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General discussion

WWhhhatttt?

Sep 13, 2017 1:31PM PDT
With Irma and Harvey devastation, Tax Cuts and Tax Reform is needed more than ever before.

An "unexpected expense"...(2 hurricanes) the country is already not operating at a profit....AND a "tax cut/reduced income" is "needed".

IF you ran YOUR household like TheRUMP wants to run the country?

Filing for bankruptcy?

Discussion is locked

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WWhhhatttt do you think?
Sep 13, 2017 5:14PM PDT

Do you think that it's just government money that provides the assistance? Read up about all of the other disaster relief agencies and aid from corporate America that's coming in. Go ahead and let the government raise taxes on all the companies and people who are giving from their own pockets as well as coming to the scene on their own time and at their expense. Take the money away that could be donated and used to provide direct aid and filter it through the government first.

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Maybe he feels these sort of officials...
Sep 13, 2017 5:24PM PDT

....should have all that money and taking care of it. Remember Mayor "Chocolate City" Nagin? He who left all the buses to get flooded instead of using them to evacuate people. He who refused govt help because he was "da man", the boss? Hmm, what's he been up to lately???

ON NO, say it's not so! Seems he's gone to jail in 2014 for 10 years.

Ray Nagin, who served as the mayor of New Orleans during the devastation of Hurricane Katrina, was sentenced Wednesday to 10 years in prison following his conviction on a host of corruption charges.

But never fear, our "hero of Katrina" will be out in 2024 at the latest, and maybe like Marion Barry, former crack smoking Mayor of DC, he can also get reelected as Mayor again.

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Nagin wasn't "in it for the money"
Sep 13, 2017 7:26PM PDT

“I’m not in it for the money,” Nagin said after he was elected to the first of two terms in 2002.

And TheRUMP is so rich he didn't need any of the hassle in his life......... according to some.

Must be something that attracts a certain type of person to politics....I wonder what it is.

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The Russian thing is not of interest to me, but
Sep 14, 2017 7:39PM PDT

there was a recent "legit news" comment that fits here. Someone said, 'If Trump people did contact Putin about campaign $, then one conclusion is that he's not as wealthy as he wants people to think.'

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RE:Do you think that it's just government money that provide
Sep 13, 2017 7:15PM PDT
Do you think that it's just government money that provides the assistance?

JUST?........NO........You're NOT saying that there is NO government/taxpayer money involved are you? It's ALL from "donations"?

Go ahead and let the government raise taxes on all the companies and people who are giving from their own pockets

They don't get a "tax deduction" for charitable donations in America? We do in Canada.

TheRUMP...never let a disaster go to waste.....
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Charitable deductions
Sep 14, 2017 1:35AM PDT

Such deductions are only legal if given through such as 501c organizations and require that one be able to show proof that the money was received. What you'll have in such cases is people provide direct aid to individuals in need...the way it would have been done before government bureaucracies existed long ago. No...that system wasn't perfect but taking money from generous folks who would help if they had the money is not the answer. Having to give it to the government instead, is neither efficient, fast, or satisfying. Sorry there Mr. Bill, but the whole idea that such disasters should be the governments responsibility to handle and dole out money for is not my idea of how a free society should operate.

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RE: Having to give it to the government instead,
Sep 14, 2017 3:00AM PDT
Having to give it to the government instead,And, in another post in this thread, you said Take the money away that could be donated and used to provide direct aid and filter it through the government first..

Filter it through the government first?

I have no idea where you got that from in any of my posts.

THIS is a Trump tweet, not my words...HIS words

With Irma and Harvey devastation, Tax Cuts and Tax Reform is needed more than ever before. Go Congress, go!

My logic is...

It is the "government services" municipal, state and federal that are involved in the cleanup AND the repair of infrastructure....so it's taxpayer money.....NOT donations...

I don't recall of ever hearing of taking "donations" to build a bridge on a state highway, perhaps America has privately owned state roads...but then would someone be making a "donation" OR would they be a "shareholder"?
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You don't get it, do you...
Sep 14, 2017 3:47AM PDT

Here's my thinking. Money taken away from people in taxes to pay government employees to do what individuals and charities can do is not efficient. Government will have a responsibility and that is for damage done to what government has provided. This, primarily, is infrastructure. Such things can be budgeted for. Disasters do happen and "rainy day" funds can be in that budget.
And here is a concept you may never understand if you've relied to much on government to take care of your needs. We are a society of citizens who should be helping each other. Disasters such as these aren't just something to have government put behind us. It's a great opportunity for individual citizens to meet people they'd otherwise never get to know and work together rather than continue with any prejudices they might have. Too much government care isolates us from one another. I dare to say that much of the, and much exaggerated, cries of racism and various phobias are caused by this isolation that government has helped to create through political division as candidates seek to find creative ways to gather votes for themselves rather than address the challenges of increasing diversity. I'm done here.

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RE: You don't get it, do you...
Sep 14, 2017 5:59AM PDT

You say

Government will have a responsibility and that is for damage done to what government has provided. This, primarily, is infrastructure. Such things can be budgeted for.

AND I said

It is the "government services" municipal, state and federal that are involved in the cleanup AND the repair of infrastructure....so it's taxpayer money.....NOT donations...

And I don't "get it"?

Don't you think both statements are saying the same thing?

RE:Such things can be budgeted for.

They "can be" BUT were they?

Since there is already a deficit....I say NO!!!!

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There is always going to be a deficit......
Sep 14, 2017 12:00PM PDT

And it's from LAST year's budget to pay THIS year's stuff....so since nobody anticipated two massive hurricanes coming THIS year, they weren't budgeted for....under BO's budget year.

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RE: There is always going to be a deficit.....
Sep 14, 2017 1:30PM PDT

AND when there is?

I don't think it's a wise move to INCREASE the deficit AND REDUCE income.

Bookkeeping 101?

HOW to go bankrupt?

Obama IS gone...Exactly WHEN does TheRUMP start taking responsibility?

so since nobody anticipated two massive hurricanes coming THIS year,

AND it appears they didn't anticipate them coming last year, OR the year before, OR the year before,...BECAUSE there were no massive hurricanes LAST year and there is NO money (deficit)....Obama got lucky, TheRUMP wasn't so lucky.....still a deficit...but not as much pressure on the taxpayer because of the hurricanes.

Like I said....IF it was a household...you'd be filing for bankruptcy....

they weren't budgeted for....under BO's budget year.

AND TheRUMP is "budgeting" for hurricanes by cutting taxes?

Paying for the latest 2 hurricanes AND budgeting for any new hurricanes?

Please explain.

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Give Toni a break
Sep 14, 2017 2:17PM PDT

She filters everything that's going on in the world through her anti BO/Dem filter.

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BO
Sep 14, 2017 3:43PM PDT

Stimulus, Cash for Clunkers, $8000 credit towards buying a house, a second autobailout..........increasing the deficit to a TRILLION+ every year for FOUR years in a row (then bragging about cutting it half when it was only HIS deficit that actually was cut in half and not GWB's like he said he would cut)......and how did HE fix it? He got millions of people to lose their health insurance, forced them into Obamacare and raised their premiums by over 50% every year and INCREASED the budget every year for more liberal program spending even with sequestration in place.....that HE suggested.

That's not a filter, Bob.......them's are the FACTS.....and there are plenty more of them.

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Re: BO
Sep 14, 2017 7:19PM PDT

Give it a rest.
You have your anti BO grudge list written down and you keep trotting it out.
It's over/done BO's not the prez anymore.
BO was a bit too liberal for me but I don't hold a grudge.
I'll sit back and watch this new bunch make a mess.

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Give it a rest?
Sep 15, 2017 2:19AM PDT

Do a search here in SE for how many liberals couldn't/wouldn't let go of GWB for over 8 years........

And although you might not hold a grudge, you are very quick to assume that this 'new bunch' will 'make a mess'........Do you believe that BO made many messes that this 'new bunch' now has to clean up?

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OH! I see
Sep 15, 2017 4:07AM PDT

"Do a search here in SE for how many liberals couldn't/wouldn't let go of GWB for over 8 years........"

So now you have another grudge and it's get even time.

Bo did some things I did not like.
I'm sure this admin will do the same.
I'll sit back and watch.

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For someone who keeps
Sep 15, 2017 1:02PM PDT

repeating in nearly every post that you are going to 'sit back and watch', you do a lot of vocalizing your unhappiness/distrust of Trump....but, like JP, you don't say what you DIDN'T like about BO. Care to voice that?

Interesting though that you would also say "I'm sure this admin will do the same"....does that mean that there will be SOME things you don't like, but SOME you will?

I have no grudge.....I have FACTS about BO's abuse of power and lies to the American people about his agenda and how badly it would affect them all.

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Speaking of "lies"
Sep 15, 2017 1:42PM PDT
TheRUMP and LIES..Synonymous?

About 57,500,000 results (0.45 seconds)

Obama and LIES...Synonymous?

About 37,800,000 results (0.56 seconds)

TheRUMP WINS the Popular Vote THIS time? By approx 20 million votes?

It's a wonder HE hasn't been bragging about it.

And they voted for 'change" ....bigger liars are better?
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For someone
Sep 15, 2017 4:40PM PDT

I did not like Trump when he was running for prez.
I thought he was too much me/me/me I/I/I.

I did not like Clinton when she was running for prez.
I could not tell what to make of her with the baggage she was carrying.

Admin.
Yes I think there will be some things I like and don't.

Bo.
He's not the prez, give your grudge/fact sheet a rest.
I do not keep a score card about things I like or disliked about past presidents.

Between liberals picking on GWB and BO doing what you did not like these must have been painful years for you.

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You're the one
Sep 16, 2017 3:07AM PDT

who said that there were some things that BO did that you didn't like....but I don't recall you being here to tell any of us in REAL time what those things were. Could you tell us about them now?

I also don't recall you stating any of the things that that you may not have liked about hilLIARy, but you continue to post about things that you don't like about Trump.

It appears to me that I'm not the only one with a filter....but you are quick to point out mine. Why?

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Re:You're the one
Sep 16, 2017 3:53AM PDT

who said that there were some things that BO did that you didn't like....but I don't recall you being here to tell any of us in REAL time what those things were. Could you tell us about them now?

No....I don't keep a multi year grudge list.
It's over/done it's in the past.
------------
It appears to me that I'm not the only one with a filter....but you are quick to point out mine. Why?

Because you have multi years of past wrongs built up and you won't let it go.
My filter is what's going on today not what happened 4/8 years ago.

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Then your filter is faulty
Sep 16, 2017 7:38AM PDT

History has proven time and time again that if you don't learn from history, you will repeat it hoping for different results. Unfortunately most established Republicans and nearly all liberal Democrats keep forgetting the proven history. I'm here to remind them as often as possible.

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Filter
Sep 16, 2017 8:20AM PDT

If you want to filter what's going on today through events that happened 4/8/12 years ago that's your business.

Times/the economy/the world/the environment has changed.

As near as I can tell pols make decisions based on keeping their job.

Nothing to do with history.

That's why I sit back and watch what's happening today.

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past presidents and their crims
Sep 16, 2017 9:05AM PDT
"I do not keep a score card about things I like or disliked about past presidents."

What about their past crimes for which they've not yet been punished?
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Crimes
Sep 16, 2017 9:35AM PDT

Presidents are sort of immune from the law unless they go way off.
What you think is a crime may be iffy when applied to the prez.

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My knowledge of bankruptcy is that
Sep 14, 2017 9:17PM PDT

a creditor can trigger it involuntarily by one's insolvency - liabilities bigger than assets. IOW it doesn't take missed payments.t Most of us are insolvent, by that standard, if we had to go "all in". No one cares because we all live day by day, and pay off our debts eventually.
Federal governments are likewise insolvent, except for one asset that trumps (!) it: unlimited taxing power; "the full faith and credit" of the government are behind its bonds e.g. That's how they finance wars.
So bankruptcy and insolvency are irrelevant terms.
If the situation goes on long enough, in historical terms, then the "faith" part is lost and collapse follows. Gibbon says the "Fall" of Rome took from Augustus to Marcus Aurelius, anyway, if not later, at the loss of Europeean colonies.
A problem that existed then but is worse now is overextension. Wars being fought on three fronts: Middle East, Afghanistan, Homeland Security aka antiterrorism. Infrastructure needs, including disaster-related. An alienated 99%, increasingly so. The economists' term "scarce resources" becoming more relevant outside the classroom.
The punchline - you've been waiting for it: Those are some of the problems facing your government, but not mine. Haggai 2:6-9.

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Do you mean like this, Steven?
Sep 15, 2017 12:11AM PDT
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A little late (I've been traveling) but
Sep 18, 2017 1:28PM PDT

my point was simply that handing over tax money to the government is a poor replacement for that same money being used by individual citizens and other charities in serving the same purpose. It's not a concept easy to explain to anyone who believes government is "go-to" choice to look for solutions where trouble exists. Government does serve a purpose but the services it can provide effectively, efficiently, and better than anyone else is limited. There's very much a coldness that comes with government aid that does not come with people to people contact. Another difficult need to explain is the need to give. In my church, we learn that people in need are gifts to people who want to and can address those needs. Giving through the government doesn't provide the same "good karma" that giving directly or by other charitable means does. We need that good karma. Sappy sounding...I know.

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"...never let a disaster go to waste....."
Sep 14, 2017 1:41AM PDT

And, on your part, never waste any opportunity to bash the president?...even if there's no way to spin it without wobbling?