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General discussion

What's the difference between Netbooks and notebooks?

Oct 24, 2008 4:55AM PDT
Question:

What's the difference between Netbooks and notebooks?

Lately, I've been hearing quite a buzz around Netbooks; maybe you've seen one, but these particular laptops are super tiny and cute! I'm currently shopping around for my first laptop, not for a desktop replacement, but a portable computer I can take along with me on my travels. I'm new to laptops, but aren't these so-called Netbooks like every other laptop out there, but just smaller in size? I'm having a difficult time differentiate the two types. Can you give me run down on the differences between the two types of laptops? I want something small in size, but does size matter when it comes to performance or operation? I sure don't want to buy something that won't meet my needs. Any information you can help me with this Netbook vs. laptop decision will help me out a great deal. Thanks in advance.

--Submitted by Donna S.

Here are some featured member answers to get you started, but
please read up on all the advice and suggestions that our
members have contributed to this member's question.

Difference between notebooks and netbooks --Submitted by 3rdalbum
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-7587_102-0.html?forumID=69&threadID=313546&messageID=2890973#2890973

Netbook vs. notebook --Submitted by waytron
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-7587_102-0.html?forumID=69&threadID=313546&messageID=2891079#2891079

What's a netbook? --Submitted by Watzman
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-7587_102-0.html?forumID=69&threadID=313546&messageID=2895071#2895071

Netbooks are... --Submitted by choosenotebook
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-7587_102-0.html?forumID=69&threadID=313546&messageID=28961632896163

If you have any additional recommendations or experience using netbooks to share with Donna, let's hear them. Click on the "Reply" link to post. Please be detailed as possible in your answer and list all options available. Thanks!

Discussion is locked

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What's the difference between Netbooks and notebooks?
Oct 25, 2008 1:07PM PDT

netbooks such as acer: "aspire one" OS is running Win XP home edition and Lnux that's means can only browse website can't join domain.
Also, most of netbooks have not CD or DVD rom.
So, netbook is tiny size and easy carry on travel.

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netbook vs notebook
Oct 25, 2008 5:27PM PDT

Netbook is more like a thin client that can be more controlled from a central location.

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Get a real laptop.
Oct 25, 2008 10:51PM PDT

The difference between Netbooks and Notebooks is more than just in the name. Netbooks are really only good for surfing the internet, hence their name. As much money as these things cost, I recommend getting a full featured laptop instead. Even Notebooks are not as fully featured as a good laptop. Sure Netbooks and Notebooks are smaller and lighter, but consider this. That reduction in weight and size comes at a price.

Laptops have larger screens, built in DVD and in some cases, still have 3.5" floppy drives. They also have better speakers, more slots for inserting PCI cards and in some cases, better video cards for displaying graphics. Laptops also stay cooler during long computing sessions.

So, unless you plan to only use your portable computer for surfing the web, I would not get a Netbook nor a Notebook.

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If your work is gaming, get a laptop - if you work is work..
Nov 9, 2008 7:48AM PST

get a little netbook. I go for months and don't use my DVD drive. There's nothing I can get done on a trip that won't fit on a thumb drive. With google docs, you can't fill a netbook up with work. If you're in the business of film or photos, you're not using a laptop anyway.
Acer Aspire one is the perfect workhorse for those who make their living away from their desks.
World of Warcraft, or GTA can wait til you get home. Now, back to work!

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To those people who wants a Netbook with Desktop perfomance:
Nov 19, 2008 9:20AM PST

Some minutes ago, I received an e-mail from Sony Vaio, announcing the new:

Sony Vaio Serie TT190F

Screen LCD 11.1" WXGA (XBRITE-DuraView?),

3 GB DDR3-SDRAM (PC3-6400, 2GB+1GB)

Drive DVD

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netbook
Oct 26, 2008 8:23AM PDT

is a notebook small in size..so small that it has no hard drive and certainly has no cd/dvd/rw drives, drive! useful for web surfing but not much else..hence netbook

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Netbooks do come with HDDs...
Nov 15, 2008 4:24PM PST

Hmm... Then why is it that my Acer Aspire ONE "Netbook" came with a 120GB HDD (now offering 160GB), 1GB memory and Windows XP Home? Don't discount netbooks as they are not all made the same. It's amazing the amount of misinformation which appears in this thread.

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No hard drive?
Mar 11, 2009 10:16AM PDT

I believe all Netbooks have, either HD (like my Toshiba NB100 with 1160 GB HD) or a solid state equivalent, usually with smaller capacity but power power consumption. As far as I know, no computer can operate without a HD or its solid state equivalent.

A for the traditional CD/DVD drives they are not includied (saving in weight, size and power consumption, but so far I have been using my netbook for all the jobs I did before with my desk PC without thiose increasingly obsolete mechanical drives.

When it comes to music or even video (not something frequent in my case), I can do this with Sandisk 8 GB pendrive that costed me 12 US$. Surfing the web? yes, but not only this....

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What's the Difference Between Netbooks and Notebooks?
Oct 26, 2008 8:46AM PDT

Working with computers for 30 years should make me credible here. If a laptop has a screen 10 inches or smaller, call it netbook. Some laptops have almost nothing built in (certain Macbooks) and need external hardware but they are still called notebooks. Some netbooks have all the bells and whistles but may cost. Set down what you want in a computer and then how much money you want to spend. If weight is a factor then a netbook might be the answer. However, the screens are small and you better have good eyes to read the smaller screen. I use a laptop with a 17 inch screen. Weight here is more but not that much more. My screen is big and can be clearly seen. There are also 5 plug in ports (USB). A smaller computer may only have 2 ports. Netbooks look cute but may not have the features you want.

John Cip

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Netbook vs Notebook
Oct 26, 2008 9:29AM PDT

There are several differences. One none of these netbooks i have seen come with an optical drive. That means to load any software you'll need an external drive or will have to download it. Next you need to look at the netbooks closely and see whether they come with a hard disk drive or a solid state drive. Solid states are similar to the way flash drives work and are more resiliant but you sacrifice storage space. A solid state drive in a netbook usually are 2-16gb while a hard drive could be much more. The basic idea of a netbook is that it will be used for basic document creation, email, and internet. If this is all you will ever want it for then these are great solutions

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What's the difference between Netbooks and notebooks?
Oct 26, 2008 10:12PM PDT

A notebook is really a small laptop. It is usually less powerful than a desktop. A lot of netbooks are usining Intel's Atom processor which is fine for surfing the web and doing some word processing. Netbooks don't have a great deal of storage. Notebooks will have anything from 80GB to 320GB hard drives and will deal with some image editing and will play some games. If you want to surf on the go, a Netbook is fine, if you want to do a lot more and have a lot of storage, a notebook is your best bet. Hope this helps,

Curlykale

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diff
Oct 28, 2008 6:44PM PDT

please clarify
the different between netbook and laptop

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Notebooks, Laptops, netbooks and just to confuse PDA's
Nov 1, 2008 1:20AM PDT

I do a lot of genealogy, and therefore I use genealogical programs. I know I can use a Notebook, laptop for genealogy and I also know I can use a PDA. The PDA has it problems, size for example, and also it is becoming more difficult to purchase a PDA without a lot of other items, i.e. GPS, Cell Phone, MP player, and I don't know what else. My real question is how much difference exists between the low end Netbooks, and a good PDA? I know size is one thing. Maybe I am introducing another question, but I may be interested in using netbook instead of PDA. Often I use the PDA as a way to have maximum data with me and not having problems with security at airports, some libraries, and also easy to have information with me in the stacks.

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What's a netbook?
Oct 29, 2008 11:11AM PDT

A netbook is a very compact laptop, basically. They differ from typical laptops in one or more of the following ways:

1. They often have solid state hard drives (but some have "real" hard drives). Solid state hard drives smaller than real hard drives, use far less power (longer battery life, even with smaller, lighter weight batteries) and they should be FAR more reliable (but some problems have been reported with some of them) because they have no moving parts. But they are VERY small (as small as 4GB) and they are very expensive. Some netbooks now have "real" hard drives.

2. Netbooks usually have no optical drive at all (e.g. no CD or DVD drive)

3. Netbooks usually will run a scaled down operating system, including Linux (very common) or sometimes XP, but rarely Vista.

4. Netbooks will typically have smaller screens than full size laptops.

5. Netbooks may have slower or lower power CPUs and Video than full size laptops .... the presumption being that you are just using them for E-Mail, web surfing and routine, non-intensive Office applications.

6. To keep down both the size and weight, the batteries are smaller and battery life may be short (but lower power CPUs and solid state disk drives both are ways of compensating for that).

7. Expandibility is very limited ... these are designed to do a few fairly simple task "just ok"; they are not designed to do "everything".

As long as what you want to do fits with the capabilities of the device, that's fine. But don't expect too much, and make sure that the screen, keyboard and included features meet your needs, because if they don't you are probably stuck.

Barry Watzman
Watzman@neo.rr.com

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Netbooks are...
Oct 30, 2008 5:05PM PDT

Netbooks are small laptops intended for portability and low cost. The main factor determining a netbook is the processor: a low-cost/low-power and eventually a little low performance processor such as the Intel Atom or Via C7.

Due to this factor, most tasks are limited to basic internet surfing, basic multimedia, e-mail and other basic applications. (still quite useful)

Optical drives are mostly omitted and screen sizes vary from 7" to 10" (10" being the trend with 12"s appearing)

Some are equipped with small capacity SSDs instead of a standard hard drives, especially more when equipped with Linux.

Most XP netbooks are equipped with a standard laptop HDD.

Pros compared to a regular laptop:
- Excellent portability due to small size and light weight
- Good enough for basic computer tasks
- Relatively low cost

Cons compared to a regular laptop:
- Small screen/lower resolution, small keyboard due to small size
- Limited processing power
- Hardware upgrades can be more challenging
- Due to lower processing capabilities, size and cost, advanced features are less adopted (FireWire, HDMI, etc..)

Netbooks are best used as a 2nd laptop when portability is needed (excellent for travel or leisure purposes). If you plan to do serious work with your computer, I recommend getting a standard laptop... but eventually a netbook will come in handy in many cases.

For comparison with other laptop categories, try my article:
http://www.choosenotebook.com/NotebookCategories.php

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Most Netbooks use Intel Atom processor
Oct 30, 2008 6:20PM PDT

I understand that most Netbooks use a new CPU called "Atom", but although Intel's website does contain a lot of technical data about this new processor, there seems to be no comparative information about how it performs as compared with other Intel CPUs such as Celeron, Intel Pentium 4 or the dual-core breeds. It is probably fast and smooth enough for playing a video, but most likely will not perform well for video editing.

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don't comment if have not experience
Oct 31, 2008 2:20AM PDT

I don?t know which is the knowledge base who other people has their opinions, but since mi first comments, I?d say that I get three PC?s:

1.- One Desktop,
2.- One Laptop, and
3.- One Netbook (Aspire One)

Also, I said that I?m using my Netbook ONLY FOR TRAVELING.

Well, you may see that I get enought experience in order to my words be more credibles.

Yes, I?m a criminal Sawyer who needs write very many texts, and if there is a fact that most of my work is made at my office, and sincerely, I have to say that was usin my Notebook in my travels, but Notebook was replaced by my Netbook Aspire One, and the replacement is most satisfactory., and I?m user from PC?s for MS Office job, not for fun like to see videos or play games.

I can?t understand those people who saids that a Netbook can not serve, just because since my previous comment, I explained thoose things, but to finish my intervention in this forum, I?ll repeat that was said until be tirad of non senses:

To the guys who scorn the Netbook because have not DVD Drive, must to remember that a Desktop have a full speed DVD Burner (22x speed), BUT a Laptop only have a limitated speed DVD Burner (8x speed).

One Laptop NEVER REPLACES TOTALLY to a Desktop.

One Netbook NEVER REPLACES TOTALLY to a Laptop.

And that the source of my comments is the fact that I?m owner and user of the three classes of PC?s before listed.


Lic. Alejandro Gonz

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@Jimmy Ho
Oct 31, 2008 3:30PM PDT

Jimmy, the Pentium and Core CPUs are a completely different class of CPU to the Atom. The Atom is built for low power consumption, the Core CPUs are built for speed. So that's why there are few actual comparisons between them.

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Travel best is travel lite
Oct 31, 2008 12:39PM PDT

I have two laptops (HP zd8200 & Dell Inspiron 1720). I also have an Asus eeePC netbook (I assume this qualifies). Traveling with either of the larger laptops is a hassle and useless. I found that I never used the features such as the full dvd burner and great computing power I thought I would always want on the road. I only use them at home now as they equal/surpass the power of my older laptops. The Asus is by far my favorite on the road. It does what I really need to do, which is the usual check email and visit known and often used websites. Plus it never has issues with things like the angle it's at or movement while on. It has pleanty of power in the MS Works word and spreadsheets while on the road for the business I encounter. It translates well to the home laptops and is as quick as my HP. I have it running a 2g ram and the 12g hd with the 8g mmc card is plenty for storage. Plus the TSA seems to really be easier on it than the larger ones. If I want to take more than I use my portable usb 200g hd, but that has been rare. It has definitely changed my thinking about what I really need in travel computing. Your number one consideration in choosing these is your wireless connectability. For most everyone but the geek to have it all for no reason these really are the way to go.

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Recommended netbooks (value + features)
Oct 31, 2008 1:18PM PDT

I have never owned my own netbook, but I have researched different netbooks since October '07 and am waiting [a while] for the prices to depreciate a little bit more before I grab my own. That said, my netbook pick, value-wise, would be the Asus Eee PC 900HA (note the HA, this is important).

This particular Eee comes with a 9" screen, 160GB HDD, 1GB RAM, 1.3MP webcam, Intel Atom, and [most importantly] only costs $350. This is the best balance of features I've seen yet, with large storage, plus the added Atom processor, which saves a LOT of battery life. Also, the battery, I've heard, will last between 4-5 hours, though you should confirm this yourself with Amazon or Newegg reviews. Dell, Acer, and MSI netbook models at $350 do NOT have a long enough battery life to avoid being a substantial issue. You will have to pay more for a model with a longer-lasting battery life, usually $400 or more.

Yes, there are flaws with this model, too. The keyboard's right Shift key is to the right of the up arrow, which makes typing capital letters tedious. This can be fixed with a Registry tweak and switching the keys, so look at eeeuser.com for help if you are curious. Also, the case is glossy, so fingerprints leave a mark on the outside. However, these are just exterior flaws, and they don't affect the performance of the netbook. The 900HA is a good pick if your needs are appropriate.

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The Future of Netbooks
Oct 31, 2008 5:00PM PDT

In reading all of the posts here, pretty well everyone has spelled out the differences between the various portable computer configurations. One thing that was not really mentioned through is that the whole notion of Netbooks is that manufacturers see what the next growth market will be: namely the explosion of people that are using more and more Internet-based applications.

Combine all of the Web 2.0 uses (Facebook, Twitter, MySpace, Skype, blogging, Wikis, etc.) with the growing web-based productivity tools (GoogleDocs, FotoFlexer, etc.), and you'll start to see the trend that more and more everyday people will start to use these types of tools over the typical software traditionally installed in laptops and desktops. I think that's why even Microsoft is moving towards building an online version of Office. Also, just do a search on "virtual desktops" to see how businesses can now place people's work desktop on their computers at home.

So, will the sale of Netbooks grow? Definitely. Will we still be buying notebooks? Also definitely. Will we need both? I'd say perhaps for now. For sure there's still a need for more powerful and capable computers do handle heavy duty tasks, but as we all know, technology is changing so fast that I wouldn't be too surprised that the power you see in current laptops start to show up in Netbooks. Even the dual-core Atom is already on it's way soon.

If I can gaze into a crystal ball and look way down the road, I see Netbook-like devices being used everyday. They would have all the capabilities of the best laptops out there now and then some. They would have wireless connectivity to things like external keyboards, mice, and monitors for home/office use. DVDs and CDs would not be needed as everything would be accessible online.

Definitely exciting times ahead!

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The Future Of Computing...Is A Confusing One.
Oct 31, 2008 6:06PM PDT

I've seen Netbooks in the store, and read up on them online, and I'll admit they enticed me. I mean, I love my current laptop, but 6.5 pounds is a lot to lug around, especially with a 15.4 inch screen, so the smaller footprint, lighter weight, and internet functionality almost had me sold. Keyword: Almost. I've stuck with my current laptop because this is one of the best investments I've ever made. (and let's face it, in today's market, when you're spending $500.00+ it's an investment. lol) What gets me is, right now, on the market, we have dual core this, 64 bit that, etc. And now, we have Netbooks taking us back to the Windows 95 era, but with better hardware. (lol) I don't understand it, and I may never, but it's working in the market obviously, otherwise they wouldn't be getting made. With the invention of Smartphones, PDAs, etc... computers are slowly being pushed onto the back burner in favor of simplicity and portability. With that in mind, I'd say that Netbooks have a very healthy future. People like my Grandparents, my Mother, etc would flock to a Netbook due to it's ease of use and size. After checking up on the Atom processor, I found out they have a dual core model now (which may or may not have been covered) and they're just one step away from replacing current computers.

I believe we're going to see a bright future for Netbooks, and I have a pretty good feeling that when it's all said and done, we'll all probably have at least one in the home.

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future netbooks...
Oct 31, 2008 6:53PM PDT

Something to add - many of these netbooks we are talking about atre coming down in price to make way for the upgraded models on the nearby horizon.
Asus is already shown its touch screen version (Available in Japan only; I believe for now) and all the others have stated plans for the same. Larger Solid State Drives are being made and the choice of which drive format has been realized. My opinion has changed to these SSD because they seem more reliable while on the move. As long as you aren't toting around alot of extrenuous media files these 40g SSD seem to be enough for any except the CAD people.
But you can easily get caught up in the waiting for features game and then the price break and so on.
Back to the most basic of all computer questions,
What is it needed for and how long can you use it before embarking upon the new 'greatest' thing?

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Netbooks are the Future
Oct 31, 2008 9:00PM PDT

For the record, I bought an Acer Aspire One last week. I was heading on a business trip and needed something lightweight and portable.

It was perfect! At my meeting everyone was looking at me enviously as there was no boardroom table yet I was able to easily balance my netbook on my legs and type away.

I noticed at the hotel another guy had the Dell Inspiron Mini 9 and we both gave each other knowing nods from across the bar.

On my flight over I watched a poor soul trying to get work done on his gigantic notebook (we were in economy). Meanwhile I set my perfectly sized netbook on my tray AND had room for a coffee beside it!

In all honesty for the average person I think a netbook is MORE than enough computing power ... check office email, do some youtube, maybe some word processing ... I was able to complete a 1000 word preview article on my flight back to Toronto which was great.

I had multiple people on both my flights as well as at the hotel come up and ask me where I got it. The look of shock when I told them the price, followed by "I'm getting one of those!" -- this tells me all I need to know ... netbooks are the future.

You're going to see tons of road warriors and business travellers picking these things up.

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Love my Netbook, BUT...
Oct 31, 2008 10:01PM PDT

I love netbooks, (actually have two); the small hard drive is no problem, as there's plenty of places on the net to store whatever you want (free), ("in the cloud"), and web-based email (yahoo, hotmail, gmail) doesn't need hard drive space.
Watch out for the problem with Linux machines - all I've seen come with a recovery disc which you will eventually need, but you'll have to use an external optical (CD/DVD) drive, and I don't know of any that will work with Linux without tricky programming. The answer is to get into an intricate maneuver on a windows machine of transferring the recovery disc to a USB stick, then plug the stick into the netbook, which, hopefully will allow booting from USB.

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Form and function, it's that simple
Oct 31, 2008 10:54PM PDT

The difference between a notebook and a netbook is specifically form and function. It's a very cut down version of a notebook which is specifically useful for surfing, communicating, data entry(such as word pad documents) and maybe a bit of multi media.

Need to process some video footage or want to edit some photos?
Well you won't be doing it on a netbook.
My advice is if you don't need a high level of function beyond surfing, communicating and data entry all in a compact unit you can slip under your jacket, then a netbook is for you. If you're as computer reliant as most of us our however and your needs lie all across the board, I suggest you just find a relatively small laptop and save yourself the disappointment as you will find netbooks are completely limited even with the large capacity models.

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Perfect for classroom
Oct 31, 2008 11:45PM PDT

The netbook's small size makes it the ideal format for taking notes in a classroom, university or otherwise. Add a USB drive and notes are easily transferred to a desktop later.

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A netbook could be the answer
Nov 1, 2008 7:29AM PDT

It?s funny how some people claim the limitations of netbooks are just too much to bear when just a couple of years ago an XP system with 1.6Ghz processor, 1G of ram, and an 80G hard drive would have been your DESKTOP machine! Besides, most netbooks can be upgraded to 2G of ram and many have hard drives up to 160Gigs! A loaded up netbook today would actually kick your old desktop?s butt!

XP will thrive on a system with those specs and Linux will FLY on it! I prefer XP for programs because I already own a bunch ? PLUS you can download iTunes. Since there is no DVD drive I find iTunes the best and easiest way to watch movies on the device.
Most people use computers to watch movies, surf the web, check email, and play the occasional game. Netbooks are perfect for these activities.

You want Photoshop? No problem, it will work on the device, BUT let me make a suggestion: Pick up a copy of Photoshop 6 or 7. They were developed with these specs in mind and you can get them dirt-cheap these days. I?m an artist by trade and I?ve never upgraded from Photoshop 7. Why would I? It is a very powerful piece of software that does pretty much everything most people would ever need.

Ok, the biggest problem with netbooks is that they can?t play the latest games.
BIG DEAL!
The computer gaming market is pretty much dead anyway. Video games moved to dedicated machines like the Wii and Xbox years ago ? and if you?re a gamer then you?ve already got one or both of those. You can still play hundreds ? if not thousands ? of titles from a few years ago when the computer gaming market was hot and desktops had these same specs. The best part is that these games are now in the $10 bin at WalMart.

I?ve got an Acer Aspire One with a 160G hard drive and XP. I?ve also got a flash drive with Linux Puppy. To surf the web I plug in the flash dive, boot Puppy and don?t worry about viruses, otherwise I?ve got all my programs and movies from iTunes in XP. To me it?s the best of both worlds.

A netbook could replace a laptop or notebook for many users.

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One more thing...
Nov 1, 2008 12:55PM PDT

I already posted but I wanted to add one more bit of information on netbooks ? particularly the reasoning behind the lack of optical drives.

A little while ago MicroSoft announced that they were going to stop supporting their XP operating system. Of course the reason was that the public wasn?t very excited about Vista and many people were refusing to upgrade. MS hoped that when they stopped supporting XP people would be forced to go to Vista. Yeah, it was kind of a sh*tty move on their part, but they are in business to make a profit after all.

Anyway, then Asus came out it the netbook that started this whole netbook craze. Since the original Asus netbook was way underpowered and had only a 2G hard drive they chose to put a Linux OS on the laptop. Surprisingly the public didn?t seem to mind. Linux was fast and easy to understand - and Asus was thrilled because Linux is free! Others started producing netbooks and also chose to use a Linux OS for the same reasons.

Suddenly MicroSoft started seeing a new unintended trend ? people were beginning to like Linux and they feared that rather than moving to Vista people just might move to Linux! This was particularly scary since they were already seeing droves of customers leaving for Apple products.

To save their customer base MicroSoft suddenly did a 180 degree turn and announced that they would continue supporting XP and allowing them to be preinstalled on netbooks.
There were some conditions on the netbook?s configuration:
1) The processor couldn?t be faster than 1.6Ghz.
2) It couldn?t come preinstalled with more than 1GB of ram.
3) It couldn?t have more than an 80GB hard drive ? though some have chosen to ignore this rule.
4) Finally, the netbooks couldn?t house an optical drive.

Why all these conditions? Well, MS doesn?t want the netbook to become a laptop replacement. They want people to continue using their products but they also want them to buy into their next OS upgrade. Right now they are pushing through Windows 7 ? the replacement to Vista.
Windows 7 is a pretty cool looking OS with a touch screen interface ? it kind of works like a big old iPhone. Unfortunately you?ll have to buy a new computer to use it ? or you?ll at least have to buy a touch screen monitor.
We?ll just have to wait and see if this OS is worth the move.

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another reason for no optical drive... and what gamers use
Nov 1, 2008 3:23PM PDT

Another thing about travel and optical drive is the fact you have to carry the cd/dvd disks. Since they hold so little compared to the newer MMC cards; are far more fragile and quite larger, then you find yourself having to carry this extra CD wallet. I now carry a small business card size case that holds eight MMC and since they can be any size up to 32g (I prefer the Sandisk extreme III 8g) this means that travel storage is far more efficient and I actually can keep them better organized than the old system of just throwing it on the drive until it filled up. Let's face it, optical drives seem to be on their way out too.

And about those gamers? Most of the MMO players I know refuse to use laptops of any kind - the sentiment being that whatever a laptop gives you, it can be beat by a desk top! And they continue to laugh at Apple, Linux and anything that is far more problematic than a Windows environment.