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General discussion

Windows Vista Bugs

Feb 12, 2007 3:26AM PST

I have been a faithful Windows user since 3.0 and I really though that nothing could be worse than Windows ME. Vista in the early stages is worse. Windows ME had its problems, but you could get support/help from 3rd party vendors. Upgrading to Vista has been a real challenge... and I feel like I'm walking through this maze all alone. So many software and hardware items don't work with Vista and third party vendors have not developed a fix yet. Virus protection... No, AOL security... NO, ATT security suite... No. Problems that were none existent yesterday are here today. The drivers for my video card, cd-rom drive and D-link usb adapter worked yesterday. Now, nothing but problem messages. I've always fought the good PC vs. MAC fight and found the MAC commercials to be amusing. But, I've never given thought to joining the MAC legions until now. If Vista wasn't ready for a release that would be seamless for the upgrade crowd, It should have been noted. And the Vista Advisor is another matter for another conversation. Why give the green light to a system for upgrade and then present you with a different reality post upgrade?

Discussion is locked

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Microsoft Dropped the ball
Mar 14, 2007 12:18PM PDT

Microsoft was aware of the incompatibilities at the start. It is up to any business to meet the needs of it's consumers. This also involves Research and Development of any new product. It is not up to other manufacturing companies that already have product being produced or on the shelf to do a recall so that Microsoft can make a profit. It is up to manufacturing companies to make any new product they produce to be compatible with Vista "if" they deem it a necessary expenditure to make a profit and continue an ever evolving business line. Just my two cents.

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Pump advertising dollars to improve compatibility
Mar 14, 2007 12:22PM PDT

Ever since I bought Vista Ultimate Edition, my Belkin wireless router drops out about once every hour, my HP all-in-one printer is not always reliable, and I get warning windows and bubbles that I have to cancel back and for seven times to get the warnings to stop, (that's 14 total moves and clicks). My thoughts are that I paid Microsoft money that forces me to download virtual PC software so that I can use Windows XP again.

Rather than spending money hyping Vista, Microsoft should put money into compatibility. I have pledged to myself that my next laptop or desktop will be an Apple. I bet Apple is thrilled about Vista and I would also wager that their ads of PC vs. Mac will be the most successful ads in computer history now that Vista is out.

Count me as another victory for Apple...and another unhappy Microsoft customer.

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Windows Vista and Windows Me: The same genre?
Mar 14, 2007 12:29PM PDT

I was very excited about the new OS and recently purchased a laptop running Windows Vista Home Premium. Initially I was impressed by its beautiful user's interface but the first deception came when I installed a very useful Portuguese-English dictionary and it failed to function properly.

After that I had another bitter experience when Microsoft's very own free programs Visual Web Developer 2005 Express Edition together with Microsoft SQL Server 2005 and Microsoft Windows SDK malfunctioned. I still could not get them to run a web page that worked seamlessly on my desktop running Windows XP.

I am very much disappointed with this new product of Microsoft that reminds me of Windows Millennium. To my opinion, Vista came out too early in the market when not only other software vendors but also Microsoft itself were not ready for this 64-bit operating system.

I would urge Microsoft to recall Windows Vista and replace it with Windows XP at no cost to its users. At least that way this giant company will maintain its respectful image and business among its loyal customers.

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Who's to blame- someone else.
Mar 14, 2007 12:30PM PDT

I have not yet changed to Vista for this very reason---incompatible drivers.
I think Microsoft should carry a lot of the angst of purchasers of Vista because of the with-holding of code needed to rewrite drivers to work {From what I have read Microsoft was not always forthcoming with code to re-write drivers to all 3rd party hardware/software companies} 2. I believe there were changes made right up to the last minute with code for Vista and time was not given to 3rd party providers to alter their code.
On the other side of the story is the hardware peripheral manufacturers who stand to increase sales of newer model products if the old ones don't work with Vista, or the software writers who bring out a new line of products that are Vista compatable.

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Now You Are Seeing The Picture - I Agree
Mar 14, 2007 12:43PM PDT

Good Overview - I Agree

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Who is responsible for Vista incompatibilities?
Mar 14, 2007 12:32PM PDT

While I think many hardware vendors have either dropped the ball or elected to use Vista as an opportunity to sell new equipment, I think Microsoft has a responsibility to make sure a new operating system works with at least the majority of "standard" hardware devices. Problems with printers, USB flash drives, and the like, should have been resolved by Microsoft. In the past, (their) new operating systems typically included the necessary drivers for most existing common devices. I'm afraid that many in the industry are trying to use this as an opportunity to improve their bottom line. I have indefinitely delayed buying a new notebook computer after seeing what Vista has done to others - I've even been looking are refurbished units with XP installed.

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Vista and Xbox360
Mar 14, 2007 12:43PM PDT

I had my XBOX360 connect to my TV and PC running Windows XP media center without any problem.

Then, I decided to put spend some money and upgrade to Vista and guess what? Not even the product from microsoft works with microsoft products.

How can I blame the third-party vendor? I called M$ support and they sent me to "Media Center experts". A bunch of kids that doesn't know how to read.

Interesting enough, the guy at M$ that helps me the most (with other issues) was from India.

Thanks Ashashi.

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Mac
Mar 14, 2007 12:35PM PDT

Dude:

Go Mac. Go Mac today. You won't be sorry. Quit worrying about how to make your computer work. Macs just work.

End of story.

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Vista ---- The Worst Yet
Mar 14, 2007 12:44PM PDT

As you I have been around since the days of the commodore computer with the card inserts, I am so fed up with Microsoft in that I just recently bought a brand new MacBook Pro 17 ". And I kick myself in wondering what took so long since 1975,,,,,God what an Idiot staying with Windows...for so long. Apple is King.....Now what to do with my less than a year old Dell XPS Desktop. I am a gamer and Vista has put a halt to that I can tell you....

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Microsoft not letting venders into kernel in Vista
Mar 14, 2007 12:45PM PDT

One of the problems that face people when upgrading to Vista is that Microsoft Giant is no longer letting venders access the kernel so that their product will run properly. Microsoft is only allowing 5 venders of security software access to the Vista kernel so that their virus detection protocols will be able to "view" everything going on. And no, AT&T was not on the vender list, and I suspect that this has everything to do with other drivers and software problems.
Microsoft has also started developing their own security software, another reason to keep vendors out of the kernel. With all the holes that microsoft has in their other software, and their inability or unwillingness to correct them, who wants that? I am not the most tech savvy guy there is when it comes to computers by a long shot, but I built my own computer which runs XP. I will not upgrade to Vista or build a computer to run on Vista. As far as I am concerned, Vista is just another attempt by Microsoft to further its own market share by squeezing other vendors out of existence. When my computer will no longer handle the workload I throw at it, I will buy a Mac.

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UNFAIR! FAULTY! SHOULD BE AN ILLEGAL PRACTICE!
Mar 14, 2007 12:46PM PDT

I was timid about ordering windows Vista Home Premium with my brand new Dell Inspiron E1705 laptop with a Core Duo 2.16 GHz proc, 2 GB of DDR2 RAM @ 667, one SWEET ATI videocard, 100 GB HD @7200 and all the bells and whistles for laptop performance. Sure overkilled the requirements that Microsoft laid out for the product that I finally decided on purchasing.

Vista Home Premium

This computer, I thought, would be a powerhouse that I needed and that it would flawlessly run Vista. Think again. My drivers for my optical drive will NOT WORK, NERO won't work, Windows Media Player "skips" on DIGITAL MEDIA (!) AND Vista has this horrible tendency to go haywire from time to time and will not allow me to open ANYTHING nor FIX IT! Bugs come up too often, but when I try and access certain folders and/or files Vista tells me, THE owner, that I do not have authority to access them. ***!?

So...I called Dell, asked them if the rumors were true about how if I load XP Pro on my laptop would the warrantee by void? Their reply was "YES!" and then the rep went on to tell me that Microsoft did this to all the manufacturors.

That is some scary ****.

Microsoft puts out a ****** product and then has the computer companies void your warrantee if you switch to a better product?! I thought this was AMERICA!!! As a consumer I should be able to have choices in this (regulated) free market economy!!!

So, $300 something bucks for a ****** *** Microsoft produce, the new M.E. if you will, and then I splurged on the Office 2007 Pro for $350 because I am a student. Word, Excel, powerpoint ALL look foreign and when I was typing up reports, on every occasion, Word 2007 would NOT let me save my files nor would it allow to save it to my jumpdrive when I panicked to rescue my large reports.

I want my money back! I want to be able to load XP pro on this machine and Linux too! I want a stable piece of software and by god it is NOT Dell's fault!! This computer is awesome, as a matter of fact I rated it highly on this website but still complained about the hell on wheels VISTA!!

Microsoft sales a poor product and is trying to force this product on the computer buying masses through unfair practices. I only bought this Operating System because I forsee it becoming the standard OS for all PC computers through Microsoft's own hand.

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VIUSTA INCOPATIBILITY
Mar 14, 2007 12:48PM PDT

If third party vendor will make all the peripals compatible with VISTA they cannot suck money from us. like that many windows VISTA owner have the surprise to buy new staff attract by the attractive advertising made by big company. see the advetising made by Hp, on them wen site the APOLOGIZE WITH THE CUSTOMER AND INSURE THEM THAT THE NEW WINDOW VISTA DRIVERS FOR SOME ITEM WILL BE AVALIABLE AS SOON AS THEY CAN, IN THE SAME TIME CUSTORMER NEEDS TO USE PRINTERS AND SCANNERS WAITING THEY WILL BUY THE NEW THAT ARE COMPATIBLE.
I CALEED HP CUSTOMER CNTRE FOR KNOW IF THE DRIVERS FOR MUY SCANNER WILL BE VALIABLE SOON, A CUSTOM SERVICE TOLD ME THAT FOR THIS INCIDENT I HAD TO PAY AU$ 42 ,SO I TOLD HIM THAT WAS JUST ONE ANSWER AND NOT A TECH SUPPORT,BUT THE POOR MAN ,INSTRUCTED BY HP CONFIRMED ME THAT FOR THE INCVIDENT I HAD TO PAY.
I SENT CUPPLE OF EMAILS ONE TO THE HP CEO (I WAS IN THAT TIME IN USA AND IS CLEARLY WRIGHT ON THE WEB SITE CONTACT CEO)IN REPONCE I RECEIVED CUPPLE OF EMAILS FORM THE CUSTOMER SERVICE TELLING ME TO VISIT THASM WEBSITE , AND AFTER SOME TIME ONE FROM THE CEO OFFICE (APPEARED TO COME FROM THERE)TELLEING ME THAY WAS INVESTIGATING THE INCIDENT AND WILL LET ME KNOW ,TWO MONTHS ARE GONE I GOT A NEW PRINTER SCANNER ,NOT FROM HP,AND I STILL HAVING HP STAFF ,THAT I DO NOT KNOW IF WILL WORK AGAIN
THANK HP FOR SUCK MO0NEY FROM MY WALLET SO KINDLY

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Too early to expect good Vista drivers
Mar 14, 2007 12:58PM PDT

I started as a CAD QA Tech lead just after Windows 2000 was released. Our CAD application is very demanding of the graphics drivers, We constantly break then.

In my experience it takes 6 to 12 months before most graphics drivers are fully functional and stable on a new OS. My team is testing Vista drivers right now. Yes, we are finding problems with even Microsoft WHQL certified D3D drivers. We are working to get these issues fixed.

The release of 32 & 64-bit Vista at the same time has strained the vendor's resources. As a result they have introduced defects into even XP drivers for new hardware. Hopefully, as a service to our customers, the most serious defects will be fixed before you see the drivers.

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to Vista or not to Vista it's too early too tell
Mar 14, 2007 12:59PM PDT

After installing a brand new WD sata 150gig raptor x, I partitioned for 2 sections. I love XP and loaded it on one partition then loaded a new install Ultimate on the second, this gave me a dual boot option to experiment with. Many issues with Vista, one was I lost all onboard perfs such as sound, LAN because the drivers that came with the motherboard are not compatible, and Vista makes no compromise to back paddle. After buying Intel 1000Pro NIC and a ATI Raedon Pro 9850 Video card, I am up and running. I find that there are way too many security bogs in Vista and with anything new I am sure there will be a time when all is well with that new OS. I was debating to go Vista, and like XP, I waited a year until all the issues in XP were resolved. Perhaps I jumped the gun loading Vista. All I need now is a scanner Vista ready and haven't found one yet. The best thing to do is make sure when you buy a toy, make sure it has a label VISTA READY. Partion off about 50 GIGS and load Vista on it. Then you have an option for dual boot. Then you can decide if it is for you. And yes, Vista was in the planning stages for at least 2 years and I blame the 3 party softwares for dragging their feet thinking everything would transpire smoothly.

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Should Microsoft be blamed for Vista
Mar 14, 2007 1:01PM PDT

This is very complicated because I am using Vista on 2 Pc's.

Vista is a nicely designed OS but with a lots of bugs for example I got this beautiful Sony laptop with Vista which was already a chalenge to install. After I installed it I had problems to install McAffee Internet Security siute2007 because I got runnig errors and later on the Bluescreen too.I also had validation problems that Northon Antivirus caused and had to call Microsoft for costumer support and get revalidate my Pc.

I am still getting because It has isues running older softwares with Vista. Which is the worse u can imagine if U paied top $$$$$ for each Software.

If U want to use Vista smoothly U have to have at least 1 Gb Ram but Vista gonna use a good 2 GB for pageging out of your HDD which makes a hell of bad performance out of a HDD..

It is also takes about 10Gb out from your HDD when you install it.

I started to play with VistaBeta a little bit and I made a conclusion.
First of all I installed it on a 3.4 GHz PD with 1 Gb Ram and only a 20 GB Maxtor HDD also a Nvidia video card with 256 MB Ram.

I started XP pro and installed Vista on top of it and took me about an hour and 20 minutes to finish with the two software.
and it works fine if I don't add any third party softwares.

It is nice but RAM hungry and it has more overhead and more background processes than we want which probably would slow your PC down.
I also miss Hyperterminal which is a great tool for Networking people who needs to do programming a Router or a Switch.

Xp has a better overall design than Vista and its more practical for even those users who has less knowledge about Windows.

In conclusion Microsoft only blamed for one thing, which is that they put a product out on the market which is not quite ready for public use with all the copatibility isues still with other Software venders

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(NT) Perfect story for why to change to OSX
Mar 14, 2007 1:07PM PDT
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Compatability-Hardware-Who's at fault?
Mar 14, 2007 1:01PM PDT

When I upgraded to XP, my Visioneer scanner was not supposed to work. It did. There was a new driver for my HP printer. With Vista, the hardware will not work. So says Microsoft and so say the hardware manufacturers. Who cares? I won't upgrade to Vista. When I do need to buy a new printer, it will not necessarily be an HP. I am very upset that HP does not have and does not plan to create a driver for my printer and a lot of others. Microsoft won't get Vista dollars and HP won't sell a new printer. Have ink and XP works great. Who needs Vista? I win. They lose.

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compatability
Mar 14, 2007 1:15PM PDT

simple everyone should have ignored vista till it was done right.

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So why is this such a difficult discussion of blame????
Mar 14, 2007 1:03PM PDT

Fact: 3rd party developers general try to keep customers and usually aren't lazy about getting ready for an upgrade that was FIVE YEARS LATE!!! If they screw up they lose customers.

Fact; Microsoft rarely loses customers when a driver from a 3rd party developer doesn't work, because Windows users are mostly cheap, lazy or corporations.

So: Does it make more sense that developers were negligent and desired to commit economic suicide or that MS was negligent or so full of bloatware that they couldn't plug all of the leaks in their billion dollar dike?

Gosh, what do you think?????

Some of you rail about dumb pc owners who "should take responsibility or know better" and some of you rant on uncaring corporations that "want to screw you over." The fact is Microsoft obviously can't decide whether to supply OS's for ITgeeks or consumers and they do a half way job of doing both.

Basically quit the whining and get a Mac.

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so, Windows Vista is new.
Mar 14, 2007 1:05PM PDT

windows vista is new, so was windows 3x, 95 , 98 2000 and xp,which is preety good.Anybody who has had to deal with these new os's knows they are not going to be troublefree for a good while.If you can't wait bear with it,, otherwise stick to xp for about a year or so,,maybe windows vista is a great unpolished new os,, let's wait,let's not start blaming everybody. experienced windows users know this. jjsifosfero

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Vista Incompatibilities
Mar 14, 2007 1:08PM PDT

Hardware and software incompatabilities have been a part of every major Windows release. Windows NT was, in my opinion, the all time winner for most incompatible OS introduction. Since then, Microsoft has done an excellent job of getting beta versions of their upcoming releases into the hands of the developers.

So, who is to blame today? No one! The fact is the developers have the beta, Microsoft has been responsive, and were there an infinite supply of developers, then the incompatibilities could be resolved by the time the product is released. Since resources are finite, the industry decides which drivers and applications to update first. If they are wise, the make this selection based on their customers' needs. So, in the end, incompatibilities are inevitable and it is the natural market presssures that determine what, when, and how the new drivers, patches, etc. shall be released.

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We let Microsoft get away with it!
Mar 14, 2007 1:09PM PDT

Where else but software do you pay for a product and let the manufacturer continue to develope it during it's life cycle. I want a software package that works the way it is supposed to from day one. Let the manufacturers be responsible for a life cycle that doesn't start until all the bugs are worked out and if they use compatability or security in the advertizing it must bet secure and compatable before the clock starts. Only after a period of zero defects would they be allowed to end the products life and discontinue support.

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Lee Koo; Manager; CNET Community Posting 3-14-07
Mar 14, 2007 1:10PM PDT

In the posting by Mr. Koo he asks if Microsoft should be held responsible for their troubles with Vista compatability or should we blame the manufacturers for dropping the ball. His apparent willingness to serve as a Microsoft apologist upsets me at the deepest level of my soul. Can Mr. Koo honestly expect us to believe that all of the manufacturers involved in the issues of Vista incompatability are conspiring with each other to make the mighty Microsoft only appear guilty when in fact it is they that are to blame? I too have been faithful to Microsoft since 3.0 but I believe they need to own up to this blunder or I will switch to Mac myself. I bought an HP Media Center with Vista installed and hated it soooo much that I returned it and got my money back. Next day I tried to find the same computer with XP installed but it seems that all stores are committed to selling only the laterst operating system. My solution was to go to Fry's and purchase a refurbished model of HP Media Center with XP which had only been taken down 2 weeks earlier and now I am happy once again. However, I have turned at least 3 people I know away from purchasing computers with Vista. Microsoft better find a way to make things right! If they do, I am human and I am forgiving. If they don't, I am human and I am unforgiving.

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Well said!
Mar 14, 2007 1:20PM PDT

And remarkably well considered. I am my circle of friends "pet geek" and have turned EVERYONE I know away from vista.... Even my 14 year old daughter sees the folly of buying into this sham and tells all of HER friends! How long will this last? At some point it HAS to hurt Microslut! When will the mass media catch onto this and REALLY sink the ship for good?

Stay tuned...I suspect it will all start here or on a sight like this!

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Vista
Mar 14, 2007 1:14PM PDT

I have loaded a copy of Vista Ultimate, which though graphicly is very pleasing, I have found to have many driver issues.

So far It would not recognise a HP photosmart 145 printer, a cisco network card, Nero software, and it corrupted a 512 meg CF card that I left in a reader.
Is this the fault of Microsoft? or the Manufactures
I am sure that the manufactures were caught off guard CISCO?? (CISCO support said that the 64 bit version of their drivers works fine with VISTA all I would have to do is change the PC all the legacy software and the $19.95 N/W card that is used in most Enterprise co would work, perhaps India only operates on 64 bit) HP?? Driver comming soon!! whatever that means Sandisk?????

I have a feeling that all the Microserfs straight fron the university with a deg in computer science etc have never been into the real world were we have to put up with computers that have less than 2 CPU's and 4 Gig of RAM I am sure that the beta testers went to a large Enterprise (Win 2000 pro) and updated the system to VISTA, I also believe in the tooth fairy.

Do I like it? I don't know as I have not got all the drivers yet!
I believe that I had a fast PC but it says that It is runing at 3.5 as would you believe a 2year old 3D AGI graphics card is dragging the system down.........................now if I just had the correct drivers

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Alexander Pope
Mar 14, 2007 1:15PM PDT

a quote:
"Be not the first by whom the new is tried,
Nor yet the last to lay the old aside"

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Vista and problems
Mar 14, 2007 1:20PM PDT

Vista sucks period. It is just another ME made into a different package and Microsoft is trying to force feed it to the public want it or not. I was going to purchase a new Dell laptop three weeks ago and was told I only could get Vista which I immediately then said there was no use going on with the order as I would not take Vista under any circumstance. It is a shame you cannot get the choice of Vista or XP as they are losing sales and I do not care what they are reporting, anyone with any computer savy knows a clunker no matter how it is packaged. Microsoft needs to do the way they did with ME and give up on this and go back to a good product i.e. Windows XP. I will never buy Vista and do not care what they patch or whatever to it, the only thing that can be said about it is that it "SUCKS!" And it you don't believe that ask people that have gotten the program. Microsoft is getting what they deserve by introducing that system instead of tweaking XP.

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disapointed
Mar 14, 2007 5:20PM PDT

here here. I've only had vista for a month . and my reasoning for having the OS. is that I'm one those people who love to try new operating systems. no matter what the hype is. and in the time I've had Vista. i only had a few problems with it.IE7 refusing to start up and the incompatibility of my games and my software. that was up until today when i was writing a a word doc in English class, and all of a sudden the system suddenly restarts and preforms a memory diagnostic all on its own. why this happened i do not know. i think the comp crashed, hard to say its been five years since i had one crash on me. sufice to say i was stuck looking at the blue screen of death while this "diagnostic" was preforming. thankfully i kept the document saved on my thumb drive. needless to say i'am at my wits end withe os and i'm going back to windows xp at least then the comp ran properly

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Fault?
Mar 14, 2007 1:25PM PDT

What difference does it make, who is to blame? The problem remains, as always, when you upgrade anything, any time, for any reason, you have problems. Some minor, others major. All the while there is that ever present lucky group that do everything and all goes just swell.

The thing to remember is no mater what opinions are voiced here nothing will change. We continue to opt for the latest, newest and fastest 'anything' computer related that comes along. We grumble at the inconvience, some change operating systems, some manufactures and some just stay with what they are familiar with untill forced to upgrade.

It's all just a learning experience anyway. Happy

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Learning experience
Mar 14, 2007 1:34PM PDT

Sure you try telling that to the customer who has just paid $3000 for a nice new laptop and connected it to his workplace!!!!
I work in medicine and most Dr's would probably remove a part of your anatomy if you came out with that statement.
They only want results not excuses, Microsoft has as always blown VISTA skyward in "WOW" but not in "does it work with legacy systems"