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General discussion

Ugh... Not a good sign...

Oct 23, 2007 8:07PM PDT

Well, ever since I got my iBook it has been ridden with problems, to say the least. Getting right on point, my OS X Panther install CDs that I waited 2 weeks for do not appear to work in my Macintosh.

At this moment in time I am in college, and have only tried the first install CD, however, it would not boot from it, and when I was in OS 9 and inserted the CD I was told the media was "unreadable by this Mac" and was given choices to initialize or eject.

So I have a few rough questions at this time.

->I have a suspicion the disk or disks may have been bent during postage. Is this irreversible damage?

->If only the first CD is kaputt, would there be ANY way to get Panther up and running with the remaining three?

->Is it a possible problem with my iBook itself? One thing did cross my mind is that this iBook came from, as far as I know, Britain, whereas the Panther CDs came from California.

->Have I just wasted money on fancy cup coasters...

Thanks everyone.

Discussion is locked

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More info
Oct 23, 2007 8:17PM PDT

I have done the firmware update required for Mac OS X as far as I know. Can't remember the name of it but I definitely remember doing the update, and it said the update was successful.

Do I need a "system enabler" to run these disks?

I'm at a loss, but I'll have a much better idea later today where I'm at.

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Of CD lens cleaning and drive age.
Oct 23, 2007 9:01PM PDT

CD lens cleaning is widely noted (internet) so I'll move on to the drive's age. One thing I've noticed is that CD/DVD drives last only a few years (all makes, models and certainly no better or worse in the land of Apple.)

It's why I keep spare drives at the shop so we can swap them quickly for a test run to nail the issue (time is money.)

Bob

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Well...
Oct 23, 2007 10:31PM PDT

Bob, you hit the nail on the head. I tested the CDs in an external CD drive, and it worked perfectly. I set it as startup disk and booted the Mac, and the grey Apple logo came up, but after about a minute it is replaced by a grey (what I can only describe as) "no go" sign, and it just hangs there. So I think we have established that the internal drive is kaputt, the CDs are actually fine, but the machine isn't liking having to load everything from USB.

P, the installation media is CDs, three install CDs and one other CD, Xcode or something.

So, time to clean the internal drive it looks like?

Many thanks to you two.

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That's a good find.
Oct 23, 2007 10:52PM PDT

It's common to see these drives begin to fail some media at the beginning. The reasons are due to laser dimming and more but the repair is well known. What I can't figure out is how to hurry the owner up and get the new drive installed rather than live with it till it dies.

Bob

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What I'll do.
Oct 23, 2007 11:31PM PDT

What I will do is try cleaning the drive and seeing if I can get it to read Cds. If not, then I'll look further into replacing the drive.

Thanks.

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What media is the installer on?
Oct 23, 2007 9:54PM PDT

Can the iBook read other CD/DVD media?

No, there is no way to install Panther without the first disk, it contains almost all of the OS, as the machine needs to be booted from the disk.

Origins of the CD and iBook have not relevance in this case as the CD's do not have Zone restrictions and the hardware for the iBook was the same world wide.

Good luck

P

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Yeah, the iBook reads music Cds and the Mac OS 9 Cd.
Oct 23, 2007 10:33PM PDT

(For instance).

The Panther install CDs are in fact the only disks yet that it has failed to read.

See reply to Bob for more detailed info. Thanks again.

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Humph.
Oct 24, 2007 2:19AM PDT

OK, update. I tried cleaning my internal drive but it still wouldn't read the CDs. I'll have another go in a minute. I copied the entire contents of the Mac OS X install CD number 1 onto my Hard Drive and set that system folder as the startup disk. I got the same "no go sign" as before when I tried to boot from the CD in the external Cd drive. It's looking like this machine just isn't interested in Panther! The firmware is updated, and the system specs are enough to start off with, I don't see where we are going wrong.

I'll keep posted.

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Another find.
Oct 24, 2007 2:40AM PDT

Booting from the Mac OS 9 CD from the external CD drive was fine. That same drive won't boot OS X. I'm so totally miffed. I have considered replacing the internal drive in the Clamshell, but if only people were aware of how difficult it is to do that... Sad

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OK. Beginning to get frustrated... Now.
Oct 24, 2007 3:03AM PDT

Tried removing the third party RAM that I upgraded, and now, I can't even get the machine to recognise the CD let alone boot it at startup, using the external. The installer (when I run it from Mac OS 9) also states that it can't set the CD as the startup disk, then it says something about -2.

I've tried everything I could think of and then some. The thing has Firewire, but the only person I know with a Mac even vaguely capable of using my clamshell as Disk Target mode... I fell out with.

Time to throw in the towel? I need a game of Duke Nukem...

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Copying
Oct 24, 2007 4:10AM PDT

Drag and drop does not work with OS X in the same way as it did with System 9.
Under 9, you could drag an entire HD from one drive to another and the thing would boot!
Under X, if you do the same thing, it will just look at you as though you are crazy. There as so many files in the X system that are invisible and that do not move with the drag and drop (or Apple + C) that that method just does not work to produce a viable copy.

I'm not sure you can install using Target Mode, even if you were still on speaking terms, as the installer requires the installing machine to be booted from the install media. Booted in that way, you never get to see anything on the desktop and you may only be running a bare bones system. Just a blank screen with the Installer window. The target "may" appear in the list of available installation locations though. That's something I have not tried.

Question. Are the Installer disks Black or are they a kind of grey color?
Black would indicate a full installer which should be capable of booting "most" machines while the grey ones usually indicate a Restore disk.
Some Restore disks were machine specific and would not boot any machine that they were not shipped with.

Thought I'd mention it as you got it to boot with and external CD player but got the No Go sign.

Just a thought.

P

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Thanks P, the disks are
Oct 24, 2007 6:04AM PDT

Black, with a kind of bronze X on them. They don't say anything about being upgrades OR full installers. on eBay they were described as machine universal though.

I have one final crazy suggestion, though.

Perhaps, copying what's on the disks onto CD-R will allow my drive to read them. Like I said, these disks are the ONLY set so far that the iBook hasn't read, and I'm just wondering whether imaging the CDs onto another may allow the iBook to read them. Just a thought, and I'm ready for trying anything just now, I wanna play with the OS!

Thanks much for your ongoing help.

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Hey I think I've fixed it!
Oct 24, 2007 7:47AM PDT

I copied the first installation disk onto a CD-RW and lo and behold the damn thing is working! I'm currently in the process of burning my second CD as well. It's currently checking my Hard Disk. Very impressed, and if it was not from a tiny thing way back a few years ago where an old game of mine was saved by a friend; I'd never have thought copying the CD would make its contents readable.

I also noted, interestingly, that with anything less than 128MB of RAM, the OS actually won't boot!.

Awesome, I'm really pleased, but I'm not banking on it totally yet... Be back in about an hour or so to tell you all how it went.

Again thanks Happy

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Doesn't that imply that you don't have a DVD drive?
Oct 24, 2007 11:17AM PDT

Perhaps this is the case. I know you could run CD's and some other stuff before, and many OS X discs seem to be DVD discs in my case. Curious. You know, it's interesting that you have a clamshell. Man, I wish I could get one just for vintage looks Wink .

Man, the G3's were good back in the day LOL. Well, at least you got it up and going. Kudos to you and your hard work.
-BMF

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I was....
Oct 24, 2007 11:28AM PDT

...actually contemplating posting back right when I got your message Happy

Yep, strangely enough, copying the first two installation CDs made them work in the machines' internal CD player like a charm. It took about three hours to install though :/

That said, the performance is still blowing me away. It has a mere 128MB of RAM and 8MB of video, yet (and I am NOT lying when I say this) graphics performance is better than my Win laptop with over 1GB of RAM and 64MB of graphics. I mean seriously, Photoshop is actually usable on the Mac, LOL.

It's made me appreciate Apple in a whole new light, and I have learned a lot tonight. What's more rewarding than a complete success?

Happy