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General discussion

Where's the outrage now?

Apr 9, 2004 5:24AM PDT

I've heard about this on the radio for a few days now, and thought for sure it would leak into at least a pg. 18 blurb in the "mainstream" media.

What with Lott's birthday party comment culminating in such outrage and all and his eventual demise as majority leader in the Senate, you would think that Dodd's comments (official comments on the Senate floor) praising Byrd would merit SOME mention??

Sen. Dodd accused of making racist comment


In a speech on the Senate floor last Thursday marking Sen. Robert Byrd's 17,000th vote in the body, Dodd said the West Virginia Democrat, member of the Ku Klux Klan before taking office and opponent of the 1964 Civil Right Act, "would have been right during the great conflict of Civil War in this nation."

Dodd's comments struck some as similar to remarks made by former Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott, R-Miss., that led to his losing the position.

The comments were made as part of large praise of Byrd's great service as a Senator, which Dodd said, "would have been right at anytime."


I don't know about racist, but "anytime" would sure include the time Byrd was an admitted KKK member.

Where's the outrage now Democrats?

Sen. Robert Byrd, the longstanding Democrat from West Virginia, cast his 17,000th vote in the chamber last week. Sen. Chris Dodd (D-Conn.) saw fit to mark the occasion with a rousing tribute in which he proclaimed, "There is no one I admire more. There is no one to whom I listen more closely and carefully when he speaks on any subject matter than Sen. Byrd."

For obvious reasons, Dodd neglected to mention that Byrd is a former Grand Kleagle of the Ku Klux Klan. Nor did Dodd dwell on the fact that Byrd voted against the Civil Rights Act of 1964 or that Byrd broadcast his racial insensitivity by using the N-word during a 2001 appearance on Fox News.

Instead, Dodd simply praised the former Klansman from West Virginia as a gifted legislator and a stout defender of the Constitution.

This is somewhat puzzling considering that when Sen. Trent Lott remarked that the country would have been better off if former segregationist Strom Thurmond had won his 1948 bid for presidency, the Democrats demanded his ouster. And rightly so. Lott's racially-insensitive remarks were indicative of his upbringing in "a time and a place" that regarded blacks as inferior. Lott's remarks suggested that he just didn't get it, that he had no ability to truly empathize with what it means to be a minority in this country. The Democrats understood this. Flanked by the Congressional Black Caucus, they pumped their fists at Lott and demanded that he vacate his post.

Yet, they say nothing when one of their own praises a former Klansman. They haven't even asked Dodd to issue an apology. This is an outrage. Some things should not be explained away, like Byrd's affiliation with an organization that has a long history of hanging blacks from trees.

And yet, there is Dodd, on the Senate floor, demanding that Sen. Byrd "would have been a great senator at any moment. He would have been right at the founding of this country. He would have been in the leadership crafting this Constitution. He would have been right during the great conflict of civil war in this Nation. ."


The double standard on racism from and within the Democratic party is just mind boggling.

Evie Happy

Discussion is locked

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Re:Where's the outrage now?
Apr 9, 2004 6:05AM PDT

It's pretty clearly a different type of comment.

Lott was saying that a viciously segregationist president would have been a great thing in 1948 and the benefits of such policies would be felt to the present day. Clearly he is endorsing the segregationist candidate's platform.

Dodd was saying that a senator who has served long and hard would have been of service to the country in any period of its history. Clearly he is endorsing the senator's long years of service in Washington.

I have seen no one say, nor am I saying, that Byrd's participation in the KKK forty-plus years ago was anything but disgraceful.

Dan

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Re:Re:Where's the outrage now?
Apr 9, 2004 6:16AM PDT

I agree Dan. Someone is taking the words out of context

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Thanks, Mary Kay. It seems obvious. -nt
Apr 9, 2004 6:20AM PDT

.

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Out of context?
Apr 9, 2004 6:22AM PDT

Gee MK, that wasn't the case for Lott though I guess.

The only difference is that Lott was a Republican who made the comment at a birthday party. Dodd is a Democrat who made the comments on the record on the Senate floor.

Frankly I don't think either Senator intended to praise racist or former racist policies of either other Senator. But where is the consistency?

Evie Happy

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consistency?
Apr 9, 2004 6:29AM PDT

That's asking too much...

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Also...
Apr 9, 2004 6:45AM PDT

Agreeing with Dan's post, historically the Democratic party has been seen as the more racially diverse party and as such would be less likely to be painted as racist. The Republicans have had the reputation as the party for rich white people evn though not totally true. While reading these posts I keep flashing back to the televised Republican convention - seeing the cameras searching the sea of white faces desperately trying to get reaction shots from minorities.

Patrick
Founder and sole member of the Enlightened Individualist Party Happy

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Thanks, Patrick.
Apr 9, 2004 6:52AM PDT

BTW, is your EIP related to any of these?

Dan

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You might try looking for...
Apr 9, 2004 6:57AM PDT

J.C. Watts, Colin Powell, and Condoleeza Rice for starters. If you hadn't noticed, it's the Republicans who are pushing more enlightened policies like vouchers to improve education in the inner city.

The Dems seek to keep blacks on the 'plantation', and viciously slap down those who get out of line. Remember the lynch mob and Clarence Thomas?

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BTW, guess which party Lincoln belonged to, and
Apr 9, 2004 6:58AM PDT

what the Democrats supported in the 19th century.

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If He Only Knew...
Apr 9, 2004 7:04AM PDT
BTW, guess which party Lincoln belonged to - Kiddpeat

If Lincoln knew what happened to his party, he would be furious. I'm sure he's spinning in his grave at this very moment. If Lincoln were alive today, he would be a Democrat... Happy
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Dream on. It's simply silly to suggest that Lincoln would support
Apr 9, 2004 7:11AM PDT

1. Killing unborn children
2. Taking God out of the pledge of allegiance
3. Gay marriage

or many of the other things that Democrats push today.

In fact, Lincoln would support the Bush war policy. Any idea what happened to habeas corpus under Lincoln? The Dems would demonize him even more than President Bush, and what fun they would have ridiculing the self-educated, country lawyer who supported himself by splitting logs on the frontier.

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Well...
Apr 9, 2004 7:17AM PDT

Maybe not. Lincoln was a free thinker. He did not belong to any church. And did not join one even after being strongly advised to do so before his presidential bid. He would most likely be a strong supporter of the separation of church and state.

Dan

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Being a free thinker doesn't mean that he would support any of the things I mentioned.
Apr 9, 2004 8:49AM PDT

I did not say anything about church and state, but Lincoln would probably not support the extreme positions to which this idea has been pushed. He even used the phrase 'under God' in the Gettysburg address.

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I made a little list...
Apr 9, 2004 8:42AM PDT

The ho-rah is that he belonged to the Klan, which did a lot of nasty things in the South in the 1950's and 1960's (as well as in other times, of course). Since my cable TV is down again, I made a little list of Governors of Southern states during that period. Notice something?


Mississippi
Fielding L. Wright 1946-1952 Democrat
Hugh Lawson White 1952-1956 Democrat
James Plemon Coleman 1956-1960 Democrat
Ross Barnet 1960-1964 Democrat
Paul B. Johnson Jr. 1964-1968 Democrat

Alabama
James E. Folsom 1947-1951 Democrat
Gordon Persons 1951-1955 Democrat
James E. Folsom 1955-1959 Democrat
John Patterson 1959-1963 Democrat
George C. Wallace 1963-1967 Democrat
Lurleen B. Wallace 1967-1968 Democrat
Albert P. Brewer 1968-1971 Democrat

Louisiana
Earl Long 1948-1952 Democrat
Robert Floyd Kennon 1952-1956 Democrat
Earl Long 1956-1960 Democrat
James Houston Davis 1960-1964 Democrat
John Julian McKeithen 1964-1972 Democrat

Arkansas
Sidney Sanders McMath 1949-1953 Democrat
Francis Adams Cherry 1953-1955 Democrat
Orval Eugene Faubus 1955-1967 Democrat
Winthrop P.Rockefeller 1967-1971 Republican

Georgia
Herman Talmadge 1948-1955 Democrat
Samuel Marvin Griffin 1955-1959 Democrat
Samuel Vandiver 1959-1963 Democrat
Carl Edward Sanders 1963-1967 Democrat
Lester Maddox 1967-1971 Democrat

Florida
Fuller Warren 1949-1953 Democrat
Daniel McCarty Died in office 1953 Democrat
Charley Eugene Johns 1953-1955 Democrat
Thomas LeRoy Collins 1955-1961 Democrat
Cecil Farris Bryant 1961-1965 Democrat
William Haydon Burns 1965-1967 Democrat
Claude Roy Kirk 1967-1971 Republican

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Ssshhhh! The Dems aren't going to like it if you start pulling up facts.
Apr 9, 2004 8:54AM PDT

Maybe that's why they're so big on apologies? Devil

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Gee whiz, Kiddpeat...
Apr 9, 2004 9:27AM PDT

Gee whiz, Kiddpeat, I just made a list. It's not like I put in any details like:

Orval Faubus, who used the Natonal Guard to block black kids from attending Little Rock Central High School. (1957)
or
George Wallace, who stood in a doorway of the University of Alabama in an attempt to stop integration by the enrollment of 2 black students. (1963)
or
Lester Maddox who turned black people away from his restraunt, standing in the door carrying a pistol. (1964)

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Pick yourself up a copy of ...
Apr 9, 2004 7:01AM PDT

... Uncle Sam's Plantation, linked to at the author's site. It should disavow you of the fallacy that the Democratic Party is one of diversity or that values equality between the races in this country.

Evie Happy

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My, my what games we can play with words and feel righteous in the process!
Apr 9, 2004 6:50AM PDT

Lott's innocent tribute was to a senator who served long and hard, and would have been of service to his country in any period. He was a man of conviction, who changed his mind regarding the races, but didn't need the latest poll to tell him what to think.

Dodd was saying that a man who once ran with vicious killers and bullies, who is still so unrepentant as to continue to use the 'N' word, should have set the country's policy in the Civil War.

Dan, you made a hypocritical statement. I hope you're just parroting the party line without thinking too much about it. There's an abundance of understanding and compassion for even the worst Democrat isn't there?

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You're missing it.
Apr 9, 2004 6:57AM PDT

Lott was specifically saying that a segregationist running on a segregationist platform for president would have greatly benefited the country had he won.

If you don't see that there is no hope of you reaching understanding.

Dan

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and Byrd is still calling blacks N******! I think it is you who are missing it Dan.
Apr 9, 2004 7:03AM PDT

My g-grandfather suffered his whole life for his effort to defend the union and free the slaves. His brother was killed doing the same. It's an outrage to suggest a KKK leader should have directed policy during that period.

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(NT) No he didn't say anything so 'specific'
Apr 9, 2004 7:03AM PDT

.

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It was in the article you linked to, Evie.
Apr 9, 2004 7:10AM PDT
Lott claimed at a private party for former Sen. Strom Thurmond's 100th birthday that if Lott's 1948 segregationist presidential bid had succeeded, "We wouldn't have had all these problems over all these years."

Lott was fully aware of the issues that Thurmond was advocating in that race. But there's a typo in it. It was Thurmond who ran in 1948, not Lott.

Dan
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Anything about segregation there?
Apr 9, 2004 7:29AM PDT

You simply are unwilling to accept Lott's explanation regarding the other aspect of his platform at the time re: States' rights. We wouldn't have a lot of the problems we have today if not for the overreaching Federal Government.

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Yes! '1948 segregationist presidential bid ' -nt
Apr 9, 2004 7:49AM PDT

.

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No ... not in the platform ...
Apr 9, 2004 7:55AM PDT

... in the link you claimed quoted Lott as "specifically" referring to that portion of the platform. Again, you and others prefer to take Lott's words out of context to mean that which you desire, despite his explanations to the contrary. While at the same time failing to see the utter hypocrisy of not holding Dodd to the same standard.

I repeat that I don't believe either intended to endorse those parts of Thurmond's or Byrd's pasts as Lott's comments were interpreted. Would just be nice for a breath of fresh air for Dodd to be held to the same standard, especially considering that Byrd has used the n-word in a derogatory fashion far more recently than Thurmond ever legislated on a racial basis.

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and, IMO, it's a safe bet that he still uses the N word in private. (NT)
Apr 9, 2004 8:58AM PDT

.

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Re: Where's the outrage now?
Apr 9, 2004 9:07AM PDT

Hi, Evie.

First, I'd like to see the context of the entire statement, not just the snippet the Times reported. Unlike Lott, Dodd is a Northerner and a liberal, and I find it virtually incomprehensible that he in fact meant what that comment seems to say. But it wouldn't surprise me at all that a newspaper known for "creative" reporting somehow manage to twist the meaning of his words.

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

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Re:Re: Where's the outrage now?
Apr 9, 2004 9:31AM PDT

You are kidding right?

I don't see how you can take anything any MORE out of context than a minor reference at a birthday party was.

So a northern white liberal can't be a racist, but a southern white conservative is automatically assumed one until proven otherwise. That my friend is the definition of double standard.

Evie Happy

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A newspaper known for "creative" reporting...
Apr 9, 2004 9:47AM PDT

Dave, it was a UPI story. Your standard smear the source attempt doesn't make it. Or do you hold that UPI reporting is "creative"?

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Senator Dodd's Speech
Apr 9, 2004 9:50AM PDT

Because links to the minutes of the senate don't work I've copied it's entirety here. You can navigate there by going to http://thomas.loc.gov/r108/r108.html and selecting SENATE for April 1 and going from there to Line 25, " CONGRATULATING SENATOR ROBERT C. BYRD ON CASTING HIS 17,000TH VOTE".

Senator Dodd stated, "

I carry with me every single day, 7 days a week, a rather threadbare copy of the United States Constitution given to me many years ago--I can't even read it well now; it is so worn out--I may need a new copy--given to me by my seatmate, ROBERT C. BYRD. I revere it. I tell people why I carry it because it reminds me of the incredible gift given to me by the people of Connecticut to serve in this Chamber, to remind me of the importance of an oath we all made, and that is to do everything we can to preserve, protect, and defend the principles upon which this Nation was founded. ROBERT C. BYRD, in my mind, is the embodiment of that goal.

It has often been said that the man and the moment come together. I do not think it is an exaggeration at all to say to my friend from West Virginia that he would have been a great Senator at any moment. Some were right for the time. ROBERT C. BYRD, in my view, would have been right at any time. He would have been right at the founding of this country. He would have been in the leadership crafting this Constitution. He would have been right during the great conflict of civil war in this Nation. He would have been right at the great moments of international threat we faced in the 20th century. I cannot think of a single moment in this Nation's 220-plus year history where he would not have been a valuable asset to this country. Certainly today that is not any less true.

I join my colleagues in thanking the Senator from West Virginia for the privilege of serving with him. He has now had to endure two members of my family as colleagues. Senator Byrd was elected to the Senate in 1958 along with my father. He served with my father in the House. I have now had the privilege of serving with Senator Byrd for 24 years, twice the length of service of my father. That is an awful lot of time to put up with members of the Dodd family. We thank Senator Byrd for his endurance through all of that time.

There is no one I admire more, there is no one to whom I listen more closely and carefully when he speaks on any subject matter. I echo the comments of my colleague from Massachusetts. If I had to pick out any particular point of service for which I admire the Senator most, it is his unyielding defense of the Constitution. All matters come and go. We cast votes on such a variety of issues, but Senator Byrd's determination to defend and protect this document which serves as our rudder as we sail through the most difficult of waters is something that I admire beyond all else.

I join in this moment in saying: Thank you for your service, thank you for your friendship, and I look forward to many more years of sitting next to you on the floor of the Senate.

I yield the floor. "