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General discussion

Sony's Secret Weapon=Time

Sep 22, 2006 9:20AM PDT

I am a little surprised by people and their reaction to Sony and the PS3. Many of you seem to think that everything Nintendo has ever done has been a resounding success and that they've followed through on all the things that they have promised. Where is the online play for the GC? Where is Twilight Princess? I reserved that game months before they decided to abandon the GC just like the 3rd party developers.

Let us also not forget as we speculate that PS3 titles will cost $100 that Xbox360 titles are $60, and that N64 games sold for $79. Fortunately PS3 games will retail for the same price point as Xbox360 titles. You say Sony is just supporting Blu-ray and 1080p because their TV's can use it...well...duh!! Sony is in business, and to strengthen that business they are going to maneuver and position themselves for success, be it buy cutting prices or adding an innovative technology that was developed by someone else (motion sensory). If you think about it, every time there is a new development or a leap in technology, it is never a proprietary development. Why? Because everyone copies everyone else, and do so by doing just enough not to get sued. (See early AMD processors)

If history is any indication, the PS3 will be the best of all next-gen consoles. The N64 got out of the gate first and was crushed the PSone. Dreamcast raced out and was crushed by the PS2 which in turn was crushed by the Xbox (at least technologically). Sorry N fans the GC was never really a factor, kinda like Ross Perot. In this case, Sony has had a chance to see the competition, get their hands on it, play it, and best it. Just like Microsoft did with the PS2. Sony already being established, unlike MS with the first Xbox should see a tremendous response when the PS3 launches.

Furthermore the price point becomes less and less of a factor when you consider all the peripherals for the Xbox and Wii, the cost of the online service and the downloads. If a 360 owner buys the new external HD-DVD drive, you have just basically paid the same price for your Xbox as you would for a PS3, give or take about $20 bucks which when you've already spent $600 is really no big deal. And while I recognize that you could just as well chose not to buy the drive, there is clearly a demand for the player, or MS would not put money into development, marketing and production of such. And yet nobody says that they are just copying Sony. The fact is that this will be a 2 horse race between Sony and MS (again) and time will tell which will sell the most, regardless whichever you chose you will be blown away. Sorry Wii guys that system is an afterthought, kinda like Ralph Nader. I may buy one for the exclusive 1st party titles when it comes down to $100-$150 because when the 3rd parties bail they'll port em' to the big boys.

Discussion is locked

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I agree. Somewhat
Sep 22, 2006 10:55AM PDT

sing it, my brother. TESTIFY!

I don't know where all the super anti-Sony sentiment is coming from. I've heard people state that they aren't buying the PS3 because they think that Kutaragi is too arrogant. Who gives a flying you-know-what about his attitude? I'm not buying his personality! I'm buying the game console.

Now, the PS3 has seen a price cut (in Japan at least) and the dream of dreams, the 20 gig now sports an HDMI port. The same people that were griping on the price are calling the move a sign of weakness. You know what else is a sign of weakness? Not giving credit where credit is due.

And I give no credit to the Wii. Nintendo is patting itself on the back over the fact that their console will be profitable right out of the box. Of course it will! When you sell 120 bucks worth of hardware at 250 bucks, its clear that a profit will be made. Ninty fanboys can scream "it's all about gameplay" all they want. It's all about PROFIT. Buy the Wii, and you are overpaying.

The PS3, on the other hand, is the best value you can buy on the market. This baby will last at least 5 years. Two years from now, the Wii will look even more gimped than it does right out of gate. The Wii is NOT a next gen system. Oh, and to the uber desperate fanboys thinking that Nintendo will suddenly reveal that the graphics are actually way better than they've been showing? Well I guess that just proves that even you know the Wii's graphics are sub par.

PS3 makes the most sense this generation. Get over yourselves and admit it.

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Flawed Facts
Sep 22, 2006 1:14PM PDT

You are correct, Sony is in business. They are in the TV business, the movie business, the computer business, the camera business and last but not least the game business. While this may speak well of Sony as a company in general it does not speak well for it's game business in particular. Sony is pushing use of their other products over use of their game console. To fully realize the PS3's potential requires not just the $600 console but also expensive games, expensive Blu-Ray movies and a big expensive Sony HD television. Compare that to the Wii, cheaper console and cheaper games with a brand new control scheme, not the same format recycled for the third time in a row. What brought this new innovation to Wii? A focus on games and their quality, not what will encourage the consumer to spend the most.

You point out the N64 was raced out and was crushed, you point out the same thing for Dreamcast. Yet when I look at the current generation it is the PS3 that is being rushed out ahead of the Wii, not the other way around. According to your own information, history has shown that the last out has the last laugh, and in this case, history favors the Wii.

Another major part of your argument is that when the day is done and peripherals and games are added up price point will make less of a difference. Yet compare the actual prices, $250 for the Wii, $180 for three Wii remotes and nun-chucks, and $100 for two Wii games at launch. Your total, $530. $70 less than the starting price of the PS3. That means by the time you add up all the games and extra controllers for the PS3 your price points are once again drastically different. Plus most people will not be buying all that at launch, instead only purchasing may be one extra nun-chuck and Wii remote set and letting friends bring their own over to share their Mii characters. This will lead to a major lack of PS3 sales, especially when people are looking for presents come the holiday season.

If anything I believe it will be the 360 who draws the short straw this time around. For all the Xbox's, "success," it still lost billions of dollars for Microsoft. The lack of built in HD-DVD player and the slight improvements of the PS3 over the 360 make it n either here nor their, a middle position that will not last for long. Due to the great similarities between the 360 and PS3 the two systems will cannibalize the same market, leaving the Wii high and dry with it's new non-gamer market share plus all those who have loved and followed Nintendo franchises since the days of Super Mario Brothers and Zelda I. Wii has the new innovation and the right price to put the PS3 and Xbox 360 far in the rear in this generation of consoles.

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The fact remains that...
Sep 22, 2006 5:45PM PDT

with the 360, you have a CHOICE in whether or not the hi-def drive should be part of your purchase. With the PS3, that option is taken away from you. And furthermore, with the 360, there's nothing that says that a BluRay drive can't be developed later on if that platform wins out, whereas it's doubtful Sony will acquiesce quietly if HD-DVD ends up winning this fight (if indeed you want to cite Sony's past history as an indicator). And WhereTF is this supposed pent-up demand on the 360 side? Both HD-DVD and BluRay content sales are tanking, and doing it BIG TIME; only the most hard-core videophiles are willing to adopt either, or both. And people though PSP UMD movie sales were bad.

You should read some of the press reports coming out of the Toyko Game Show going on now...some are positively scathing; these guys in the Japanese press are NOT being very kind to Sony. Considering the technology wrapped up the the Cell processor and BluRay, there seems to be a universal comment concerning a lack of innovation in the actual gaming experience, something the Wii is perceived to have in spades over both the Sony and MSFT consoles. And many of these reports seem to have already declared Nintendo as the clear winner.

BTW, AMD, among others, was sued by Inhell for their 'copying'/patent infringements of X86 technology, even though AMD ultimately prevailed.

And even more pointedly, why should past history provide some sort of automatic bank for Sony? Considering all their foul-ups of late, why should ANYONE blindly believe that they can get the PS3 right, paricularly considering all the delays and false promises leading up to this point?

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samll point
Sep 28, 2006 7:18AM PDT

"with the 360, you have a CHOICE in whether or not the hi-def drive should be part of your purchase. With the PS3, that option is taken away from you."

did you ever think that maybe sony wanted to include support for a larger capacity disk that could enable publishers to increase game content?

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Valid, but...
Sep 28, 2006 10:09AM PDT

Many game publishers have enough trouble filling a DVD's worth of content, let alone a BluRay or HD-DVD disk's worth.

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true, but despite that it still makes sense
Sep 29, 2006 1:44AM PDT

that is true but when the ps2 and xbox were released neither HAD to support DVD as a format but it was a smart move. You say sony forces blu-ray on you, but why wouldnt they incorporate it right out of the box. If it is production from the get go then that is one less add-on you will have to buy in the future and will help reduce cost to Sony and the consumer on down line. Also, it is backwards compatible so developers don't have to utilize it if they dont see fit and with some recent developments in media production the cost will likely drop significantly within a year or so.

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Hello you inaccurate living sony commercial
Sep 23, 2006 12:04AM PDT

Your whole post was just one big commercial trying to justify and glorify sony in every possible way, and you can't even get your "facts" straight and are telling us that the n64 came out before the psx? **** n00b...

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You are correct
Sep 23, 2006 1:52AM PDT

Yes in the fervor of writing that article I did misquote the release order of the PSOne and the N64. The N64 was released in the U.S. in 1996 whereas the PSOne made it's debut in 1995. However the "it was crushed" part was spot on. That being said, rather that address any of the points made therein, you chose to resort to juvenile insults. "**** n00b" I believe it was. You MUST be a scholar. I am not trying to glorify Sony, though I do enjoy my Grand Wega and PS2 and I will enjoy my PS3 as well.

What I am trying to do is understand why so many of you seem to hate Sony, when the system isn't even out yet. You Wii lover's seem to forget to old addage "You get what you pay for". You all seem to think that the price is $250 because the big N "cares about gamers". WRONG!!! It's $250 because the can't justify selling it for anywhere near the price of an Xbox 360 or a PS3. You know, a real game system. They had to include Wii sports to justify the $250. Also they point that Nintendo is after non gamers is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Someone should tell them that gamers play video games. This thing will be the GC all over again and all you'll have to show for it is a stupid gimmick controller. They should have spent more time on the system rather that this innovative controller which you'll use to play games that are not even on par with last gen's Xbox of PS2.

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In Reply
Sep 23, 2006 3:57AM PDT

You get what you pay for. I look in the news and I see that the PS3's Core price has been lowered in Japan to about $410, around 20% less. Does that mean that when you buy a Core in Japan you get 20% less than when you buy a Core anywhere else? No it does not, it means that Sony realized nobody was going to spend $510 on any game system, no matter what the hype is. Yet the price remains the same here in the US. You are paying a price that even Sony realizes is too high, as shown by their Japanese price cut.

Nintendo is charging $250 for the system because that is all it costs to make. That's right, the Wii doesn't have really high priced graphics or extra Blu-Ray video capabilities. That is because they know most people can't afford that. When you look at a photograph, an identical picture to real life, do you enjoy it more than looking at the Mona Lisa, or a Van Gogh. I certainly hope not. Those paintings, while not as true a representation of real life as a photograph, have a much greater message and many hidden meanings. The same can be said for many Wii games. Mario and Zelda are classics of the video game world, people have grown up playing these characters and loving them. Everyone knows Mario, he is a pop culture figure. Such games are much deeper than anything on the PS3 and don't need an ultra high price to be fun. And they do not need to look like real life because they aren't real life. They are a video game and that is what makes them fun.

Right now, gamers play the 360, gamers play the PS2 and gamers play the GameCube. Yet, look at the Nintendo DS. Huge sales and an amazing success. Why? Because they have tapped the non-gamer market with nan-gamer games such as Nintendogs, Animal Crossing and Brain Age. Huge new demographics are being opened in front of the DS and the result is a wave of profitability and new gamers. These new gamers will migrate to the Wii and even more will be drawn as new even more innovative games come out. PS3 and the Xbox 360 on the other hand, will be forced to feed off each others consumer pools and will not be able to grow and expand the market. Truly, the Wii is the wave of the future.

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"Wii is the wave of the future" LOL
Sep 23, 2006 8:53AM PDT

For the sake of the gaming community, I hope the Wii is NOT!!!! the wave of the future. Let's look at the facts. Although the Wii is the cheapest of the 3 consoles, this is due to the fact that there isn't much of a leap in game graphics from the GameCube. The hardware of the Wii can best be described as that of an overclocked Gamecube. Wonder why Nintendo has been reluctant in giving specifics about the Wii's hardware capabilities? Because not only do they know their isn't much of an improvement from the Gamecube, they know it pails in comparison to that of the PS3 and the 360. Also, the Wii has less third-party games than the PS3 and 360 plan to have. It gets on my nerve how they milk their current franchises to death. Have I grown up with Mario? Yes. Do I like playing his games? Occasionally yes. Do I like it when a gaming company bases most of their games on a few franchise characters? NO I DO NOT!!! You can tell that Nintendo wasn't aiming high for the Wii. The Wii looks like it will neeed replacement in 2 years, while Sony and Microsoft are aiming for at least 5 years for their respective game consoles. Finally, it appears to me that Nintendo is basing all of their hopes on the WIi's motion sensory controls. While it's not a bad idea, it's far from revolutionary technology. Don't forget, a motion sensor control was created for the XBOX by a third-party company, but people took little notice of it and it eventually died off. From what I see now, although Sony will loose a lot of marketshare to Nintendo and Microsoft, it will still be on top.

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HD And... Nothing
Sep 23, 2006 12:49PM PDT

Everyone already knows that the Wii has poor graphics compared to the PS3 and 360. But what most people should realize is that HD televisions still cost a huge amount and most people can't afford them. To get the full effects of the PS3's graphics you have to pay at least another $600 to get a small HD TV, and even then not a very good one. When played on a normal SD TV, as the majority of consumers will, the difference between Wii and 360 or PS3 is hardly noticeable. And Nintendo has already stated that by the next generation they believe HD televisions will be prevalent enough to make the system support HD. So don't worry, if you're rich enough to afford an HD television game systems will support you in the future, just not right now when you are the small minority.

The Godfather, Excite Truck, Red Steel, Resident Evil:Umbrella Chronicles and Splinter Cell. Those are just five third party games coming to the Wii. Those games look amazing and they are only the tip of the ice berg. Ubisoft alone is providing huge amounts of support, much more than they did for the admittedly sub-par GameCube. Everyday new developers are announcing their intent to create games based on motion sensitive and point related controls.

Yes, many of Wii's hopes are tied to the new controls. But look at how successful the new controls were on the DS, it tapped a previously untouchable market. No developers developed for the Xbox's motion sensitive controls because they were only available in an obscure third party controller that most people did not own. There was no way that a developer could trust in a control scheme that most consumers could not utilize without buying all new controllers. With the Wii, everyone is guaranteed to have motion sensitivity and a pointer.

I believe that innovative and effectively used technologies, combined with large 1st and 3rd party support, plus the opening of new markets will result in a win for the Wii. Leaving Microsoft and Sony to compete for those few who have the large amounts of money required to use the new HD technology that seems to be the only thing that differentiates them from the previous generation.

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I own an HDTV
Sep 23, 2006 2:27PM PDT

I actually own a $2,200 Sony HDTV. I don't play games tons though. I play a few hours a week. I bought an HD-DVD player ($500 model) during the summer (before the Blu-ray player was released) so I could watch Serenity in HD. That was more or less the only reason I wanted it back then. Since then I've picked up about 30 of the HD-DVDs. I'm a big movie fan and watch tons of movies.

This said, I wouldn't spend 600 bucks to play video games. Now the PS3 will indeed play Blu-ray movies but I haven't found anything that is out for Blu-ray that I say I "must have" like I did with Serenity (also Constintine came out for HD-DVD and wow does it look good, also Aeon Flux). Another factor is that the PS3 is only going to do 1X Blu-ray play speed, not that it matters much since there's only a few movies I'm even interested in at all and none that I "must have" as of yet.

I own and HDTV and there was no way I was going to wait 5 or 8 years to watch dvds in HD, it just didn't make sense to me to wait for the "war" to end. If HD-DVD loses then I'll still have my player to play the movies I own and to upconvert the older dvds and then I'll pick up a Blu-ray player assuming I haven't bought one by then (if something I must have in HD comes out for Blu-ra). Lets face it, the PS3 is only useful if you own an expensive TV and you play games A LOT. For me, a few hours a week doesn't justify spending that kind of money on hardware. I do however spend many hours watching movies and I didn't have a regular dvd player (I recently moved a great distance and gave my old one to my former roommate).

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LOL THE WII DOES NOT HAVE LARGE 3RD PARTY SUPPORT
Sep 24, 2006 8:24AM PDT

Anyone who says the Wii has good 3rd party support doesn't know what games the Wii is missing out on. Here are some of the games that will be available on the PS3 and 360, but not on the Wii:
-Half-Life 2
-Resident Evil 5
-Unreal Tournament 2007
-Assassin's Creed
-and the biggest of them all...GRAND THEFT AUTO 4!!!

Good 3rd party support, I think not.

As for HDTV, Nintendo might be right in saying that HDTV isn't prevailent today but that means Nintendo doesn't have a long life-span in mind for the Wii. It appears to me that Nintendo has a 2-3 year life span in mind for the Wii, while both Microsoft and Sony have at least 5 years in mind for their own consoles. Due to development costs, it's cheaper to creat a console that lasts long-term rather than a console with a short life span. Also, I attribute the success for the DS more to it having better games than the PSP than the touchscreen. Although the Wii may have a lot of hype coming out, I doubt it can keep that momentum. It'll definately do better than the GameCube, but not as well as the 360 and PS3 will.

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What's New?
Sep 24, 2006 11:54AM PDT

Say what you want but many developers have stated that they wish to develop games for the Wii in the future, and as the second wave of games comes around we shall see which console is able to retain and gather the most support.

You point out that it is cheaper to produce a console for the long term. Yet Nintendo is the only one making money on their console and that is at a much lower price. So Even if Nintendo is intending the Wii to only last three years it will still make more money on the console than Microsoft or Sony and the next generation will have a leg up on the outdated competition. Which Wii buyers will be able to afford because this system is not even half the cost of the others.

You attribute the success of the DS to its content over its controls, but look at the PSP. It can play movies, it has an mp3 player and it plays games, it should have three times as much content as the DS could ever hope to get. Somehow the DS is still a huge triumph, why? Because of the innovation and brand new style of interaction that allows brand new types of games to come to light.

As for the PS3 and 360, besides having better graphics, which I have already pointed out does not necessarily make for better games, what else is new about them? The PS3 has the last minute motion sensitivity which most developers aren't utilizing and it has blu-ray which might not even exist in a couple of years. What do they offer that is different from the previous generation? Nothing.

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who cares about grand theft auto?
Sep 24, 2006 12:06PM PDT

I rented a couple of the GTA games back when the series was still new. It was fun for a while but I quickly found it to be boring. I don't see why people think it's so great. Of course, that's just me I guess. I suppose it might be worth it for maybe 10 bucks to me but that's about it. I certainly wouldn't get enough gameplay out of it to make it worth sixty dollars. Maybe it's a game for teenagers or something?

Now, onto the system lifespan. My guess is that the Wii will have the usual five year life span. You can be pretty sure that they aren't planning it for two years. Sony has said that their PS3 is "upgrade proof" which of course is total BS as we all know. I'm guessing they're expecting the PS3 to last eight to ten years. If this is the case, then you might as well wait for the price to drop (for the system and some good games) and then get the system, some games, and some accessories for the price of the system ALONE at release.

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"Who Cares About Grand Theft Auto" LOL A LOT OF PEOPLE
Sep 25, 2006 6:57AM PDT

The Grand Theft Auto franchise is one of the largest game franchises out there. Garnd Theft Auto: San Andreas sold twice as many games as Halo 2, meaning a lot of people do care about it. As for the lifespan of the Wii, Nintendo may plan to have it last 5 years, but I don't see how that's gonna work. The Wii games aren't much of an improvement from the GameCube games. While the PS3 and 360 have lots of room to make their game graphics better, the Wii doesn't. I can speak for myself that after seeing the graphics of the 360 in person, the graphics of my PS2 never looked as nice as it use to for me. I don't see how Wii gamers can see the competitions games keep getting better and better, while their own games dont.

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grand theft auto = boring
Sep 25, 2006 7:55AM PDT

My opinion remains unchanged. I played several versions of GTA and found them all to be fairly boring. As for t he PS3 and the XBOX360, they are both too expensive (for me). I won't buy either at the prices they want. I play games a few hours a week and don't see the point in spending that kind of money on something. I enjoy doing things with friends much more than playing video games or even playing video games online with "online friends" like the PC crowd (World of Warcraft anyone?) Lets face it, no game for $650 (system + 1 game) can be half as fun as flying to Vegas with some friends and gambling because $650 is enough to go on vacation.

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Still Waiting
Sep 25, 2006 8:22AM PDT

You certainly seem to be basing a lot of the PS3's success on GTA. However I seem to remember you writing in an earlier post how much you hated it when consoles only relied on their proven franchises. Are you changing your mind? Also this report,http://www.cubed3.com/news/5991/1/Take-Two_%28GTA%29_Currently_%22In_Talks%22
found on C3 News states that Nintendo is currently in talks with Take Two, possibly for a GTA version on the Wii.

Graphics aren't a substitute for games. You can look at a photo and it's not as good as a work of art. Reality isn't necessarily the best thing for games, especially games where you have to constantly kill people (GTA).

Finally, I still want to know what makes the PS3 an improvement over the PS2 besides the graphics, which don't necessarily make games, and the blu-ray, for which the PS3 makes a poor quality player, and which might not exist in a couple of years.

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Same Question
Sep 25, 2006 3:09PM PDT

What makes the Wii an improvement over the GC? And please don't say that gimmick contol. Because a gimmick like that doesn't make good games either. And here's a news flash for ya....PEOPLE CARE ABOUT GRAPHICS!!!!! We care how something looks, and how it well the story is told, and how it controls. If the graphics don't matter, why buy a new system at all? Because despite what you may think, that's what new consoles are all about, graphics. Speed and graphics. And I don't see any meritable improvements in the Wii that I should replace the GC I wasted my money on.

Also you all talk like there were no good games on the PS2 or either Xbox consoles. How about God of War? Ninja Gaiden? Halo? Jak? Rachet? Crismon Skies? Anyway... the difference is that Sony and Microsoft seized an opportunity to make their consoles multimedia hubs as well as superb gaming consoles. Each offers excellent games like, GTA, Halo, and MGS4. Who gives a crap if they're sequels. The 2 latter titles are epics that engross though superior storytelling. They are not however, re-hashing the same characters and bleeding them for every dime they can get. There is no "Master Chief Extreme Soccer" or "Snake's Smash Tennis". Don't get me wrong, I grew up with Mario and it's cool to reminisce every now and then but Mario, like most N titles are geared for children. And no, you don't have to kill someone for a game to be fun, but how about some strategy and character development, or at least a storyline. BTW don't say "what about Zelda" in your reply cause I didn't mention Zelda. They have done a great job of keeping the series fresh. Instead of allowing it to become an embarrassment like Sonic or Mario.

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Different Answer
Sep 26, 2006 5:40AM PDT

If all you care about is power, get a PC, it'll be about the same price and you will end up with so many more features. It can play multimedia, you can hook it into your TV, you can play thousands of games... My point is when you say all you want is power than the PS3 is really not powerful compared to many other electronics on the market.

Yes, graphics are nice, but they are not everything.
If graphics were everything than painting would be
dead, movies like Sin City with very little color would be bad and cartoons would cease being funny. Fortunately, those things are not true. Just look at South Park, originally made with paper cutouts, it is much more funny than many live acting, better looking shows.

I agree with you completely, story telling matters a lot. Graphics don't have anything to do with story telling. Books almost always tell better stories than movies and you certainly can't say a book has good graphics.

I never said anything about there not being good games for PS2 and Xbox. There are a whole lot of great games for both. In fact there are many more good games for PS2 and Xbox then there are for GameCube, I don't know what made you think I disagreed at all.

In making their consoles, ''multimedia hubs,'' Sony and Microsoft drove up the price and in Sony's case sacrificed a whole lot to make it that way. In Monday's Wall Street Journal, Ken Kutaragi, father of the PlayStation said, ''You could say that we could have avoided problems if we had gone with a regular DVD player.'' Mr. Kutaragi was referring to the many set backs and price problems involved with the PS3. Sony may have chosen the multimedia route, pushing their pricey Blu-Ray technology, but in doing so they have sacrificed some of the game system's functionality.

Mario may be aimed at children but many games coming to the Wii are not. The Godfather and Red Steel just to name two, and Take Two is in talks with Nintendo for another M title. You say that Nintendo has no character or storyline then go on to say that Zelda was good, a little contradictory. Games like Starfox and Earthbound have amazing storytelling and great game play years after they came out in their original forms. Also, Sonic is Sega, not Nintendo, so don't throw that one at me.

Now, what makes the Wii new and improved? First off, Virtual Console. This system allows some of the most successful games of all time to finally be replayed by many new people, either those that enjoyed them in their childhood or those who never had a chance to play them. Second, Wii Connect 24. Always connected, you will be able to turn on your Wii and find free demos and new levels, plus, its free so no costly monthly or yearly charges. The Channels, instant weather, online browsing, Mii characters. The Wii Channels allows for multipurpose functionality at no extra charge. Speakers in the remote will immerse you in the sound like never before.

Finally, you call the controller a gimmick. Here is the definition of gimmick, ''to equip or embellish with unnecessary features, esp. in order to increase salability, acceptance, etc. (often fol. by up): to gimmick up a sports car with chrome and racing stripes.''

The Wii remote is not racing stripes. It is the heart of the system. Whenever I'm swinging a sword in a game I often move the controller, just as a natural reflex, I tilt my body in racing games around tight corners. With the remote all the body language will finally be translated into game controls that allow for a brand new level of immersive play. Call it a gimmick if you want, the Wii still has an amazing new set of features.

And still nobody has said what is new and good about the PS3, I want to here positives.

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Hot dog we have a Wii-ner
Sep 26, 2006 8:56AM PDT

What are you talking about? Comparing graphics of a game console to movies like Sin City, Tv shows, and books. Well MOVIES have real people in them instead of colorful sprites and don't rely soley on graphical presentation. Sin City is a stylized film adaptation of a series of graphic novels. Not sure what point you're making there. South Park is funnier that live action shows? The quality of a show trends towards the writing. So live action or cartoon doesn't determine what's funny that's called writing. Now graphics in books......that was dumb. Graphics matter in VIDEO GAMES. If they didn't all these new next gen titles could have been produced for any, yes and of the past consoles only at a significant graphical dowgrade. Also the motion sensory could have been added to any existing system. As for the $600 PC...uh a $600 PC will not be fast or powerful. So again not sure you made your point there.

You say that Virtual Console will be sooo great. Hmm let's see downloads, News, Weather...sounds like....multimedia. But Sony and MS are too focused on MM!! I don't need new and weather I have a $1500 PC and I pay for cable. I also don't see the point of buying games that I can play for free on the internet. And no, I don't care if it's legal. I do care that I benefit from the HD enhancement of the PS3 and 360 cuz I have an HDTV.....2 of em'...But you have fun playing Mario, Zelda and Metroid cause that's all you have once the support for your system is dead Wii-ner. When you are buying the next so-called great N system in 2 years let me know if they've finally caught up to the bigs huh, cause the PS3 and 360 will just be hitting their strides.

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I know some PS3 positives that don't include Blu-ray or Cell
Sep 26, 2006 9:25AM PDT

1. True Backwards Compatibility

Unlike the XBOX 360 that relies on software emulation to play XBoX games, the PS3 will be hardware-capable of playing pretty much all PS2 and PS1 games. Then, Sony can go through creating emulation software for the games to enhance their quality. Although the Wii can play GameCube games, it cannot play N64 games unless bought from the Virtual console.

2. Good Hardware Performance

The latest PS3 test kits (pretty much what the final version is gonna be) have shown to produce little sound and heat. Although the Wii isn't known for hardware problems, the 360 is. I know some people who have gone through 2-4 360s because of hardware problems. It looks like these type of problems aren't gonna be a problem for the PS3 like it was for the 360.

3. Region free games

The PS3 will have region free games, unlike the 360 and Wii. Although it might not seem like a big deal, it is a good thing. For starters, since games from any region will work, game distributors won't be as able to stiff people in certain regions with higher priced games as they use to. It will also encourage game developers to release games without long time-spans in release in different regions. It can also encourage game makers to release less region-exclusive games, especially games in Japan.

And while I'm at it, let's look at some of the cons of the Wii:

1. No built-in hard drive. If Nintendo has big plans for the Wii's online services, I don't see why Nintendo didn't include a hard drive with it. All it has is 512MB flash memory, which won't be enough for those who wish to hold a large collection of favorite Nintendo games.

2. No built-in Ethernet. I'm not sure why Nintendo would make WiFi built-in, and Ethernet an accessory. Didn't Nintendo say the opted to not have HD games because not enough people have HDTVs? Well, I don't think enough people have WiFi to make it worth having built in and Ethernet not.

3. Only 2 USB ports. I know Nintendo is really into wireless, but it has its limits. Just getting the accessories of the 2 points mentioned above would take up all the ports, and it would be a big hassle to keep changing cords.

And the biggest con of them all...NO BUILT-IN DVD!!!. I'm not sure what Nintendo has against DVD. Not only won't they use it to store their games, the Wii won't be able to watch DVD movies without an accessory. No built-in DVD player might seem like not a big deal today, but it's a pretty basic thing to include.

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Sorry, Can't Reply To Actual Post B/c Too Deep, Replies Here
Sep 26, 2006 12:31PM PDT

In Response to "Hot dog we have a Wii-ner" by Lovethechamp:
You deeply misread my post, I was not directly comparing game consoles to movies, books and TV shows, I was using them to prove a point. My points were:
a) Storytelling does not rely on graphics, as shown by stories completely without graphics.
b)Graphics don't determine quality, as you yourself said about TV shows, its not the look, its the writing, taken to video games, its not the graphics, its the story-line.
I used different forms of entertainment to point out parallels amongst them, the parallels being the points above.

You can get a Dell Dimension 1100 for just $279, way below the $600 PS3 and with more functionality. Sure, motion sensitivity was added to the PS3, but it was a last ditch effort and poorly done. Plus it did not have the pointer functionality that is essential to the Wii.

My point about multimedia was that the multimedia formats PS3 chose, Blu-Ray has dragged down the rest of the console. Channels on the other hand comes at no extra cost and will not be holding up the system. The other upside of Channels is while surfing TV, when the news isn't on you can just use the Wii to very quickly check what's up.

Sure, you can break the law and play some games online. But there is no way you can get even a majority of the games out there. And most of the downloads are buggy and come with the risk of viruses. Or they lack functions like save and are very jerky with poor load times.

I can see that you are very rich to have two HDTVs and to brag about them so. While that is all well and good many people aren't as privileged as yourself and can't enjoy the miracle of HD as you can, for those who have to live in the hell that is known as Standard Definition the graphics of the Wii, PS3 and 360 are very close and the difference becomes much less of a selling point. But hey, you go ahead and spend $600 bucks on your PC3, sorry, PS3 and let us less fortunate know how it turns out.


In Response To, "I know some PS3 positives that don't include Blu-ray or Cell," by TheSoleProtector:

You make some really good points and you answered my question, thank you. Now let's see if I can't refute any. Happy

The backwards comp. on the PS3 is impressive and I like it. However VC will be pretty cheap and Wii plays GCN games so the points kind of cancel out.

PS3 sounds like it will run well, which it should at $600, but as far as I have heard the Wii runs just as well.

Region free games is a sticker that got me down when I heard Wii wouldn't support them. However, with all the support the US is getting from Nintendo I don't think it will be too much of a problem, but we won't know for sure till a couple of years go buy.

No HD on the Wii, no Ethernet and two USB ports are annoying but, you really only need two USB ports to plug the two above in. Just get a converter for the Ethernet and plug a HD in to the other slot, problem solved and there is nothing else to plug in.

Finally, Nintendo didn't include a DVD player in order to keep costs down. It is the movie watching Blu-Ray functionality that is holding the PS3 up and I think Nintendo just wanted to avoid that all together.

I would list PS3 cons but it would mainly repeat what I already wrote in previous posts.

Well thanks for reading the long post. Thanks Sole for answering my question.

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Wii 3rd party support SUCKS!
Sep 25, 2006 10:13AM PDT

The wiis 3rd party support is terrible! Most of them are pltformers trying to get a pice of this so called "innovation". I looked on nintendo.com, and these are the developers and games thatll be out by march 31 2007. Nintendo itself made 9, ubisoft 10, THQ 4, midway 4, majesco 1, activision 6. These are the well known companies. A total of 5 small companies no one has ever heard of are making 7 games. There is also atari and EA, but they are making about one game each. As you can see, the wiis 3rd party support is made up mostly of major platformers like ubisoft and a few small companies no ones ever heard of. This is very bad 3rd party support. People claim that this ma be good 3rd party support, but many of those platforming companies are taking previously exclusive titles from other consoles and giviving them to everyone. Ubisoft is releasing COD 3, Far cry, blazing angels, and splinter cell and releasing them for other consoles! Most of those games were originally 360 exclusives. For example. COD 2 was such a huge hit on the 360 (not to mention an exclusive title), then ubisoft is now releasing COD3 for wii and ps3. Thats why I hate ubisoft! They ruing exclusive titles and turn them into platformers, then nintendo fans call this good 3rd party support. Platformers are crappy 3rd party support. If all nintendo can get are platformers to make games for them, that dosnt reflect good on them. That tells everyone their very desperate because no one else wants to make games for them. Plus, most of nins first pary games are unintertaining and kiddy.

Actually, the ds's success was not based entirely on the touch screen. It is priced far below the psp though it shouldent be. Nin is selling the ds at a negative profit. It should cost as much as a psp. Nintendo sells the ds at a loss, and most people buy their first party games which make up for the difference. Plus, the game selection isnt that great on the psp. Dont get me wrong. Its OK. But you can get most of those games for the ps2 anyway.

Who gives a crap about a new controller. You nin fans can scream gampley experience is what conts all you want. But when you have someone over at your house who has not played video games in a long time, do you think their going to notice more, a motion sensing controller, or how beautiful a game looks in HD. Obviously the second one. If the xbox motion sensing controllers history repeats itself with the wii, there will be no more nintendo in 2008. Their desperate, so they invent something crazy with old thechnology, put it in a new box, and call it innovative and revolutionary. I looked on the nintendo website and their even calling the disk drive that can accept GC and wii disks innovative and revolutionary. Actually, now that I think abou it, this post should be called,
"motion sensing controller and.... nothing"

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Wii Stands Strong
Sep 25, 2006 11:26AM PDT

Look at Red Steel, Suda's 51 Heros, Elebits, just three great looking titles by 3rd parties exclusively for the Wii. And the first two are definitely NOT kiddy games. Zelda and Mario are uninteresting? Those two titles have successfully spanned almost the entire length of the video game industry. Mario in particular is probably the best known game of all time! Somehow millions of people spanning multiple generations disagree with you about this one.

You're telling me the games are weak on the PSP but what about all the music and video features? With so many different forms of media available to it surely something would give it a boost over the DS. But the DS, without any kind of multi-media functions is still the life-to-date leader for handhelds. The only feature the DS has got is its touch-screen. That is the explanation for its success, not a lack of content on the PSP's part.

Whenever a non-gamer comes over to my house and sees me playing Xbox they are immediately turned off when I try and teach them how to work the controls. Even people my own age who don't play games can't get the hang of most of them. Anything they might see on the screen is just another part of the confusion of the game. On the other hand, I don't think anyone will be confused by waving a stick around.

Besides, most people won't be dazzled by the HD because most people don't have HD. And they are not going to pick up a $600 console just because it looks nice, nor will the pick up an HD TV set for the same reason.

The Xbox motion controls failed because developers couldn't create games knowing that most people didn't have the necessary controller. So your analogy is a little off.

Also, Wii has the Virtual Console. Games that previous generations loved have often been put out of production as the systems that supported them disappeared. Now old gamers will be getting back into the picture playing games they loved in their childhood, providing a whole new wave of market share. With the VC Wii has the support of games from over a decade.

I still haven't heard any real positives for the PS3, just lots of Nintendo bashing.

P.S. Please try to use a spell checker or read over your posts, I could hardly figure some words out.

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Nintendo stuck in the past.
Sep 27, 2006 11:41AM PDT

Poor nintendo. They still think their in their glory days in the 80's. People liked their games back then. They were good (not that there was much else in terms of other games). Thier not equipt for the modern gaming world. Their preformance on the N64 and GC tell it all. Why should the wii be any different. To make matters worse, their going to keep being stuck in the past. Their virtual console will do that. Nintendo must not be up to date with modern hardware. Maby the hardware on that new half console they have would be amazing in the 80's, but today, most pc's are better than that.

The wii should have been released last gen. If it was, then it could be considered a worthy adversary. But they HAD to release the gc. The cheapest of the 3 last gen consoles, and not to mention the loser. It was a failure on the global scale. Made nintendo lose money, not to mention 3rd party support. The wiis hardware is exactaly the same in terms of preformance as the gc, only with a slightly better graphics card. Well, nin is cutting corners everyewhere. Crappy hardware, crappy controller, a shelf life of only 2 years. They dont even include a dvd drive! Those are be standard now adays. I forgot. Nintendo is cutting corners everywhere. It would be too expensive to add a dvd player. I mean their too cheap to include an ethernet port! Would hat be too much to ask for. I forgot. Im talking about nintendo. The company thats too cheap to add anything useful. But they do add pointless things like a weather channel. Are you going to turn on your console to just check the weather? Thats what the tv is for!

Redsteel... A cheap matrix copy with AI's with the IQ of a neanderthal. Sudas 51 heroes? Whats that? Elebits, another chibi robo like knockoff? Well, zelda and mario could survive longer if they actually made the games interesting and not kiddy! Zelda got bad after ocarina of time and mario got bad when mario 64 came out. Those games are getting so repetative its not even funny. Those millions of people have are going to change their mind when they see mario galaxy (yet another mario title retrieved from a source that ran dry 5 years ago).

Dont get me wrong, not all games for the psp are bad. A lot are pretty good, its just that a lot arnt. So what if their more media on it? Thats just sony trying to push their other products over their video games like UMD and memory stick duo.

Um... i just had someone over at my house last weekend and I showed him my 360 in HD (yep im a 360 guy not a ps3 guy). He was blown away by the graphics. He payed no attention to my controller. Actually, i disagree. I think the waving the controller around will only confuse people more than regular controllers.

So what if every one dosnt have HD. HD TV prices are going to go down and in 2009 all channels must broadcast in HD by law. So then prices will probably tank and everyone will buy one. Plus, HD is an OPTION, no ones forcing you to buy it. When I got my 360 I wasnt going to hook it up to HD. Then I accidentally found out my tv had HD and so I hooked it up in HD.

The virtual console is a pointless feature. Its just a scam trying to make you buy old games when you can just download an emulator onto your computer for free and download all the games you want for free.

Thats about it for now. Hope my spelling was better this time.

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Nintendo, Sony and MS
Sep 28, 2006 7:56AM PDT

I have a few Nintendo products: SNES, N64 and DSlite and I love all of them (only play the DSlite nowadays though). I think Nintendo was smart to offer something different than the bigboys did since they found out that GC left much to be desired as it tried to go up against PS2 and Xbox and was outsold by both.

The Wii controller will be fun for certain games and difficult for some, I bet. Wii Sports looks basic, but fun and I'm sure the next Mario Party will rock with the Wiimote. FPS games will suffer bc something just feels wrong about trying to shoot things on my TV like it was duckhunt in this day-in-age.

Sony has risked alot with forcing people to shell out extra money to get a BR player, a cheaply made one at that. Everyone knows that the first gen of a new media tech sucks (see first gen DVD and CD players) so I assume there will be alot of performance and hardware issues with the PS3. It will be a good gaming machine if those issues are dealt with or if they do not occur.

360, in my opinion, is the best all-around system. If you don't have a 1080p TV, you can elect to just get the system for alot cheaper than the PS3. 360 games cater to Americans moreso too since there are far more FPS games on the 360 than the other consoles. My fave game franchises are Halo and Splinter Cell...both are MS exclusives now. Also XBL will be better than either of the free services that Sony or Nintendo offer due to the fact that a service you pay for will 99% of the time be better than a similar free service.

PS3 users can have fun paying each developer to play their games online too.

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Sorry, ubisoft sold out splinter cell.
Sep 28, 2006 9:37AM PDT

Yep, ubisof screwed microsoft over when they released double agent for all consoles. It WAS supposed to be a 360 exclusive. Ubisoft can burn in hell for all I care.

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i agree......sort of
Sep 29, 2006 3:16AM PDT

you have it basicly right about the wii but u r wrong about the fps games what could be more realilistic than having the controler be your gun it will be awsome!

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FPS games on the wii.
Sep 29, 2006 4:04AM PDT

FPS shooters have enormous pontential for fun on the wii.
comparing it to duckhunt is unfair.
with duckhunt shot "AT" the tv. it was only a light gun.

with the wii controller you can aim at something while keeping the cursor in the middle of the screen, like a mouse on a PC but more realistic.

not only that, imagine that you run out of bullets or are going in stealth mode, you switch to a knife and use the wii-mote to start making stabbing motions, or creep up behind someone and slit their throat. sounds fun for a game on nintendo, doesn't it!

how about switching to a grenade? and depending on how hard or fast your throwing motion is, the grenade goes further or higher.

throwing knives, a la goldeneye?
punching?
smacking people in the face with the butt of your gun?
pretending to use a shoulder mounted rocket launcher?


I'm sure there's a lot more possibilities that i haven't mentioned.
come on guys, use your imagination!