Taking count.................

But didn't you hear, a year ago Saturday Bush made his landing on the deck of an aircraft carrier and gave a victory speech while standing under a Mission Accomplished sign!

I'll grant you both that we've done a lot of good over there, but it's also becoming increasingly apparent to me that Bush either didn't have an exit strategy or had a bad one.

and josh just like nam all the friggan nay sayers help give the baddys more back bone they will wait till were forced to pull out because of lack of support

Mark, if you'd like to start a separate discussion about Vietnam, fine, but we're talking about Iraq now. Something like 700 American soldiers have died in Iraq since Bush made that carrier landing and it isn't due to any lack of support from home. Rather, it appears to be because the Administration simply didn't think this kind of insurgency would happen or last as long as it has. Part of planning a war is planning for the aftermath, and I think Bush was expecting parades.

Haven't seen you for a few days. Been doing something
exciting and fun ?

Just my 2 cents...When it came Monday AM I suspect there
were a few folks who wished that sign had never been put
up. By a purely military standard, it was correct. What
is happening in Iraq today is, in fact, combat, but certainly
not 'major' combat operations.

As far as the numbers of deaths in April 04, IF, IF, the
military had been allowed to conduct 'military' operations
free of political appeasement restrictions (which may
or may not prove to be the answer) those two major areas
of conflict, Fallujah and with that cleric, would have
been completed quickly, and I suspect with fewer American
casualities. My guess is as good or correct as any other.

The problem in Iraq, and it will continue for some time,
is the attempt to create a new society without changing
any of the root causes of the problems that have existed
in those cultures forever.

As for an 'exit strategy', what is an exit strategy ?
It seems to me that had someone determined the US would
pull out on 'date certain', that the insurgents would
have waited until 'date certain' plus X, and then made
their moves. It appears to me that the existing exit
strategy is to stand up an elected Iraqi Government,
and upon determination that this government can maintain
security, then depart. Anyone's guess-estimate of that
'date certain' is up for grabs.

I wish, Del. I came down with some kind of bug and was very sick all week. It felt almost exactly like a bad flu except I didn't have any sneezing or congestion and only had a slight fever. Aching muscles, see-sawing back and forth between uncontrollable chills and pools of sweat, and that's just for starters. I lost 10 pounds in three days. Still very weak and not much appetite but improving.

Sounds a lot like me first week in Jan. Mine didn't even have any fever first till the third day. I started very gradual on a Sunday afternoon and got worse. By Thursday nothing would stay down. YECH.

Hope you get over it fairly quickly. It was Tuesday the week after before I started feeling better, just weak.

Hope your's recovers quickly now.

RogerNC

click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

Thanks, Roger. Mine started on Sunday afternoon with a headache that got progressively worse. After dinner I started to feel woozy and by 8:00 or so I thought I was going to puke but I didn't (and never did through all this). I could barely get out of bed at all except to use the bathroom until yesterday when I was able to come downstairs for awhile. I had my wife drive me to work today. I felt very bad about hardly seeing any of my daughter for three days and I just hope she doesn't catch it. It's going to take several days to bounce back, I can tell.

Apparently this thing is going around so I just hope that no other SE members or anyone in their families are unfortunate enough to catch it.

.

I just Googled it and the symptoms don't match, but thanks for trying to help, James.

Why aren't you concerned with a longer standing deployment of troops than the relatively short time of our troops in Iraq?

Hi, James.

The Europeans aren't killing our troops and destroying their effectiveness and morale -- and they never did. It's clear to all but the true believers that we've failed in our goal in Iraq -- we will not be able to stay long enough to impose an American-style pluralistic democracy. Instead, we'll end up with a Shiite theocracy and probably a three-way civil war unless the country is partitioned. Since the Kurdish area has the oil, that's unlikely to happen Think this is just speculation from a Bushophobe?
check out this poll of Iraqis!
(Washington Post login: semods4@yahoo.com; pw = speakeasy)

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

and josh if you look at it you see its the same bull slice story no support at home history repeats itself
so its just like nam with all the friggan bleeding hearts .
yes men died its a war not a snowball fight.
wake up and relize it.

good thing iseral dosnt listen to our bleeding hearts they would be dead now or under arab control

You're obviously unwilling to discuss this rationally so I'm not going to keep trying.

And for those members who have criticized John Kerry for calling Iraq "Bush's Vietnam," please note who is making that analogy in this thread and who isn't.

... the mission of removing Saddam from power.

I don't think Bush has a crystal ball, but he has good people advising him.

Evie

.

He need to do something at the time to make it look like something decisive. It was already veering wildly from whatever plan they'd written on the back of a napkin.

Dan

.

.

Hi, Del.

Hate to break it to you, but there are widespread reports that the military is becoming increasingly disaffected with Bush. BTW, there's also a report out today that Ambassador Bremer gave a speech shortly before 9/11 that was highly critical of Bush for doing much too little to fight terrorism. The story was on NBC Nightly News, but there's no link available yet.

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

.....and spread by persons like yourself.

I have many immediate connections with active duty military,
officer and enlisted, including a web-cam from Iraq,
and your rumors are completely false.

Generally speaking, including those members who are frustrated
by the increased Op-tempo, and those who have been extended
beyond their expected tours, they may well be disappointed
by some of the things going on today, but rest assured
for the most part, they have no time for liberal mind sets
such as yours or Kerry's.

And some of their responses to criticism of President Bush
are not polite conversation.

New enlistments and re-enlistments are ahead of projections/requirements.

Hate to break it to you this way.

,

At my last post, I was not sure the exact source. This morning, I heard on CNN Radio News that what DK said of Bremmer's speech was true and that he gave it in 02/01.

Thanks DK, google may be doing an IPO, but I sure could not plug in the right info to dig this article up. Of course I may have been looking prior to this news article.

Hi, Rusty.

The story is hot on the wires today; in my experience, it takes a few days for copies of news items to get indexed in the various search engines -- and then they're all too often either 404 or in a pay-only archive.

-- Dave K.
Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!