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General discussion

You know we're in trouble when

Dec 3, 2003 7:57AM PST

both conservatives and liberals are criticizing the Republican Congress.

We expect Molly Ivins to be critical
http://www.dfw.com/mld/startelegram/news/columnists/molly_ivins/7362899.htm

"These Republicans have talent. It is not easy to do this much damage to people's lives with a straight face and that unctuous air of piety.

I like the timing, too -- they slipped that Medicare deform bill through just in time for the drug companies, the insurance companies and the HMOs to give loud hosannas around their Thanksgiving tables.

The Health Reform Program of Boston University estimates that of the bill's $400 billion price tag, $139 billion will go to increase drug company profits over eight years -- a 38 percent increase in what is already the world's most profitable industry.

In case you haven't been keeping up (and you do have to race to keep up), there is a gasoline additive called MTBE that has polluted ground water across the country. So naturally the Republicans have put in a provision that would limit the liability of the manufacturers of MTBE -- that means you can't sue them for ruining the water -- and the bill would give the companies up to $2 billion in federal aid."

And that's just the beginning.

What we don't expect is Cal Thomas
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/calthomas/ct20031126.shtml

"The just concluded (thankfully) Congress is an embarrassment to itself and everyone who favors smaller government. This Republican Congress, in addition to increasing spending on entitlements and expanding big government - like the Democrats they once criticized - also dished out $95 billion in tax breaks and pork-barrel projects.

The Heritage Foundation's Brian M. Riedl says mandatory government spending will reach 11.1 percent of GDP this year, a record high, and non-defense discretionary spending in 2003 will amount to 3.9 percent of GDP for the first time since 1985. Riedl also predicts taxes will inevitably have to be raised to pay for it all. What politician wants to be demagogued about cutting "essential services"?"

Discussion is locked

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(NT) Compared to Congress (in general) we in NC barely raise any 'pork'.
Dec 3, 2003 9:20AM PST
Wink
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What surprised me is that AARP approved of that Medicare Bill.
Dec 3, 2003 5:04PM PST

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Was somebody wined and dined?

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Ever hear of the term
Dec 3, 2003 6:39PM PST

In their ads advocating passage of the bill, AARP refers to it as "a good start". The implication is that they can come back later and "fix it" (read: make it even more expensive than the $400 billion over 10 years estimate).

About that estimate: Government never gets estimates of the cost on entitlement programs right. When enacted in 1965, Medicare/Medicaid spending was estimated to be $90 billion in 1990. The programs actually cost $390 billion - a 400% increase over the estimates. That's why I and many others actually expect this prescription drug entitlement to cost more like $1 trillion (that's a thousand thousand million) over the next 10 years - with or without the AARP's "fixes".

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(NT) Forum quote bug got me, Rosalie; should read. 'Ever hear of the term 'incrementalism' ?'
Dec 3, 2003 6:46PM PST

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Let's not forget that the fraud in Medicare and Medicaid is appalling.
Dec 4, 2003 3:25AM PST

Some of that money should be spent on combating that fraud and in so doing reduce the cost by a huge percentage. Only time the fraud gets any attention is when it reaches an astronomical level as it did recently with the motorized wheel chair business. All they have to do is watch TV and magazine ads to get clues. Hospitals and clinics are sprouting like weeds. This money is coming from somewhere.

A lot of that "entitlement" money is going somewhere other than to actually pay for the patient's needed medical costs and care. If you look at any EOB you might see a doctor's charge of $1,239.80 and Medicare paid $345.67. It no wonder that many doctors are refusing Medicare patients. Labs and hospitals are doing a bang up business in charging for a lot of unnecessary test, treatments and equipment that hardly benefit the patient. Another case of the rich getting richer and the guy on the bottom getting shafted. Don't forget those with Medicare insurance pay for it.

It looks like the Medicare patient will see very little benifit from this recent drug bill. Why is it going to cost so much?

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About paying for Medicare ...
Dec 4, 2003 7:23AM PST

It would be more accurate to say that the beneficiaries pay a little bit of the cost. The actual cost of the program far exceeds the premiums paid by people who pay for office coverage.

A large portion of Medicare is paid for via the ~2% payroll tax that comes out of paychecks. I don't remember if there is an employer 'match' for that payroll tax like there is for Social Security. That payroll tax theoretically pays for most of the Medicare tax after the worker retires, but the payroll tax is not bringing in enough money to keep Medicare solvent. That is why there have been so many noises about 'reforming Medicare'. If the system is not fixed in some fashion then it won't be solvent when some of us get old enough to qualify.

The new Medicare bill won't fix the problem. In fact it may make the situation worse.

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Don't foget!
Dec 5, 2003 3:33AM PST
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That didn't even occur to me, Dan! Makes me angry to say the least.
Dec 5, 2003 4:51AM PST

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I have always believed that AARP was truly an advocate for the retired and especially the elderly. This really throws a different light on them and I'm disappointed
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Feet of clay. nt
Dec 5, 2003 5:47AM PST

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Re:You know we're in trouble when
Dec 3, 2003 9:12PM PST

Hi Diana,

There are a lot of fiscal conservative/small government types out there who have been dogging the Republican Congress and the President for quite some time. Forget the spending on the war, domestic spending is outta control. It's hard to compete with the "bread and circuses" when 50% don't pay income taxes to support the programs they disproportionately benefit from.

Evie Happy

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I've about decided both sides are right about the other
Dec 4, 2003 8:51AM PST

The left claims the Republicans only care about huge business interest, trample on the poor etc.

The right claims that Democrats will take more and more to give to the poor that are unwilling to earn their own way.

Well they both got on thing right, the government takes it out of my pocket and puts it in someone elses most of the time. And sadly with little good effect for me, the poor, or the nation.

The idea of less government is only a fairy tail too, government is just like any organic tissue, it seeks to eat, grow, and reproduce until it dies.

roger

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nt) someone starts a new thread on Se. FOCL
Dec 4, 2003 9:52AM PST

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FOCL?
Dec 4, 2003 10:30AM PST

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nt) Falling off chair laughing
Dec 4, 2003 11:26AM PST

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