot of money because the--
-You only make-- I think they only make like $4 or $5 on the sale of new games.
So, the markup on used games is really where they cash-in and in this evolving ecosystem where used-- where games are just becoming digital, there will not be
the idea of used game down the road.
-So, you know, I saw a video fresh [unk] on Fox News, Fox Business talking about the GameStop stock price and how it actually gone up recently and now it's headed back down and this is a very vital sort of situation or [unk] as it were.
-I mean it's sort of-- it's like a double whammy, right?
Because on one hand it's in-- it's retail.
It's a brick and mortar retailer which is like impossible now.
-It's very hard.
don't go out shopping.
-And they've been closing stores for a while.
-And then you have just the industry itself which is gaming evolving and going to a different platform.
And so, is GameStop gonna be up?
What's it trading?
Let me see this.
-I don't know.
What is it trading?
-I got it up right here.
-What is GameStop trading at?
-Thirty-four and a half and now, if you look in the past it actually-- it was at a high for a while or it was higher than they've been.
-Yeah, than it had been and I'm not sure of the reasoning.
Don't get me wrong.
This is a company that's
still making money and we'll continue to make money for a few more years because don't forget, everyone is still holding on to their Xbox 360, everyone is still holding on to their PlayStation 3, their Wii.
I guess their Wii U.
-But stocks up 37% this year.
-It's not like jump change.
-Right and it's not-- there's no like--
-Jeff Bakalar is putting a cell rating on this stock.
I've been like--
-It sounds like it.
-You cannot sit there as a person with easily accessible information
about where video games are going and be like GameStop is gonna be around for a while.
-It just doesn't make sense.
The writing is on the wall.
It's kinda clear.
-Isn't it kinda weird, though, like so yeah, that games like there's no secondary market now, right?
Because things are digital.
I just heard a podcast recently on Planet Money and they were talking about this with records and music, because there's-- you know, you might-- if you bought a CD way back when and you say I don't want anymore, you can go to a store and say here, trade it
in or whatever and you get something.
And then that market has basically evaporated because everyone's just downloading stuff and could there be a way to sell something you bought?
Like I bought this thing from iTunes.
I bought the album for $999.
I don't want anymore.
Could I resell it somehow for $4?
And I think that's absurd.
It's an absurd idea and I have this conversation with my buddy Cory last Friday and he was talking about relinquishing the rights
-You know, because we don't own things that way we own-- we used to own them.
You have a final record.
You have a CD.
-Right and the trademark stuff and the patent stuff is also very clear about having physical possession or something, right?
-Right, for sure.
I mean, one thing-- and it's-- I don't know.
Tell me what you think about this.
You have-- you buy these MP3s from iTunes and you burn them to a disc.
Well, now, you do have a physical copy of it.
-But the license doesn't change from where you originally purchased.
-Well, there's like a big court case that's pending about changing this and so that when you buy a-- when you digitally download that, that you-- there can be no-- there can't be a limitation like you can't-- you should be able to own it.
The question is you can't then just give it away for a million people to use, right, 'cause in here destroying their models.
-So, is there some way that there could be like a third party that comes in and says, you know, will check that you have certain rights and will buy it from?
I don't know.
There's probably tons of
stuff on my iPhone that I don't really want anymore that I may bought.
-Right but do you think there's value in you relinquishing the rights to something like that?
I don't think there's a monetary value time for that.
-Well, I don't know.
-What about relinquishing it back to the company that sold it to you and say you don't want that album anymore, can you trade it back into iTunes for a little bit of credit?
-Yeah, after you--
-But it's just--
-That would be really useful.
What if-- right.
What if I could say--
-But then-- I mean, but there's way-- oh, I'm sorry.
-Oh, so you know, like you go and you buy something stupid.
-For example, like when you win on that Lady Gaga bench.
-And I just bought
all her records.
And then you say, wait a minute.
I have one dance party and you decide you're gonna download it.
-And why shouldn't you be able to go back to iTunes and say--
-or maybe you could rent it.
-That'd be cool.
-Wouldn't that be kind of fun, like you could rent it for like five days and then pay some price for that?
-Right and it has this like a self destruct day or something like that.
-They do that already with some things.
But to me, it's like there's too many loopholes there.
-Yeah, I guess.
-If I'm downloading, if I'm returning an album I bought on iTunes,
-I can totally rip that and keep it forever.
-It's not a problem.
It's kinda like the way, you know, with the Netflix DVDs, where you would have it, rip it and give it back.
So, I know--
-We could do that?
-People still do that.
-Yeah, with DVDs, not with Blu-rays but-- hey, you have a DVD burner?
-You could do it with Blu-rays it's just not as economical.
-I just-- I don't know.
I'm just-- I just think it's crazy and the idea that you're done playing with a game and you wanna return the right to-- go help yourself and feel like it's just crazy.
-That's why things like Spotify are more popular
because it's more of like a one time payment system that you can access to their entire catalog.
-Right and suppose to blank each out at the same time, yeah.
-And then you walk away.
-Then you want [unk].
-So, and I mean, maybe that's a viable model for games.
Maybe you pay Bethesda,
-you know, you belong to Bethesda, Capcom and EA and you get all their stuff.
I don't-- I don't know.
-That is kinda cool.
I like that.
I don't know.
I just-- I don't know because--
-And then what happens-- and then your friends at GameStop are out of business.
Now you've cut out the middleman.
-They're my friends.
I don't know.
It's just very strange.
It's such a volatile time right now that I didn't realize it was all just gonna hate it once because it really sorta is.
You know, everyone was like, oh, down the road there will never be a-- your physical media is on its way out.
Well, now it's like--
-You know and it's like here and we're faced with this and don't get me wrong like, you will be able to buy a PS4 game in the store, you will be able to buy an Xbox One game in the store,
-but by the end of these life
cycles, I mean--
-these games are also gonna be ghost towns, right?
-That's so wild.
-There are still people who don't have internet that can really handle this sort of bandwidth but at the end of the day, the majority of people are just not gonna be [unk] the story.
-Now, going back to my flight for a second, if I may.
-Go for it, yeah.
-I was astounded by the number of grown men playing games on the plane.
I don't understand.
-And what were they playing on?
-I don't know.
There's like a little-- yeah, for your own little digital do-to-do with movies and stuff--
-It has a controller or something?
-A game controller?
-That's kinda cool.
-Why the hell not?
-Why not, right?
-And they're like--
-Don't get-- Jill, you are within the Sony and market but you are all within their demographics.
-They are aiming for you especially with Xbox One.
-They weren't aiming at kids.
-They're not aiming at you know, 12 to 20, they were aiming at people who are like--
-Well into their decade, yeah.
-Well into their 20's and 30's.
-But yeah, it's just a very rapidly changing landscape.
I wanna bring one other
thing and then we could get to the questions and stuff like that.
And this is something everyone can speak on.
The Last of Us is a new video game that's out June 14th but the embargo is today and all the reviews are coming out.
And you know, people who review games, there's a lot of controversy with like, oh, you gave me this score.
Oh, it's a lot of score.
It's a lot of nonsense.
People are giving this game 10 out of 10, which is pretty much the best score obviously you can do.
And I live on the side of the fence that believes no game is perfect and you can't award something a perfect score.
Now, my review, I don't do scores, which I'm so grateful for.
-Thank God, right.
-Because I would just never hear the end of it.
-I mean, I think this is one of the best PS3 games in a very long time.
So, I'm curious what you guys think about the idea of you know, giving not just a game of perfect score but any sort of product, the perfect
There's no perfect product.
If there's a perfect product, everyone would have it now--
-You mean, Nadia Comaneci should not have gotten a perfect 10 in the Olympics?
-That's what I'm saying.
-I'm saying nobody deserves an A+.
Well, A+ is not as, you know, matter of fantastic 10.
-Ten out of ten.
There is no 10.
-No one deserves 100 over 100.
No one deserves--
-Is there not a perfect movie that you've seen where you're like, wow, that is a perfect movie.
-There's ones that are freaking close.
-The Big Lebowski.
-Or The Godfather.
-Parts one and two.
-Part two, sure.
-You wouldn't give that a ten.
-You can't give something a ten when product reviews 'cause then there's no reason for anyone else to make a future product.
-Which is depressing 'cause then I would put [unk] with that.
-You wanna give something-- you wanna give a near perfect score, a 9.8, a 9.9.
And like you have to-- did you-- was there something in this game thought that you could have said, they could have done a little better?
-Yeah, of course.
So, then it isn't perfect for you.
-But I'm seeing a-- my colleagues, some of them are just going nuts,
you know, totally just be like best game ever, ten out of ten, couldn't do better.
-It looks like a major motion picture.
-I mean, it's freaking great and you know, say forgetting too deep and then if you have a PS3, come June 14th, go freaking BIOS game.
It's a fantastic game.
But it's just-- you can't make a perfect game and I just struggle with-- and there's all these--
-So, it's better than Pong?
-Just slightly better.
-What are your critiques of the game?
What would you think should be improved?
-There's a lot
of trial and error that gets a little frustrating.
-It's-- so, the story line is it takes place in this-- in you know, I guess the modern, you know, age where a fungal infection wipes out like half the world and it was based on this thing from planet earth where there's species of ant in a rainforest that got infected by these spores, these mushroom fungal spores.
-Yeah, that's why I hate mushrooms.
they-- it changed the composition of their brains and they're like making them do things, like weird things, unlike what ants normally do.
So, that's how the idea respond for this, like oh, what if there's-- so, these people who get infected start developing these like fungal you know, amount of-- sort of weird things that happen on their body and so-- anyway, and you have to like, you know, kill them and--
-We have to kill the bad.
-It's not really--
-It's good versus evil?
-It's not really a good versus evil.
It's a survival thing.
It's a survival horror thing.
-Do you think that most of
the best games that you have that have that theme versus you know, like a good versus evil or a survival thing or any of those--
I don't think there's any-- no, I don't think like good versus evil, like the best, you know, makeup of a game.
I don't think there's anything like, you know, define like that.
But this is just-- it's a really-- it's like for me, there's a genre survival horror where it's like you feel like you're at your wits' end and you're desperate and every bullet matters and everything like that.
And this game does a great job of creating that kind of thing.
-Justin, that's like
your hiking trip.
-Yeah, I know except that--
-Except I would be one of the guys covered with fungi.
-I appreciate the shots in the face because of that.
-You have no chance whatsoever.
-This is like attractive people versus ugly people.
-But they do such a great job with this and there's-- it's not perfect.
It's flawed in a few minor ways.
-But I just-- I'm just-- I wanted to bring up the idea of like the perfect game and how it simply does not exist, the same way the perfect album or the perfect movie doesn't exist.
-I think there are some-- so, I used to say that there was like-- well, remember you play that game like what's the perfect album, right?
And there are some that really do get up there but I agree.
There's always like one song, we're like, yeah, but if that song weren't on it--
-That's the thing and that's okay.
-It's our personal preference too.
-You know, 'cause I-- my favorite album would be a hip hop album.
-That will be a perfect ten, not for you, you know, any of you.
-Well, it's not even that but like, so-- but you're saying like you think thing-- like no one could ever do it better than this album that you think is the best.
-If for my preference.
-For your preference.
-You know what I mean?
-So, that's why I'm saying a general perfect 10, you can't really--
-Right, yeah, exactly.
-In love with that and get account for personal preference.
-I feel like there's also a difference between saying best of all time from now until the future ever.
-Best right now.
-Yeah, best right now is a good way to say it too.
-So, you could say, but I like that you're framing it though, Jeff, it's like it's the best-- you know, it's like it's a glory game, I love it but you don't have to put the superlative tag on it.
-Because sometimes, when you see those lists, I always feel weird like, 100 best novels in American history and you look at it and you're like, well, that feels-- I don't believe that.
Like not for me.
-And have you read all the--
all the books in the world every written and--
-Oh, you know, and also this [unk], I have to say they're so misogynists.
They always leave off like half the great women novelist--
-because they don't really count.
-I mean, it's the-- I'm aware of the irony of you know, journalist who write about their opinions and you know, dealing with the imperfect, you know, situation of subjectivity.
-But that's part of-- like that's why I kinda hate lists,
-even though I know I'm test with doing them every year and at
E3 I'm gonna have the best games of E3 and stuff like that.
-And see a whore.
-But that's what it is and at the end of the day there's no way to definitively cast such a specific net about, you know, what's the perfect game or the perfect movie.
-So, what's your favorite or your--
-But the best game ever is--
-I'm just gonna say it.
So, like-- but you could do like your top three games.
-So, what are your top three?
-Well, of all time?
-See, I struggle with doing that too.
You know, maybe like the First BioShock, you know.
-Also has to do with like where you were
in your life when you were playing that.
-It's a lot of evidence.
-That's evidence for music, right?
-A lot of evidence.
-It's [unk] association, right?
-Association, yeah, definitely.
-I mean that's why I love not having to give games a score.
It's the best one ever.
-That's why Pong is still a favorite for me.
-Yeah, you know.
-So many hours then.
-Oh, my God.
I-- really I'm the worst-- I'm so glad that I know you because I have no connection to this really, because to gaming--
-That's your fault though.
-Well, I just-- how much time do you have in a day?
-Yeah but you could-- I mean, I'm sure you spend some of your time commuting.
-Even though I don't wanna like
encourage casual gaming, you could still like get on board with the game on your iPhone.
-I told you I do a little Sudoku.
So, you do play games.
-Yeah, a little bit but not a lot, not a lot.
-I'm telling you're right in the sweet spot for a lot of demo-- target demographics for a lot of game makes.
Well, maybe sometime.
-I feel like you're like me.
You're a TV watcher,
-because you like to talk to people about what you consume.
-And then after you play a game, there's only a very limited number of people you can be like, have you played this video game?
-Or you're so wrong.
-Maybe what I should do is, wait a second, why don't I this?
Why don't I find out and do like
a sort of an information poll of the people that, like I encounter of a certain age group, mine.
And find out how many people are real gamers 'cause I think it might-- you're right.
I think it may surprise me--
-to learn that more people are playing games than I think.
-Oh, certainly it will surprise you.
-I saw Zinga laid off 18% of its staff.
What's going on their Farm Boy, Farmville or whatever?
-I mean, it's-- there'll be lots of things like you know, I think all of these casual and mobile, you know, web-based games, it's-- there's a surplus of it and I think
they, you know, when high or crazy after you know, Farmville and Words-- are they Words With Friends?
They're Words With Friends also.
-And Draw Something and all this stuff and you know, it's just starting to like catch up with them.
-I find it highly annoying this whole Words with Friends thing.
Like you-- I don't know why but it just like when some of my friends like this will ask me, you know, I need a word.
I said like well that-- like, can't you just entertain yourself?
Like do you need to have the interaction
of somebody else?
Could you just sit there and do a crossword puzzle by yourself?
-Can you just play?
It feels like a little-- like weird to me.
It's just very strange like everything has to be an interaction like that and then you know, you meet all this people and they don't really know how to interact face-to-face anyway.
-So, I'm very worried.
I have a little bit of a concern about the demise of the American--
-You sound like my father.
-I am your father.
I'm like five years younger than him.
It's not that bad.
-It's not, right?
-I think people underestimate--
-Please give me a little bit of the optimistic glass half full.
-I think people underestimate how social gaming is.
-Or it can be.
I get that.
-I think that's a big misconception.
-What about the idea of that youth of today don't really know how to communicate verbally in the same way, that maybe we--
-I don't disagree 100%.
-Even you are in like closer to my generation than that generation in that respect.
-But it's relative.
-It's the evolution
of human communication.
-So, you can't-- I understand what you're saying and it sucks--
-Oh, my God.
It's like I'm talking with Shrink right now.
I hear what you're saying--
-And I agree with you on most of that.
I do because it's sad not being--
-It's weird, right?
-It's weird but it is an evolution.
-Like everything that happens to us culturally and you know, the way we interact with, that's an evolution and there's nothing you can do to like mandate chain.
What about that [unk] who said you can only have the cellphone,
How that work out?
-Not so great.
I don't think.
-Not so-- you just can't stand in the way of evolution that I've found.
-This is true.
-I mean, I think we know that from history.
-But my mother is doing a good job of it.
-Oh, she's trying.
-I don't think she's every gone to an ATM ever.
-I mean, that's an amazing statement.
-You know, and it's-- and to bring that sort of like, you know, analogy, I have a father who's completely freaked out by giving credit cards online, number online.
Only wants to write checks and you know, he--
-He knows that the
world is rapidly evolving in the way money is transacted and there will soon be a world where checks will just not be a thing.
-Just doesn't make sense and you know, he likes struggles with that.
He like can't get past that.
-I feel like my dad was-- who's, I think, older than your father is a little bit--
-I think so.
-I think a little bit older was-- he's--
-Well, how old is he?
-My dad just turned 76.
-So he's not that much older.
He's 16 years older.
-So, my dad seems better with technology but I think it was because of you know,
he was on Wall Street in the beginning of computer trading.
-And so they kinda had to-- they brought them into that world.
-So for him, the first way, he never had e-mail.
He was so reluctant to have e-mail but then when he had an online trading account, he needed an e-mail address.
That's when he started using it.
So, it was for him like trading online, no problem.
Giving someone his e-mail address, huge problem, like wait a minute--
-So, you're like-- you wanna-- you'll put money in an account, you'll trade with it and so, but he's gotten more comfortable.
He still feels-- it's funny.
gets a little bit freaked out because his identity was stolen once.
-And-- but he gets a little freaked out by banking online.
-And I don't see why it's so different to be-- having an investment account versus banking but somehow it's like I don't wanna-- I wanna write the check and pay the bills and know that they're, of course, what he's really saying is I want your mother to do that.
-My mother does that.
-But there's a lot of psychology to it too.
And it's like some people have a hard time understanding that you know, their money isn't just like on a shelf
somewhere, where it's like vulnerable to leak out through the tubes of the internet.
You know what I mean?
Like it doesn't work like that.
-And that's a reason that some people mostly of an older generation just struggle with like, oh, I don't trust it.
A lot of it is the fear of the unknown, I think.
-Well, I think the credit card thing is funny because I think that more credit card fraud takes place by someone physically, who you hand your card to than anything else.
And like looking over your shoulder and stuff like that.
Oh, by the way, we're in Europe.
We're like I'm getting money out of the
ATM and all of a sudden my accounts gets frozen.
-Because I used it too many times in a row.
-I'm like, oh man, I gotta sit here and talk to Bank of America now?
-What a pain in the neck.
I mean, it's good.
-But you know you can do, you can ahead of time.
-I should have.
-Tell him, okay, I'm going to Europe.
-But that was actually-- I thought it was like hey, fraud protection, all right.
I'm cool with that.
-Yeah, for sure.
We-- we're running out of time but I wanna to one or two--
-Can we get to the one from--
-You do anything you wanna do.
-our listener today?
This one is from, I believe Schnides.
This is a question we've definitely done before but Schnides is a-- he's a regular and he deserves to get his answer here.
-What's the difference if any between the 401K?
-And oh, that's corporate sponsored.
-And a Roth IRA.
-That is a very good question.
-Is there any such thing as a non-Roth IRA?
I don't know what that means.
So, there are employer-based plans.
A 401K when you have a
private company or a floor profit company.
You have a 403B that's for teachers usually.
-You have a 457 plan which is something that usually through municipalities and that is a payroll deduction plan where money comes out of your paycheck, you get put aside for retirement and you don't get tax on the money that you put aside.
So, your tax base slower.
-So, all those come from your job essentially.
A IRA or a Roth IRA is just you
putting money into a special account that has taxed preference and you don't need a company to do it.
You can put money and after tax dollar into your Roth IRA.
-You can make a contribution to your IRA and then deduct it on your taxes.
There are things called a SEP IRA if you wanna put more money away and there are things called SARSEP.
There's all different kinds of plans but that's the basic difference.
The other big difference is the 401K limits are higher.
So, you can put more money into a 401K than you can into an
So, IRAs are private essentially?
They're like your own.
-Your own personal.
-Individual Retirement Account, that's what it stands for.
So, if you could do one through your employer, do that.
-Well, not always.
-And [unk] they match though?
-If they match, yes.
Always up to the match for sure.
There you go, Schnides.
What else you got?
This is interesting.
My husband works for school department.
They just switch over retirement accounts to Vanguard Target Retirement Funds.
So, a lot-- you know these Target Date Funds are basically there's a
Fund and it's followed by some date which is supposed to match up with when you will retire.
So, the Vanguard 2035 Fund, The Vanguard 2055--
-Like predicting the future.
-And just-- they take more risk the younger you are and they reduce the risk as you get older and older.
So, this question is basically the default option is now Target Retirement Funds.
It used to be the default options where money market funds.
And actually that change, because we found out that through lots of research that people just didn't even realize here
of putting money in their money market.
So, at least we would get them into a target date funds so they'd be invested doing something.
Now, here's a question.
We were thinking of moving it to the Vanguard small cap, the Vanguard 500, the Vanguard Total Stock Market Index and the Total Bond Market Index, 25% each.
There's $1500 in there right now.
Is this a better option?
-I always get this question.
Should I basically divvy up the money myself?
Or should I just throw it in a Target Date Fun?
Depends how much you wanna manage your money.
You know, part of this is about like are you gonna be a hyper
focused and make yourself crazy over this account?
-Most people just wanna put on a little pilot.
-I think the auto pilot is pretty good.
I think that once you start getting more than 50 grand, you can start diversifying but if you're into it and you know, I don't mind it to have, say 25 in these 4 different funds.
-I would point out one major thing about Target Date Funds.
They all can have way more risk than people realized.
They often are 90% stocks, 10% bonds and then might be
a bumpy ride that you as a you know, 29, 30-year old care to takes.
So, you should check out how much risk is in these Target Date Funds and just click on it through Vanguard.
It really, you know, most people-- they just-- if you can put on auto pilot and not mess with it,
Hey, a couple of updates because I have some questions about--
-Yeah, what's up?
-student loan refinancing.
Student loans now-- new student loans are about to go up to interest rate as supposed to double from 3.4% to 6.8%.
I think they could probably come to a deal about it in Washington but there's a been a ton of press about student reifies and you should do it, you shouldn't do it.
I just want everyone to know, if you got a student loan, if you have a federal product, a federal loan, the Federal Government has a website which is called loanconsolidation.ed.gov.
-And you go to that website and there's like some cool calculators there and you'll figure out whether it's worth it to consolidate
your loans to current interest rates.
It may not be worth it.
If you have a private loan, it is so hard to refinance.
I wouldn't really even drive yourself too crazy.
There's like maybe a half dozen different companies that do it.
Be very careful with these reifies.
Sometimes it looks like your payment is going down because they're just adding years to the loan.
-And that's not so [unk], right?
I mean, so you gotta know what you're doing.
And last thing is more--
-That little PSA, I love it.
-I know, right.
-I just went--
I got on the phone with my buddy, the mortgage broker, Mikey Raimi, Mike Raimi at WCS Lending.
-Oh, that's my guy.
-He says, the mortgage rates have spiked over the last two weeks.
-And I called them up just to find out what was going on and he said it was unbelievable, he said that we were at three and three As for a 30-year fixed rate mortgage.
-And what's it at now?
-Four percent in two weeks.
-Well, that's a lot.
-That's a big jump.
So, what's interesting about
it is he said he found that people were waiting.
They said, oh, 3 and 3 Ace and he said, hey, no, you should just do it now and he-- people were like, forget it.
I'll wait 'til it goes down.
So, this is what he told me.
They were waiting for it to go from 3 and 3 As to 3-1/4, which you know, I say on an average loan of a-- I don't know, like $300,000 mortgage?
It would save you like 20 bucks a month to wait-- by waiting and missing it and now rates are up.
-It's costing an extra 120.
-Well, to reify but you wouldn't
-Well, that's-- the thing is that like, what he was saying is it was unbelievable that like at the time when rates were at their all time lows, people were still so greedy and saying, I'll wait for it to go down even more.
-That they miss their opportunity.
-Do you think it's gonna go back down?
-I don't know.
I mean, the reason why interest rates are rising is that there is a perception that the economy is getting better and that the federal reserve may not keep doing all the stuff it's doing to pump up the economy.
So, people-- investors were saying, well,
if that's the case, then interest a rate are gonna go to more normal levels, right?
-Right, they make a difference there.
-They're gonna be more normal.
So, what I think is if you can, you know, if you can qualify for a reify and the numbers makes sense, you go ahead and do it.
Stop waiting around for things to get better.
-It's still great.
If you have a 6% loan and you're reifying at 4, it's awesome.
Who cares if you missed 3.375?
-And he also said that if you have like credit scores and become really interesting, he said that if you've got a credit score for a
conventional loan, it used to be that you could get like the best rate with a 700 and [unk] 740 now.
-Why is that?
Well, there's more--
-Because they're getting--
-I got it.
-Getting choosier and the credit score doesn't matter as much if you have a shorter term loan.
So, if you have 15-year mortgage, don't freak out about your credit score.
-30-year-- you gotta worry about it.
-Rock and roll.
This is a good deal.
This is great.
We gotta say goodbye.
-Thank you for all the information.
-You know what's really sad--
-It's not sad, you were here all the time.
-I like that.
Makes me feel better.
-What are you gonna say?
What is sad?
-It's said as that
we're not having lunch today but--
-Oh, come on.
-Jeff and I cheated on Justin last time.
-Yeah we did.
-You guys went out to lunch?
-Best lunch I've ever had.
-And guess what, Jeff paid.
-You missed that.
-Sucks to be you.
-Which I don't have the dollar menu did you get?
-I can't even believe that you got lost in the woods.
I feel like--
-You gotta listen, Jill.
-What is that movie-- what's that scary movie where they were lost in the woods?
So, I was like--
-It's called Lost in the Woods.
-Cabin in the Woods?
I don't know.
-Cabin in the Woods.
I don't know.
-I don't know.
-Oh, Evil Dead?
-The Evil Dead is like that.
-No, it's like-- one who has like a
-Oh, Blair Witch.
-Blair Witch, yeah.
-Yeah, I agree.
That's it, that's what I'm imagining.
-Yeah, it's just like that.
[unk] we didn't feel any of it, we're too busy, pardon me.
-You should survive and get--
-I-- you know what I'm gonna predict right now?
-This whole experience for him.
I'm predicting engagement.
We'll be dancing the Horah that Justin Yu's [unk].
-What is that?
Are you gonna teach me that dance?
-That's gonna be a fun wedding.
You didn't see that on my wedding day?
I think they did that.
-They dance in a circle.
-Oh, I did see that.
That one that put you up on the chair?
He did the whole chair thing.
-With a little move, with the [unk] and all that crap.
-It was cool, yeah it was cool.
It's the highlight for me.
-I'm like, get me down off this chair right now.
-Before we say goodbye, this is gonna be-- we talked about making corrections like the times does.
-Yes and amplifications and corrections.
-We're-- I'm gonna do one because it was like I'm very blessed from this error.
-And I want to fix.
-[unk] but yesterday we had someone off from Spotify, Shanon Cook, who you like very much.
-And we were going over
lyrics that are misheard.
-And one of the classic ones that someone put in the chatroom was the song Purple Haze, excuse me while I kiss this guy.
-But it's excuse me while I kiss the sky, obviously, right?
-So, we for whatever reason, I think it was-- I read what the chatroom said and the guy said it.
Said it was a Lenny Kravitz song.
-It is clearly not Lenny Kravitz.
We all know this.
-It's a Jimmy Hendrix song.
-So, I just wanna get that out there because--
-That's a blasphemous exactly.
-It's kind of blasphemous.
You're talking about
like rock royalty here.
I mean, that's kind of a blasphemous move and we got blasted on Twitter specifically by one guy, Jonathan.
I just wanna say, Jonathan, I'm right there with you, buddy.
-Jonathan, we're so sorry.
-We agree it's a terrible mistake.
-It's a horrible mistake but really, could you start worrying about, like global warming instead of these issues?
I mean, people need to like--
-You were there.
-get to wrap their minds.
-You were there.
You saw it firsthand.
It's not no one-- it's like-- I get it.
I think people are still like upset like, oh, is it us that's doing?
It doesn't matter who's doing it anymore.
-That's the thing.
Like you can't deny water levels are rising.
-And that's-- to me like, all right.
Even if it's still, that's really happening.
-On the way back from the-- I was trying to stay up, so I watch three movies.
One of them was Promise Land, which was very interesting about the whole fracking thing.
-It's really-- it was a very interesting and well done movie.
Very John Krasinski and cutie pie, what's his name?
I'm losing my mind.
-John Krasinski from The Office.
-Did you watch the end of The Office, by the way?
-You don't care.
-I didn't think the last three seasons were very good.
-You stop watching that too.
-No, I didn't watch it.
Is it good?
-There was one-- I liked it when Steve Carell came back.
-That was fun.
-That was cute.
There's just-- no, so much to talk about and did you watch The Americans or not?
-I think my brother said he was into it and there's too much TV.
-The rest of development and all that stuff.
-And also don't forget August breaking bad last season.
-Oh, well, okay.
-I'm gonna watch the entire show on my trip to LA.
-Try to give you that.
I think I have the first five or six seasons.
-Oh, don't you worry about that.
-You're all set?
-I got it locked down.
It's all good.
-Thanks to Jill.
Go to jillonmoney.com.
Follow Jill on Twitter, @jillonmoney, listen to her program and just get involved.
-Yeah, do it.
-Send me your questions, ask Jill at jillonmoney.com.
Anytime you have a financial question.
-And there you have it.
We're back tomorrow with a brand new show.
On Friday, we welcome
Mr. John Hogdman to the program.
That's gonna be a lot of fun.
-You don't know who John Hodgman is?
-He is a regular on The Daily Show.
He's an actor.
-He's got a Podcsat.
-He-- I think he's doing something right now that's really good.
-That maybe we'll learn a little bit more about.
But he is here on Friday and that's how it'll finish up the week.
-Oh, my God.
It's already Wednesday.
We'll see you guys tomorrow.
I'm Jeff Bakalar.
-I'm Justin Yu.
-I'm Aunt Jill.
-I'm Ariel NuÃ±ez.
-This has been The 404 Show.
High tech, low brow.
Thanks again to Jill.
We'll see you guys tomorrow.
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