US police handcuff five-year-old

It's POSSIBLE that calling the cops to help subdue the child was justified (personally, I doubt it). But the police wanted to arrest the child, take her to jail and hold her overnight for arraignment in the morning. That's simply outrageous -- if you saw the tape, the child was just flailing wildly and there was no danger of injury being done to the teacher or assistant principal. She's a FIVE year old, for Pete's sake -- they're still in the tantrum throwing stage, even if it's not pretty. And our litigious society has nothing to do with it!

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
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The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

in the futre when she uses a knife

but:
I'm working with a third grader, and we were discussing how we hope to help him now ... so in ten years I don't have to crack his skull while he's coming through my window at night.
Regards, Doug in New Mexico

don't turn out bad. If she were even 6 or 7, I'd agree completely, but she's still in kindergarten, for crying out loud!

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

... a pattern for this girl. School officials aren't parents and, as Cindi pointed out elsewhere, are limited in the amount of physical restraint they can use. So the police were called. It didn't seem she was that out of control that they couldn't have restrained her w/o cuffs (or tried that first), but as I understand it, they delivered her to her Mother after Mom was too busy to come collect her herself.

Would you support putting her in a rubber room by herself the next time until Mom can get there?

Evie

You'ld be out the money required to build the rubber room. Let's face it. If the police are not allowed to restrain a disruptive child, then no one can no matter what technique is used.

she attacked teachers and so what would u do let her continue?

thats why they get worse in later yrs.you mollycol them.
ill see them dislapined

... or principal (not sure who it is) shows pretty amazing restraint in that video. Standing and whatever on the table, one can see how easily a kick to the face could have turned the situation REALLY ugly.

I agree with Josh, in that it's not obvious having viewed the video at length, that the girl required such restraint by the time the cops arrived -- perhaps they could have tried merely "taking her into custody" to bring her to her parents -- but at most, the cuffing is a forgiveable error in judgment. This little girl will suffer far more dire consequences being allowed to carry on like that w/o discipline than she will (if any) being handcuffed.

Evie

I think he was exactly correct in his action.

She has every prospect of turning out bad if the parents don't shape up. This is a wake up call.

BTW, what's the difference between 5 and 6?

'They finally drove her to her mother in the back of a police cruiser.'

and my understanding is that is what happened. My understanding, based on radio news, is that the child had hit the school staff with something.

Our litigious society and lousy parents have everything to do with it. You must be the kind of guy who is pleased by nothing Dave. Everybody went by the book. If they hadn't, you would be the first demanding their heads.

I'm basing my comment on the "NBC Weekend News" report I heard over this over the weekend (Saturday?) They did eventually return her as you say, but that's not what they originally proposed to do.

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

...just to show your constant misevaluation of most situations. You say and I quote:

"...and there was no danger of injury being done to the teacher or assistant principal."

So there was no danger present in the kid HURTING HERSELF???...especially when the little girl was on top of that desk???

This vividly illustrates just how incomplete your thoughts and evaluations are on any given situation...especially all the doom and gloom and nay sayings you spout out. There is absolutely nothing objective in your comments.

... which is why school is NOT babysitting service and the Mom should have come and retrieved her kid. Discussions over the weekend indicated that the little girl was somewhat subdued by the time the cops arrived but the sight of them set her off again. Her mother has apparently had a run-in or two with the law and been handcuffed in front of this little girl.

Evie

The video story (right under the picture of the horrified little girl) has a pretty good coverage of the officers child abuse.
http://www.tampabays10.com/news/news.aspx?storyid=13475

While the girl is in need of anger management classes, there was no good reason to pin her arms and then cuff this five year old girl. It took 3 grown officers, fully armed, to do it too, which really made the scene chaotic at best.

I hope none of these officers have children at home. They need parenting classes!

means less chance of harm to all.
but thats just my opinion but then i support the police raised my children corectly.

I watched the video, and while I didn't see the outrageous tantrum that I was expecting, there's only so much the teachers can do since they're not allowed to physically restrain the child.

If they'd been allowed to sit her rump in a chair and make her stay there, instead of having to follow her around while she destroyed the room, it might have prevented the need for the police. Since that option was removed, the authorities had to be called.

She wasn't horrified she'd gotten handcuffed, she wasn't frightened, she was mad because she was prevented from continuing her game with these adults.

If the police cuffed her, and took her to her mother then that was the proper response. There was no "authority" left. The teachers didn't have it, and the school administration didn't have it.

I'd be ticked if my child were one of the other kids in that class that were losing out on some education for 45 minutes while this brat had free reign.

Nobody was anything but nice to this kid, which is part of the problem.

--Cindi
Speakeasy Moderator
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Does that tell you something about the need to restrain this girl?

The officers don't need parenting classes, her parent(s) do. The officers, as with the school officials, are not acting in the capacity of parent.

There is apparently a history here that has yet to come out. Unfortunately this will probably cost the taxpayers a bunch of money for actions that are, at worst, an understandable error in judgment (can't have people making honest mistakes anymore I suppose). The mom will pocket a bunch of cash, and I bet the kid never gets the help she deserves to undo all the harm that has been visited upon her by her parent(s) -- this situation doesn't even occur if Mom was doing her job!

I'm wondering if the video wasn't placed in the classroom in order to "catch" this girl in the act if she's been disruptive before. It seemed so to me, especially if the reason was "self-improvement" yet no other classmates were around.

Still, I think it was smart to do, there is video proof that clears the teachers of any allegations of abusive behaviour toward the girl.

--Cindi
Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email the mods

Someone was actually photographing the scene with a hand-held camera -- the camera "tracked" from one room to another during the incident (that's from a report on this morning's "Today Show"). And child psychologists contacted by NBC say that fact in itself may have exacerbated things further, becuase many kids "act out" while on camera. I'm clearly no expert here -- just reporting what they said.

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

They redirected it a few times. The caption while the video played stated "The girl's teacher videotaped her class that day as a self-improvement exercise. An attorney calls the arrest "absurd" and "excessive.""

--Cindi
Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email the mods

Do the cops always use the necessary force and never exceed it? I know your love for armed forces (when they are dressed right) but you must be able to have some little thought about the cops and their capability of NOT being able to solve, but worsen some situation. Does that ever occur? I have yet to see you mention that.

Have a nive day. Everyone knows my opinion in this case and I doubt anybody here is going to change no matter what evidence comes up and no matter what happens in court. The court system is only good when you agree with their sentences, right? LOL!

... the officers conduct may have been excessive. However given the circumstances, it is reasonable to attribute that to an error in judgment rather than looking to ruin the lives of three officers trying to do their jobs. The presence of police here quite possible exacerbated the situation. However the girl clearly wasn't responding all too well to the prior attempts. Even if she appeared to eventually settle down, this would have been a bad ending to the situation as she was able to control it. This incident would probably end her shenanigans if the next time she acts up she knows the cops will be on the way.

> The officers don't need parenting classes, her parent(s) do.

I'd say that her parents need to be spayed and neutered, if anybody has any idea who both parents are. The odds are at least 1000 to 1 that they're totally hopeless. They shouldn't be permitted to pollute the gene pool any further.

If a child cannot adjust to social norms by the age of five it's pretty much too late. It's likely that this one is going to be a life-long burden on all of us.

DE

Some tragic events recurring from time to time?
Mix in the pool that is never crystal clear to begin with.
Pessimism poured into mix does not help improved it.


CL

discussed on the radio. Notice, that we do not see very much of what went on before the police arrive. When they do arrive, did you catch what the officer said?

'Do you remember me? I told your Mom that the next time......'

The officer is doing what the parents should have done long ago. He is doing what he promised he would do if he found her in a bad situation again. He is following through, and keeping his word to the child. Kids need to know that parents and other authority figures mean what they say. That they will follow through. The officer's behaviour was flawless. The child was gently, but firmly, treated.

These officers do not need parenting classes. They should teach them. Perhaps we would have less problem children to deal with.

Have you ever seen kids whose parents did not follow through? They know the parents can be ignored because they are all talk and no action. Such kids grow up both hostile and miserable.

They cant imagine sitting still for more than a few minutes, and if they dont get their way, a tantrum results. I dont know of any therapy that can deal with this -- not that Im an expert. If anybody does know, let me know.

Ah, that's the problem indeed. In fact, there would have to be more than one therapy, since there are several possible causes.
Example: My primary-concern kid has definite emotional problems leading to serious (non-age-related) tantrums. But he also misbehaves "normally." Problem: since he's been identified as needing more than the usual help, and since we live in a wonderful age of attorney-to-client ratio, he's 'untouchable,' even when a simple whack upside da' head would do him a world of good.
Anyone out there know of any undetectable, legal whackupsides?
(Just kidding. My lawyer told me to say that.)
Regards, Doug in New Mexico