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General discussion

white, black, and microwaves

Feb 13, 2010 1:35AM PST

Noticed something today. Put a bagel and a brownie on a paper plate and placed in microwave for 20 seconds, just to warm them a bit. Seemed to me the bagel barely got warm but the brownie quite warm. I know color makes a difference in sunlight, but was surprised at the microwave result. It wasn't a test, just something I noticed. Is there a defined range of radiant energy in which differences in color as perceived by human eyes has an obvious effect on energy absorption? Or could it be due to some difference of ingredients between the bagel and the brownie?

Discussion is locked

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I'm thinking not color but maybe fat content
Feb 13, 2010 1:45AM PST

or other forms of moisture. If you've ever tried to soften butter in a microwave, you'll know it goes quickly from solid to liquid unless you very carefully control the power setting.

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brownie
Feb 13, 2010 2:35AM PST

It would have more fat and sugar ingredients in it than bagel. I wonder what would be the best way to do an experiment to test color aided absorption of microwaves? White paper vs black paper? It would have to be of the same construction. Dyed water of equal volumes?

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In that case, it would be the what's in the
Feb 13, 2010 2:53AM PST

dye and not its color. We know that metal objects absorb MW energy quickly...even shiny aluminum. Steel wool is fun to watch too. You could try a block of dry wood (cellulose), an empty water glass and a slab of meat. I'm thinking the meat will swipe most of the energy, the water glass will stay relatively cool and the wood will warm only slightly. Don't test your best French Limoge dinnerware. Wink

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try equal quantities
Feb 13, 2010 2:57AM PST

1/4 glass of milk, water and cooking oil
try 10 seconds and see if there is a difference in temps

.,

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composition of the two
Feb 13, 2010 2:17AM PST

is one denser than the other? pastry versus flaky?

and also, your bagel is probably my bread roll Wink

,.

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different ingredients
Feb 13, 2010 2:37AM PST

so probably not the best test. It would be interesting to know if color aided energy absorption extended into microwave range, since it's obvious within visible light spectrum.

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I think it has more to do with the density...
Feb 13, 2010 4:15AM PST

bagels are usually denser than brownies and have fewer air pockets. My guess anyway.

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Isn't that a song by Janis Joplin?
Feb 14, 2010 9:14AM PST

"Combination of the Two" from Cheap Thrills by Big Brother and the Holding Company. 1969. Truly an archetypal piece of blues inflected psychedelia, but not of any particular relevance here.

Rob

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It is primarily because of the sugar
Feb 13, 2010 4:46AM PST

..... content in the brownie.

Also, the brownie has more fat because of the chocolate and added shortening which exacerbates the faster heating.


Angeline

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all very good thoughts on it
Feb 13, 2010 12:20PM PST

While realizing now it's maybe the ingredients had a bigger part in the difference in heat for each item, even though they were side by side on the same paper plate, I'm now wondering if at any time color makes a difference at all to energy absorption in the microwave RF range? Maybe the Defense Department has investigated it when doing their stealth technology. I googled around but didn't find a clear answer based solely on microwaves and color.

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As I understand it, MW heating doesn't start
Feb 13, 2010 7:35PM PST

at the surface and work to the inside but is generated anywhere within the object as molecules absorb it. I don't that that's difficult to prove. Moisture and fatty substances that liquefy get their molecules moving readily from such radiation. Ungrounded metallic elements produce electric current with them which can spark and flame. I'd suspect you could take two glasses with an equal volume of water and put some sort of water soluble aniline dye in one glass. Put them both in the sun for a while and take their temperature and then repeat that using the MW. The dyed water should heat faster in the sun but, if it did the same in the MW, you might be on to something.

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I might try that later
Feb 13, 2010 9:31PM PST

Too busy with winter crap at the time. Be interesting. Email friend who knows radio wave theory well claims microwaves don't "see" color at all.

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From the friend . . .
Feb 15, 2010 9:43PM PST

A microwave oven, or a microwave, is a kitchen appliance that cooks or heats food by dielectric heating. This is accomplished by using microwave radiation to heat water and other polarized molecules within the food. This excitation (molecular vibration) is fairly uniform, leading to food being more evenly heated throughout (except in thick objects) than generally occurs in other cooking techniques.

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one interesting fact about m'wave ovens
Feb 15, 2010 11:21PM PST

they don't kill ants (at least ours doesn't)

.,

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(NT) Careful...it might make them grow big!
Feb 15, 2010 11:57PM PST