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General discussion

What effect has Sony's rootkit attack had on us?

Nov 22, 2005 2:38AM PST

As I understand it, for the "rootkit" to be installed on an OSX computer you must 2-click the installer on the CD, and type your admin password.
OK, Sony can't hide the install on a Mac. On the other hand, because they do lie about what the install is and does, I'll bet there are Mac users out there that have installed it. Anyone heard of an instance?
Just curious.
What I'd really like to do is get a discussion going on a few other points of this situation, if anyone's got an opinion.

Will the Mac masses just consider Sony's actions one more reason for not using Windows, and then move on, business as usual?

How has Sony's dirty little secret effected everyone's purchase of music, now and in the future? It seems that it's not just Sony, but other record companys as well. Will it change how you buy music?

Should spyware be legal? Following right behind that question is the obvious (and central to any solution), What is your definition of Spyware?

I'll be posting my my opinions on this over the next day or so. I'd rather not do it right at the top of the thread, because I would like to hear what others have to say, as in "discussion". Not "what do you think of my opinions", as in "argument".
I'm sure there will be some of that too, or at least I hope so. It's worrying me that the Mac forum hasn't seemed to have noticed the barbarians at the gate.

Lampie "Chicken Little?" Clown

Discussion is locked

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From Sony's site
Dec 9, 2005 7:28PM PST

Copy pasted this from Sony's site this morning. on the XCP uninstall page.

You may either:

Update the XCP software on your computer.
This option installs an update which removes the component of the XCP software that has been the subject of public attention and will alleviate concerns you may have about the software posing potential security vulnerabilities. It will also enable you to continue using the protected disc(s) on your computer.

Completely uninstall the XCP software and associated content protection files.
This option will remove all XCP and associated content protection files, including service/processes, registry entries and folders from your computer. Note that once you delete the XCP content protection software, if you wish to play a CD protected with XCP it will be necessary to reinstall the XCP software in accordance with that CD's End User License Agreement after you insert the disc into your computer.

Lampie

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(NT) (NT) Sorry, missed that.
Dec 10, 2005 6:09AM PST
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Thats why I referenced food laws
Dec 5, 2005 2:10AM PST

While even food ingredient and nutritional value disclosure rules aren't perfect... they are at least reviewed on a regular basis by advocates for consumers to ensure an attempt to educated people as to what they are eating.

Disclosure to me, is an explanation of what you are getting ready to do, implement, perform, consume and/or legally obligate yourself and your descendants ad nauseam and in perpetuity to. The question of whether legal speak can suffice for the average consumer was again addressed by nutritionists when it came to food ingredients. You can find a can of Chef Boyardee from 30 years ago (I suggest not eating it if you do find one Grin) that will say it has pasta and tomato sauce in it or you can find one today that has daily nutritional values in a simplified listing. A lawyer or nutritional scientist working for the Chef could, I'm sure, give an explanation of those same ingredients that would be factually accurate AND make you think a steady diet of the glop would be good for you. As they said in "Hitchhiker's Guide"... "the demolition plans have been posted in the regional office for 6 months... it's your own fault for not going down and reading them !". The media and content providers are all about "fair use" laws benefitting their endeavors at the expense of their customers. Consumer advocates had to fight for years to get accurate labeling on food products. Food producers even now, attempting to find loopholes in those laws, quibble over what is and is not "organic" and how much genetic manipulation of food must occur before they are required to inform the public. Laws, regulations, and continued oversight is required to keep these descriptions accurate. Should the electronic content providers work under similar conditions ?

Hey, the RIAA has been threatening suite and has yet to take a person to trial because the threat of protracted lawyer fees are enough to cow most people. Does Sony have the legal right to put all these fair use parameters in their EULA or is this new law that they are creating but never been tested since no one has the money to take on sony in court ? Is this the electronic version of the Ford Pinto ? Who and where is todays Ralph Nader and when will they step up to fight our fight ? Obviously our government has no desire to apply anti spy ware and hacking laws to this case (or has yet to indicate it will).

Many questions, few answers - and questionable business practices that will be continued if we keep blindly buying these products. I have posted several times at different sites asking if people intend to boycott sony for this. Roughly 20 % have paid some lip service to the idea but will they follow through ? Probably the same amount complain about WallyWorld and then shop there anyway. I sold sony home electronics for about 5 years... they don't make the same quality stuff they made 25 - 30 years ago. It's crap that breaks down as often as everyone else's now. Still, people will be the little unquestioning drones and accept their lot in life or be the paranoid lunatic like me and rant till they quit inviting us to their cheese sniffing parties and their belly button link exhibits. My brain hurts... MY BRAIN HURTS... Where am I ?

Like I said, take the "al capone" approach to them. If you can't bust them one way then do it another... require all content providers to plainly state what the disc will do to the computer. Add the legal protection as well but require a plainly written disclosure of what the additional content will do. You know, whether sony legally told you they have the right to install a back door or not, when questioned publicly they first denied the existence of the back door and then stated the software did not report home to sony anyway. Also, the fact that certain components were installed whether you agreed to the EULA or not seems to be quasi legal at best. Did Sony also include the EULA as a hard copy along with the liner notes ? If they did not then seems to me that laws regarding unlawful hacking should apply or the few unscrupulous creeps who've been convicted for such infractions should go home free and possibly be given a job working for sony.

Shhh... I need to quit screaming as I type.

grim

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Someone go git me a rope!
Dec 8, 2005 2:13AM PST

Wow Grim, very prolific! I'd say this topic pushed a button. Eh?

Rock on! By the way, I got the HHGTTG ref. "In the basement, with no stairs, and the lights gone out... and there were alligators!" funny stuff.

Disclosure to me is being honest, open and forthcoming about what you do, with anyone who might be effected by what you do. I don't have a legal definition worked out for it, because lawyers live for grey areas, and it would take me pages of drivel to plug them.
Unless... we could agree on the definitions of four words.

Honest = Truth or as near to it as you can get. (you can't tell what you don't know, and some of what you do know may be wrong.) Not lawyer truth either, but the real stuff. Pure, with no cut on it.

Open = Tell all of it. Admit what you don't know. Admit when you find you were wrong. Do it in a language your audience can understand. Explain it to those who don't.

Forthcoming = Put the information out as soon as you know it. Put it where people are going to look for it. Update it when it changes. and let everyone know what was updated.

Effected = OK, that's a tough one. Make it too open, and garlic farmers will never get any sleep. In the case of Sony, it would be anyone who might put the disk in to a computer, right?

There. My definition.
The laws and regulations for digital content providers need a major overhaul, but the over-site body is already in place. It's the AG of your state, and the U.S. AG. That's why the Texas and California AG's stepped in, and I read that the French and British were reviewing the situation to see if there was cause for action in their countries.
I'll start this paragraph with the statement; I'm not a lawyer, I just play one on TV. Wait that's not right. I play with one while I watch TV, yea, that's it!
Sony can't change or enact laws by saying it in the EULA. Contracts are agreements (though Sony is stretching that definition too) between parties. A contract that goes against a law is not binding. Usually there is a clause in contracts that says if any part is trumped by law, and not enforceable, that doesn't mean the rest is out the window, or something like that. Here's the tricky part. What if THAT clause is against the law?
Basically a law trumps a contract. That's why some warranties say that if you live in XYZ states, the limits that the manufacturer puts on the warranty do not apply, and you may have other rights. Those states passed laws to protect the consumer from unfair warranties, the manufacturer can't get around it, and is required by law to say so.

Texas and California (and other states too I suppose) have passed laws to protect people from computer tampering or computer spyware, or something that Sony did. I don't have the details. The state AG is responsible for enforcing those laws. I don't think we have a federal law, or the US AG would be looking at it. In the case where there is a state law and a federal law that contradict each other, Federal law trumps state law. State law trumps county law. County law trumps city law, and a three of a kind still beats two pair.

I don't think you can require anyone to plainly state what a disk does to a computer. First, wouldn't that be open source? Second, imagine what the Tiger install disk would look like. You'd need a microscope to read it, or a forklift to get it out of the car.
The law needs to decide what our rights to the music we buy are, and put it in big letters. Then the law needs to decide who owns our computers.
As I see it, the law for what Sony did is there, on the books, and we need to kick our AG's and PA's in the but and make them enforce the law.

Think about it. Can the police use a shotgun method and just tap everyone's phone, because some people use phones to commit crimes? I'm ashamed of the answer. Not before the Patriot Act. If Sony convinces the Feds that terrorists fund their cells by bootlegging music, we are done for. Until then, It's against the law. It's against the Constitution. It's in direct violation of the Bill of Rights.
Sony might say that it's in the EULA, and we agreed to have our computers "tapped", but it's not, and when Sony was asked publicly if the rootkit phoned home, they denied it.

Someone go get the Marshal. We're gonna have us a first class trial, followed by a first class hangin!

One other point, then I gotta go.
Sony has rights to the music, but they are not police. The law protects Sony's rights, but it doesn't give them the right to enforce the law. They have no claim that I can see to take the law into their own hands, and appoint themselves Judge Jury and Executioner of DRM laws. I know better than that. That's why I said "Someone go get the Marshal!" Cause when we hang em after the trial, it's gonna be legal!!

Lampie

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Interesting...Sony is not the law...
Dec 8, 2005 10:39AM PST

As you said, laws vary by states and what is accepted in one place is not legal by any means in another place. Thats just what lawyers count on though...ignorance of the law !

I am worse off though because I have no law degree but let me mention a little ruse that many retailers count on. When I used to work retail we kept complete records from the day the store opened of all sales and extended warranty. I can't tell you how many folk came in to replace a broken item and were delighted to find they were covered by waranty... not because they remembered but because I looked up their previous receipt. We, as a store, got a lot of return business because we cared about our customers. My district manager, on the other hand, often wanted to know why we did so much more waranty returns than his other stores. Large manufacturers count on ignorence of the law, short term memory and the desire for immediate gratification to smooth over little things like this hacking scheme...uh, I mean copy right protection software. They count on "ignorence" of the law to get away with some of their "legal" demands. They also count on ignorence of the reality of their scheme to lessen the impact. I'm surprised how quickly this incident has already disappeared from the daily news casts. Will the hub bub of the holidays create amnesia in the general populace ? I'm afraid so.

I fear this discussion could really benefit from a lawyers input as we can speculate about whats fair but our ignorence hobbles us. Any one with a law degree out there ? We really didn't mean that stuff we said about your profession (put the rope away Lampie or you'l scare em off).

It's not a button you pushed here Lampie so much as a growing discontent with a steady errosian of our rights. If not our rights then maybe I should say a willingness to do whats right then because we all know what is legal is not necessarily the right thing.

grim

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If copyright protection schemes are here to stay...
Dec 7, 2005 10:16PM PST

1... what & how would be a fair way of doing it.

2... should the consumer pay less for these discs (considering the content providers attribute higher costs to cover piracy losses).

3... obviously, it wont benefit the content providers to detail how the protection scheme works but should the manufacturer detail any changes/dangers to consumers equipment ?

4... content providers say that they loose money due to internet sharing but from what I've read (not trying to start anything here) the bulk of piracy occurs from illegal CD and DVD copies made in Asia. Should north american and european consumers pay more than other regions to bolster media companies profits ? - BTW the pharmaceutical companies do the same and charge americans more than other countries for their drugs. A movie studio example would be a recent kid movie... I believe it was the Herbie love bug remake, but I could be wrong... that was released in theaters here and the DVD was released in Asia that same day for around $ 2.50 american (which was about twice what a street bootleg cost).

grim

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I forgot to add
Dec 7, 2005 10:24PM PST

after the revelation that the sony software can effect Macs I have heard little mention about it. Does anyone here actually have the stuff on their mac ?

The hack was designed to limit repeated burning of copies but does it limit how many times you can load it on your iPod ?

Does it effect iTunes functionality if you share play lists with friends computers ?

I personally don't have an iPod (can't stand ear phones/ear buds so I never bought one so forgive my ignorance re: the devices.

grim

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That Sony Thing
Dec 8, 2005 2:09AM PST

from what I have read, it does nothing whatsoever on the Mac.
Once the track is in iTunes it can be burned any number of times.
I guess you would only want to load it on your iPod once but there does not appear to be a limit to that either.
iTunes functionality has not been affected.

P

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It's helping iPOD sales.
Dec 8, 2005 2:15AM PST

Sony strikes out with their rootkit, the bungled patch for the rootkit, MEDIAMAX, bungles the patch for MEDIAMAX and sours the market with any product labeled 'SONY.'

For a short time I thought Sony MP3 players had a shot when they updated the lineup.

Now that Sony shot their foot off with not just one shot but 4, Apple iPods never looked better.

Bob

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Something's Fishy
Dec 8, 2005 2:31AM PST

Why would they write software that does nothing? Is it possible that because everyone thinks Macs are safe, no one has written software to detect whatever it is?
Think about it...
How long were the rootkits out before 1 guy, while testing a rootkit detector that he made, found one, and had the brain to figure it out, and track it down to Sony.
That was on a platform that has spawned whole industries of security people, software, and watch sites.

Do we even have a neighborhood watch?

Only half kidding,

Lampie

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The impression I got
Dec 8, 2005 5:45AM PST

was that the things that were installed on the Mac were NOT part of the Sony RootKit combination but are part of the Sunncomm deal that is also on Sony CD's.
I think that the Sunncomm (whatever their name is) stuff does not work correctly on the Mac. Keeps asking for a user name and password if it is "turned on" It appear to be Inactive by the writers choice.

Not sure about a neighborhood watch for macs though. guess there are people out there that play like that

P

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Yea, it's from sunncomm
Dec 8, 2005 6:28AM PST

The mac software is written by sunncomm, and the Windows root kit is first4internet. I think sunncomm wrote a Sony DRM app for Windows too, before first4 did.
While it's pretty obvious that neither company is very good at writing software, it's hard to believe that sunncomm would write DRM software for OSX and then submit it to Sony to include on the CD when it didn't work at all. It seems that they don't care what it does to us, as long as it protects the music. If it didn't do that, I doubt it would make it onto the golden master.

Maybe a Tiger killed it? Seigfried and Jobs. They sure know how to train em, but that doesn't help Panther owners from having problems.

I know I have not found any reports of people locating DRM spyware on macs, and I also know that dead software on a golden master is pretty unlikely. Guess I'll get my music from the i-Tunes store, and wait for groking to come.

Lampie

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Root Kit. Where does it stop?
Dec 8, 2005 3:35PM PST

Lampie, what other CD'd are infected with a Root Kit?
Still think a class-action suit is needed against Sony.
Even if I never knew about it until you brought it up here in the Mac Forum. What do the various Windows Forums have to say about it?
Thanks,

-Kevin

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Did F-Secure Know?
Dec 8, 2005 8:41PM PST

Yes they did. And they didn't reveal it for weeks or months.

This raises the big question.

-> What other products have invasive worms or other items that F-Secure, Symantec or others know about and have not published?

Bob

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What I've read...
Dec 10, 2005 1:23AM PST

...but can't prove.

First4internet (who wrote the root kit) has claimed in interviews that most of the major record companies are customers.

You can find a list of rootkit infected Sony CDs here http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/english/titles.html

From USA Today
EMI's Cottrell says there are no hidden files in EMI's copy-protected CDs. And he sticks up for DRM tools, saying the copy-protection software makes the experience better for consumers by offering additional features.
Photos, lyrics and video can be accessed in the embedded player that comes with the CDs, he notes. "Without software, we can't make that happen."

Ah huh? Can't make it happen? I can, tell him to e-mail me. I'll show him i-Movie. So after reading that, do you believe him about the DRM?
Besides, Sony is still putting out CDs with the Suncomm DRM. Apple's i-Tunes store is looking better and better.

I put info on the lawsuits in another post, but I found this after. Video of the Texas AG on the subject. He even gives em bell for making CDs that can't be used on iPods. http://www.oag.state.tx.us/oagNews/release.php?id=1266

Makes me proud to be from Texas.

Lampie

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Apple Not Inocent! Record Labels DRM'ing US to Death!
Dec 12, 2005 7:11AM PST

Haven't you heard about the fact that ''First4Internet'' were also busted for including stolen ''Open Source'' software in their DRM product that breaks the Apple iTunes DRM? This open source program is a hack for disabling Apple's DRM. Don't tell me you honestly believe Apple is inocent.

There are over 30 DRM products on the market and although you may not have a problem playing iTunes downloaded mp3 on your puter now, Apple has DRM loaded into every song downloaded. Copyright is not followed by anyone as far as the user is concerned. All the top companies out there are greedy as hell and violate our Copyright ''Fair Rights of Use''. Every movie every music cd. By law we have the right to make backup copies and transfer those between our own devices.

All DRM is guilty of these violations yet no one seems to be concerned. No one seems concerned about iTunes, Real Player, Quicktime, Sony, Disney, and the myriad of companies that may even be DRM'ing the same product, song, or movie. So when you download a ''Real'' DRM'ed movie you can't play it on your Quicktime Player or vice versa. Thought you were buying that cd? You're buying a temporary use permit if it has ''DRM'' in it. If you attemp to rip it and put it on a cd/dvd, you can't play it on any thing else (This universal play is legal under ''Fair Use'' rights). Now with this ''DRM'' they are forcing you to buy over and over again the same song or movie and it's all, time limited at that.

Very funny you Apple Snobs think you're going to get by the ''Evil Twins (the now Intel/Apple)'' plans for your future. What? Not aware they're working on a ''Hardware DRM'' chip solution just for your ''MacIntels''! That chip they're talking about for you guys will actually punish you and mark you for the life of your new ''MacIntel''.

The rest of us out here, will really be laughing at you then, because we'll still have a free choice of manufacturers. You'll be forced to buy this Mac specific chip and motherboard with it's very own spy chip. Wink

If you want to break free of their greed begin to boycott all DRM products. Search the net for free music and movies. Free of DRM abusive restrictions!

One such place is ''Magnatune''. It is a record label that claims ''We are not Evil''. They go by the new CC (Creative Commons) license not the ''Big C'' Copyright only. Use and buy CC licensed products and you'll be doing yourself a favor for the future of all our entertainment.
http://magnatune.com/
http://mirrors.creativecommons.org/
Also check out the ''Open-Music'' site to get the low down on CC (Creative Commons) Licensing. Watch the movies in your Quicktime Player. Learn the truth! Happy

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Grumpy !
Dec 12, 2005 9:46AM PST

Your Bio says you have at least 1 mac in the house so why the bilious attitude ? No one here said apple was perfect and the discussion was started to explore where this might be going. The links are interesting but the vitriol is unnecessary.

Cest la Vie ? How about Vivez et apprenez or Il faut bien tout le monde vive !

Don't make me taunt you in french again.

Bonne Nuit !

grim

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Not Grumpy Just Mad About DRM!
Dec 12, 2005 2:42PM PST

Ok, so I may have been alittle harsh and yes I do have an Apple that I love using. I come from a very large family of Mac Addics. In fact at least 4 members have worked for or do work for Apple. One of which is a female who was to take over the leadership of Apple when Steve made that fateful bad decision of hiring John Sculley instead of her in 1983 (from within the company). As we know now in 1985 Jobs was forced out of command into outer Siberia of the Apple campus and subsequently left the company he helped to create.

A woman in that position was just not acceptable at the time and so he wooed Scully away from Pepsi to do the job. Thus began a slow decline in Apple's viability as a contender against Microsoft. Several bad decisions later, Apple lost the Apple/Microsoft lawsuit (due in no small part to Sculley's bad decisions), made numerous marketing blunders, most of all made no gains against the company that stole parts of it's graphical interface in the market place.

I wonder if Jobs still thinks he made the right decision by hiring that sweetened water maker? If he had the decision to make over again, would he have gone ahead to move this extremely capable woman into the position of power he placed Sculley in? Perhaps he would have never left Apple then.

Although this woman quit Apple at the same time Jobs left, she now is a high ranking excutive with a major film studio and has her own consulting firm on the side. Doing what? Consulting on the use of Macs in the film industry of course.

Here is a link that explains a little more about the soon to be reality of Apple Hardware DRM on the ''MacIntel''. Only I couldn't re-find the article that fully explains that the chip running ''MacIntels'' does not bode well for future Mac users. Since they will have no choice but to accept this bad decision and what their fearless leader has in store for them this time.

http://applematters.com/index.php/section/comments/484/

P.S. Thanks for the scolding, it helped, I feel better now. Wink

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(NT) (NT) LOL
Dec 12, 2005 4:19PM PST
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Lawsuits Against Sony Update
Dec 9, 2005 6:30PM PST

I found a page dedicated to reporting on the litigation side of this. Here's a link, http://sonysuit.com/

I'll put the highlights here. This is by no means a complete list.
Texas first, of course!
Texas AG Greg Abbott Is making use of an "anti-spyware" law just passed this year in Texas. The AG is doing it as a class action on behalf of Texans. He's looking for $100,000.00 per computer, and cost.

Check out the Italians!
I think they are just a little upset. They, it seems, are going for individuals within Sony and First4internet (instead of the corp.) and they are going for CRIMINAL charges. As they put it,"willfully damaging computer systems, as well as making justice ?on his own? without taking the issue into court"
They see it like I did in another post, that Sony is taking the law into their own hands, and it ain't right!
I love the part where the "uninstall" software they put out is considered an explicit admission of guilt by Italian law!
They are also looking into other "record" companies to see if they are using invasive DRM software.
I think I'll have a Pizza to celebrate.

Next up is a class action suit...
filed in NY and designed to cover all 50 states. It's Michaelson v Sony BMG Music, Inc. and First 4 Internet. There are others in Ga., Ca., Ok. but this is the national one. They are using Federal computer fraud laws, Federal trespass law, and Federal fraud law as the basis.
It's for anybody who purchased a Sony BMG copy-protected CD, or
who played the CD on a computer and were infected.
Sign up and get your $15 back! Just kidding, but that's how these big class actions sometimes turn out.

It's good to know that there are still pockets of sanity in the world. I'm just blown away that one of them is in Italy! Don't get me wrong, I love Italy, north and south, but didn't they elect a porn star to office?
Hey, here's a thought. I heard somewhere that the new Pope likes Celine Dion (one of the infected CD's). The Pope's computer gets infected, and Vatican City decides to file suit. For those of you who don't know, Vatican City is a country. a very very small one, but ... Sony would commit marketing suicide to fight it. The headlines would read Sony vs. God.
Me? I'd just hand over the keys and walk away.

Lampie

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A little perspective
Dec 9, 2005 8:40PM PST

''Don't get me wrong, I love Italy, north and south, but didn't they elect a porn star to office? ''

Don't go knocking the Italians for this, didn't Washington, DC residents elect a convicted drug dealer/user for Mayor and didn't Louisiana elect Edwin Edwards as Governor (Twice) even though everyone knew he was a crook. He's now serving time in Federal Prison.

Just a thought Wink

P

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Technicly, she's still an actress
Dec 9, 2005 11:59PM PST

and I hazard to guess her work was just as good as any to be found in "Bedtime for Bonzo". Grin.

grim

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Grim Graphics for ya...
Dec 10, 2005 10:35AM PST
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That's my point!
Dec 10, 2005 10:29AM PST

Washington & Louisiana don't have cases against Sony that I can find. LOL

About a dozen porn star in office jokes just flashed through my mind, but to tell them here would look kind of like this.

How about the ******* **** , if it got ******* **** she could *********! LOL

It looses something I think.

Lampie

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Lampie Living Up To His Name!
Dec 12, 2005 7:20AM PST

Had a good belly laugh on this one Lampie! Never thought of it that way. But you're right for once! Just kidding, I do read your post and learn from them. Wink

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Actually Lampie is beyond his name?
Dec 14, 2005 2:03PM PST

?and makes great posts for us all to follow.
Lampie should be called, ?Thank You?, at times.

Lampie, you're one of my heros?
Post it and keep posting it!!!

eyefun2, as to the posts from you. I do not really understand where you are coming from with the woman that should have headed up Apple or what ever you were posting about. Lost me on that one.
The original post was from Lampie concerning Root Kit,
not Mac OSX, not Steve Jobs or this woman.
I am not an in-sider to Apple info as you are.
Such is life!

Pete, the end?

-Kevin

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It's Peter or P and No, not the end
Dec 15, 2005 9:18AM PST

Still plenty of miles in this one. You should be concerned about these things, there will come a da.....


P

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Not the end
Dec 15, 2005 2:17PM PST

Thanks Peter, miles to go still I guess. I brought up the Root Kit issue at work and there was not one person who knew about it. Thanks to Lampie for bringing up this heads-up to us.
Thanks,

-Kevin

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Please accept my apology
Dec 15, 2005 7:49PM PST

I have been making the same error with your name. I am sorry.

Thank you for letting this thread run. I realized early on that it wasn't exactly a ''Mac'' thread, in the sense that the rootkits don't (at this time) pose much of a threat to Apple products, so the thread might have a more fitting home in another forum. In the long run however, the issues involved do effect Mac users.

There are still many issues to bring up, such as reasons why your Mac is more secure (and why it won't help), and what possible solutions there are to the ever growing p2p vs. record company problem.
After all, even if the courts bring Sony to it's knees, (doubt it) the problems will still be there, and the battle for our rights vs. theirs will continue. It's good to understand the situation before the problem is put on your doorstep, because it WILL be at your doorstep one day soon.
(Actually it's at your doorstep now, I just didn't want to frighten the children.)

At the moment, It's nutcracker season, and ballet pays nicely while absorbing every free moment of my life. Next week all that will end for another year, and I can spend some time writing about the things I've learned while digging into the subject of DRM, security, privacy and Macs, but hey, I just started the thread, I don't own it.
Anyone else have thoughts to add? Solutions to consider? Complaints to air out?

Heard any good Sony jokes?


Lampie