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General discussion

Windows Vista Bugs

Feb 12, 2007 3:26AM PST

I have been a faithful Windows user since 3.0 and I really though that nothing could be worse than Windows ME. Vista in the early stages is worse. Windows ME had its problems, but you could get support/help from 3rd party vendors. Upgrading to Vista has been a real challenge... and I feel like I'm walking through this maze all alone. So many software and hardware items don't work with Vista and third party vendors have not developed a fix yet. Virus protection... No, AOL security... NO, ATT security suite... No. Problems that were none existent yesterday are here today. The drivers for my video card, cd-rom drive and D-link usb adapter worked yesterday. Now, nothing but problem messages. I've always fought the good PC vs. MAC fight and found the MAC commercials to be amusing. But, I've never given thought to joining the MAC legions until now. If Vista wasn't ready for a release that would be seamless for the upgrade crowd, It should have been noted. And the Vista Advisor is another matter for another conversation. Why give the green light to a system for upgrade and then present you with a different reality post upgrade?

Discussion is locked

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Vista is a joke and everyone with an iq over 50 should know
Mar 14, 2007 1:25PM PDT

What a bunch of clowns. Upgrading to Vista, what a joke. That POS has more bugs than a stray dog. The government should have stopped him from making new operating systems until he debugged Windows 98. LOL What possible reason would anybody upgrade.

I'm going to buy a final complete install of XP home edition on Ebay so I have something to run if I hire someone to build me a new computer. I will buy extra keyboards and mice to keep me going. At 62 I should be able to get by with one more computer. Dell and the others with their Vista systems and their help desk in India can all kiss my a$$$$$$.

Those of you dumb enough to buy vista got exactly what you deserve!!!

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

noelvm

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Mindfulness of Vista
Mar 14, 2007 1:27PM PDT

Any who leap before looking may end up someplace they did not expect to be. It sounds like the move to Vista has been made by consumers without understanding the affect of that move. Personally I know I will be moving to Vista in the next year and I am already planning on the changes that I will need to make other than the operating system I choose. A new laptop is on my list along with MS Office 2007 and a new printer. Other concerns are the PC dependent devices I use such as my GPS and mapping software, my digital camera, a PDA, cellphone and iPod. Wow... making the change to Vista seems daunting. But then I compare to selling a home and buying a new one. Why did I do that last year... it was the return of having a new home that met my growing needs and changes in lifstyle. Vista is an upgrade to meet growing needs and lifstyles. I have also made similar choices in choosing a new vehicle. I gave up my SUV a couple of years back for a sportcar and I am now considering a supplemental vehicle such as a small pickup truck. In all these I have been mindful that change is required and that this is the nature of life. With the advances in technology and my ever changing uses for technology is it fair for me to expect that change does not come without effort? I leave it to each who read this to be mindful of their own lives and what choices they make are their own. Life is change, growth is optional, choose wisely.

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backup wont backup
Mar 14, 2007 1:27PM PDT

My husband bought a computer this year with the Vista windows and since he doesnt have time for a lot of the maintenence of his computer, I, his wife, does this.

We have been noticing messages keeps popping up on the monitor since I did the Recovery Discs for his machine. At the time I did this it seemed everything was going well. One message says that the backup failed. and the other message says we are running low on disc space, and the message suggests we run the disc cleaner. I have done the latter part, but seems like this message keeps popping up. And I have no idea how to correct the disc backup failure. Microsoft really gave people a bum product. I am glad I got my computer before Vista came out.

C J Olney

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Vista Bugs
Mar 14, 2007 1:28PM PDT

After Bill Gates delivered his speech to Congress saying American workers are a species to be annihilated as quickly and efficiently as possible, I don't put anything past him.

Vista is his way of trying to jumpstart a dormant computer industry. The ante for running Vista has been made so high that the only real way to make it run correctly [if that's even possible] is to buy a new computer.

He has made a lot of software obsolete and is forcing the folks who move to Vista shell out for new versions of software [read: Nero, all Anti-virus programs, all Firewalls, etc]. How many average consumers out there will actually ask a salesman if a copy of such-&-such software will work? Not many.

It's a black hole, with no seeming end and no logical solutions.

Linux may never be ready for prime time. Macs are OK if you're not truly a hardcore gamer. MS is the only game in town & the piper will always be paid.

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Go To Mac? I don't think so.
Mar 14, 2007 1:31PM PDT

I just switched from Mac back to PC. That's right. It was a year of hell. Yes, Mac does offer a simple and working system but if you're looking for OS problems with third party software - boy are you in for it when it comes to Mac. It was a tech who repairs Macs that told me many users have complained when they woke up one morning and found a OS update (very much like the Windows ones) suddenly caused problems with third pary software and scanners and printers. Patches were NOT every provided by Apple, simply because Apple doesn't care - as far as they are conderned it's up to the company who made that scanner or printer (since Mac only has about 5% of the computer market that means you might be waiting a long while. And lets just mention how Apple just pulled the only proper working cam for their top of the line monitors without cams built in. First they sell the iSight cam for about $150. then over a year later they market a brace for it for monitors when it should have come with the cam in the first place. Next, they discontinue the cam leaving owers with a built in program that is incompatible with other cams and features. Add to all this how few programs there are out there for the system and how over priced the ones that are needed are as well. Apple NEVER extends its warrentary beyond 3yrs (Unlike Dell which give the option of extending beyond 4yrs at a yearly rate). As I was told by the tech it's because they built and produce their own parts so when a certain design is abandoned the parts last as long as they are on the shelf - there is NOTHING interchangeable about them. In the end one can be very quickly stuck with a expensive paperweight. When my unit, the Power Mac G5 started to fail due to a power issue (which I learned from an almost hidden page on the Apple site) it was like pulling teeth to get an in home tech (which I had pre-paid for) to come to my home. Apple first made me schlep my unit to the nearest Apple Store where it was tested (?) for 48hrs and to which nothing was found wrong. They and even the at home tech hadn't even hard of the problems with the powerboard - I had to print it from the website to get the part needed. When I needed advice from the Apple store about a program and no one could answer my question - they simply and smuggly stated that it could do what I was looking for simpley because it was for MAC. I later found out I not only had to purchase a $1200. program but another for an additional $800. to do what I found on PC for only $400.!, and even on some programs that sold for $50.! As told by the tech Apple feels they design and produce computers. They are NOT responsible for anything else, which of coursr mean supplying patches. When I posted my story on the Apple site message board for advise from other my post was struck in 15mins. I posted again, and again I found it deleted. I've had Vista almost a month now and in that time all but one program has been given a patch. With that kind of service from various companies I can't complain. Switch to Mac? I DON'T THINK SO!

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Microsoft is to blame...
Mar 14, 2007 1:33PM PDT

Microsfot needed to design backwards compatability into it's OS. If you buy a new PC you should not be required to buy new versions of your software to run on it. It should be a simple matter of being able to install your old hardware & software. I will stay away from Vista for this reason.

Poor planning and design on the part of Microsoft They are 100% responsible.

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Microsoft not to blame
Mar 14, 2007 1:33PM PDT

Microsoft can't possibly be responible for every driver and compatability issue that involves Vista. They told us ahead of time the operating system would work differently. Virus and firewall programs were told they would not be allowed into the kernel. Microsoft could make generic drivers to cover a lot, but not everything. BUT, some of the third party vendors have had in my opinion, plenty of time to come up with drivers. HP in particular seems to not really care. They gave some of us a generic printer driver that would work, but I know folks who still have no driver at all. Panda did give their security suite users access to a virus program, but we are still waiting on the full security suite. Roxio claims Easy Media Creator 9 works with Vista, but this is not intirely true. There is a driver compatability issue that Vista disables, But Roxio says its not big deal. WRONG, the audio capture program does not work, cannot set the recording levels properly with Realtek audio driver thru the Roxio program. Must do it thru Realtek. Vista seems sound, so I say the blame lies on the third party software vendors who seem to not be in any hurry to catch up, figuring Microsoft will catch all the blame. And for all you Microsoft haters, why are you even bothering to be involved in Microsoft dealings. Stay on your Macs, or Firefox and leave the rest of us alone.

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Dump microsoft, move on to Linux.
Mar 14, 2007 1:33PM PDT

I've had enough of Gates' world and have very happily moved on (or is it up?) to Linux, Ubuntu to be precise. It was a very easy and FAST install. If you go to find a Linux user group, they will eagerly help any way they can! There is no longer any point in putting up with microsoft and the questionable software the company puts forth. I've regained total control over my computers and network, I don't have to re-install more often than I can remember, far less fears of intrusions, viruses, worms, spyware, etc. No patches for this, that and the other thing. Very few if any security problems. Free help any time of the day or night on chats or in forums. Dell will soon be offering portables with Linux installed. Open Office does everthing that msOffice can, faster and better AND it can read more formats than Office applications can... For browsing there's Firefox and for e-mail, Thunderbird. You can have everthing as simple as point and click, or you can go command line. The only thing that will lose is worrying about what will happen next and you'll gain freedom from slavery to micro-not-$o-$oft...
The clay-feet giant is about to come crashing down...

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Microsoft not to Blame (completely)
Mar 14, 2007 1:37PM PDT

I began using Vista about the time of the beta2 release and can say now that the third party manufacturers (TPMS) are to blame for any incompatibilities with the new OS and not Microsoft.

Microsoft has given enough time for TPM's to develop and test their software and hardware with Vista and have no excuse for it not to work. As well they are also responsible for any technical support that should acompany said products.

That said, MS also dropped the ball with their slow development on Vista to begin with and their not forcing TPM's to upgrade their software and drivers to be compatible.

It is now the third month since Vista's release and many bugs and driver issues have been fixed. In fact when I installed Vista on my laptop, I found the drivers from ATI actually upped my graphics card max memory to 256mb shared in addition to the 128 dedicated.

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Mac is not the answer
Mar 14, 2007 1:38PM PDT

If photoham had trouble with Vista, they will surely have trouble with Mac. The software and hardward variety offerings by Mac has improved, but is no where near the variety offered by Windows. There is lies some of the problem. Windows is so user friendly that almost anyone can write a program or create a device that is compatible with it. Then if the inventor does not conform to "Windows" platform, Microsoft gets the blame. It is truly a "Catch-22" type of problem. The main problem is really a lack of cooperation between both Microsoft and the third party producers. Much of the lack of cooperation can be laid at the feet of the lawyers. Microsoft does not want to collude with anyone, but needs to have a product that they can call their own. There needs to be some middle ground here, but the competition will stifle most of it.

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I am staying with XP for the foreseeable future.
Mar 14, 2007 1:40PM PDT

After testing a Vista installation on an Intel Core2-Duo platform I have decided to stay with XP. I don't have time to start searching for a myriad of device drivers and software fixes specially when using Vista is not giving me anything additional. I refuse to surrender to Vista pretty face. Maybe a year from now drivers and software fixes will be readily available. Take for example 3Ware RAID controllers drivers. Their 8000 models is not what you could call vintage. They are in the 9000 models now. 8000 models are still widely available in stores. But a couple of weeks ago they came out with the announcement that they will not release supported drivers for Vista for their 8000 models. So users will have to use drivers that will stay in the "Engineering Phase" forever. In their own words "Official support for the 7000/8000 Vista drivers will not be available".
My opinion is that both Microsoft and the soft/hardware manufacturers are to blame. Microsoft for not releasing information to the soft/hardware manufacturers early enough (as in the case of McAfee) and some manufacturers for refusing to supply their clients with decent and supported drivers (as 3WARE).

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readily available
Mar 14, 2007 1:49PM PDT

MVarela. just guessing, but don't consider anything you find at Walmart current. A lot of the computer related items they sell are on the verge of being outdated. That is not the place to buy computer hardware

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More on reasonably current hardware
Mar 15, 2007 12:37AM PDT

Being a PC builder for many years (besides being a full time BSEE, PE with my own engineering enterprise - www.mevepr.com - and Director of Engineering at another - www.ltapr.com - ) I do most of my hardware shopping at Newegg.com. 5 out of their 23 3Ware items lineup are 7000/8000 models. So, most likely 3Ware is still manufacturing them. Abandoning support for a new OS is not exactly a good policy, specially for a sensitive item such as a RAID controller.

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At least the Upgrade Advisor worked for you!
Mar 14, 2007 1:42PM PDT

At least the Upgrade Advisor worked for you. I'm running Windows XP SP 2 with all of the critical updates. I've downloaded and installed it but it just starts to scan my system then reverts back to the start page. This is on a system that surpasses the published requirements for Vista Premium except for the video controller, a Matrox Millennium G500 with only 32 MB of video memory.

Thank goodness for all of the people who have published hardware and software compatibility lists.

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In My (not too) Humble Opinion it's M$ fault entirely.
Mar 14, 2007 1:44PM PDT

I'm not a programmer, but it seems to me that M$ could have and should have made sure that anything that worked on XP would work on Vista.

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I knew this day would come.
Mar 14, 2007 1:49PM PDT

Well I myself have a few Windows computers. One from the 80's its Windows 3.1 and I got one from the 90's (Running 98 and XP even though its "impossible" to run XP on it) and my 2006 Compaq Presario V2508WM which is running Windows XP. Now let me tell you this. I have ran Mac OS X 10.4.6 on this laptop. I wanted to check it out. No problems what so ever. It was nice and easy to use. Now it ran on a Project OS X86 incompatible computer (as I have never seen my laptop on there anywhere and I cant do a "proper" install). So yeah make the switch to Mac. Microsoft has been screwing us all over for YEARS. I'm sick of it. I'm switching back to Mac. I used Apple computers on and off through out the entire time I was in school. I'm sick of the Windows flaws. Vista is the beginning of the end for Microsoft. Most of the problems with your drivers and software are Microsoft's fault for not making sure Vista was backwards compatible. That's a common problem with Windows computers. They are never FULLY backwards compatible. They can drop the hardware the way Apple does... little at a time. But software should never be dropped. Never.

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New OS gliches
Mar 14, 2007 1:51PM PDT

I too am frustrated with Vista and all the incompatabilites. On one side I am frustrated with Windows and on the other hand I am frustrated with all the other software and hardware companies for not investing enough time to create patches ahead of time to correct these issues. I spent about a month researching whether or not to switch to a Mac. In the end, I figured I would have more compatibility issues dealing with work related software on a Mac. Then another issue is with the new IE 7. I can't even access Microsoft Outlook Web Access and reply to my work e-mails. When I try to load the patch I get an error that I don't have enough storage to process the command. I am not a whiz at computers but with a two week old Dell XPS 410, I don't understand how I don't have enough storage. It's like buying a new electric or hybrid car. As fast as computers get outdated, how come the computer and software companies don't work together to keep them up. I am not sure how long it will take for the rest of the companies to jump on with Vista. The fact of the matter is that MS is working hard to improve their technology but the other companies are not working as fast. I'm not sure that Vista is that much better than XP to say that I am happy with it. MS Office 2007 has improved somewhat but............I would much rather have waited another year or so before taking the Vista jump.

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SOLUTION TO VISTA
Mar 14, 2007 1:52PM PDT

THE SOLUTION IN ONE WORD : APPLE

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Vista is not wearing any clothes.
Mar 14, 2007 1:54PM PDT

Intelligence is never a guarantee for good decision making but I was gobsmacked when I sat down to review our departments first Vista system. Desperately trying to keep an open mind my staff and I kept asking "who thought that was a good idea" and "didn't they think to test this"? Some of the changes were genuinely stupid-bad, like the changes to the wireless information that makes it difficult to spot a man-in-the-middle wifi proxy. I'm with photoham on this one: we just brought our first Mac into our offices as a trial unit. I never thought I would say this but I am actually considering jumping ship as well. Frankly, I think we're all tired of being pay-as-you go beta-testers for Microsoft. During all the delays prior to Vista's release, didn't anyone at Microsoft consider doing a market study of what the majority of users really felt was needed?

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Windows Vista Bugs
Mar 14, 2007 2:01PM PDT

Microsoft seems to have completely abandoned the concept of "backwards compatibility" with their previous products. I refrain from further comment.

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Compatibility Issues
Mar 14, 2007 2:03PM PDT

I ran the beta version of Vista and really, the only thing I saw that I liked about it was the search functions. I was disgusted about the lack of compatability with my hardware...couldn't even print to my color laser printer (the B&W one still worked). After suffering through it and some unknown-why-they-did-it changes, I decided to start over with XP Pro. I don't know why they had to make all of those changes except that it will probably sell more instructional software and classes.

Gil

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total agreement
Mar 14, 2007 2:05PM PDT

yes I've been watching this game play out and I agree that there's no need to upgrade to vista for any reason.My next computer will also be a mac.I've had nothing but problems with xp and no help from microsoft.enjoy life and prosper is what I've tried to do,and encourage all others to as well.

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Vista Upgrade
Mar 14, 2007 2:07PM PDT

My office will be getting the Vista upgrade soon and I asked our medical software company if they were compatible. She said they were working hard on it. We've known Vista was coming for a long time and the third party vendors knew it too. They've had lots of time to work on compatibility. We are going to install it and we will work through the problems. If somebody didn't do it, technology would be so slow to advance. I hated it when Win 98 came out, but I learned to love it. The same with XP. I've had issues with Microsoft, but they have improved in their compatibility with other products. And without the research Microsoft has done, we might still be in a DOS prompt. New technology is all good, bugs and all.

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Bought a Mac for my wife today
Mar 14, 2007 2:08PM PDT

Well, it's done 8 months of complaining to Microsoft during the Beta Testing and then spending 150 bucks for the REAL thing last month, an we are through with all the headaches. We went out and bought a shiny new(refurbished) macbook and she is sitting next to me smiling while finally able to watch her beloved CW videos on the net. I can finally get our wireless all in one to recognize the printer and our home automation software works fine without resetting the darn thermostat back to 55 degrees everynight. She is happy but I'm not. Yeh, I could have downgraded to XP but then I was like... "Why would I install 5 year old carpet into a 1 year old home, nope... I want the latest greatest thing out there". Vista sure is not it. I'm sure by SP2 all the kinks will be ironed out i'll go ahead and finaly get rid of XP and 2000 off our other computers, cause I'm not switching...well at least not until my wife tells me to. But lets see how long this experiment lasts in our family... there is always ebay if things go south.

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Stop the bleeding!!!
Mar 14, 2007 2:09PM PDT

I think this thread is nonsense. Upgrading to VISTA is just optional. They have specific requirements and it is obvious new hardware is needed if you have paid attention to sellers selling VISTA ready computers. There is even a tool in the MS website to check your computer for VISTA compatibility.
I am no Windows advocate as I go with what works. I have high end Mac computers as well as PCs and UNIX boxes. All of them have their issues. I don't think switching to any of those is the solution if you come from the Windows world.
Vista has been out for a while now and I have not even touched it. I have several thousands of dollars in software in my PC computers that I am not willing to stop using because some careless developer missed the VISTA boat. I will get new hardware before I move to VISTA and would make sure it works with it.
Again, all OSs that I know of have their issues. I think MS did what they had to, they released a working operating system, it is the little perks that bother most as they may have hardware that do not meet the requirements. As to VISTA drivers not being available yet, I would blame the third party vendors as it is up to them to ensure that their product would work in potentially 80% of PCs worldwide.
Macs right now run Windows XP, there is no news regarding VISTA drivers for the MAC so people wouuld be stuck with it and most of the good stuff out there won't run on a MAC running OSX so there is no clear solution at this time.

Read the fine print!!!

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Read what you wrote....
Mar 14, 2007 2:35PM PDT

Yes the sellers have requirements, but look again at the real requirements for vista home basic, it is really pretty weak! 800mhz processor, 512mb RAM, DVD Drive, Even the Ultimate edition is way behind where technology is, a 1ghz processor, (Thats a P3) 1gb RAM, 15gb drive space and a DVD drive these are not state of the art systems not even to a Mac user! You have to see it for what it is, everytime a major version of Windows comes out, and it's been 5 years, we are told by the kids at best buy, etc. that we need the newest and the best to run this, well Microsoft disagrees with this, and the requirements I listed are from their site. Now you tell me is retail, and manufacturers trying to shove new stuff down our throats that we really don't need, or is it Microsoft, is the sagging computer industry tired of Selling computer systems with printers, and LCD monitors for $399 and have found a way to jack the price up because hey this has a vista logo on it, so what, Microsoft does not manufacture the vista logos, the equipment manufactureres do! I build computer systems everyday in my shop that are vista ready they meet and exceed all the requirements that MS call for, once again, we as consumers are our own worst enemy!!

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Won't upgrade my laptop.
Mar 14, 2007 2:14PM PDT

According to MS's Vista compatibility utility, the video chip for my laptop isn't compatible with Vista, and i can't upgrade that video chip. Apparently Vista doesn't play well with older software, either.

When I buy my next PC, I might have them install WinXP Pro because it runs with most Windows software, including most older stuff.

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Blame, blame, ease my pain...
Mar 14, 2007 2:20PM PDT

Huge Microsoft makes an easy target for nearsighted gun slingers, but they can't be held responsible for every other software company out there.

Any computer savvy person knows not to salivate on "micro software's" raw meat. They let the market grill cook it 'till all the bugs die and then they eat steak.

Michael Chavez

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You know, it's funny....
Mar 14, 2007 2:22PM PDT

For all of those who insist that Microsoft is somehow obligated to ensue forward compatibility of every other device, software, and driver, nobody seems to be able to answer what should be a very simple question. Why?

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Once bitten... twice shy..
Mar 14, 2007 2:24PM PDT

I'm a developer who has used windows in some way since it began. I think Microsoft is absolutely to blame. What did Steve Balmer say at the height of when they were supposed to release Vista for the first of 4 times? "We're going to _____ kill Google". MS has spent all their time and energy on competing with every product Google makes and vice versa. I wish Google would stick to search and let MS stick to an OS. It's too late for microsoft now. I believe Sun/Google will have a hosted OS within 10 years...potentially a crushing blow to MS. And it's MS's own fault for not doing what they do best. For all the Microsoft territory Google has thrown their hat into, they still have THE best search engine. Yahoo is busy trying to be a portal AND a search engine...and failing. In the end, the consumer suffers like these people now having Vista problems. I will not even think of upgrading to vista for at least a year from today...just like I waited for XP. I don't know if it's 100% true, but i read the kernel for Vista is still the exact as XP Pro, and will not really be the longhorn Kernel until the 1st or 2nd Service Pack of vista... and for god sakes.. vendors had 5+ years to make drivers for Vista so shame on them too.