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General discussion

Streaming music often times freezes my computer! What gives?

May 22, 2015 9:35AM PDT
Question:

Streaming music often times freezes my computer! What gives?


Here's my problem: I like to listen to either Pandora Radio or Apple Radio while I am on my Sony PC with Windows 7. Oftentimes, the screen will freeze and I have to either force a shutdown or hit Ctrl+Alt+Del multiple times to unlock it. I have tried many ways to solve the problem, but nothing completely eliminates it. I think it happens a lot when pop-ads crop up. Is it possible my computer is underpowered? Or is my Internet connection slow? Any suggested solutions will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

--Submitted by Mike M.

Discussion is locked

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Unfortunately, It Could Be A Lot of Things
May 22, 2015 12:04PM PDT

While we don't know what exact specifications are for your computer, there are a lot of things that can cause this. If you are getting a lot of popup ads, something is wrong with that. How much memory RAM + paging file) does your system have? For streaming (audio or a/v), you should have a lot of physical ram because using your disk as memory (paging) can really slow things down. Your processor has to stop working on the streaming in order to swap programs in and out of ram. So, I would avoid running much else on your computer while you are listening to music. Yes, I know you want to be listening to the music while you work on a lot of other stuff. But try it out to see what happens. Also, you probably have an anti-virus product. You may want to consider putting in an exception with your security software for your streaming and see if that helps. What is your disk doing while you are streaming?

Streaming usually buffers to disk so you need to think about how much disk is available, how fragmented it is and how fast it is. Are you getting anything that tells you that you are short on "memory"? That can mean that your paging file can't expand. You may want to make the paging file a fixed value rather than letting windows manage it, especially if you don't have at least 40% of your disk free and unused.

Have you checked your event history after a freeze-up? There might be something in there that will help you. Are you just using the web for the streaming or are you running a player? There actually could be a combination of different factors that can affect this issue but please try to do only one thing at a time to narrow down the problem. Using the task manager while streaming can give you a hint where things go wrong. The performance information and the processes can be a hint. Unfortunately, there are a lot of things that can combine to make the situation happen as one can affect the other. So, other background jobs and grab onto resources needed by the streaming including ram/memory which could be tying up your disk drive.

You might want to find someone local to you that is good with performance issues that can take a look at this with you as we would need a lot of information just to start thinking about the problem remotely. Sorry, I can't be of much help.

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You pretty much covered it all...
May 23, 2015 7:15AM PDT

I rarely get them, but when it happens, I close the browser, if it is not Internet Explorer and run CCleaner, and that clears it up for a long time. It rarely happens, so I can't attest if it is just a lot of blabby cookie traffic with the servers or other app-data or temp file problems.

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Thanks
May 24, 2015 12:53PM PDT

I am using Firefox (current version). The important thing to remember is, if your router has great bandwidth (2+ GB/sec on WiFi or 1 GB/sec wired) that doesn't mean that your download speed from the Internet will be that fast, if your ISP is only providing you with slower speeds (like, 15 MB/sec). Also, excluding streaming from your a/v software can be important as it can cause timeouts. And, having not only a lot of RAM but also a lot of FAST disk space is important especially with the paging file. If I get "buffering", I pause the playback and wait until a lot more of the download completes.

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That last FireFox update...
May 24, 2015 3:15PM PDT

Seems to have borked FF for I and many of my friends. It is a shame, because it did high definition the best of all the browsers I use. We get one gigabyte speed here; so no problem with the ISP - it is challenging finding a router with that kind of throughput though.

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I'm Currently Having Firefox Issues Too
May 25, 2015 7:21AM PDT

I've been having Firefox tasks hanging and then crashing after I try to shut FF down. It's a bit annoying but I keep sending the diagnostics up to Mozilla in hopes that someone will figure it out soon. These may be a bit annoying, but they are not a "show-stopper" for me. Could even be something else on my computer causing it (I'm overdue for a new PC anyway...)

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I'd start a new post.
May 25, 2015 7:26AM PDT
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do not use cclean
May 30, 2015 10:33PM PDT

CClean makes other thing not work.
I used it to clean my computer and after you have a clean computer and run cclean it creates more problems that are not really true

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If you did the registry back up using CCleaner
Jun 1, 2015 1:06PM PDT

Like you are supposed to you wouldn't have had any problem. Just clicking on the most recent backup file since any trouble started, will recover the registry to it original form. I've only had to do that once in the decade I've been using it on hundreds of clients computers and my own.

Besides one of CCleaner's strong suites is that it simply cleans up the temporary files and app-data. That is where malware could be sleeping that may not have system permission to execute - especially if you are logged on as a limited user just like everyone should be doing in ordinary daily operations. Even if some fake alert malware has executed - running CCleaner and ending the fake alert with Task Manager will kill all traces of the attack in the first place.

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Freeze up on Audio/Video Streaming
May 24, 2015 7:20AM PDT

I have the same issue on occasion, but with me it is usually when streaming video. I have found that when I first start my audio/video player that I can kill the issue by immediately hitting CTRL+Alt+Del, click Start Task Manager, highlight the application I use to play audio/video, right click on the application, and up the priority to HIGH, or Real Time.

This may slow down other applications, but it halts the staccato breakup of the music and/or video.

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streaming video.
May 24, 2015 7:27AM PDT

Disabling hardware acceleration in flash should help. The OP should run a speed test to get a idea of what speed they have.
Dafydd.

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Firefox leaks and ties up computer resources
May 30, 2015 12:41AM PDT

Firefox uses humungous amounts of RAM on a system, and so does Google Chrome. I have a four year old 32 bit computer with 4 gigs of RAM, and both browsers often bog down my computer and I find them using over a gig of RAM.

Many people still have only a gig or two of RAM on their computers. I have a six or eight year old laptop that will only upgrade to 2 gigs of RAM, and it used to run just fine. It couldn't even properly run a browser. Keep in mind that your antivirus probably eats a large amount of RAM as well, and you could have e-mail or a note program or WORD open as well. This computer was running Windows XP, which has a serious tendency to mysteriously grow the RAM the operating system processes are using. I wiped the hard drive and installed Xubuntu, a lightweight version of Ubuntu Linux, and it now runs well, though a bit slow.

On my main computer I just recently installed two Firefox utilities that cause it to reboot once it uses 500 MB of memory, and that has helped alot. I also installed flashkiller and something else and now sometimes I jump through hoops getting videos to play... oh well.

Problem with Firefox is it leaks memory, so it'll start out using 300 mb o fmemory and soon it will be using a gigabyte of memory. Playing flash videos is particularly problematic.

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viedeo stream
May 30, 2015 10:36PM PDT

Do not use it puts errors on a computer that was previously cleaned.

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Unfortunately it could be a lot of things
May 29, 2015 12:23PM PDT

I have a new computer, lots of disk space, lots of ram, and my computer will not let me play the free version of Pandora without almost every song breaking up. I emailed Pandora about this and they told me to empty my cache. did that. Still have problems, and it does not matter if I have programs going or not, but FB seems to be the worst culprit. My computer had not frozen YET. But this is very annoying. If I am playing my own music whether CD's or playlists, this never happens. Only Pandora. I also use Amazon Prime music and so far it only 'stumbled' once, not nearly as loud or as screeching as Pandora breaks up. I sure wish there was a simple way to fix this.

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Just Happened to See Your Post to Hforman
May 29, 2015 10:15PM PDT

Hi kwiemers

First to Hforman: Please excuse me for "quasi-hijacking" this post Cool . I'm sure Hforman will respond with more info as needed.

To your question....Thanks and KUDO's for providing your computer specs. I wish others would follow your example.

I don't stream al lot of music over my PC's (only on a few occasions) as I use my iPad and connect to my Sonos system with Pandora, iTunes, Spotify and SiriusXM. That hook-up means I only have to look to my external hardware and ISP to resolve streaming issues.

That being said I checked the specs on your system and they appear to be adequate. So, assuming you've applied ALL the advice given in this forum regarding your PC, external hardware and checking your ISP I can only offer the following links (click in the order listed):

Notice to Pandora Listeners - http://blog.pandora.com/2013/02/27/a-note-to-our-listeners/

Get the Pandora App - http://help.pandora.com/customer/portal/articles/90988-desktop-app

Pandora Help Topics - http://help.pandora.com

Hopefully, this information helps resolve your issue. Good Luck!


Together Everyone Achieves More (TEAM)

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Just happened to see your post to Hforman
May 31, 2015 12:17PM PDT

Thanks for the response, ajtrek. I tried everything you posted, all three links, and after restarting my computer, first song was garbled on pandora...however...it seemed to stream ok after that first time. But as I disabled the plug ins, first time I went to pandora, they informed me that pandora cannot run without the plug in for shockwave. so had to get that one back. I appreciate your help.

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Thanks
Jun 1, 2015 3:40AM PDT

I'm glad someone jumped into this since my specific knowledge of Pandora is lacking and, besides, I think I missed this thread before (very sorry). The only things I can suggest are:

1) Check out your event log for the exact time of the disruption (both "application" and "system"). Maybe something happened that influenced your stream at that moment.

2) After a problem, check out the size and recommended setting for your paging file.

3) Run with the task manager and look at some of the performance tabs. I'll admit, I'm not very familiar with 8.1.

4) Have you tried this on a different machine?

5) What is your lowest connection speed to the Internet? Are other household members streaming at the same time?

Sorry if I'm nit being too much help here.

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Unfortunately it could be a lot of things
May 29, 2015 12:31PM PDT

Sorry, my computer is an Acer A6-5200
AMD processor
6.00 GB of RAM with 5.43 usable

Disk has 863 GB of space available with only 51.3 used.
running windows 8.1

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So it cannot be RAM.
Jun 9, 2015 3:34PM PDT

In which case it would be good establishing whether the issue comes only with Pandora. Try testing with other streaming sources, like Radio Paradise (3 different speeds of stream). Should all the others run smooth, Pandora itself needs looking into.

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Not Likely to be RAM
Jun 9, 2015 5:46PM PDT

I believe the OP said he has 6 GB so I "doubt" that it is ram. Could be a paging file issue or some kind of anti-malware issue (firewall?). It is really difficult to tell remotely.

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Not really accurate
Jun 3, 2015 1:59PM PDT

Streaming usually does NOT buffer to disk. Streaming audio usually buffers only a few MB of data at most which can trivially fit into memory on any computer made in the last 20 years. Even if it was going to disk, that stream is probably 128 kbit/s or 256 kbit/s at most, the latter being equal to 32 KB/s...while modern hard drives can easily write in the range of 20 to 100 MB/s (i.e., over 600 times faster than would be needed for audio streaming) depending on the level of randomness of the read/write locations.

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RAM + Disk = Memory
Jun 9, 2015 5:42PM PDT

While it may not buffer directly to disk, I did suggest that the OP check (while streaming) the Paging file usage. I usually try to specify "ram" when I mean the actual DIMMs and "memory" is actually the ram plus the paging file (we had this discussion awhile back when an OP was getting a message "out of memory" when he was really out of disk space and could not expand the paging file.)

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A Few More Points to Consider
May 24, 2015 9:33AM PDT

Hi Mike

In addition to what has already been said here are few more points to consider....

Minimum Bandwidth Requirements - According to the specifications in the following link Pandora requires a consistent 150 kbps. ITunes Radio may be slightly higher but probably not by much. Here's the link: http://help.pandora.com/customer/portal/articles/166391-minimum-specifications-to-run-pandora

Internet Service Provider (ISP) Tier - Subscribing to the highest Tier provided by your ISP will always ensure the best bandwidth, although you will pay for it.

What does that mean? You can check your ISP bandwidth at http://www.speedtest.net. The results will be in MBps. Therefore you can use a conversion table to see the results in Kbps. Here's a link to such a table: http://www.checkyourmath.com/convert/data_rates/per_second/kilobits_megabits_per_second.php

The results will always be extremely high leading you to think that everything is OK. What you have to take into consideration is that the results are what your ISP is sending to your modem. When the signal is converted to Wi-Fi (over your router) the resulting throughput (reduction) is more in line with what can be reasonably expected.

Cable Modem Standard * - Is it a DOCSIS 1.0, 2.0, or 3.0 (Data Over Cable Service Interface Specifications). Most likely it isn't DOCSIS 1.0 as that is a very old standard. There are benefits of a DOCSIS 3.0 vs. DOCSIS 2.0. (Not to be confused with your router, which transmits your Wi-Fi signal 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac to your Sony wireless card).

The main difference between DOCSIS 2 and DOCSIS 3 standard cable modems is that DOCSIS 3 allows for a much higher maximum throughput. DOCSIS 3.0 achieves that by using multi-channel bonding (using multiple channels simultaneously for download/upload) while DOCSIS 2 modems do not.

You can check the number of bonded channels for your modem at one of the following IP Addresses. The first IP Address being the most common:

192.168.100.1 or 149.112.50.65 - if neither works...contact your ISP.

For more information on Modems: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/robin.d.h.walker/cmtips/ipaddr.html

A DOCSIS 3 modem with 4 bonded channels, for example would provide 4 times the bandwidth of a DOCSIS 2 modem. Because of this, DOCSIS 3 may experience less of a speed drop during peak usage hours vs. a DOCSIS 2 modem. The D3 modem, depending on how new it is and how many channels the ISP makes available, has access to 2x-8x more bandwidth than a D2 modem, allowing for a somewhat more consistent connection.

To be clear...a cable modem with an upgraded DOCSIS standard does not necessarily mean "faster" speed. What it does mean is more consistency under heavy load or peak time usage as can be seen from the table below.

DOCSIS 1.x (v1.0 1997, v1.1 1999) 38 Mbps downstream, 9 Mbps upstream. Version 1.1 standardized QoS support.
DOCSIS 2.0 (2001) 38 Mbps downstream, 27 Mbps upstream.
DOCSIS 3.0 (2006) 38 Mbps downstream, 27 Mbps upstream per channel, 4+ channel bonding, support for IPv6.
DOCSIS 3.1 (2013) 10 Gbps downstream, 1 Gbps upstream using 4096 QAM.

* Some information provided reproduced from this link: http://www.speedguide.net/faq/docsis-2-vs-docsis-3-differences-390


Router Specifications - Routers of today typically broadcast on two frequencies: 2.4 GHz and 5GHZ. Wireless N routers are the most common with backward compatibility to a/b/g Wi-Fi standards. AC routers are the newest standard but not all PC's support it, but that is rapidly changing.

A good Wireless N Dual Band Router will support up to 900 Mbps - 450 Mbps on 2.4 GHz band and 450 Mbps on 5 GHz band. If your PC is dual band capable you'll want to configure your wireless card for the 5 GHz band which works better for streaming. If your computer is only capable of recognizing the 2.4 GHz band there are USB wireless adapters that can provide 5 GHz compatibility.

I hope this additional information although somewhat technical proves useful. As I have tried to present...there are other factors to consider that can have an impact on your streaming capabilities outside of your PC. Good luck and Safe computing.

Together Everyone Achieves More (TEAM)

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More Info RE: Modem, Router, Wi-Fi signal & PC Wireless Card
May 25, 2015 1:01AM PDT

Not to insult anyone's intelligence, but there may be some newbies reading this post. Therefore here's a very simplified analogy of ISP Bandwidth in relationship to a Modem, Router, Wi-Fi signal and PC Wireless Card. This in no way is intended as a scientifically verified real-world scenario.

Think of the data stream provided by your ISP as a one direction (download) four-lane highway (i.e. data stream). Every vehicle traveling on that highway is identical (i.e. kilobyte). At any given time the highway (data stream) can carry 1000 vehicles (kilobytes).

The "off ramp" (connection of the data stream to your modem) can only handle 700 vehicles (kilobytes). This is a limitation of the modem, which is to be expected.

The "street you live on" (connection of the modem to your router) can only handle 500 vehicles (kilobytes). This is a limitation of the router, which is to be expected.

The "walkway to your home" (Wi-Fi signal transmitted by your router) can only handle 450 vehicles (kilobytes). This is a limitation of your routers ability to transmit over one of 802.11x protocols, which are a/b/g/n/ac ("n" being the best at this time, as not every computer can accept "ac").

The "front door to your home" (Wi-Fi signal that can be accepted by your PC) will only allow 275 - 375 vehicles (kilobytes). This is a limitation of your PC's Wireless Card, which is its ability to accept Wi-Fi over 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz (the best for optimal performance). Other factors can degrade a wireless signal such as microwaves and network traffic from internal Wi-Fi devices inside your home or external devices outside your home.

The take away from this exercise is that with each "handoff" of the data stream (i.e. ISP > Modem > Router > Conversion to Wi-Fi > Computer Wireless Card) a degradation in the signal is too be expected.

So, in a perfect world (with an optimized PC) you have a:

1) Modem that supports the latest DOCSIS standard (3.0 or 3.1)

2 a) Router that supports Dual Band Wireless N 900 @ 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz
2 b) PC with Dual Band Wireless Card capable of accepting wireless N signal or equipped with USB Wireless N adapter *

Or,

3 a) Router that supports Dual Band Wireless AC 1300+ at 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz
3 b) PC with Dual Band Wireless Card capable of accepting wireless AC signal or equipped with USB Wireless AC adapter (AC USB wireless adapters for OSX are difficult to find and do not integrate with consistency) *

* Optimum performance is realized over 5GHz frequency


Together Everyone Achieves More (TEAM)

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Good Points
May 25, 2015 7:29AM PDT

But, you forgot to mention that the highway may have a toll booth that slows down the cars and your "off-ramp" and local streets may be very fast, but it won't help very much if the cars are moving very slow on the highway. Also, a lot of people are NOT using WiFi at all so we have the Lincoln Tunnel here consisting of an Ethernet cable.
So, if you have WiFi at 2.0+ GB/sec or wired Ethernet at 1.0 GB/sec (or even 10/100 GB/sec) but your ISP only provides 15 MB/SEC, you are still not going to use your super exit ramp.

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Ethernet Cable...What a novel Idea!
May 25, 2015 8:54AM PDT

Like I always say...Together Everyone Achieves More (TEAM)

I started to include a disclaimer for a wired connection. But tell me...what happened to the Ethernet Cable...I mean the Lincoln Tunnel in this case...I hope the ITS was still working. Using Wi-Fi may have been the better option. Beam me up Scotty! Cool

https://tribwpix.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/lincoln-tunnel-crash.jpeg

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Ethernet Cable
May 25, 2015 4:31PM PDT

Ethernet cable is better than WiFi Ethernet. There is less or no interference and my desktop does not have WiFi in it. Also, the PC sits only a few feet from the router anyway. Great tunnel! What I was saying, is that, if you are doing Internet stuff, regardless of whether you are using wired or wireless Ethernet, you won't get full speed if your ISP is giving you slow speed. So, yes, the tunnel is all crowded but it ,ay be more that the ISP is only providing less than 300 MB/sec speed even though your router can do 2 GB/sec.

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Your Comments are Valid
May 25, 2015 11:50PM PDT

Not disagreeing with you. A direct connection (Ethernet cable) will perform better than a wireless connection in the majority of configurations. However, I think you may have taken my response entitled "Ethernet Cable what a novel idea" a bit too seriously. It was only intended as fun in response to your comment about the Lincoln Tunnel. Also, I was very serious when I said I should have included a disclaimer regarding a "wired connection" because there is a difference as opposed to wireless as you pointed out.

I'll admit that I may have made an incorrect assumption that Mike's configuration is a "wireless" setup (you'll see why later). But on the other hand Mike didn't indicate if he is using a direct connection to his Sony PC via Ethernet or whether his PC is a tower or laptop? If he had indicated a tower configuration I would have made the same assumption that his configuration is wired and omitted anything referencing Wi-Fi in my posts. That is why I firmly believe it is very important that as much information as possible be given when posting to a forum...especially regarding a question like Mike's.

As everyone seemed to be focusing on Mike's PC (prior to my initial post) I thought I'd introduce another dimension and look at factors outside of his PC that may have an effect on his streaming performance. My treatise on modems, routers and the numbers presented were strictly given as a simplified example to illustrate a point to show that with each handoff of an ISP signal there is a degradation (that applies to a wired configuration as well). Granted...bandwidth provided by the ISP is a critical factor. That being whether it is the best the ISP can provide (low bandwidth), or if the problem is a result of "throttling" (and that's another topic).

There's one component; in any setup, that will have an effect on consistency of bandwidth reaching the PC regardless of a wired or wireless setup (even with optimal parameters set for the PC itself) - that's the DOCSIS standard for the modem being used. So, my intent was to suggest that after all of the other factors regarding the PC are ruled out...look outside of the box and consider the hardware. That being the modem DOCSIS standard and/or router, if a wireless configuration.

I run 5 computers. Three (3) OSX (one of which is an iMac) and two (2) Windows 8.1. They're all wireless including my iMac. Now you see why I gravitated toward discussing a "wireless" configuration. FYI, I use an Apple AC router, DOCSIS 3.1 Modem (that I own) and subscribe to the highest tier provided by my ISP. I have my PC's optimized; as many have suggested in this post, but from personal experience I discovered that the Modem standard in play is a critical component that should not be overlooked (regardless of what the ISP is delivering).

One more comment. IMO we're moving toward a wireless world. Towers for the average consumer are moving toward gaming rigs (expensive), business oriented (Dell for example) and those who are DiY'ers. The demand for portability IMO is driving the trend. With the exception of my iMac none of my systems natively accept an Ethernet cable...they all require a dongle. Apple's latest laptop only has a single port for everything including charging the battery! Ports on AIO's are becoming sparse to reduce bulk and enhance screen real-estate.

My point is that we are slowly being pushed away from connections and forced to manage our end-use devices wirelessly. That means we are going to have to start figuring out ways to optimize our wireless devices to get the best performance without interruption and that includes the peripherals used to support them.

Sorry for the length of this reply. However, your comments (Hforman) are always appreciated and insightful. Keep 'em coming.

Together Everyone Achieves More (TEAM)

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Those are Good Points
May 26, 2015 2:49AM PDT

I did sense the Lincoln Tunnel was humorous. I wasn't disagreeing with you at all and the points I made for for general consumption. I agree that we need to start optimizing both our WiFi Ethernet and wired Ethernet connections. The only point I was making was that we need to remember that the traffic will flow from our ISP to our device at the slowest speed. If you have this great big pipe (or Tunnel), the speed is not going to exceed the slowest speed, which could be the the ISPs speed that the consumer pays for. That is sort of the problem that, if you want super-duper high speed, you have to pay more money to your ISP EVERY MONTH, while it is easy to go to the store and buy a DOCSIS 3 cable modem ONCE and a super router ONCE. I also agree that there is movement toward a portable world (except in big business - will explain) but a lot of that will probably be LTE. If you look at you WiFi device out in the middle of town, there will probably be a lot of hotspots but most will be password-protected. "Free" WiFi doesn't work too well in a 'commercial' capitalist world except to draw in customers to a brick-and-mortar shop (aka, "Starbucks"). As for why big business won't go too portable, the average worker doesn't take work home. Devices that are portable need MDM software or full disk encryption because they are too easily lost or stolen. Desktops tend to stay put on desks more than a device that can be hidden in a trash can or whatever.
Thank you for your kind words. I'm not disagreeing at all but just trying to add-on a few things for people to think about.

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Agreed and Agreed
May 26, 2015 4:50AM PDT

Speaking metaphorically, I believe we are both on the same non-stop flight, we're just seated in different positions...but what the heck...the final destination is the same for both of us.

We probably better stop using so much of this forums real-estate for our personal discussion as Lee (or R. Proffitt or Dafydd) may lock us out. Great exchange of information...I enjoyed it!

Together Everyone Achieves More (TEAM)

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Why not meet up....
May 26, 2015 4:58AM PDT

In speakeasy or buzz out loud forums.
Dafydd.