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General discussion

What's your take on the next-generation DVD format wars?

Mar 7, 2006 7:37AM PST

What's your take on the next-generation DVD format wars?

Blu-ray all the way (tell us why)
HD-DVD, that's for me! (tell us why)
Too early to tell; I'm waiting it out (tell us why)
Not interested (why not?)
What the heck are you talking about?

Discussion is locked

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Interested in HD-DVD, but Blu-Ray interests me too...
Mar 7, 2006 9:59AM PST

Currently, we are interested in both formats, but think it would be foolish to jump into the pool just yet. We'll more than likely stick with standard DVD for now and upgrade to an HD-DVR after the tech matures a bit there, then after HD-DVD has had a couple years to grow into itself, upgrade there too.

Currently running a 60" HD with UltimateTV DVR.

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blu ray or hd dvd who cares
Mar 7, 2006 10:08AM PST

If i had time to watch a move I may care but at this time backing up my wife work at home computer is a more pressing need. being able to dump her RAID 10 setup on to 1 dvd disk every week would be nice if the cost was with in reason. so i will wait. i donot like bleeding edge tech after spending 30years in large frame computers. whose company management chased every star leaving people like myself working late into the nite and most weekend while they(management) chased the sun and wondered why their dwarfs were so pale. ps: with a 5 disk sony dvd player going to the next disk give time unload and refresh the beer and popcorn snaks anyone

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I'm going to wait
Mar 7, 2006 10:13AM PST

I going to wait it out for two reasons, 1st to see which format wins but more imporantly because I can't watch HD on either format if they use the downrez flag. My older set only has component inputs and I'm not going to buy a new set for HD Dvd's until my current set dies.

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The Standard answer?
Mar 7, 2006 10:26AM PST

Who has all the technical advances to make a coherent choice in the matter? I've got the tv but who wants to end up with a boat anchor? Wait and see, I'm with you all the way.

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Fools rush in where Wise men save their hard earned dollars
Mar 7, 2006 12:28PM PST

When the Videos are on the shelf, the Games all need the hardware and the old gear needs replacing people will move. Early adoptors will probably miss out on the dual standard unit (yep it may even have 2 drives in it like the dvd/vcr combos of today) at half the price they were on day one and with extra features that have yet to be invented.

With no compelling reason to move, and many reasons (like the Content Restrictions And Protectionism [C.R.A.P] which keeps everything encrypted right into the TV set) I'll wait for the companies to get desperate and start adding features that users want, rather than what the RIAA and its ilk want. and get a better unit

Of course make a compelling reason to switch like the PS3 with really cool games AND access to hi-def movies and maybe I'll get used to a standard sooner rather than later.

After All I got my first dvd writer before I brought my first PC with a DVD player. Since I was doing video editing going didgital made sense. As of today I have no such reason to spend my dollars.

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Toshibas' HD-DVD over Sony's Blu-ray
Mar 7, 2006 10:18AM PST

Simply because sony sucks! I'm one of several million CD buyers who had thier comeputer screwed-up after downloading that blackmail/Big Bother software... And becuase of that EVERYTIME I get slam Sony I do! I'm warning consumers to stay away from all thing Sony-The Digital Anti-Christ! Go Toshiba!

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Bluray versus HD-DVD: Not interested
Mar 7, 2006 10:18AM PST

It is not a matter of technology, but a matter of marketing. The world settled for VHS instead of Betamax the "last time", and the world got an inferior product because of marketing, NOT technological superiority. Shall we end up once more with the better marketing instead of the better technology? Hence the discussion is irrelevant. As consumers we have no way to defend ourselves at this stage.

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Sony? Marketing problems with Beta? as if!
Mar 7, 2006 10:34AM PST

marketing? is that what you think doomed Beta? Umm... no... it was greed. Pure and simple capitilistic greed. Sony charged too much to license their Beta standard, and JVC charged next to nothing for VHS.

Sony shot themselves in the foot because they got greedy (why do you think that Apple has such a small share in the computer market... the same licensing issues).

And yet they continue... with Memory Stick... Not one of the fastest or most robust memory products in the world, and yet... what do you know... Sandisk, Lexar, and others have to pay royalties to Sony to produce them... as do camera manufacturers wishing to use the slot for storage... and thus... not hardly anyone uses Memory Sticks (except Sony of course).

And now... I'm sure Blu-Ray will work the same way... Sony will charge too high a royalty for the production and sales of Blu-Ray devices and, the other standard will probably win (and with Microsoft on HD-DVD's side... how can that not help bring it along... if Windows accepts only HD-DVD for a format... what chance does Blu-Ray have on the computer...).

It will surely be a fur-flying, barn burning fight... and myself, and many many many others are probably just going to sit back, plug in their up-converting DVD players, and let it play itself out.

Wink

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No new system needed (yet)
Mar 7, 2006 10:42AM PST

Unless you are watching a DVD at a home theater, or on a gigantic screed, there really is no need for a better format. The quality is more than optimal, and staying with this system will keep prices down. There really isnt a big need to move on. When something revolutionary comes along I might take a look.

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Not interested in another dvd format.
Mar 7, 2006 10:42AM PST

I am sick and tired of having to keep buying new equipment. Dvds are much better than vhs and I'm satisfied with it. I would rather see more work done with printer longivity, make PCs work like they are supposed to when they are supposed to, software that does what its supposed to do, a more stabile computing system. Windows XP (Media Edition sucks) isn't perfected and now Vista is coming out. Don't make it work right, put out a new model.

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Both are betamaxes because holograpgic is coming
Mar 7, 2006 10:46AM PST

Holograghic is coming in 2006 or 2007. Capicity is 100 gigs/disk (single layer). I like blu-ray, but it will be obsolete in less than one year, unless you buy a PS3. For everybody else, including computers, holographic will win.

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Wait it out.
Mar 7, 2006 10:48AM PST

Another new technology, you better wait because until an industry standard is set, if not you run the chance of being stuck with a quickly obsolescent piece of equipment. Or maybe worse, two years down the road you end up paying $5 or more per disc for your technology while the other technology costs a few cents per disk.
Just look at all those people stuck with PC's with RDRAM memory, which was going to be the next "new" memory technology. Now it costs $250-$300 for a 512MB upgrade compared to $50 for DDR memory. While getting the newest stuff first is cool, waiting a little while until the standard is set can make you look brilliantly cool.

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Consumers are tired of Format Wars
Mar 7, 2006 11:02AM PST

I think consumers are tired of format wars period. I'm in the A/V business and this is the last thing we need right now. From what I've read,it seems like Blu-ray will have more movies when it comes out but HD-DVD is hoping that it's fast start will give it a big lead over Blu-ray. As a consumer and someone who works in the A/V business I can't wait for someone to bring out the ultimate Universal Player- one that can play both Blu-ray and HD-DVD as well as regular DVD's and SACD/CD/DVD-Audio. If this product can be made for a fairly reasonable price then that's the product that I will wait and pay for. I will take a wait and see approach and see what happens in this format war.

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Early Adopter no longer
Mar 7, 2006 8:58PM PST

As the owner of Beta from the beginning, laserdisc(hundreds) and DVD I've had enough of the idiotic format wars. I'll buy after Sony has lost another format war with a superior product.
DVD has become so pervasive because of the price drops that have made owning a movie almost cheaper than copying. I don't see this format debacle being worth my dollars.

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Neither Optical Media is History
Mar 7, 2006 11:10AM PST

Neither HD-DVD or Blu-Ray will be the next big thing. Apple will allow us to download any movie ever made at any time day or night without having to buy, store or rent movies. Just type in the name of the movie you want and watch it, pause, rewind, fast forward whatever you want (streamed live over broadband though iTunes).

So no need to store anything, no scratched discs, just any movie you want anytime in HD quality for a monthly service cost.

I mean this discussion is practically like asking which new typewritter is going to be the most popular? I mean common, the age of the disc is over.

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In the future Maybe, but not yet
Mar 7, 2006 1:05PM PST

The problem is Broadband penetration. The us has high figures but with slow growth, NZ for example has just 16% of the population with broadband and by broadband we mean 2 meg down 128K up, so its throttled in most cases.

Unless broadband is rapidly deployed at low cost arround the world hard media (DVD) and other optical will still be needed.

But I am yet to be impressed so iTUNES looks good - Except there is no ITMS in New Zealand.

You need to see the global picture to see why this is happening. But the PS3 will at least let you play blu-ray as well as play games so its looking like the logical answer. will sony make it easy for others to join the game or will it be another UMD. That is te real question

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HDTV too much!
Mar 7, 2006 11:22AM PST

Too expensive, too much DRM, too much control of what I can view it on, and where I can view it. I hate the straight jacket the Corporations and Big Media are putting around the tech!

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HDTV too much! ***?
Mar 13, 2006 11:36PM PST

What are you talking about? No one controls your hd content any more than any other standard tv content, and the prices of hdtv's are now comparable to what tv's were costing in that size range before hdtv became popular, let's not forget how cheap standard tv's are now that more and more hdtv's are being produced. You can buy a 50" dlp / lcd proj. hdtv for less than $2000.00 and for a 50" hdtv crt model for less than $1000.00 do you realize that's less than what standard big screen tv's use to cost before hdtv's started filling the market! If anything tv's are getting cheaper?

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I prefer HD-DVD but let's see!!!
Mar 7, 2006 11:39AM PST

I am like the next guy always frustrated by the next thing coming. HD-DVD is referred to as High Definition DVD, like DVD-Audio from Dolby which is more universal to some people but like The Sony side of 5.1 Audio none of that really ever took off, but with video hopefuly things will change. Eventually the CD will to. Things will get better but the industry needs to standardize everything like Microsoft does. It is just better for the consumer!

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Not interested!
Mar 7, 2006 11:58AM PST

For crying out loud, HOW CLEAR does the picture have to be in order to enjoy a movie? I love my high def TV, but the quality I'm already getting is great, so I can't imagine anything short of holographic images dancing on my coffee table inspiring me to start buying above and beyond my current DVD library. The technology is too new - not even out of the womb - to even merit consideration on my part...

...but that's just me, and I could be wrong. Happy

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I agree
Mar 7, 2006 3:29PM PST

Original DVD is just fine if you ask me, too. So long as they keep shipping movies as regular DVD's I'll keep buying them that way. Even scaled to high resolutions, they still look great. Hey, if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

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10 years
Mar 7, 2006 12:09PM PST

I am still waiting for High Def television to make it.
You can bet that this fake tiff is about important as Quadrophonic versus discrete music.
Remember those early adapters of those large expensive digital platters , I can't even remember what they were called, Oh yes, "laser discs" Who, or Whom even has one?
Give us a break. DVD is almost ,finally, getting universal.
Believe me , america will not know or care about this fight. Adaptation is beyond the average person's knowledge or interest.
This is so far down the road from meaning anything to anyone beside a bunch of cutting edge geeks.

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holographic DVD - a dark horse
Mar 7, 2006 12:16PM PST

Holographic DVD will be on the market about the same time as the Blu-ray. Some think it may beat the Blu-ray. I think this is a dark horse that may eventually win out over both new formats if a clear winner is not quickly established. Sony is a great product innovator but when it comes to marketing they seldom win the long race.

Klark

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I couldn't agree more
Mar 7, 2006 8:57PM PST
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Will hold almost six times more...
Mar 7, 2006 12:26PM PST

The "next generation" of DVDs, able to hold almost six times as much information as current standard discs, has been unveiled by major technology companies.
The new format, the Blu-ray Disc, will store more than 13 hours of film, compared with the current limit of 133 minutes,

It is expected to come into its own as more viewers become able to record TV shows on DVD machines.

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HD-DVD: It's already HERE! Why debate over storage media?
Mar 7, 2006 12:29PM PST

I'm a little bit embarrased for you. HD-DVD is ALREADY here. And, the Media is plain old DVD.
Picture quality is STUNNING. I've already seen it. Here's a glimpse:
http://www.divx.com/hd/
http://www.divx-digest.com/software/xvid.html

I'm enthusiastic about the new STORAGE formats for DATA - but as far as DVD goes - the HD versions are stunning thanks to codecs like divx. See for yourself on the links above. Totally stunning & can be stored on today's DVD format.

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(NT) (NT) War good G'awd Y'all.. what is it good for?
Mar 7, 2006 12:41PM PST
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Until recently I thought Blu-Ray would be best.
Mar 7, 2006 12:42PM PST

First let me say that I've been reading about the "next generation" of blue laser based digital disks for several years now. I even read a very interesting interview in MIT Technology Review with the man who invented the new laser technology. So I've been waiting probably about 4-6 years now for this next jump in optical storage capacity. Sometimes I wondered if it was EVER going to get here. Happy

And from the very begining, the name I heard most was always Blu-Ray. In fact I didn't even hear about HD-DVD until sometime during the last year or so. Don't get me wrong, I not in the least surprised to find competing technologies, after all, look at DVD in all its +/- variations. Sadly, I think format wars are just a natural and unavoidable consequence of business economics as companies try to carve out marketshare and diferentiate themselves from the competition. Yes, sometimes industries will get together to create standards, but just as often you end up with multiple, competing and generally incompatible formats. (sigh)

Now all that said, and given that mostly all I'd heard about was Blu-Ray, AND given that it will have a higher capacity, I was firmly in the Blu-Ray camp... UNTIL I started to read some of the posts in this forum. Quite honestly, I dont have the money to be an early adaptor, and much as I'd like to, I probably can't even join the HiDef club when the prices of each technology drops by half or more. Sadly, I'm the sort of guy who has to wait until the hardware is dirt cheap and all the standard's wars have played out. Meaning I will sit on the sidelines for probably another 2-3 years, and just have to accept which ever format "wins".

However, after reading some other thoughtful posts on this subject, I believe it would be best for every one if HD-DVD emerges as the "winner" in this war. My reason has nothing to do with size, or price, or quality, or resolution, or any of the other things techno-nerdy things I would normally care about. In this case my reason is soley that as much as I admired Sony in the 70's and 80's, I no longer trust them as a hardware company.

Back in "the old days", back when Sony invented the walkman, and captured the world market with their cool little electronic gizmos, that was great. But now Sony is not only hardware, now it is a multimedia PRODUCER/DISTRIBUTOR, and as such its first focus is on DRM. In other words, now the whole issue of DRM makes it both supplier - and adversary - to its millions of customers.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm NOT trying to get into a whole debate about DRM, and pirating, etc. Honestly I can understand the arguments on both sides, and I feel both sides have abused the tolerance of the other.

My point is that as a producer/distributor of original creative works, Sony has tunnel vision. It's corporate philosophy has now become "how can we make sure that people MUST pay us whenever they access our digital content?" And this is a VERY different philosophy from "How can we make really cool electronics that people will want to buy?" Proof that the first philosophy now predominates at Sony is the recent debacle about Sony producing DVD's that install rootkit malware.

Honestly, no matter what format wins during the next few years, DRM is going to be grow and grow to be a majorly f'd up situation. Especially when companies pay to have legislation passed that strips consumers of their rights, and force users to accept draconian EULA's. The whole DRM is just going to get worse and worse in the next 10 years.

But for TODAY, I must vote AGAINST Blu-Ray purely because I don't trust Sony to treat me ("the end user") fairly when it comes to DRM. If it was PURELY a technological question, or one of who can stuff the most bits, then I'd vote for Blu-Ray without a split second of hesitation, and damn the price. (after all, I know that as critical mass is achieved in the market place, prices will come down, as they always do)

But given the extra DRM dimension, I am now forced to vote AGAINST the superior technology, and just hope that the latter generations of HD-DVD will eventually grow to the size that super high quality HiDef video demands. I've been a techno-weenie all my life, and it just "feels wrong" to vote against a technologically superior product. But in this case I feel everyone will benifit if we don't allow Sony to ulimately have near monopoly control of both content and medium.

So, that's my 2 cents worth, no doubt LOTS of people will strongly disagree, and tell me that I've got it all wrong, but unless Sony decides to sell off its Music and Video Production/Distribution divisions, I just don't feel they will have my ("the average end user") best interests in mind. They won't be making cool new electronics that have all the features I want. Instead they will be create products that are designed from scratch to be "crippled", and which force me to accept the features THEY feel I should be "allowed to have", while also doing their best to prevent me from gaining the features I really want (that being the ability to easily use/move content that I've paid for, on any product I own.)

Sincerly,

Ima Sloetyper

Disclaimer: Your milage my vary, Take with large grains of salt, and Never put anything in your ear, except your elbow! Happy

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Sony's DRM Focus
Mar 8, 2006 5:02AM PST

I agree with your arguement that Sony puts DRM first when building hardware.

I own a Sony Mini Disc player and found that I couldn't load a pod cast from National Public Radio to it using the MD Simple Burner software that came with the Mini Disc player. The error message from the software was that I didn't have "rights" to load the pod cast. It appears to me that Sony built DRM into its Mini Disc software long before they built root kits into their CDs.

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Rootkits came first... READ my MAIN post: "DRM"
Mar 8, 2006 5:37AM PST

You'll find out all sorts of thingsWink