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Two separate capture inputs equals bad timecodes (off-sync)!

by bozobyte / March 20, 2011 6:41 PM PDT

I am TRYING to use the Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 14 HD version 14-

The two capture devices are -
VIDEO(1) The PCI-500 that came with Studio 12.1 (with only video capture.

AUDIO(2) The audio goes into the soundcard input on the MoBo. (I DO NOT have a dedicated PCI soundcard) It Came with the MSI motherboard.

The software program prior to this I tried first was the Studio Movieboard 12.1, which came with a PCI card called a PCI-500 to bring the video in,(s-video, FireWire, and RCA Video IN/OUT, but no audio in/output. When I upgraded to the latest HD 14 Studio, it did not come with a PCI capture device, so I used that one with the HD Ultimate version.
FIRST~ I brought audio from my JVC analog camera OUT into the RealTek AudioHD onboard sound to computer. (no sound card installed like Turtle Beach or Creative Soundblaster, etc.)
SECOND~ Then the Video out from analog camera to the PCI card.

After I captured, edited, and made movie, I played back and the audio was totally out of sync, maybe a few seconds. I have spent countless hours and wasted many TDK DVD+R discs trying to troubleshoot why I am having sync/dropped frames while trying to capture analog VHS-C camcorder tapes to ultimately burn to DVD.

1) Camera- 1997 GR-AXM25U Analog Camcorder with (one Audio, and one Video IN, JLIP, and RF DC out)
2) Old Panasonic PV8451 VCR with RCA Composite AUDIO IN/OUT, VIDEO IN/OUT ONLY, ((no FireWire, Component, or S-Video ))

Pinnacle support and myself have been going roundy rounds, mostly on my part, The only response from them was to turn down the DATARATE from 6 to 4 then try 2, but the audio is still off by a few seconds. Did not make any difference.

Doesn't matter of it's my canon G6 Digital video, analog Panasonic VCR, or JVC 1997 Analog Camcorder, it all is off sync. I've de-fragged, cleaned up disc,emptied all temp/internet files, redirected the video to go to secondary 500GB HDD (Storage) instead of to my Boot 74GB Raptor HDD for apps,to minimize paging files and resources, and end tasked all programs running in the background before I start to capture to Studio.

Someone mentioned a pass-thru method using a DV tape camera (without any tape) connect JVC analog camcorder into the DV tape camera, (with VHS-C tapes) then use a firewire connect to go to computer. Is this my only option?

P-35 Platinum MS-7345 Mobo
Windows XP Home Edition SP3
Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz (4 CPUs)
2.4 GHz, 3328 MB RAM
NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT 512 Memory Size
Realtek HD Audio Output Sound
DirectX version: 9.0c
Monitor: Viewsonic VX2035wm Series
Pioneer DVD -111D CD/DVD
Pinnacle Ultimate Studio HD v.14
...with PCI-500 AVID capture device

I have about 50 VHS-C camcorder tapes I want to capture (using most audio on video) edit, create chapters, effects, then burn to DVDS.
*Any ideas on what scenario(s) could possible work using any of the above hardware/software for the (best analog capture with the best sound and video in sync? My issues is the sound does not match the video when being captured from camcorder. I've tried starting the camcorder, pausing it until I see the video frame on my Studio preview capture screen, then hit record, but it still goes out of sync.

ADVC110 was a possible fixer, but what I've been told, I need a powerful Full Raster Time Base Corrector (TBC) but they are expensive, and even the Canopus 110 or 300 are a few hundred dollars, and no guarantee that they would fix my out of sync problem.

Thank you for any replies or suggestions...Most people I've talked to hate the pinnacle studio products for lack of support, and issues like these that never get resolved. I also know full well that I am not the only one with these issues. I do like STUDIOS' easy to use editing tools, and do not want to copy straight from analog tape onto a DVD without first editing the bad stuff out first.

I think the obvious. For Pinnacle to create a pci capture video device without the audio together on the same line is crazy! But why do they make such a beast? All I'm doing is capturing audio and video signals through different devices. How can that work?

If I capture audio and video together on the same piece of hardware, the audio and video clocks will be synced together, and then one might think that I would not run into A/V sync issues. Other sites I post to tell me that I need a syncpulse, timecode, or a Genlock device to sync Audio and video together, and that my Videocard (in this case my PCI-500 capture card, and my onboard sound card (RealtekHD Audio) are incapable of achieving this through pinnacle.
Is that why more and more posts here on these boards are from people suffering from these same issues? So now I have Pinnacle's Movieboard 12.1 and Ultimate HD Studio that are worth nothing?

Thank you for any replies! Have good day!

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Capturing VHS tape

I am embarking on a similar project. I started with a cheap USB capture device running into my AthlonX2/Visa laptop using Corel VideoStudio X2. my plan was to save everything as .avi files and then edit from there. (the video went into the USB and audio went into the line in capture card.

This setup yielded poor results. saving in .avi - many dropped frames and way out of synch. Saving in mpeg - the synch problem was minimal but video quality not great.

I borrowed a vintage Dazzle DV Bridge from a neighbor. (firewire capture device that processes video and audio inside. NO SYNCH PROBLEMS, however in .avi would only capture for about 18s and then stop. Video quality was very good.

saving in mpeg, worked very well, quality of video only slightly less than in .avi. and no sych issues.

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Is this my only option?
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / May 12, 2011 1:02 PM PDT

Just a quick nod that it is among the best options. The one I still use is a simple DVD Recorder. I learned years ago that involving a PC in the process resulted in about 6 hours of PC work for 1 hour of video. It was not worth that much to me so I went with the old VHS direct to DVD method.

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Wow, what a mess

After trying different unsuccessful ways to import video, I finally did the smart thing: I purchased a Canopus converter that took analog inputs and did a FireWire output into the computer. Canopus is made by a large broadcast equipment company that knows how to make converters that keep video and audio synced. I have input dozens of VHS-C and VHS tapes into the computer, and not one had sync issues. If you have a lot of tapes, the cost is worth it.

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Canopus conversion
by ahealthysmile / May 12, 2011 10:26 PM PDT
In reply to: Wow, what a mess

What format did you save your files in? *.avi, or *.mpeg? or other?
What software did you use?

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by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / May 13, 2011 2:34 AM PDT
In reply to: Canopus conversion

I understand your question but AVI is not a format but a "container." MPEG has dozens of standards so that's too vague as well.

Today I toss the encodings into .AVI files (containers to be more precise) and encode them with what works.

Now that I have a spiffy Android tablet I found HANDBRAKE to be adroit at transcoding video well.

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Format from Canopus
by Dan Filice / May 13, 2011 3:21 AM PDT
In reply to: Canopus conversion

The Canopus simply changes an input from composite or Firewire to a Firewire ouput. The video file was saved as a DV Video file, but that may have simply been how the software saved the file. Not sure. I use both iMovie and Final Cut on my Mac, and for both the video is imported as DV. As Mr. Proffit mentioned, Handbrake will convert files into whatever you need as will another program called MPEG Streamclip. Both are free. Keeping sync with long imports has been an ongoing problem, but the Canopus relys soley on hardware to manage the import. If you have a PC, you will need a Firewire port and then software that will recognize the Firewire import. I've imported 2hrs of video from a VHS tape using the Canopus and everything stayed in sync.

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