RFK Jr rants...

then deny what some/many may take from your statements.

I question what you say/mean

So there is NO ONE at all who is anti-American?

Or are there such people?

And if there are, who are they, hmmmmm?

WHO do YOU think are anti-American?

WHY do YOU think they are anti-American?

WHAT have they done to demonstrate their "anti-Americanism"?

OF course just because you ask questions about anti-American doesn't mean you think there are anti-Americans.

It's called planting a the seed, dropping a hint/innuendo.

See what I mean, jelly-bean?

the organizers and members of the ANSWER rallies, as an example. I'm not planning to name names, but I am saying that not everyone accused of being anti-American is falsely accused, as Josh seems to think.

There is no innuendo or any of that kind of thing here, (not from me at least) regardless of what you are implying.

Anyway, not in the mood for a ride today.

....is that the term "Anti-American" as it's been used should really be split into two separate terms, each of which would describe separate ideas.

The first would be "Anti-America," which would comprise anyone who has a fundamental distaste for this country and its principles no matter who is President. It has nothing to do with political parties or foreign policy decisions; it's a general disapproval for who and what we are. Bin Laden is anti-America. Much of the Arab world is anti-America. In the sixties there were a few extreme fringe elements (and yes, mostly on the Left) who would have fit into this category, even if they later grew out of it.

The second would be "unAmerican," which (IMO) would comprise anyone who thinks they love this country but are willing to chop up the Bill of Rights when they think their personal politics are being threatened. People who would deny First Amendment rights to others simply because they find those people's views offensive or distasteful would fall into this group.

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is as perfect a summation as there is of what America should be about. People who don't get that and would treat others in ways that contradict the spirit of that statement are "unAmerican" IMO. It's easy to stand up for the rights of people who share your views. It's not so easy to defend those same rights when the views are abhorrent to you.

Disapproving of the Bush Administration's foreign policy is no less American than disapproving of the Clinton Administration's foreign policy was.

i would say "you done said it good son!"

as me i say "ditto"


.,

find for me someone (especially someone prominent) who has said someone who disapproves of the Bush policy is anti- or unAmerican.

Make sure it's a case where the "target" is NOT such.

Nowhere near the same thing. And, as I said, sometimes the charge is true. Don't you think if someone is saying that they hope the US loses the war that that is just a wee bit anti-American? Did you read your link?

While Ms. Maines has every right to voice her opinions (but notice she didn't make her spiteful comments here in the U.S.), she has learned that the American people will also embrace the right to voice their loathing of her words by abandoning their support of her band. (Ms. Maines later attempted a pseudo apology for her words, but the damage had been permanently done.)...

HMM. Is that calling anyone anti-American?

Tom Robbins, author of "Jitterbug Perfume" and "Even Cowgirls Get The Blues," said: "Quite probably the worst thing about the inevitable and totally unjustifiable war with Iraq is that there's no chance the United States will lose."

At a recent concert, The Pretenders lead singer Chrissy Hynde said: "Have we gone to war yet? We [expletive] deserve to get bombed. Bring it on!" Later, she added, "I hope the Muslims win!"

QED

I'm not a big Coulter fan, but I think the Dems would do well to look hard at their Party and recognize that to some extent the whackballs HAVE taken over. I think the RFK meltdown is an indicator of that.

...and you got them.

For a few quotes from the less prominent (outside of SE),

CLICK HERE. Granted, an inordinate number are from one person, but still.

that you PROVED MY CASE? Doh!

you did a forum search on "anti-American" but didn't actually read the posts. Doh!

Very, very far from bolstering your case.

BTW, interesting to see posts by Charlie Thunell again. Wonder where he went, anyway....

....you only read the first few and didn't scroll down far enough. I realize and am sensitive to the fact that he is no longer here to defend himself but please read the posts from Dave Evans (who was posting all that hate as a moderator!).

sorry, but you just don't have much of a case.

Those posts from DE make my case quite plainly, despite your assertions to the contrary.

Any number of Mark's posts will support my case as well.

this is such minor league stuff compared with what comes over from the "other (your) side".

This one says that anyone who supported John Kerry was "anti-American" (you have to read the post above it for context):

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6130_102-0.html?forumID=50&threadID=32382&messageID=371985#371985

Here's one in which DK is called anti-American AND a troll simply for posting a link to a news story critical of the war:

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6130_102-0.html?forumID=50&threadID=25558&messageID=287426#287426

Here's one in which John Kerry is called an "anti-American subversive":

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6130_102-0.html?forumID=50&threadID=178283&messageID=1954904#1954904

Another in which a link DK posted is called "anti-American" simply for being critical of the Iraq invasion:

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6130_102-0.html?forumID=50&threadID=111161&messageID=1264728#1264728

Another in which merely supporting John Kerry is called "anti-American":

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6130_102-0.html?forumID=50&threadID=39399&messageID=462270#462270


Want me to keep going?

in each case you are either exaggerating, inaccurate or the "charge" was justified.

Saying someone posted something anti-American is NOT the same as calling them anti-American.

This is your hobbyhorse, Josh. Not at all valid or relevant. Did anyone call for Nuremberg-like trials for those that disagree with them, as one "green" "scientist" did not so long ago? Get some perspective.

I see. This is just too funny. I provide numerous posts in which the poster is flatly called "anti-American" and you still refuse to acknowledge it.

No point continuing this.

for instance,
Let's not shove the anti-Americanism of the anti-American Michael Moorons in their face too hard. They might whine. A LOT!

That is NOT saying that "anyone who supported John Kerry was "anti-American" " It just doesn't say that. And you would be hard pressed to deny that Michael Moore is anti-American. He clearly is.

OR...

Trolling is most definitely a hallmark of the anti-American left these days

It is quite a stretch to claim that DE is calling DK anti-American or even a troll, as you claim. It would be more accurate to point out that DK was trolling (which he may have been) and that DE said trolling was a feature of the anti-American left (which he did.

OR...

There are very few parallels between Iraq and Vietnam ...
except the behavior of the anti-American leftist subversives like Macbeth and Kerry

Evie quite correctly points out that Kerry engaged in anti-American, subversive behavior when he lied in his testimony about Vietnam. Well, DIDN'T he?

OR...

Can you possibly post more anti-American tripe?

A link; a LINK fer crine out loud! is being called anti-American. Accurately I might add.

AND, FINALLY...

<jingle> Anti-American, oh oh, Kerrios. </jingle>

Maybe YOU can translate that into: merely supporting John Kerry is called "anti-American" but really, that is not what it says. Sorry.

So, no, you didn't provide numerous posts in which the poster is flatly called "anti-American" at all.

As you say, Josh, not worth continuing.
.

to you.

I doubt very much there is nearly as much of this kind of rhetoric to be found on the non-Global Warmists "side".

But there's a difference. Who is proposing all kinds of legislation and demanding everyone change their way of life and curtail their freedom? Who is proposing that people who don't agree with them be punished?

The fact that you are so worried about about a bunch of folk forcing laws upon you to curtail your freedom excites me.

Can I get you to sign my petition asking for the repeal of the Patriot Act?

As far as I know none of my freedoms has been curtailed in the least by the Patriot Act despite the hysteria of its opponents.

Why change the subject?

which of your freedoms has been "effected" by the Patriot Act? Which of anybodies?

Enough bogus BS, Grim. Stick to the issue if you can.

I was sticking to the issue when you started up with the personal criticisms...

In reply to: sounds much the same from both sides to me. by grimgraphix

"Of course it does... to you. :
by EdH - 7/11/07 2:05 PM


Then you started discussing your fears of having your freedom curtailed with forced legislation, demands, and being punished because you don't agree with someone. I simply mentioned a bit of legislation that was forced upon us based on claims the sky was falling. I remember those who publicly spoke against it were punished in a variety of was... because they didn't agree with it.

Rhetoric and scare tactics are found on both sides I opined. Yet, you want to pretend that those skeptical of global warming are somehow more reasonable the the greenies. Fine... but don't cry foul about the methodology of legislation being rammed down your throat. If that is what you found most egregious, then anything other legislation forced on the American people in the same manner should be just as offensive to you.

"Bogus BS" Ed? I suppose you would indeed be an expert in recognizing it... since you are the source of so much of it yourself.

Didn't think so.

As for personal attacks, you are the expert. It's what you do.

Bye bye.