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General discussion

TiVo vs. Cable DVR

Nov 29, 2006 11:47PM PST

Yesterday, the BOL crew vehemently supported TiVo features over DVRs supplied from cable companies.
I must speak out in favor of my Adelphia DVR, which I absolutley love. It records in HD, and allows me to record 2 different channels while simultaneously watching a third recording (I believe that this is only possible with analog cable on the Series 2 DT TiVo). I also find it to have adequate hard drive space for my needs. All of this for a ridiculously cheap monthly fee, as opposed to forking over $600-$700 for an HD Series 3 TiVo.
Just a small shout out for the non-TiVo users!

Melba
Salem, VA

Discussion is locked

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DVR Sony vs Comcast
Dec 10, 2006 1:47AM PST

i was considering getting a comcast settop box. i have a Sony DVR which works well enough but thought i might be missing something. Now, in reading all these posts, i see that all i am missing is the usual comcast double speak. On balance, i think i will just wait for 2008 and what comes next. PS why is TV Guide wrong about what Comcast will be broadcasting in my area (zip-code) about 20% of the time. Even the Comcast printed viewing guide (which i pay for and receive monthly) is dead wrong about 20% of the time about what is going to be coming on. The only reliable guide i have found is the one from Yahoo. Go Figure.

G H

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Another TiVo vs. Comcast DVR comparison
Jan 28, 2007 2:49PM PST

I'm one of those people that have both a Series 2 TiVo and a cable company DVR. The DVR is a Comcast Motorola high def box that I've had for 2 years. The Comcast DVR recently got a major software update that did successfully fix many of the problems. The big thing is that it never (knock on wood) crashes, while it used to crash all the time. Crashing is a big deal with those boxes because it takes 12-48 hours to recover the program guide, so this is a welcome fix. The other fixes were minor but valuable user interface improvements.

Aside from that I don't have anything to add about the comparison between the boxes. I like the DVR because the quality is better. The rest of my family find the DVR user interface infuriating and don't understand why I keep it. They love the TiVo. The one problem in their minds is that it can only record one program at a time. That's a biggy. I don't want to shell out the big bucks to upgrade to one of the dual tuner Series 2 boxes or an HD TiVo, so I make do with my DVR/TiVo combo.

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I Love My Cable DVR
Apr 15, 2007 3:20AM PDT

I don't understand the TiVo craze, sue me. I subscribed to the cable company's DVR service (Time Warner Cable - NYC) years ago, and I have been very happy. Initially I simply couldn't afford the THEN $300 Tivo box + $300 lifetime service. Now I can, but I don't want to. The cable DVR box (HD version now) does all that I want it to (playback controls, search, season pass) plus it allows the recording of two shows while watching a pre-recorded third. Tivo has tried to catch up by allowing the recording of two shows, but the fine print indicates the limitations that frankly, the cable DVR does not have. So no, I can't set up a remote recording, and I really love that part about Tivo. I have learned about a show that I would love to have set my DVR to record, but oh well, without the remote feature, I have to hope it re-runs. But other than that...my cable DVR doesn't have compeition for MY needs. It's perfect.

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what happens when you tivo breaks?
Apr 15, 2007 7:21AM PDT

Love my time warner SA 8300HD. and if it breaks i just replace it for free...

u tivo lovers sound whiney and defensive. i bet u all have macs Silly

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poorer interface, but greater features
Apr 15, 2007 2:21PM PDT

I recently got a Comcast Motorola HD-DVR. I kept the Tivo and put it on another TV to compare the two service for a while. I don't use the Tivo at all anymore, and my wife (a diehard Tivo fan) just conceded that she wants to get rid of the Tivo and get another Comcast DVR.

The Tivo interface is better, but being a winner in only that one category wears thin after a while. The comcast box is $11.00 a month, so aside from being cheaper, it does HD, has two tuners, and has way more capacity than the single-tuner Tivo series 2 box it replaced. Sure, the Tivo interface is better, but I got over than pretty quickly. The Comcast box is better in almost every other way. After a month, no crashes, no missed recordings, nothing really wonky. I'm not looking to switch back to Tivo anytime soon.

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I got my parents the Tivo
Jun 30, 2007 10:09AM PDT

We were looking for a gift for my parents and wanted to get them a DVR. They have Time Warner Cable, but not the digital package. They tape a lot of shows on their VCR. I just got the time Warner DVR and it works well for what we use it for. The DVR came pretty poorly packaged with a remote and power cord. Nothing else. Being pretty computer literate, I was able to figure it out OK. My parents on the other hand are pretty computer illiterate. We bought the Tivo series 2 which is able to record two show at once and had a 1 year subscription, The unit was 'refurbished' but looked new to me. It came with a great manual and a whole bunch of different cords. Basically I was very impressed. My dad ran through the set up guide after installing it and I really am considering returning the Time Warner box and getting a Tivo Myself. The refurbished unit can be had for $50 and the yearly subscription fee is actually $1.00 less per month than what we pay Time Warner. If you have the digital cable, then you have to pay $7.00 to Time Warner for the cable box.

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Windows User Here
Jan 13, 2008 12:58PM PST

TiVo fan boy and Windows user here. Just a question for you. What happens when your TV breaks? The cable company won't replace it for free.

It's just fact of life that things are going to eventually break. I've had my Series2 for about 2 years now, and no problem with it yet. If it breaks it won't be a big deal since I've already upgrades to a Series3 when I got my HDTV about 4 months ago. Hopefully before anything goes wrong with my Series3 there will be a new better one that I have already upgraded. If not, I'll do the same thing I did when the mother board on my desktop died. I'll buy a new one.

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what about stored programming?
Jul 22, 2011 2:29PM PDT

"If it breaks, replace it for free." That's fine but what about stored programming that is "lost?" How do I view it?

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Dish Network DVR (am I missing something?)
Jul 1, 2007 11:32PM PDT

I've been using Dish Networks' two tuner DVR and I LOVE it. (Granted, it's standard def, but I've not allowed myself to be spoiled with HD yet.) I notice absolutely zero compression artifacts, recordings seem 100% as good as the original broadcast. Scheduling and conflict resolution work 100% as expected, I've never missed a show, or had it shut off unexpectantly, etc.

I've had no problems with the interface. In fact, I've tried friend's Tivo's and I am underwhelmed:

Tivo doesn't SKIP commercials, it fast forwards through them. I know that's a configurable option, but I believe it defaults that way.

I think compression is better on DISH too, It's clear, where the Tivo seemed blocky in fast moving scenes. I understand tivo can be adjusted to save space at the expense of quality, but who would use the high compression if it looks like cell phone video?

Of course, Dish only charges $5.98 for DVR, but you save $5/mo on the second tuner, so it's only 98cents a month, vs what? $13/month for Tivo?

Oh, and it's nice not to be spied on what I watch and rewind, as far as I know. If I'm wrong, please enlighten me. We all know Tivo tracks that information (Janet Jackson wardrobe malfunction).

About the only thing that bugs me is you can't switch recordings from one tuner to another on the fly, to free up a tuner on the set you are watching. But then, as far as I know, tivo doesn't do that either.

You all complain about non-tivo DVR's being so crappy, but I don't see it with Dish. So, what am I missing? Why would I want Tivo over Dish? Has anyone else got Tivo-Dish experience?

-S

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4 operations at one time?
Jul 1, 2007 11:50PM PDT

Did I mention I can record 2 programs while simultaneously watching two recorded shows? I don't know if Tivo can do that, but a previous post suggested Tivo was having problems with one playback and two recordings. My Dish dvr doesn't skip a beat doing all 4 operations at once (unless I'm over 85-90 hours on the hard drive, then fragmentation causes problems, but that's to be expected).

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Re: 4 operations at one time?
Dec 15, 2007 5:05PM PST

Why in the world would you want to watch 2 things at the SAME time? That's like the stupid Comcast Central feature that you get with the Motorola DVr's (even though I have comcast digital cable and a comcast DVR). It doesn't make much sense. It's like being in a movie theatre and watching "American Gangster" and "I Am Legend" at the same time. It doesn't make sense because your attention is being divided, and it is stressful.

that was my point.

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Economics of TiVo vs. Cable DVR (for HD)
Jan 1, 2008 2:40PM PST

I'm kind of tired of reading posts casually stating that TiVo is more expensive than Cable DVR rental - this is just not true in my area - Houston, TX for HD. A TiVo HD can be had online for $271.88 (shipping and tax included). Purchase a 3 year subscription for $299, for a total up-front cost of $570.88. You'll need to re-up $299 every 3 years for the TiVo. A multichannel CableCard is free from Comcast, and gives you 2 tuners in the DVR.

Comcast rents the *FIRST* HD DVR for $12.95/mo + sales tax = $14.08/mo (assuming you have no other cable set-top boxes). Any additional HD DVRs will add on a 'cable converter' cost of $7.49/mo, for a total after tax cost of $22.22/mo.

Now, I've owned my current TiVo Series 2 with no problems for nearly 6 years, so I can easily imagine a 6 year life.

Tivo 6-year total cost: $869.88
Comcast DVR 6-year total cost: $1,013.75 (if it's your only cable box)
Comcast DVR 6-year total cost: $1,600.08 (if it's not your only cable box)

In my case, the Comcast DVR is nearly DOUBLE the cost of TiVo. Plus, I get all of the added benefits of being able to copy and view shows on my PC, burn DVDs of shows, play music from my PC's media library on my home theater sound system, view photos from my PC on my TV, etc.

Since I'm looking at adding 5 HDs, TiVo saves me close to $4,000 over a 6 year life.

The only downside is if the TiVo breaks. This would most likely be a crashed hard disk, which can be replaced for much less than the cost difference.

The only other option (other than satellite) is buying a Windows Media Center PC with ATI's new Cablecard TV tuner, but the cheapest PC properly equipped with 2 tuners would run over $1,300.

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I made my own DVR
Jan 14, 2008 4:01AM PST

I hated Insight's DVR, even though it was a dual tuner, and I didn't want to spend money on a Tivo so I took an old Pentium 4 1.8GHz, slapped a couple Hauppauge tuners in it, got a cheap video card with S-video out, bought a software package called BeyondTV (they threw in a free RF remote), and connected it to my entertainment center.

I didn't need to upgrade the hard drive because 80GB is good enough for 30 hours of programming even at the "Better" quality setting and the software is incredible!

The only down side is that I can't get a digital signal decoded on my computer by itself, so I will eventually be required to rent a couple tuner boxes from the cable company to get the digital signal unscrambled and tuned it, then my home made DVR will be able to record it. It will be a little bit of a hassle that I will need to decide if it is worth it when the time comes.

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ATTN Guidemaker Dave
Jan 6, 2008 7:12AM PST

From a fellow comcast rep,

Is the TIVO better on recording the shows and remembering it has recorded a program and been watched?? I understand the tivo will track that and no record duplicates (because it has a better guide or is smarter)

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Yup, it's a setting
Jan 6, 2008 10:09PM PST

You can tell it to record only new, new + repeats, or all episodes including duplicates (I assume that goes across all channels, tho I've never used it).

There're some parameters (last I came across it months ago) which can still get the wrong results--if a show is repeated after x number of days have passed, it will not be assessed as having been recorded ever. So it does not appear that the TiVo uses the guide data as to whether something is new or a repeat. I've assumed it is an internal personalized dbase of the unit's history, tho I have no real basis for that. Easy enough to check--just delete a season pass and start over--does it re-record stuff that the previous pass was going to skip?

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Closest Thing to Molly's One Box
Jan 13, 2008 12:50PM PST

I have to admit, I'm a hard core TiVo fan boy. I have both a Series2 and a Series3.

About three years ago before my roommate moved, we had a Comcast DVR, and I thought it was OK. That was before I got my Series2. Since then I've fallen in love with TiVo.

It does a great job of streaming my MP3's from my desktop. I even use it to listen to BOL that way sometimes. I do occasionally get frustrated when I want to stream one of the few protected iTunes tracks, but Amazon has come to the rescue on that front, I just buy all my music from their MP3 store now.

I don't really download a lot of video from the web that I want to watch on my TV. I have, however, used the Amazon unbox to download to my TiVo. Now if unbox will hurry up and get HD content. If they are able to do that, then who cares about the format war.

When it comes to the latest version of the TiVo Desktop, I am impressed. It allows me to set up an auto-transfer for shows and then it seamlessly adds them to my iTunes library for transfer to my iPod.

TiVo has even added a whole section for video downloads from other web sources. I use it to get the weekly TiVo cast of Cnet. I also get DL.tv, Cranky Geeks, David Pogue's videos from the NY Times, as well as the NY Times movie reviews.

Then there are the other web features. Such as Yahoo weather. I use the weather to check the weather here in Dallas before heading out to work. I'll also use to check the weather in Chicago before leaving since I work for an airline and it's nice to know if they may be causing weather delays. I also use their podcast feature from time to time. I mainly use that for the podcasts I don't listen to on a regular basis, I just have them bookmarked and will stream the most current one in the feed.

If all you want is a box to record your shows and then watch them later, a cable DVR is probably fine. I've found a ton of added feature in having a TiVo.

Oh yeah, one last thought. I'm looking at moving sometime this year. What are the odds that I could take a cable company DVR with me when I move. Slim to none. With my TiVo, I don't have to worry that there are shows I haven't watched. I can just unhook my TiVo, move to a new home, and all the shows I haven't watched yet are still there. I don't even have to wait for the cable company to come pop in the cable cards to do that. If I had a cable company box, those same shows would be gone and I would have to hope that they were re-aired at a later date if I want to see them.

OK, enough of my TiVo adoration.

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Comcast / Motorola are crap, Tivo Rocks
Dec 12, 2008 11:20AM PST

The only Comcast DVR boxes I have seen have been made by Motorola and it is absolutely amazing to me that a company like Motorola can still be in business and produce crap like their DVR's and the remotes that go with them. I live in Chicago and now the burbs and it's no wonder Motorola is laying off people every time you turn around.

One look at the remote control, reveals a device that looks like you took a bunch of pebbles, shook them and rolled them out onto a board with glue. About 50 buttons, small and stupidly placed. I've been a Tivo subscriber since the original Series One and upgraded along the way. After getting married and moving to the burbs, I decided to give Comcast a chance, after all, cable companies are either making or licensing their own DVR's. After using it for about a month, I wanted to throw it out the window (this was 2007, so not an *old* one).

Have Motorola's engineers EVER eaten their own dog food? I remember pausing live TV and then trying to hit the Pause button to start it again. NO, NO, you have to actually look over, find the small Play button and hit it. Are you kidding me? With Tivo, you can hit Pause and either Pause or Play to start again; and the Pause button is a big Yellow button that even my father can't miss. BTW, the guys at Tivo are smart enough to realize that if you are a real techie, you are probably not trying to use their remote as your universal remote. Indeed I do not, I have a Logitech Harmony One. So while you can turn either your TV or Receiver on or off with it, it mostly is designed to be a very good Tivo remote, and succeeds greatly.

One more thing. Fast forwarding through commercials and hitting the Comcast/Motorola Play button after you see your show come on is too late, you miss several seconds and have to back up. Tivo is smart enough to account for this and to back up about 8 seconds which is slightly longer than your reaction time, such that you are positioned a couple seconds before your show actually comes back on.

Don't even get me started with menus and such. Honestly, there are at least 20 other very good reasons I could go into here, but my wife just looked over at me and made that "I can't believe you are wasting your time responding to this" look.

I would really like to see a survey of how many people have returned their cable DVR after having given it a side by side comparison with their Tivo.

You can't pry my 2-tuner HD Series 3 from my cold, dead hands, though I wish it had a DVD burner like my old Pioneer / Tivo non-HD Series 2 had. I do miss that, though it's upstairs and not HD.

Tivorocks!!!

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Few suggestions
Dec 13, 2008 7:33AM PST

(Disclamer: I am a comcast rep taking phone calls and browsing on forum between calls @ late night and on breaks, here in nashville tn.
I am not being paid to be here (I am not Mr Samsung lol )

Just in case you did not know man, the directional buttons (anyone know a better word thats not tecnical like cardinal or such) also control the playback on a Comcast DVR.
Up plays/pauses (it will resume after pausing like you want)
Down exits (as best as i have tried)
Right and Left Fast Forward/Rewind respectivly.

There is also a 30 second jump back button (its illustrated as a circular arrow going counter clockwise) and there is a 30 second skip function (this was supposed to be removed here in the last round of updates but I still have access so I assume everyone does)

Here are the instructions I googled (use the comcast remote and I assume your universal one has learning/keymoving options so you can make it learn the button after programining and move it to a key that makes sense like I did)

1) Press the ?Cable? button at the top of the remote to put it into Cable Box control mode.
2) Press and hold the ?Setup? button until the ?Cable? button blinks twice.
3) Type in the code 994. The ?Cable? button will blink twice
4) Press (do not hold) the ?Setup? button
5) Type in the code 00173 (for 30 second Skip)
6) Press whatever button you want to map the skip


hope that helps and is able to fix the two complains you brought up.

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Like I said
Dec 14, 2008 6:43AM PST

Like I said, I don't have 3 hours to outline the 20+ reasons the Motorola box is crap, but I'll respond to your response:

1) The Pause should be a toggle, LIKE ON EVERY OTHER PAUSE BUTTON IN THE WORLD THAT ANYONE has ever used. I know the directional buttons work, but the reason for the success of products and GUI's in software is that they WORK LIKE PEOPLE expect and there are de-facto standards.

2) The Tivo has again, a MUCH easier 30 second skip; easter egg: Select - Play - Select - 30 - Select (again, for an overall comment on the Motorola box, just compare that with your 6 steps below and your 994 and 00173 codes. Need I say more, really).

BTW, I DON'T WANT to jump back 30 seconds. I want to either FF until I see the beginning of my program and then have Tivo be smart enough to figure it took me a second to hit the Play (hence the 8 second backup) --- OR, I can do the 30 second forward skip and if I go too far, I can press the Tivo 8 SECOND JUMP BACK button once or twice, MUCH BETTER than 30 seconds back. Let's you and me record the same program, then when the commercial starts let's see who can skip it and get to the program first. I will win every time and am willing to put my money where my mouth is.

Again, there is NO COMPARISON between the two, don't embarrass yourself. I can speak to both, but have you tried Tivo? BTW, I have seen a couple of comments here about Tivo's with 2 cable cards and reboots and such. Mine works flawlessly and I have never had a problem with it and have had the Series 3 HD over a year now. Again, I've had them all and hope that the worst case scenario is even if Tivo does not survive as a hardware company, I sure hope their GUI and software live forever and is at least bought by someone.

If you want one more, for old times sake, just look at the CRAPPY program information on the Motorola. Yes, you can select a smaller font, but if I remember correctly that gives you about one more line of program info. You can never get rid of the advertising info if I remember correctly, which is just a frustrating waste of space. But let's suppose you could. You are still left with that horrible "horizontal" guide, which you have to scroll right to see what else is on that channel throughout the night. With Tivo, the current channels and time are on the left, and AS YOU SCROLL down thru them, the right side of the screen gives you 5 or 6 of the next programs thru the night (depending of course on the number of different programs and their times). This is hard to explain without seeing it, but it is SIMPLY BEAUTIFUL.

Again, it is really BEYOND BELIEF that Motorola is still in business. I sure as heck hope they don't join the automakers and ask for a bailout. Ever get into an American car and not be able to find the trunk latch? I did that once when renting a car. Get in my SC430 or my wife's Camry and everything is exactly where you'd expect it; near your fingers, no guesswork.

I am a red-blooded American, no I do not work for Tivo or own their stock, but I sure wish American engineering would return to greatness. Again, if the engineers would just use their products AND CHECK OUT THE COMPETITION and COPY WHAT IS BETTER, then building a better mousetrap would at least be a place to start. I think they try so hard to not obviously copy good design, that we produce crap. Copy first if you have to, innovate next if you do not have any good ideas; which obviously they don't.

I could go on about Motorola's Razor phone (again, crap, I owned my first and last one). One bright spot of American technology....the iPhone. I made my wife buy one and I have my company Crackberry. Again, one great American product and the other Canadian. Oh well, can't win them all.

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Now with 3 generations of Tivos
Dec 13, 2008 5:19AM PST

I have an original Sony branded Series 1 Tivo that is probably 11-12 years old. I added a Series 2 a couple of years ago and my new Series 3 Tivo HD just arrived. Even the oldest is still working fine, and is only being replaced because we dropped our home phone line and can no longer get updates.

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Tivo is better, but I'm still not sure if it is worth the $
Mar 4, 2009 11:24AM PST

I've had my TivoHD for the last year. Before that I was using a SA box from Cox, so I am in a good position to speak on both.

Tivo is better (by far) than the SA box, once it gets working (see below). The guide is better, the box has far more flexibility and functions, when I was in an area that had OTA coverage I used its ATSC tuner (great). I've used the Netflix and Amazon functions now and again. I use an external HDD as an extender, so I have tons of storage. The ability to schedule remotely can be useful. I've even had the Tivo suggestions make a few great finds (Tin Man)

However, I still don't know if this is more than a niche product. Getting the box to work with cablecards was a nightmare, and it still flakes out from time to time (for no reason). It has a significnat upfront cost, and the subscription is significantly higher than the cable company boxes. If/when it breaks, I'm on the hook for it. If the cable box breaks, just trade it in at the office for a new one.

Bottom line: if you are a videophile, and a big TV watcher then you should really consider the Tivo. If you don't like to bother with details, and just want something to record some of your shows: go with the cable company box. In between: depends on (honestly) how much money you want to drop.

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TiVo! the truth
Apr 6, 2011 3:12PM PDT

Tivo!

i have had every service from satellite to cable to over the air antenna. i have used every DVR there is to mention almost.

People say TiVo does not support HD, while this is true on older models they were not made in the time of HD. the newer HD and premiere offer HD and even format SD channels and programs to 1080i with the format button. How cool is that?!

The newer HD and premiere also are dual tuner so u may record 2 shows at one time. even while watching pre recorded material

Video on Demand is even better with TiVo, there are many more ways to watch movies and episodes. TiVo supports Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster and even web based material through YouTube and other sources.

Music is very nice to have but now with TiVo there is no need for a stereo! with its compatibility with its THX certification you can listen to music, watch music video and stream music through your TiVo on what is usually the best sound system in the average persons household. TiVo supports Pandora and Music Choice music videos. also it has its own feature called 365 Radio which offers every genre (which has its own sub genres) for free allowing you to get the maximum satisfaction.

Pricing....
Everyone says TiVo is just too expensive. while it is true that it has the highest monthy fee, there is no lease fee like most cable companies. with the cable companies that is not YOUR DVR. you are leasing it and must return it at the end of its usage. with TiVo you OWN your TiVo, its yours! also there is an option on service charges... YOU HAVE A CHOICE! ;-D the annual pre-paid subscription is the same price as the rivals... better yet, TiVo offers a LIFETIME payment. that means for the life of that TiVo you pay once. one charge at 399.99 and you will never pay again for service so long as that TiVo remains. after 3 years the service more than pays for itself and seeing as the average lifespan of a TiVo (including mistreated TiVo's outside the 90 day warranty) lasts 6 years. Thats 3 years for free at minimum! take care of your TiVo and it could be 10+ years like mine.

TiVo does offer a warranty, actually 2 outside the 90 day warranty that is no charge. While the warranty does not cover theft or personal damage (lets be honest, its not a football its an electronic device and should be used as such)
There really isnt anything to lose!

I sincerely hope many will consider this and maybe even enjoy a lifetime of entertainment brought by TiVo. They have my service for life!