Tomorrow (Thurs) on PBS there's a Frontline called "The Jesus Factor". It's about Bush. - (NT)

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Remember now, make sure not to bring up Jimmy Carter ("You can't divorce religious belief and public service ... I've never detected any conflict between God's will and my political duty. If you violate one, you violate the other."), He was a Democrat, and the game is "trash the Republican".

The "game" is that Bush, apparently claims to have been "CALLED" by the creator of the universe, the answerer of prayer, the keeper of the book and the ultimate travel agent. Kerry, to my knowledge, didn't do that.

I think Carter's religious practices are probably like most Christians: based on hope and generosity and sympathy. Bush is a whole other story, IMO.

I'm the one who sits here quietly (nine hundred and ninety nine times out of a thousand) when "holiness" is invoked, when prayers go out and when righteousness is indignified. And you're telling me to make small, Bush's claim of appointment by God to guide the world? Uh uh, J.

There's two approaches to religion. One assumes that the default of human condition is weakness, fear and uncertainty. I believe that most religious people would rather err on the side of kindness and sympathy. In other words they first and foremost do not want to take away anything that eases anothers path. I think Carter is one of these.

Then there's the hard roaders and their counterparts, the manipulators.

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It's great fun passing the time yammering about political stuff for entertainment, but wasn't that a little cruel to say that about him, considering that it is a result of his disability?

Yes, of course I do. I hope he feels free to take a cheap shot at me too. Just smile a little bit. I'm not trying to be hurtfull.

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Diana, he can't "speak" in the physical sense. I think that when somebody uses that in a political situation, it is way out of line. The later response about demanding that he personally object is even much more out of line. Can't this current communication, here and now pass, for "speech", even though it is not "speech" in the normal psysical sense? If I were a Democrat/liberal vs. a Republican/Conservative, would it make a difference? To some, it would seem to.

J, I can take correcting from you when I need it, and I obviously needed it here. I was stupid and I screwed up. I know I shouldn't make cracks about peoples disabilities. You tried to set me straight and I laughed it off and I'm sorry. It won't happen again. I'm sorry. Thank you for the reminder.

Bob Graham

Yes, Carter did say that he was a nuclear physicist.
He was educated in the Plains public schools, attended Georgia Southwestern College and the Georgia Institute of Technology, and received a B.S. degree from the United States Naval Academy in 1946. In the Navy he became a submariner, serving in both the Atlantic and Pacific fleets and rising to the rank of lieutenant. Chosen by Admiral Hyman Rickover for the nuclear submarine program, he was assigned to Schenectady, N.Y., where he took graduate work at Union College in reactor technology and nuclear physics, and served as senior officer of the pre-commissioning crew of the Seawolf.
Does having taken graduate courses in reactor technology and nuclear physics mean that he was a nuclear physicist?

Hi, J.
Sorry, man. Don't know what I'm getting worked up about. I don't know squat about either mans heart. Not really. Religion and decisions about the use of armys just scares the crap out'a me, that's all.

The magic-show is coming on in 10.

It does not "beat me", Bob, the answer is no. If I had taken some graduate courses in medical schoool, that wouldn't mean that I was a doctor. Same for any subject from anthropology to zoology, a few courses does not make an an Anthropologist nor Zooligist. That the person in question is either a Democrat or Republican does not change that fact.

... but Jimmy Carter pronounces it Nu-cu-lar too!

I'm not gonna touch your views on religion.

Evie

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We can't have them thinking they are free to believe what they think is true, and we CERTAINLY can't tolerate them acting on their beliefs.

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Carter was saying that a good leader has to stay true to his core beliefs. He was not saying that God had chosen him or planned to vote for him.

I don't think Bush ever said God planned to vote for him. I also don't see there being anything to get all fluffed over that Bush feels God's will in the path he has taken. He is not saying he speaks for God, or has God's preferential support. Or do you believe that when players on both teams in a game pray, God chooses who wins or picks sides to root for?

Evie

According to the quote, Bush said he was "God's choice for President." Sounds like a belief that he has God's preferential support to me......assuming the quote is authentic.

I always laugh when I see baseball players pointing at the sky after hitting a home run, or crossing themselves when they step into the batter's box. Like God has nothing more important to do than to sit there and say "OK, the 3-1 pitch, over the left field wall, 3rd row."

... 'I believe that God wants me to be president.' (from MK's link)

As in perhaps he felt a bit of God's hand in his life leading him to aspire to higher office. That's the way I read it anyway. Trying to turn him into a Pat Robertson who DOES speak like he has a landline to God's ear is distasteful to say the least.

I guess it's OK to present oneself as religious so long as you only live it only on Sundays. I think that's bass ackwards!

Evie