TVs & Home Theaters forum

Question

Samsung DVD-HR775 - no Timeshift

by ashcroft99 / August 25, 2011 10:36 PM PDT

I only just bought this product. It supports Timeshift (it is emblazoned all over the box and it is in the manual). However, it won't work. I get the "You cannot use this operation or function" icon on the TV screen. I have written to Samsung but, so far, no reply.

It is attached to a satellite decoder and I have already had to change a setting on that box (Widescreen signalling) in order to get the Samsung machine to record at all (without changing that setting, I got a "You cannot record copy protected movie" message).

This seemed a bit obscure to me (although, technically, I wouldn't have a clue) and am wondering if there is some other setting that is equally obscure that is causing Timeshift not to work.

I understand that Timeshift may use EPG and the satellite decoder does provide that.

Also, I heard of another problem where the decoder date/time didn't match the recorder date/time by a substantial amount but that isn't the case.

It may not be related but the "freeze" function on the attached TV (with continuing audio signal, at least) works fine.

Anyone have any ideas?

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All Answers

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Answer
There's your clue.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / August 26, 2011 12:44 AM PDT

"You cannot record copy protected movie"

HDMI, HDCP, that Broadcast Flag and more thwart and stop such features. While I would make a bet it would work on PAL or NTSC (region dependent) signals you find folk that want this to work in HD.
Bob

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Not sure...
by ashcroft99 / August 26, 2011 1:05 AM PDT
In reply to: There's your clue.

So, are you saying that despite my (quite legitimately, it is a standard parameter accessible to all users) disabling Widescreen signalling at the decoder box to get rid of the "You cannot record copy protected movie" message and enable recording generally, there may be some other security feature at the decoder box that is inhibiting Timeshift?

It might explain why, upon opening an account on the satellite company's website forum and asking the same question, they have not only almost immediately deleted that question but also the account that I created.

I don't understand. Didn't Sony win a case over 27 years ago that effectively enabled people to Timeshift record legitimately? Ahhh... but that was America, I'm in Bulgaria. Perhaps I should complain to the EU.

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To be sure.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / August 26, 2011 1:14 AM PDT
In reply to: Not sure...

I make no apology for the industry that is crippling products left and right. As long as HDMI is used, I would never bet the recording or timeshift would work.

It's a shame the makers are not as blunt here.

What does remove the protection from the signals is to use PAL/NTSC or Component connections. Those signals do not have the copy protection or broadcast flag on them.

Even after all this I find folk that don't believe this HDMI/HDCP is the cause. Give them time.
Bob

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HDMI
by ashcroft99 / August 26, 2011 2:28 AM PDT
In reply to: To be sure.

Ok, I really am naive here and having trouble understanding your statements.

The TV and Recorder are HDMI capable. The Receiver may be, I'm sure it is, except it doesn't have HDMI (cable) output capability. It has a Scart connector, YPrPb (?) RGB and DVSC video out capability.

The devices are attached via Scart cables. I am not sure what you mean by PAL/NTSC (I know the terms, just not how you are referring to them here) or Component connections.

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What you need.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / August 26, 2011 3:01 AM PDT
In reply to: HDMI

Is for Samsung and the content provider to "fess up" about restrictions. While I think you know what each term is, let us simplify it as much as possible. We really don't care if it's this or that but if there is any restriction on any content in any way.

You did see that restriction and found a way to record but given you have SCART and we rarely see that in the USA I can't use my experiences on what could be at work on a SCART connection.
Bob

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PAL/NTSC are analog
by Pepe7 / August 26, 2011 4:08 AM PDT
In reply to: HDMI

That's what Bob was getting at. Similarly, a component connection sends along an analog signal which does not contain copyright protection. The burning issue is, on your particular device, when you throttle down from a digital (widescreen) signal with copyright flags to an SD one that may be passed along to another device, does the time shifting feature stay activated(?) There's no law that says they have to actually facilitate this unfortunately ;(.

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Timeshift is a disingenuous feature
by Pepe7 / August 26, 2011 4:05 AM PDT
In reply to: Not sure...

Clearly there are restrictions that they will not discuss on their web forums since it would involve circumvention of copyright protection. Unfortunately, they can be sued for that type of thing hence your account deletion if they are quite draconian about the real time discussion as such.

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Thanks
by ashcroft99 / August 26, 2011 3:40 PM PDT
In reply to: There's your clue.

Anyway, thanks for all your help.

The silly thing is that we can do simultaneous record and play, which is effectively the same thing (i.e. we can start recording and then do playback, etc. while it continues to record). The only difference really is that Timeshift has its own onscreen menu displaying status points of record and play, etc..

In fact, in a sense, simultaneous record and play is better in as much as you can use both DVD and HDD whereas Timeshift is restricted to HDD.

Perhaps one day I will hear from Samsung. Gone are (seem to be) the days where you could get immediate service for a warranted product online.

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You aren't thinking about the money train
by Pepe7 / August 29, 2011 5:09 AM PDT
In reply to: Thanks

Of course it's allowed on the primary unit supplied by the sat provider, and permitted by the content providers. You pay for that. It's when you want to enable something external that lets you save/redistribute the licensed content that you can quickly see why they wouldn't want to help customers facilitate this.

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