Real Deal 70 is up - Digital TV Transition - December 2008 - Forums

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Great attempt to clear the FUD

by punterjoe Aug 7, 2007 10:56PM PDT

I sometimes wonder if the FUD supply for DTV is unlimited. Sadly, most of the DTV transition seems more about marketing & not technology (too much sizzle/not enough steak). I have a set with the legally mandated "digital" tuner. Regrettably, the legal mandate for tuners seems to be merely that a set HAVE one, having nothing to do with any minimum performance requirement. If a car drives by my house, it can push reception over that digital cliff between perfect picture & bluescreen. I've found most "digital" sets to have performance suitable only for ideal signal areas. People outside of cities (or not living near antenna farms) are pretty much abandoned.
BTW - does CNET's review crew have the tools to test things like ATSC reception? SF's terrain seems an ideal area to torture-test receivers.

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Antenna information was a bit misleading

by spiff72 Aug 8, 2007 12:58AM PDT

Hello,

I wanted to chime in and comment that I disagree with your statement that analog broadcasts aren't directional and digital ones are. (A statement was made saying that your antenna needed to point to the transmitter for digital, and for analog this wasn't the case).

This isn't true. The signals are just as directional as they were before. You have always had to orient your antennas toward the transmitters (this is why they have been manufacturing rooftop antenna rotors for years). There are also some area-specific antennas that were created for TV markets that don't have all of the transmitters located in the same area. These special antennas have elements that point in several directions, and can be manipulated so that the element for each channel is independent of the others. This eliminates the need for an antenna rotor when changing stations.

It should also be pointed out VHF channels are still being used for OTA digital broadcasts. There are going to be two channels in my area that have VHF channel assignments (channels 7 and . I haven't heard of plans to move these to UHF channel assignments. One of these is being moved from VHF channel 2 to channel 8.

Thanks!

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Fine points

by acedtect Aug 9, 2007 8:23AM PDT

The first is a fine distinction. My experience with analog broadcasts is that I don't have to move the antenna around if I'm near the signal, however with digital broadcasts I do. SO I think it's fair to say the digital broadcasts are much more directional than analog ones.

However your second point is fine in a different way, in that it's very interesting. Is the VHF channel that's moving broadcasting digitally on VHF? What's the station?

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Direction can depend on distance

by spiff72 Aug 9, 2007 9:31AM PDT

I will agree that if you are very near to the transmitter, the orientation of your antenna isn't as important. Perhaps it is better to say that digital RECEIVERS are better at multipath rejection (eliminating what would have produced "ghosts" in an analog broadcast).

With regard to VHF broadcasting, we have two channels in the Grand Rapids, MI market that broadcast digitally on VHF channels.

They are:
WWMT-DT (CBS), analog channel 3, digital channel 2 (the worst possible channel assignment when it comes to electrical interference). My understanding is that this channel will be moving to VHF channel 8, which will vacant when the analog channel at this location is shut down.

WOOD-DT (NBC), analog channel 8, digital channel 7. I don't believe that this channel is moving after the analog shutoff.

My understanding of the FCC's plans is that the low-band VHF channels (2-6) will be abandoned by television stations, while the high-band VHF channels (7-13) will still be used in some markets for digital transmission.

There are a lot of markets with digital VHF channels -- apparently Las Vegas has FIVE of them! See the following link:
http://www.solidsignal.com/antennas/dmamarkets.asp

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So what does that mean fro antennae

by acedtect Aug 10, 2007 1:01PM PDT

Since almost all the antennae I've seen are UHF. Do they somehow work well with the digital VHF?

Thanks for the details! Interesting stuff.

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VHF antenna is needed sometimes

by spiff72 Aug 11, 2007 5:30AM PDT

VHF channel 2 is the worst, since it is the longest wavelength of all of the TV channels. It requires an antenna element size in excess of 100". Most rabbit ears aren't even close to this.

Some of the higher VHF frequencies might work with a UHF antenna, but it isn't an ideal situation.

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What will Happen to "Broadcast Only Cable"?

by JoeTheProgrammer Oct 26, 2008 6:29AM PDT

Hi - love the podcasts, thank you!

I had a question that I haven't heard covered in all the DTV transition discussions:

I pay $7.80 a month to Comcast for "basic video" which is essentially the broadcast only stations over the cable wire. I had heard that it was mandatory this service be offered to customers, but I don't have anything to back that up.

My question is - after February 2009, will this service still be offered, is it still mandatory? If so, I'm assuming it will be analog? The tricky thing here is that there will be no "analog broadcast" stations, so if they offer it, will Comcast be taking the digital broadcasts, converting them to analog for me, and sending them to my house as if nothing changed?

If anyone knows any info on this, I'd greatly appreciated it!

Cheers

thanks!
Joe

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re: Broadcast Only

by JoeTheProgrammer Dec 7, 2008 9:29AM PST

Bumpetty-Bump. Anyone on the above? Buller?

I'm also wondering if the cable companies will provide a new "broadcast only" that is speficially digital (but not requiring the box rental or anything? A digital version analogous (pun intended) to the $8 analog option I'm using today).

thanks!

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