Windows 10

it seem to me that you can't complain about windows 10
you can say anything positive, just not tell the truth about the system.
so having a forum about it seems a waste of time.

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Re: forum

We have forums about all OS'es, and people post problems and question in every one. Can you explain why you think we shouldn't have one about Windows 10?


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Ok...then why don't you tell us the truth?

I like to know.

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Such truth has been written about
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what does Microsoft admit to?

Ed Bott, bless his soul, does some good articles, but he's a wee bit of a shill at times for Microsoft.

Let's see what Microsoft claims for itself.


Microsoft collects data to operate effectively and provide you the best experiences with our services. You provide some of this data directly, such as when you create a Microsoft account, submit a search query to Bing, speak a voice command to Cortana, upload a document to OneDrive, complete a survey, or contact us for support. We get some of it by recording how you interact with our services by, for example, using technologies like cookies, and receiving error reports or usage data from software running on your device.

We also obtain data from third parties (including other companies). For example, we supplement the data we collect by purchasing demographic data from other companies. We also use services from other companies to help us determine a location based on your IP address in order to customize certain services to your location.

The data we collect depends on the services and features you use, and includes the following.

Name and contact data. We collect your first and last name, email address, postal address, phone number, and other similar contact data.

Credentials. We collect passwords, password hints, and similar security information used for authentication and account access.

Demographic data. We collect data about you such as your age, gender, country and preferred language.

Interests and favorites. We collect data about your interests and favorites, such as the teams you follow in a sports app, the stocks you track in a finance app, or the favorite cities you add to a weather app. In addition to those you explicitly provide, your interests and favorites may also be inferred or derived from other data we collect.

Payment data. We collect data necessary to process your payment if you make purchases, such as your payment instrument number (such as a credit card number), and the security code associated with your payment instrument.

Usage data. We collect data about how you interact with our services. This includes data, such as the features you use, the items you purchase, the web pages you visit, and the search terms you enter. This also includes data about your device and the network you use to connect to our services, including IP address, device identifiers (such as the IMEI number for phones), regional and language settings. It includes information about the operating systems and other software installed on your device, including product keys. And it includes data about the performance of the services and any problems you experience with them.

Contacts and relationships. We collect data about your contacts and relationships if you use a Microsoft service to manage contacts, or to communicate or interact with other people or organizations.

Location data. We collect data about your location, which can be either precise or imprecise. Precise location data can be Global Position System (GPS) data, as well as data identifying nearby cell towers and Wi-Fi hotspots, we collect when you enable location-based services or features. Imprecise location data includes, for example, a location derived from your IP address or data that indicates where you are located with less precision, such as at a city or postal code level.

Content. We collect content of your files and communications when necessary to provide you with the services you use. For example, if you receive an email using Outlook.com, we need to collect the content of that email in order to deliver it to your inbox, display it to you, enable you to reply to it, and store it for you until you choose to delete it. Examples of this data include: the content of your documents, photos, music or video you upload to a Microsoft service such as OneDrive, as well as the content of your communications sent or received using Microsoft services such Outlook.com or Skype, including the:

subject line and body of an email,
text or other content of an instant message,
audio and video recording of a video message, and
audio recording and transcript of a voice message you receive or a text message you dictate.

We also collect the content of messages you send to us, such as feedback and product reviews you write, or questions and information you provide for customer support. When you contact us, such as for customer support, phone conversations or chat sessions with our representatives may be monitored and recorded. If you enter our retail stores, your image may be captured by our security cameras.

Health Related Ad Targeting.

In the United States, we provide interest-based advertising based on a limited number of standard, non-sensitive health-related interest categories, including allergies, arthritis, cholesterol, cold and flu, diabetes, gastrointestinal health, headache / migraine, healthy eating, healthy heart, men's health, oral health, osteoporosis, skin health, sleep, and vision / eye care. We will also target ads based on custom, non-sensitive health-related interest categories as requested by advertisers.

Data Retention. For interest-based advertising, we retain data for no more than 13 months, unless we obtain your consent to retain the data longer.

Data Sharing. In some cases, we share with advertisers reports about the data we have collected on their sites or ads. We may also share data directly with service providers to permit them to provide services on our behalf or to partner with us in selecting and serving ads for our advertising partners. For instance, Microsoft uses a service provider to match your Microsoft cookie ID and account data with data an advertiser may have about you (such as your recent purchases from them). This is done so the advertiser can reach you with an ad it thinks may be relevant to you. However, the service provider we use acts as a trusted third party and does not share any personal data that Microsoft or the advertiser has about you.

Some browsers have incorporated "Do Not Track" (DNT) features that can send a signal to the websites you visit indicating you do not wish to be tracked. Because there is not yet a common understanding of how to interpret the DNT signal, Microsoft services do not currently respond to browser DNT signals.

You have choices about the data we collect. When you are asked to provide personal data, you may decline. But if you choose not to provide data that is necessary to provide a service, you may not be able to use some features or services.


Feeling the privacy yet?

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Looking good here.

While I'm a programmer, author and more, I see where I have no problem here. I don't use IE, Cortana (will later just like my Amazon Echo) and opted for a local login.

Your post is close to TL;DR for many. But it assures me that I'm fine with all this.

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hah, that's after I SHORTENED it...
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The thing is.

For simple things like a Weather app, how else to get it working without revealing details like where you are?

Do folk really need to be told how that works?

I haven't seen any Weather internet app that didn't reveal enough detail that you are "there" at this "time" and a little more.

Does that make all weather apps a security or privacy issue?

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scattered data among...

non associated and non aligned collectors of that data for that single purpose, isn't the problem.

Collated data of many types from many sources can be a problem. That danger increases where the data dump of such information is "shared" with others, for the right price.

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That's a bigger problem than Windows 10.

The Weather app and what can be gleaned is just a start, then you hit the web for for some medicine side effect document and CVS for something. Pretty soon all this leads to a pretty detailed picture of you and more.

And Windows 10 didn't even enter the picture. Maybe those folk that want more privacy need to reconsider using the internet, cell phones, cars and more?

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In addition to the above, they send out surveys asking...

...questions like "do you consider yourself a leader", "where do you like to travel", etc. that are none of their business. I don't know how they select who they send these to, it may be I get them because I'm a Windows 10 insider. I can't say who else gets these. The surveys start off asking purely technical innocent questions, but when you get about 60% of the way through it, these personal questions start. Sad
All this is why I will only run Windows 10 on my test PCs and stay with 10 at least for the next couple of years.

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Remember I didn't use the email login.
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I've used one of my Yahoo IDs w/10 & that's where I got the

...survey. I've only used WLM and Comcast webmail on 10. Maybe they just sent the surveys to Windows Insiders, who knows?
When it comes to Windows 10 itself I have very mixed feelings. I haven't seen many problems with it, especially since it went RTM in August. But I haven't seen any problems with earlier versions starting with Vista either (and maybe XP - my memory is fading about XP). Performance wise I haven't seen any noticeable difference. OTOH I haven't seen anything in it that makes me want it, and the "snoopware", the way they've forced the nagware (viz KB3055383) I find very offensive. Certainly Cortana, Edge, and the (cr)apps are negatives in my book. Also the way they force updates out is a negative. YMMV.

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The updates are only forced on Home versions.

I find the Pro version to be controllable. There's a reason why we are headed to such controls. All that malware that hijacks a PC, turns off updates and then the malware digs in deeper.

For home users I am seeing this system to be better. If someone needs more control, they need to look at the Pro version.

As to the crAPPS, I treat them like bloatware which is not saying much.

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Forced updates may be better technically, but...

...MS isn't making any friends by doing that. I always install the important updates (but never the optional ones) as soon as they come out because I've never had a bad experience with them (knock, knock) and I have backups in case Murphy strikes. My 4 Win 10 installations are all Pro, but while you can delay updates with it, I've read that you can only delay them for a relatively short time, and I haven't seen a way to selectively install them like we can with earlier versions. I've seen MS say (in the Insider forums) that the only version with true control of updates is with the Enterprise version. I can't speak to that because I don't have it.
Getting back to whether forcing the updates on home users is a good thing, time will tell I guess. My take for the present is that you can't keep some folks from doing stupid things, so unless MS comes up with a way to make Defender (or the likes) stop all malware, I'll believe it improves things when I see it. It's sure not going to stop folks from downloading and installing infected programs from shady sources. Besides, isn't that good for your business! Laugh

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How we got here.

With users all over the map on updates and same users screaming at MS for tech support for 2^N (2 to the power of N) combinations of patches and well, here we are.

If we didn't ask support for a setup with patches 1,3,5,6,7,8 and the next user has another combination the mess it is had to change.

If you think this is bad, look up the Android and Linux fragmentation issues. Folk are starting to explode over support. And support can't realistically be offered with everyone with a different configuration. At some point this had to happen.

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Re: privacy

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