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General discussion

When should you replace your Wi-Fi router?

Mar 1, 2018 5:11PM PST

When should someone consider replacing their Wi-Fi router? Is it around the 4- or 5-year mark or only if it is starting to act up? What do you all do? And are there any added security benefits to having newer hardware? Thanks.

--Submitted by Dan P.

Discussion is locked

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Lightning, indeed ...
Mar 3, 2018 4:31PM PST

Thanks, Hforman.

We've looked into surge protection for the whole house, but it seems even with GOOD stuff it is an uphill battle around here. Fortunately, the power line, being underground, is not hit quite that often. Our exposure seems to be the phone line, which is copper on poles. And the telco is not keen to do much about it because eventually it will give way to fiber and/or wireless technology, such as LTE or 5G - cable theft being another problem ...

So, our entertainment center, the computers, the alarm system and the irrigation system for the garden are all on inverters sporting between 100 Ah and 160 Ah calcium batteries. That will give us between six and 20 hours off the grid as far as power is concerned. All network equipment is also on these batteries, so that I can post to CNET during a thunderstorm or other power outages Wink

Surge protection for the phone line is something I could still add - it is just awkward to do at the right place, the way the wires are run through this old house. The placement of the ADSL splitter and filters is probably less than optimal, but since 4Mb/s is all I get - and I am getting that - there is not much of an incentive to fine tune that - especially considering that everything but the ADSL router seems to survive. Sometimes just the ADSL function goes, other times the whole unit dies. And sometimes the phone line itself survives and sometimes it does not. Go figure ... (as you can see, I am getting somewhat fatalistic about the whole thing ...

(Signal lines, of course, are another story. Gate intercoms survive for much longer if they are wireless, as do outdoor security sensors, CCTV cameras, etc.)

But - to get back to the thread's topic - The WiFi router, which in my case is also the ADSL router, gets replaced after electrocution 99.9% of the time and very rarely for other reasons. And for as long as WiFI speed is much greater than WAN speed there is no upgrade pressure.

If your internet connection is on a fast cable it may be a different story, depending on how fast your WiFi capable devices are. Obviously, if you use LTE or (soon?) 5G your WiFi may need to be top notch to keep up, but then your router would be quite a recent model anyway that supports the higher WoFo speeds.


If your WiFi router links to a fast cable it is

or to a mobile phone network via UMTS, LTE or in future 5G instead, the speed

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LTE? 5G?
Mar 3, 2018 9:43PM PST

The only device I have that handles those (4G or LTE) is my cell phone. I don't have tablets with SIM cards nor do my desktops and notebooks. They have BT and WiFi, no mobile LTE or 4G. Only phones have that here.

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5G, LTE etc ...
Mar 4, 2018 12:48AM PST

BT? British Telecom? I.e. fixed line telco?

What I am aware of in addition to that is satellite (now mostly obsolete due to the huge latency and the need for a back channel on a separate technology,) TV cable, proprietary microwave links and mobile phone technology. There also seems to be some variant of WiFi that is WAN capable, but I am not sure of that.

Mobile phone technology became viable with UMTS = 3G, currently the best option is LTE = 4G and the first announcements are out about 5G (not sure yet what they call that standard, but it is supposed to be a major leap in available bandwidth. Yes, all this is mobile phone technology, but they wouldn't need all of that just for a single voice channel. So it is decidedly data technology. My last three smart phones all have a feature where they can start a WiFi hot spot that allows laptops etc. to connect through the phone to the internet via LTE or whatever phone connectivity is available at the location. (Alternatively, they can also log into other WiFi hot spots and use their internet connectivity - but only one or the other at any given time.)

Thirdly, we have devices that provide 3G, LTE or soon 5G connectivity to compute devices. Some take the shape of a USB "dongle" looking like a USB storage stick but providing direct connectivity to the mobile phone network for data use. Others work like my smartphones, opening a WiFi hot spot connecting several devices at once to your mobile network. Google some or all of these for more info:

B315 LTE Wi-Fi Router, R230 Wi-Fi Router, R216 Wi-Fi Router, etc.

All these use a SIM card linked to either a data-only contract or a prepaid option by your local mobile phone service provider of choice.

Possible speeds over LTE exceed the ADSL speeds, so do prices. Coverage - yours may vary. So check covarage maps from all your network providers before putting your chips down. Most of the options mentioned here are quite mobile, so also check coverage in other areas you might frequent.

Writing all of this down is also quite therapeutic for me, since I have just seen a telco technician chasing my current landline outage three weeks after it went down, so i am reconsidering my options. Maybe I need to migrate to a country where free unlimited bandwidth is part of the Human Rights Syllabus. Wink

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Lightning
Mar 11, 2018 12:08PM PDT

Over my many years of Service calls, I have found that homes with Underground Irrigation systems, Landscaped Lighting systems and underground dog fences seem to get affected by lightning strikes more than other homes. Underground or above ground electrical service does not seem to be a factor because surges come through the lines regardless. It seems to be like having a giant antenna leading directly into your home. I cannot tell you how many dog fence controllers I have seen literally blown off the garage wall without a knowingly direct lightning strike. You do not need to have a direct lightning strike to your house or pole to get large surges coming down electrical, telephone and cable lines. Even strikes several blocks away can induce large surges. I would definitely recommend installing whole house surge protection as well as smaller local surge protectors on all sensitive electronic devices.

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There Are Many Factors to Consider
Mar 6, 2018 7:22AM PST

If a router is hardwired (via Ethernet) to your device or devices potentially (meaning you don’t use Wi-Fi) you could theoretically keep the same router forever (although you wouldn’t want to), barring component failure, inflicted damage or power surge.

The Ethernet ports on today’s routers are 10/100/1000 Megabits per second (Mbps). Worst case scenario someone may have an old router that is only 10/100 and that individual without a doubt should upgrade.

By way of explanation..."10/100/1000 mbps means that the port or device supports 10, 100, and 1000 Megabits per second. When a device is connected to a port, the device and port will exchange information to negotiate what speed they will use when communicating. The fastest speed that the device and port both support will typically be used".

Let’s say that you are using a game console that is capable of accepting an Ethernet connection at 1000 Mbps. If the ISP supplies 1Gbps and the router can pass that on to the game console then 1Gbps will be the negotiated throughput for all three. However some mitigating factors are:

_The router is only capable of 10/100 throughput and the ISP provides 1 Gbps speed_Buy a new router; as most likely the game console will have poor frame rates.
_The router is 10/100/1000 capable; but the ISP limits the speed to 300 Mbps_Buy a new router only if the frames rates on the game console are degraded which might indicate a failing NIC in the router (more on that later).
_The router is 10/100/1000 capable and the ISP provides 1 Gbps speed and frames rates on the game console are good_No need for a new router

Another factor that will impact an Ethernet connection is the Network Interface Card (NIC). Device performance (even if the router and ISP negotiate at 1000 Mbps and both have good NIC’s) may be degraded; if the NIC of the client is not capable of accepting speeds at 1000 Mbps or is damaged. This goes to say that in a wired configuration poor performance may not always be the fault of the router.

Security in a wired (Ethernet) configuration as it relates to the router is a non-issue for the most part. Breaches would have to occur at the ISP level in order to be transmitted; barring the end user visiting unencrypted websites and/or opening email with malware or allowing someone to remotely take control of their PC to plant malware.

To wrap this section about a router that is wired via Ethernet to clients_all things being equal (ISP provided speed, all clients 10/100/1000 capable, security breach being the fault of the end user) you probably wouldn’t notice a decline in router performance. At least not until a faulty connection can be traced back to the router as the weak link which could be years barring any of the mitigating factors mentioned above.

The Wi-Fi router
The majority of consumer oriented routers are Wi-Fi capable. Here is where things can get convoluted. Todays Wi-Fi capable routers come in various flavors to meet Wi-Fi standards of 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac and now 802.11 ad. The alpha’s theoretically represent the following:
_Speed Improvement (connection throughput)
_Interference resistance
_Combination of Speed/Interference resistance


Next_Wireless Frequency_2.4Ghz and 5Ghz
The 2.4Ghz frequency is slower than 5Ghz but has greater penetration through walls. Therefore most wireless devices reside in that range. The 2.4Ghz is also more vulnerable to interference from other wireless devices many of which are found in the home like other wi-fi devices, cordless phones, Bluetooth devices, baby monitors and microwave ovens.

The 5Ghz frequency is faster than 2.4Ghz but has a shorter distance than 2.4Ghz and less penetration through walls. The other advantage is that there is less traffic on the 5Ghz frequency which makes it less susceptible to interference which is an advantage over the 2.5Ghz frequency in crowded urban areas.

To bring this into perspective here’s some information on Router's Wi-Fi Standard (802.11 a/b/g/n/ac). For brevity we’ll focus on 802.11n:

"This standard - 802.11n - allows you to transfer data at 600Mbps (mega bits per second) theoretically, though some 802.11n routers come with top speeds of only 300Mbps (which translates to downloads of 37.5MBps or mega bytes per second). The latest Wi-Fi standard is 802.11ac. It allows a transfer speed of 1.3Gbps".

When you purchase a router today the lowest standard will be 802.11n while the highest will be in most cases 802.11ac. Regardless of which standard the router maxes out at it will be backwards compatible to 802.11 a/b/g at least for the foreseeable future. The 802.11ad is the newest and is basically a gaming frequency. Although it is super-fast its distance is very short almost to the point of being line-of-sight.

All this talk about throughput (i.e. speeds) really means nothing if the client is not capable of negotiating the standard. Most consumer PC’s manufactured today are capable of communicating wirelessly over 802.11n with an ever increasing number of PC’s using the 802.11ac standard. There are very few PC’s that can handle the 802.11ad frequency. Non-PC devices typically operate with 802.11n utilizing the 2.4Ghz frequency as the default. Some are capable of operating in the 5Ghz frequency.

Wi-Fi Security
Unlike a wired connection Wi-Fi has many vulnerabilities. Wi-Fi is where outside hacks begin. Therefore, any router you purchase should be capable of 128 Bit Encryption and WPA2 standard compatibility. No exception. Period.

The router_which to buy? There are really only two you should consider:
_802.11n or 802.11ac_both of which offer dual band capability (2.4Ghz and 5Ghz)
_802.11ac_which can offer dual band and tri-band (2.4Ghz x 1 and 5Ghz x 2).

The latter offers load distribution to enable large households to place devices on different bands to ease congestion and/or mitigate bandwidth interference internally and externally. As a mention…Wi-Fi operates on various channels (6, 8 etc.) which some routers allow the user to select; as another way of mitigating interference. The choices become even more convoluted when you start talking about features_click the link for info on the Asus RT-AC5300 for an example: https://www.asus.com/us/Networking/RT-AC5300/

If you’re a Tech-Junkie like me you might flip them based upon technical offerings. As your clients become more sophisticated out-of-the box (such as a PC that can utilize 802.11ad Wi-Fi std) you might consider upgrading your router. Last with Wi-Fi if you are experiencing slow streaming, client drop-offs, signal interference or any combination of the aforementioned you might consider upgrading your router. The caveat being you have thoroughly determined that none of your clients; nor ISP are at fault. FYI, slow steaming can also be experienced over Ethernet. If the ISP and client are ruled out then you might consider a new router. Reference security_if the router is capable of 128 Bit Encryption and WPA2 standard there’s not much to do until a new encryption protocol is established.

Read more about routers at the link:
https://gadgets.ndtv.com/laptops/features/buying-a-wi-fi-router-here-are-the-features-and-specifications-that-matter-67592

Together Everyone Achieves More = TEAM

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Mesh wireless "systems"
Mar 9, 2018 6:48PM PST

The new mesh wireless systems suggest that one might replace one's router when one doesn't have good wireless all over the house. I have an eero with 3 2nd generation "Pro" nodes, and I have better wireless all over my house than when I had a single "honking big router" at the point where the cable broadband comes into the house. So, if wireless is important to you in this day of phones and tablets everywhere, then that's the time. Mesh is much better than trying to use powerline networking or wireless extenders. Go for it. Enjoy it.

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Mesh is unnecessarily expensive for WIFI
Mar 9, 2018 11:47PM PST

Mesh is unnecessarily expensive for WIFI. If you need to, use a gigabite or greater Powerline pair and locate you router in the center of the coverage area.

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When standards change
Mar 9, 2018 7:39PM PST

1. Look to replace a router when the industry standards change, e.g. the move from 802.11n to 802.11ac as the top of the line wifi.
2. Look to replace your router when you need more bandwidth, e.g. replace an AC750 router with an AC3200 one.
3, Look to replace your router when you need better coverage in your home or office. Newer standards provide capabilities like beam-forming to direct a wifi signal to a device, rather than dispersing it. Although I have not tried it yet, the newer mesh network router and supporting equipment offer potential for better coverage with no dead spots.

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Security standards change
Mar 9, 2018 11:51PM PST

The most important standard change is a security standard change. This change should cause you to consider an upgrade.
Above all make sure you keep the firmware up-to-date.

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The Limiting Factor
Mar 10, 2018 8:52PM PST

When my old 802.11G router needed replacing, I did NOT go with the fastest 802.11AC router. There was no need to because the limiting factor on the Internet was my ISP giving me 50 mbps down, 5 mbps up. I couldn't do more than 50 mbps regardless of what the router was capable of. Now if I was running my own server, that would be a different story (file transfer between devices).

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I change only when I need to!
Mar 9, 2018 10:34PM PST

I have a TP Link Modem/Router which is dual band and up to N class.

No need to change to AC class as all my linked devices use N and are not able to connect to AC.

I will move up only when I have devices that can use AC or my present TP link dies.

Make sure you have the lattest firmware available & change you wireless passwords periodically.

No point upgrading because AC is the latest standard if you do not have devices that can connect to AC.

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Re: only when I need to
Mar 9, 2018 11:05PM PST

Yep. That's the approach.

Keeping the firmware current is a good idea and an absolute MUST if you are security sensitive.

Obviously you will have an eye on what the pundits say about the current encryption standards and react when vulnerabilities are discovered and upgrades are announces. At teh time of this writing the current standard is WPA2 and you shouldn't use anything less. However, there are reports about problems with it and an announcement was made recently referring to a next version named - not very creatively - WPA3. Considering the vulnerability of WPA2 it would make sense to upgrade to WPA3 as soon as it becomes available (leaving a bit of time to get the first wave of fixed out of the way - and to find that you have the first devices that also support it, because it makes little difference if your router can do WPA3 but none of your devices can.)

You may find it surprising, but the security experts are now coming around to the opinion that a good password does not lose its security rating due to old age. Which makes sense - since hacking a password is not an iterative process: When you enter a wrong password they don't tell you "the first seven characters are okay, but the rest still needs work" - they just tell you "Wrong!" You don't even know if you have the right number of characters. The only reasons to change a password are if you accept that it is easy to guess or if you gave it to someone or find that someone looked at that piece of paper that you shouldn't have stuck under the keyboard in the first place.

Obviously, with routers that come configured with a default WPA2 key (or "password") that you can find on the sticker on the underside of the router - you do need to change that - once. Also, the admin user ID for accessing the router's configuration pages needs a personalized password - not (!) the same as the WPA2 key, by the way!

I know of course that an estimated 99% of the people that read this know all this and an estimated 45% act accordingly. I wrote all this up here for the rest of you ... Wink

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WIFI Passwords Hacked in 5 Minutes
Mar 10, 2018 1:01AM PST

Hi,

I did Cert 3 in Networking & was encouraged by the tutor to do Cert 4 where they would teach Ethical Hacking. He claimed he could sit outside any house or business & hack the Wi-Fi within 5 minutes.

He was put to the test & accomplished it regardless of the network security.

That's why I change passwords on the wireless network every other month & have changed both the Admin Name & Password on my Modem Router as well.

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Intersting. That now begs the question:
Mar 10, 2018 1:56AM PST

How can that be?

Not that I doubt that. I am in no poistion to do that until I have an idea how that is done. Which is why i am asking you here.

Obviously, hacking a Windows user pasword is not quite so quick (except by social engineering.) By the same argument I would expect the hacking of the admin password to take a similar amount of time as a Windows or Linux password. Clearly, if one can log into my router as admin one can easily see my WiFi key and even change it (which of course would be counterproductive since it would lock me out and just force me to go through a factory reset.)

So, what is different about the WiFi router's environment? It wouldn't impress me if he can only do that with out-of-the-box routers, using a database of factory-installed passwords, or with routers where the admin password is still the factory default.

Then, on the other hand, if this could be verified I would lean more towards changing my password every other hour or so ...

Okay, whatever. What I had said was that ging a secure pasword is no longer recommended - the temptation to choose "memorable" passwords snd/or to write them down is just too great.

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What's worse a Google Search shows you how
Mar 10, 2018 12:07PM PST

Hi,

Not something I would try to do myself however a Google search of "hack wifi modem/router" gives pages of links how to do it with youtube video tutorials.

You simply have to keep all settings at max, everything uptodate & change passwords frequently and hope your neighbours are honest & not literate in hacking wifi.

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I did that search
Mar 10, 2018 5:24PM PST

It looks like the current weak spot on modern routers is WPS. It is apparently a weak protocol, and can be cracked within a few minutes. So, disable WPS. If you have a device you want to add to the network, and that's the only choice, then enable WPS long enough to add the device, and then disable it, again.

From that point, WPA2 with a strong (meaning long) password is reasonably secure from any random hacker. You would only be at risk if you're very high profile person or company and/or you have some government wanting to break in.

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Oh, WPS ...
Mar 10, 2018 6:54PM PST

Yeah, that one is indeed an old and well-documented vulnerability. Well, the brand of router I stockpile for replacement after thunderstorms comes with a good price and WPS off by default - and I know better than to use that.

So - that wasn't "WiFi passwords hackrd in 5 minutes" it was "WPS hacked in 5 minutes." Yes, I agree, one needs to stay away from that as far as possible.

We should add that to the reasons for replacing your WiFi router (and any WiFi enabled device, in factHappy --- If you cannot keep WPS off reliably ---

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There can be many reasons to replace a Router
Mar 10, 2018 4:53AM PST

There really is no set life expectancy for Routers, Modems or Gateways however I typically recommend replacing them about every 3 or 4 years. Having said that, there are many possible reasons someone might want to replace a Router other than due to failure or technical issues. Note: Routers and modems tend to be more susceptible to lightning strikes and surges since they are the first devices in line from the street which is why many may fail prematurely.

RANGE ISSUES – Your current Wireless router may not be reaching all the rooms and locations throughout your home or office and you want to purchase a new Wireless Router to improve the wireless coverage. The New MESH network systems like the Linksys Velop and Netgear Orbi can dramatically improve wireless coverage in larger homes and offices or in locations that have poor reception.

LARGE NUMBER OF WIRELESS DEVICES – Maybe you have increased the number of wireless devices using your network and the whole system is starting to slow down. A new router may offer more advanced routing features that will allow you to prioritize Internet traffic so you can give the fastest access to specific devise or people. For example: you might want to give your streaming TV priority so as to prevent pauses and excess loading problems while watching online content.

ADDITIONAL SECURITY – Many of the newer routers have improved security and other features like VPN capabilities for those that might want to connect into their computers from outside. Some units may include more advanced firewall capabilities as well. There are also many other new security features that may be of interest to some users?

PARENTAL CONTROLS – Many of the new routers have advanced parental controls that offer the ability to control Internet access so as to keep children off the Internet during specific hours as well as other features to control access.

WIRELESS SPEED – New routers can offer increased connection speeds over older routers offering Dual or Tri Band capabilities having both 2.4 GHz and 5.0 GHz networks. This feature can also give you the ability to relieve a crowded network by placing some devices on one network and others on the other network. NOTE: To take full advantage of some higher speeds, your receiving devices also need the capability.

GIGABIT ETHERNET – Another feature that may be of interest is Gigabit Ethernet. This is the speed of the connection to devices in your house that use an Ethernet cable to connect to the router instead of wireless. Many home have a main computer that may be connected via Ethernet or many devices in the home connected via Ethernet. Some homes or office may have Ethernet jacks in every room. NOTE: All devices must have Gigabit capabilities to take advantage of this. But they will still work if some don’t.

Dana
Wayland Computer

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When it stops working
Mar 10, 2018 8:11AM PST

I replace mine when I start having to reset it everyother day.

The newer versions give you the ability to require and administrator to approve linked devices and easily add them. So if you have a lot of through traffic, it might be worth it to upgrade. But if you don't hand out your Wi-Fi password like it is holloween candy - why bother?

At the end of the day all sensitive transactions should be encrypted and you should have a firewall on your PC.

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When it malfunctions or there is a new 802.11 standard
Mar 10, 2018 8:34AM PST

A good router will last a long time without malfunctioning, but when they malfunction they tend to give you LOTS of early warnings, like noticeably reduced throughput and/or a high percentage of files corrupted on download, necessitating a lot of retries.

But they do malfunction sometimes, and obviously you will want to replace them when they do.

But there are some things to try first. Of course the first step is to unplug the router and then, after a m inute or so, plug it back in, thus doing a "hard" reboot. This fixes the problem an an astonishingly high percentage of the time. If not, it would be unusual for them to be reparable, but sometimes, like all data processing systems, they get corrupted for some reason like an errant cosmic ray or a momentary power outage, corrupting the firmware. You can sometimes clear such problems by reloading or updating the firmware (this is easier on some brands of routers than on others).

But the chief reason for getting a new router is the release of a new 802.11 standard. Currently the production release is 802.11ac, which was a big improvement over 802.11n, which was an even bigger improvement over 802.11g, which was a SPECTACULAR improvement over 802.11b.

The new standard, 802.11ad, is almost ready for promulgation,. and you might want to get one of those when they come out, which will provide gigabit throughput surpassing most wired Ethernet networks.

But otherwise, if it's working, you needn't fix it.

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Hope This Helps
Aug 23, 2018 12:33AM PDT

Hi,
I only replace my ADSL Modem Router for the following 2 reasons:-

a/. When either it dies or starts needing a cold boot (turn off & back on) to re-establish the internet connection regularly.

b/. I buy a new device that has a higher speed wireless. For instance I buy a new laptop that has wireless AC and my router only has b, g & n thus to use AC I need an AC Router.

If you have no devices that use AC then a b, g, n Wireless router would be fine.

Lastly I have mine plugged into a surge protection board as well as the phone line through the surge protection board. Thus never been damaged by power surges.