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TV On-going Power Supply Failures, file complaint w/BBB

by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 7:46 AM PDT

Samsung LN46A750 46-Inch 1080p DLNA LCD HDTV with RED Touch of Color.

I've been doing some research into a problem I was experiencing and found a common problem with all Samsung TV's. I've described my experience, but if you go online and do a little digging you'll find hundreds of complaints identical to mine.

Purchased in April 2009 and in August 2010, four mo's after warranty I began experiencing power up problems. On power up the unit would click then the power-up tone would sound, but would not turn on. It continued to cycle through power-up cycle to no avail.

I found out that Samsung has known about faulty capacitors on their power supply board, but hasn't publicly admitted it or addressed in an across the board recall. The cost to the consumer for the repair is typically in the range of $500.00 but the actual cost for the capacitors is less that $20.00.

DO NOT BUY ANY SAMSUNG TV'S UNTIL THEY PUBLICLY ADMIT THE FAILURE AND OFFER A FIX AND AN EXTENDED WARRANTY FOR THE POWER SUPPLY BOARD.

If you have experienced similar problems join me and file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau of New Jersey: www.newjersey.bbb.org

File your complaint under:
Samsung Electronics America, Samsung Electronics America, Inc
105 Challenger Road
Ridgefield Park, NJ 07660-2113

Phone: (201) 229-4000

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This one is not limited to Samsung.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / September 6, 2010 8:30 AM PDT

The BAD CAPS problem is being seen across many products and across all makes.

Your post was interesting but didn't tell the full story. Please update your facts.
Bob

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My TV my experience
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 8:53 AM PDT

The whole truth is Samsung has a problem and choose to ignore it. I'm a squeaky wheel and I'm not going away. I'm ticked that a $1800 TV stopped working less than two years after it was purchased because some bean counter decided rather than spend that extra money less than $1 per unit and put higher voltage rated bi-pass capacitor they would stick it to the consumer.

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Surge Suppressor
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 9:19 AM PDT
In reply to: My TV my experience

Before anyone asks, a leading brand surge suppressor was connected to the TV along with an AC line conditioner.

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Sorry it appears you are lacking some facts.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / September 6, 2010 11:45 AM PDT
In reply to: My TV my experience

The capacitors were properly rated but if you type in BAD CAPS at google you will learn the cause of this and some other million failures. It is a shame you think Samsung is alone in this issue.

And you may be going after the wrong company. Why are you not going after the maker of the bad parts?
Bob

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Repair Facts
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 12:16 PM PDT

Yes I read that it's believed that a batch of capacitors were mislabeled, explain to me why all the repairs listed on the forums state that the replaced capacitors have a 16v rating instead of 10v.

For the record I worked as an electronic tech for years and we would do lot sample testing on any component we installed because ultimately any failure was the ours because our name was on the end product. We had pride in our products and stood behind them.

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Did you include the companies that made the bad caps?
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / September 6, 2010 12:21 PM PDT
In reply to: Repair Facts

So far you seem to be limiting yourself to one company. If you've been around that long you would not limit yourself to slamming just one company over this issue.

As to the Volts, it is prudent when replacing parts to use what parts you can get. I often substitute the next voltage up. It's a shame you take such practice to be some admission of guilt rather than good practice when you can't get the exact parts.
Bob

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Legal Term
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 12:38 PM PDT

Vicarious Liability

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Available parts
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 1:07 PM PDT

The 10v parts are available, the reason for the increased 16v components is an increased margin- as was told to me over the phone by a repair tech, something that should have been done at the factory.

It's true that Samsung is not the only manufacturer on consumer electronics to play this cost saving game, but this forum is about Samsung and my 'Samsung' product is what failed. From the looks of the hundreds of posts I've read- I'm not alone.

Ultimately if Samsung makes this right with me, I'll go away.
If not, I'm just getting warmed up.

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Sorry you missed out on the BAD CAPS issue.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / September 7, 2010 12:54 PM PDT
In reply to: Available parts

It appears you want to believe what you want to believe. This means your actions may not fair well since you are intent on not getting the complete story.

I wish you the best and hope you research the BAD CAPS issue a bit more.
Bob

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Bad Capacitors
by jim isham / September 7, 2010 11:11 PM PDT

At what point did Samsung realize there was a problem and quit using these capacitors? I have a LN52A850 with a manufacturer's date of February, 2009

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Anyone's guess but let's read a prior discussion.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / September 8, 2010 7:32 AM PDT
In reply to: Bad Capacitors
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10 volt are adequate in these circuits.
by CARRJ142 / September 8, 2010 7:34 AM PDT
In reply to: Available parts

One of these capacitors is in a 5 volt and The other is in a 2 volt circuit.
5 x 1.5 = 7.5
2 x 1.5 = 3.0

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failed caps
by rarchacki / September 8, 2010 2:21 PM PDT

once my unit is back up I'll post all relevant information in case any of my friends ;Q at Samsung are interested in 'fixing' the cause of all these failures they can include it in their data base.

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The cause is well known.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / September 8, 2010 10:55 PM PDT
In reply to: failed caps

I was hoping you would find the cause in this discussion so you would not be dismissed in some complaint because you didn't have all the facts.

We know that some folk don't want to know all the facts, they just want it fixed.
Bob

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Bad components
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 12:32 PM PDT

The way our legal system works the person/company whose name is on the end product has all liability/responsibility for its content. When I purchase 'Samsung' it is with the belief that they have done all due diligent testing of the components therein.

If Samsung feels financially injured then they have the option for litigation against those component suppliers. I suspect that Samsung's parent company has a vested interest in the component manufacture since they own several component manufacturing facilities.

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Samsung 40 inch LED TV LN-T4065F - Power Supply problems
by ChoLuis / September 17, 2010 8:56 AM PDT

I have model LN-T4065F and my TV is dying, started with pink dots which will disappeasr if you power off and back on. However power up is taking longer an longer as weeks go by. One time it powered up with vertical lines only. These symptoms match what other Samsung owners have seen.

I tried contacting Samsung and also the store where I bought it but the only remedy they provide is that I take the TV to an authorized repair shop . . . which I have not done since the price appears to be more than $300. The TV cost $1,800 three years ago. (My old CRT TV is still running after 15 years and I never had to repair it.

I am sorry but while I do understand that the bad capacitors were not made by Samsung, this does not a good enough excuse for Samsung or any other TV maker. I would expect Samsung to:

1) Be open about the problem and notify customers about the problem

2) Provide a reasonably priced repair solution

3) Answer customers with transparency when they receive complaints about the problem

I am not impressed with Samsung and will not buy any of their products in the future. I have not decided what to do when my TV finally dies . . . but certainly the solution will not be to by another Samsung.

LM

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More Consumer Protection information
by rarchacki / September 6, 2010 1:24 PM PDT

I found an additional thread that stated if your unit is out of warranty The BBB may not be able to help you.
Several complaints similar in nature are currently before the New Jersey State Attorney Generals Office. You may wish to contact the State Office of Consumer Protection at (973) 504-6200. Since Samsung US is Headquartered in NJ you can file a complaint regardless of your resident state.

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$1800 Heath Kit /aka Samsung HDTV
by rarchacki / September 8, 2010 7:23 AM PDT

Opened up my unit and surprise, surprise--------bulging by-pass capacitors. Capacitors CM851 and CM852 had visible signs of failure. Both capacitors are 1000uf 25V rated for 105`C/ W7E-PET.

Waiting for replacements ordered Sunday Night.
Replacements have same temp rating but are 35V
All parts will be saved.

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More to it
by cohbraz / September 9, 2010 3:04 AM PDT

"Yes I read that it's believed that a batch of capacitors were mislabeled, explain to me why all the repairs listed on the forums state that the replaced capacitors have a 16v rating instead of 10v."

If the capacitors were mis-labeled, as you say, then explain why the 25v capacitors in your unit failed? I can. The 10v caps were not mis-labeled. They were that their label says they were. A few years ago, there were several manufacturers who produced capacitors which had an incorrectly mixed dielectric internally. That caused the caps to fail prematurally. You wonder why Samsung does not test their parts? These caps, the very ones that are failing, worked fine originally. Think about it, did your set work when you first bought it? To say that Samsung did not test their parts before using them is like saying you should have tested your TV when you bought it. There is one thing no manufacturer can test: time. It simply took time for these parts to fail.

One thing I did not see in your post: what steps did you take to try to get this resolved?

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You are correct
by rarchacki / September 9, 2010 4:22 AM PDT
In reply to: More to it

The forums do state that the caps that failed were 1000uf 10v and the ones that failed in my unit were rated 25v and if you continue to read in the forums you will also find that some units have 2200uf 16v that failed.

The more I am reading about the issue the more I am of the belief that the higher voltage rating is merely extending the time before failure and that ultimately if the capacitor has the bad formula it's going to fail regardless of the voltage rating. Thus the higher the rating the longer the time before failure. As far as replacement capacitors, I've talked to some TV repair techs and they are same opinion so they are installing the highest voltage rated caps that will fit with the hope of extending the life of the repair in case the new capacitors are not of the quality that they were advertised to be.

To the question of testing- again, as I have read. Initially before the problem was discovered standard testing would not have detected the failure. However, for several years they have had means to detect the bad capacitors. It is my opinion that in my case and many others Samsung made a calculated decision that they believed that they had engineered enough of a safety margin in their calculations that even with the bad capacitors most would last longer that then the factory warranty and that rather than spend the extra money on a recall or testing they would install the capacitors already in stock and deal with the failures as they occurred. Any admission or knowledge of the inferior capacitors would make them culpable and responsible for the repairs even those out of warranty.

As far as my own situation, I contacted Samsung's customer service number twice and was given the company line. Your TV is out of warranty and if you spend the money and have it repaired we might reimburse you. In case anyone Samsung hasn't noticed times are tough and I don't know to many people with an extra $500 or so laying around that they might have reimbursed.

Now I'm not saying that the Samsung design's are bad and I'd even go so far as to say that prior to this comically bad customer service and public relations nightmare I loved my TV. I really think that this whole situation could have be avoided if Samsung took the lead in the situation that they found themselves in with these substandard capacitors. Customers brand loyalty would have increased if Samsung would have said their is a problem and we're going to take care of our customers and made this into a positive. If anything is to be gleaned from this mess, consumers remember perception- they were either helped or screwed over, and sad to say from the look of things on this and other forums it wasn't handled correctly.

Robert Archacki

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Sorry to hear that
by cohbraz / September 9, 2010 6:55 AM PDT
In reply to: You are correct

I truly hate to hear that you are having issues with your set and Samsung so far has not been able to help you. When is that last time you talked to them? Would not hurt to try again. As the saying goes, the third time is the charm. Who knows, it certainly won't hurt.

However, I can GUARANTEE you that Samsung did not make a conscious effort to install capacitors they thought would just get them past the warranty peiod. Samsung tries to grow the company and their sales, not decrease sales due to manufacturing thousands of defective sets. I know that many sets have been covered by Samsung this year, even if they were outside of their 1 year warranty period. Please, call them again and see what they can do.

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add me to the Samsung list
by coreyinallen / December 8, 2011 3:33 AM PST

I'm going through the same thing right now with a Samsung I bought in '09. Because the quote was $400 to repair, I looked it up on YouTube and found a video that showed how to replace the bad capicitors. I hope I'm successful.

corey

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