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Question

Unknown Device IDE Drives

Mar 18, 2018 7:53AM PDT

Ok... First... I've been messing with pcs for about 8 years. I am no expert by any means. I have some pretty old ones that I used to play with but have been on a shelf for a few years now.
I decided to pull out my old Dell 4600 to clean it out and get it ready to give it away. When it went on the shelf, it worked. Now... neither my dvd rom or my cd burner are recognized in bios. I've tried everything I can think of.
I set the jumpers at CS, Master/Slave, no jumper on 1 drive, no jumper on both drives, tried 3 different ribbons and I still have Unknown Device error.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

Discussion is locked

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Clarification Request
I wonder
Mar 18, 2018 8:03AM PDT

How the old CMOS battery is doing ?

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Hmm
Mar 18, 2018 8:20AM PDT

Ahhh good question. 5-6 years would be my guess. Didn't know that could make this type of issue.

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although
Mar 18, 2018 8:45AM PDT

I do have to say, after being on the shelf for probably 3-4 years, The clock was only off by minutes... date was correct... That should indicate the battery is still good.

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Since you can boot into BIOS
Mar 18, 2018 8:57AM PDT

And it seems the USB's work , maybe try plugging in a Live Distro and see if it boots up

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Boots hard drive
Mar 18, 2018 9:09AM PDT

Not only booted into bios, I've updated it. The hard drive is loaded. OS is XP. It will load windows. I've been online with it several times. I just can't use my DVD or CD drives

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Oh !
Mar 18, 2018 9:12AM PDT
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I would
Mar 18, 2018 10:41AM PDT

still try out a Live Distro before buying anything to rule things out.

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Answer
Disc
Mar 18, 2018 10:08AM PDT

Do these discs have power?

Do the trays open and close?

If you disconnect the hdd at the mobo and plug the discs into that mobo port does the bios see them?

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I believe
Mar 18, 2018 10:24AM PDT

You just gave me the answer. I just swapped the power supply cables between the hard drive and the cd drives. Now I have the cd drives and unknown device for my hard drive. Must be a bad strand. Should I buy a new power supply and test the theory? Hmmm

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Or a DEAD RAIL
Mar 18, 2018 10:40AM PDT

Some PSUs have multiple +12V rails. So tape off the bad connector and don't buy a new PSU.

Look around for extra power connections and try those.

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Can't
Mar 18, 2018 10:50AM PDT

This ps only has 2 strands with 2 ide connections each. My terminology is off I'm sure. Sorry about that... The one strand that I'm positive is working has a sata connector however it's not long enough to reach from the hdd to the cd slot. Otherwise I'd just put in a sata cd drive. I'm learning new stuff today so thanks.

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(NT) get a longer cable
Mar 18, 2018 10:56AM PDT
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Your call
Mar 18, 2018 11:42AM PDT

If the problem follows the power cable.

Shop for a Y power splitter and run all the devices from one power feed.

Replace the psu.

Send the machine to the recycle center.

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Answer
I've worked on many Dells
Mar 18, 2018 10:14AM PDT

That never showed the CD/DVD in the BIOS but would boot from such.

However in this story you would test if these drives worked in other PCs after a quick test. I don't see any mention if the eject or open/close button works. That must work or we are wasting our time. It's only a partial test of the drive and cables. Also it's well known that you will encounter dead or disabled IDE ports. Be sure the secondary IDE port is enabled and shows your HDD. And then BUT....

So there is a small risk of tinkering around old PCs so moving the HDD to the second IDE is usually fine but if the machine is old and failing it may only get worse, which is fine in my view since it wasn't going to last long anyway.

Enough with how to test ports and drives.

Back to a few old Dells that never showed the CD/DVD drives. Why? Back then you would install the OS from a boot floppy then the rest from CD which used drivers off the floppy boot. Very challenging to today's new tech which never saw this.

As to XP. I'd just install a nice Linux and move this machine out.

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Mobo
Mar 18, 2018 10:29AM PDT

I bought new about 5 years ago. AGP slot went bad on original. The new board never seen much use. I'm thinking it's a bad strand on my power supply. Thanks for the tips though.

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you can manually load CD drivers
Mar 18, 2018 11:22AM PDT

Using the old autoexec.bat and config.sys method.

https://www.computerhope.com/ac.htm

Find and download oakdrive.sys and use it instead.

Here's what I'd put in the autoexec.bat file
SET PATH=C:\Windows;C:\
C:\Windows\COMMAND\MSCDEX.EXE /D:1


I'd put this in the config.sys file.
C:\OAKCDROM.SYS /D:1

Both this and the autoexec.bat files should be in the root folder, or the main folder, that is the file area above all folders. You don't need to add the himemory nor extended memory drivers, just load the drivers into the regular RAM area. Of course, you need to make sure those files are there in the correct folders.

https://www.computerhope.com/cdromd.htm
more info, and also link to download for oakcdrom.sys file. It works with every CDROM device I've ever tried it on.

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Answer
Is the power cable or the IDE cable?
Mar 18, 2018 11:27AM PDT

Your last post about this and your reply left me wondering.

If it's a power cable you tape off the bad one and get some Y power cable/splitter.

If it's the IDE cable, then I DID NOT BROACH ANOTHER SETUP but will now.
Ready?

OK, in old PCs with IDE we would classically use the first IDE for the boot and OS drive and the Second IDE for the Optical. WHY!!!? Because in those days the optical drives often were DMA 33 speed and HDDs were twice that. So this delivered the best speed.

But if you have a bad port we would put the HDD as master and the ODD (optical disc drive) as slave and use the single good IDE port.

Hope you can follow this old lore and ideas.

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(NT) Is the IDE cable an 40 wire or 80 wire?
Mar 18, 2018 12:17PM PDT
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Good question.
Mar 18, 2018 12:52PM PDT

Even on 80 wire IDE I've found I've had to jumper as if it was 40. This really rankles those that demand the 80 wire system work. But this is old gear and we go with what works.

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Answer
Update SOLVED
Mar 24, 2018 11:28AM PDT

Got the new power supply and just got it up and running. Everything works like a charm now. All devices recognized. I'm online using it now. Happy
Just wanted to say thanks for all the friendly assistance.
Sassy

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Thanks for the update.
Mar 24, 2018 11:38AM PDT

A lesson I learned long ago not to cheap out on PSUs and always oversize them power wise.

Another thing is that for 99% of the machines I go with single rail models to avoid having to balance power on the +12V rails.