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Question

Port Triggering and Port Forwarding?

May 6, 2015 5:56PM PDT

Is port triggering and port forwarding required to work together to have a successful connection to any website on the internet I'm not talking about connecting to a game server or a email server I'm just referring in general to all websites I know what port forwarding is people say It's optional and my book make it seem like it's not optional please clear up this confusion So please explain to me In your own words and please no links from google because I already search for weeks using google, explain to me about this in a easy way to understand this more, If you can give me a visual diagram of this like your own illustration or something visual on the web Then I will appreciate that more.

Discussion is locked

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Answer
Re: prt triggering and port forwarding
May 6, 2015 6:07PM PDT

What is "my book" and why are you reading it? And what people did you ask about it?

To just browse the web with your PC/laptop/phone you need neither of the two. So the answer to your question is "no".

Kees

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Still confused
May 6, 2015 6:27PM PDT

I don't get it then a website is obviously a server how come some people need to configure there router sometimes in certain situations with port triggering or with port forwarding to certain servers on the web.Are these servers really that different from the every day common servers people access daily

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Re: configuring
May 6, 2015 6:40PM PDT

I've never needed to configure my router sometimes in certain situations for certain websites. Did you?

Kees

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I see
May 6, 2015 6:57PM PDT

No I haven't touch my router So its only apply to certain websites? I still see no reason why those websites will need to do that if most websites out there doesn't require you to use port forwarding or port triggering why do does people make it harder for themselves when they decide to use the Port Triggering approach and the Port Forwarding approach that's where it throws me off just saying I still see no use for it wouldn't it just be easier if those people have there web sites like the other websites? What do you think there reasons are on why they use them

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Re: websites
May 6, 2015 7:45PM PDT

Well, it was you that said that "some people need to configure there router sometimes in certain situations".
It was only my thought that it was for certain websites, and I might have been wrong.

So please give some examples of what people do it in what situations.

Kees

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Thanks but...
May 7, 2015 10:22AM PDT

I asked my former teacher on the phone today and I'm not sure I'm going to create an argument here or even an angry group disagreeing with him so this is what he said Port triggering and Port Forwarding is a requirement if you plan to connect to a server or a homemade website that is made from scratch with hardly no help from any Internet related companies that does most or all the work for you, So Port Triggering is metaphorically speaking is like going to the door (aka the internet) and knocking to see if one can get in once you get through the door (aka the internet) and out and it keeps going then that situation becomes Port Forwarding so usually your Internet related companies does most or all the work for you so he said In other words he said its either you that does the Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own to connect to some servers or some websites or its either the internet related companies that does most or all the work for you. Now back to me so my theory as of right now is correct me if I'm wrong but I think it all depends on what kind of router you have because I do notice that there is some routers that don't come with Port Triggering but only comes with Port Forwarding and If you're lucky your router comes with both visible options (Port Forwarding and Port Triggering) that the user can manipulate thru the GUI of the router. And I think the only time you have to use Port Triggering and Port Forwarding is if some important internet related company or companies that give you services on certain things don't have any index record of that server or homemade website server or an application on a server that you're trying to connect to then I think that's where It's needed where you have to do that Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own I'm not sure if you guys will agree with my recent theory I'm just trying to make sure I get the right understanding because a lot of sources make it complicated to understand or unclear or rarely even mentioned on google search results so here's the evidence clues to my theory

Router with Port Forwarding and Port Triggering options

http://cdn5.howtogeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/netgear.png

Router with only Port Forwarding

https://wiki.vuze.com/mediawiki/images/e/e4/TypicalPortForwardingSetup.png

Anything internet related on the computer requires ports look at the section, what are some commonly used ports

http://portforward.com/help/portforwarding.htm

The difference between Port Forwarding and Port Triggering

http://www.linksys.com/us/support-article?articleNum=132863

Details I added to make more sense of this in a easier way

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bz628-7_lKPXWDZmeVlZSVg5cFU/edit?pli=1

And if you look at the synonym of the key word triggering in the two word combination term (Port Triggering) you begin to notice that the synonym of triggering is start here's the link

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/triggering?s=t

And the synonym for start is beginning here's the link

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/start

So obviously Port Triggering form the article that I just linked in this replay will start and end half way of the process and Port Forwarding will end the other half of the process and I feel like you need these two to be able to connect to any server or website server and I feel like it would be you only that will have to do this to connect to some web servers that the internet related companies that you rely on most of the time doing your work for you that you paid them to do for you will not be able to do this because they lack the index of that secret server well
I feel like my theory of Port triggering and Port Forwarding is correct please correct me if I'm wrong and be honest with me if you feel like I'm still misunderstanding this ok thank you

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That's not what you lead with.
May 7, 2015 10:26AM PDT

In fact if you have a server it's as simple as putting the server into the DMZ entry or if you wish, put the server IP into the forwarding along with the ports you serve up.

However I still don't see the need for the triggers.
Bob

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Please give an example ...
May 7, 2015 5:46PM PDT

of such an "homemade website that is made from scratch with hardly no help from any Internet related companies that does most or all the work for you", for which I need to do something special in my router to see it.

- How can such a site be visited by people that don't have a router, but just a modem with one PC connected to it? That was a quite usual configuration a few years ago.
- How can such a site be visited wirelessly via 3G or 4G?
- How can such a site be visited from a public hotspot, where I can't do anything in the router?

Kees

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forward & trigger
May 7, 2015 12:38AM PDT

You have router. Suppose you want to do remote admin using it. You choose not to use the default port 8080, but instead want to use maybe 6060, just to discourage someone looking for an easy hack target. So you set that to be the trigger port for the remote admin. You may have your home computer set to WOL or Wake On LAN, and decide to have a particular port set to be triggered.

You want to play an online game, but it requires you to send to a particular port in order for the game between you and the other person to work properly, so you "forward" anything coming in from the game to that "port".

When you send a request to a website you are triggering their port 80 for HTTP content. If using FTP, you'd trigger their port 21.

For instance;

http://www.cnet.com/

is the same as

http://www.cnet.com:80/

but not the same as

http://www.cnet.com:90/

If you tried to use http (hypertext terminal protocol) on port 21, you'd get an message telling you it's a mistake.

http://www.cnet.com:21/

if however you used FTP, (file transport protocol) then you'd get a different reaction.

ftp://cent.com/

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Thanks but..
May 7, 2015 10:23AM PDT

I asked my former teacher on the phone today and I'm not sure I'm going to create an argument here or even an angry group disagreeing with him so this is what he said Port triggering and Port Forwarding is a requirement if you plan to connect to a server or a homemade website that is made from scratch with hardly no help from any Internet related companies that does most or all the work for you, So Port Triggering is metaphorically speaking is like going to the door (aka the internet) and knocking to see if one can get in once you get through the door (aka the internet) and out and it keeps going then that situation becomes Port Forwarding so usually your Internet related companies does most or all the work for you so he said In other words he said its either you that does the Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own to connect to some servers or some websites or its either the internet related companies that does most or all the work for you. Now back to me so my theory as of right now is correct me if I'm wrong but I think it all depends on what kind of router you have because I do notice that there is some routers that don't come with Port Triggering but only comes with Port Forwarding and If you're lucky your router comes with both visible options (Port Forwarding and Port Triggering) that the user can manipulate thru the GUI of the router. And I think the only time you have to use Port Triggering and Port Forwarding is if some important internet related company or companies that give you services on certain things don't have any index record of that server or homemade website server or an application on a server that you're trying to connect to then I think that's where It's needed where you have to do that Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own I'm not sure if you guys will agree with my recent theory I'm just trying to make sure I get the right understanding because a lot of sources make it complicated to understand or unclear or rarely even mentioned on google search results so here's the evidence clues to my theory

Router with Port Forwarding and Port Triggering options

http://cdn5.howtogeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/netgear.png

Router with only Port Forwarding

https://wiki.vuze.com/mediawiki/images/e/e4/TypicalPortForwardingSetup.png

Anything internet related on the computer requires ports look at the section, what are some commonly used ports

http://portforward.com/help/portforwarding.htm

The difference between Port Forwarding and Port Triggering

http://www.linksys.com/us/support-article?articleNum=132863

Details I added to make more sense of this in a easier way

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bz628-7_lKPXWDZmeVlZSVg5cFU/edit?pli=1

And if you look at the synonym of the key word triggering in the two word combination term (Port Triggering) you begin to notice that the synonym of triggering is start here's the link

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/triggering?s=t

And the synonym for start is beginning here's the link

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/start

So obviously Port Triggering form the article that I just linked in this replay will start and end half way of the process and Port Forwarding will end the other half of the process and I feel like you need these two to be able to connect to any server or website server and I feel like it would be you only that will have to do this to connect to some web servers that the internet related companies that you rely on most of the time doing your work for you that you paid them to do for you will not be able to do this because they lack the index of that secret server well
I feel like my theory of Port triggering and Port Forwarding is correct please correct me if I'm wrong and be honest with me if you feel like I'm still misunderstanding this ok thank you

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let me simplify
May 7, 2015 12:21PM PDT
"I asked my former teacher on the phone today and I'm not sure I'm going to create an argument here or even an angry group disagreeing with him so this is what he said Port triggering and Port Forwarding is a requirement if you plan to connect to a server or a homemade website that is made from scratch with hardly no help from any Internet related companies that does most or all the work for you,"

This refers to accessing a home computer across the internet, which is usually done with a VPN setup for security. To make that access easier, you choose a port to trigger it's password response, which when given the correct name and password allows entry.


"So Port Triggering is metaphorically speaking is like going to the door (aka the internet) and knocking to see if one can get in once you get through the door (aka the internet) and out and it keeps going..."

Yes, typically connecting to the trigger port you assigned to your router for remote administration and contact.


"then that situation becomes Port Forwarding "

yes, the router (server) after access and proper entry then forwards you to the resource you have set for it. Usually there are limits set, such as protocols allowed and may face another user/password challenge from that inside resource. Some will just set for a DMZ to the inside resource, if desired.


"so usually your Internet related companies does most or all the work for you "

There are softwares one can use which simplify the process. Your teacher may be referring to online resources which are supplied by an ISP such as ftp accounts, drop boxes, etc, but that's confusing the issue if YOU are supposed to be the one setting up the triggering and forwarding.

"so he said In other words he said its either you that does the Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own to connect to some servers or some websites or its either the internet related companies that does most or all the work for you. "

"Now back to me so my theory as of right now is correct me if I'm wrong but I think it all depends on what kind of router you have because I do notice that there is some routers that don't come with Port Triggering but only comes with Port Forwarding and If you're lucky your router comes with both visible options (Port Forwarding and Port Triggering) that the user can manipulate thru the GUI of the router. "

If the router has Remote Administration, then it may not call it "triggering" but that's what it's doing.


"And I think the only time you have to use Port Triggering and Port Forwarding is if some important internet related company or companies that give you services on certain things don't have any index record of that server or homemade website server or an application on a server that you're trying to connect to then I think that's where It's needed where you have to do that Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own "

You are confusing some issues. Please read about DNS servers and Dynamic DNS servers. In short, servers with static IP addresses typically have domain names associated with them too and this is stored in DNS servers by all ISP, but your home IP connnection is more often dynamic, which means it can change from time to time and you may not have a domain name, which means you must connect to it directly through IP address, which isn't a domain name but a series of numbers, such as the one you use to connect to your router internally 192.168.1.1 How then to know this number? Typically one subscribes to a Dynamic DNS server and on a daily or more regular basis the router or a computer connected to the ISP's modem will send that IP info and it can also be received when away from your home in email message. This allows you to know the current IP address at your home, so you can contact the home system.

So;
1) you want to be able to contact your home router or computer
2) you need to know it's IP address, which can be sent in an email
3) If you also have a domain name, then you can use Dynamic DNS which will track the IP changes and allow access to home system by domain name, at this point a couple different routes can be taken, depending on how it's setup.
4) You want to access secured data, but not on an open port 80, so router assigns a different port, like 4444 for ftp, http, or https connection. It forwards you to that port on a particular resource at your home LAN.
5) If direct to computer, no router behind the modem, You'd contact that port using browser but set to the port. Say your home IP was 200.100.50.1 then the browser URL would be 200.100.50.1:4444
6) You will have some shared folder which will require a password prompt for access
7) Hopefully used a VPN for doing this, but even if not, you have access now to the resource.

That's just a very brief description of the process and there's not just one way of accessing the resources you want, it's however you set it up for yourself.
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Wait i'm getting it more and more now
May 9, 2015 10:04AM PDT

So I have few more questions then

So obviously I think i just misunderstood my former teacher so Port Forwarding and Port Triggering is only design for private net works aka private servers like private Ip addresses?

and I know this is going to sound illogical but I want to be sure of this so Port Forwarding and Port Triggering isn't design for public servers like public websites and public Ip address huh?

and if it isn't design for public servers like public websites and public Ip addresses is it possible to use Port Forwarding and Port Triggering to public servers like public websites and public Ip addresses I already know that there's a big chance i know what your going to say but then again I want to make sure

And one last question so Port Forwarding and Port Triggering really do have to work together from your computer to get to the other persons server right? So its a requirement for Port Forwarding and Port Triggering To combine forces to get through to the server completely right?

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One thing is not the other.
May 9, 2015 10:29AM PDT

While I did use the forward to get traffic to the server, the trigger was not used.

I guess you need to think it through and reveal what you are trying to do.
Bob

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did you read the first paragraph in this?
May 9, 2015 11:16AM PDT
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_%28computer_networking%29ports
are for internet use. If you were sitting at home and removed the
TCP/IP and removed the client software, connected to no internet, you
wouldn't need them at all. Certain ports are reserved for specific
uses. That was the other article you may have missed which I linked.
For ins tance port 80 is for http connections and port 443 for https
connections. Invariably, when you visit a website you will access it
first by one of those two ports. You send a request for a
webpage from a site. It goes to your ISP server first, which looks up
the route by DNS, and then sends it along that route. When it arrives
there the site knows to send you back the webpage along the same router
and when it arrives, your computer or router knows which port it's
supposed to be expected on. If it comes on some other port, no
communication since that would be an insecurity, the only port open to
receive it is the one it should arrive at. That's just simple request for a page on the server's open port 80 or 443.


I answered just to what you asked.

"he said Port triggering and Port Forwarding is a requirement if you plan to connect to a server or a homemade website that is made from scratch with hardly no help from any Internet related companies"

That doesn't mean it ONLY applies to that.

"So obviously I think i just misunderstood my former teacher so Port Forwarding and Port Triggering is only design for private net works aka private servers like private Ip addresses?"

Not sure what you mean here, but if by "private" you mean "secured" then that might apply. If you mean it's only for servers that aren't also websites, no, that is wrong. All servers or routers can do port triggering and forwarding whether private or public. The only difference is if they expose some part to the internet or not.

"I know this is going to sound illogical but I want to be sure of this so Port Forwarding and Port Triggering isn't design for public servers like public websites and public Ip address huh?"

Yep, illogical. They are all servers, they work the same, the distinctions is on the type of sofware they are running and if they are also connected and provide internet services such as webpages, file storage, bloggging accounts, etc.

"
and if it isn't design for public servers like public websites and public Ip addresses is it possible to use Port Forwarding and Port Triggering to public servers like public websites and public Ip addresses I already know that there's a big chance i know what your going to say but then again I want to make sure"


Any server, public or private, can and usually does do some amount of port triggering and forwarding, even if the user didn't set it up himself. For instance a router which is a server of sorts does both for users behind it on the LAN.

"And one last question so Port Forwarding and Port Triggering really do have to work together from your computer to get to the other persons server right? So its a requirement for Port Forwarding and Port Triggering To combine forces to get through to the server completely right?"

To access resources outside your own computer by contacting another computer using TCP/IP networking, pretty much port trigger and forwarding is going on.

It's not always necessary to use port triggering and forwarding, nor even the internet, nor TCP/IP. Remember dialup networking? Your friend had some pictures he wanted you to access or other files. So you dialed up his home number after he set his computer to answer the phone. Bot would be set to something like zmodem, a DOS based program. You got his password challenge, answered it, and had access to a folder he'd put the files in. You copied them to your computer, then sent a terminate service message, which when he saw it knew he could drop the connection and turn off having his computer answer the phone next time. All done without TCP/IP, or port triggering or forwarding. Windows users often used Hyperterminal to do this, something I think is dropped from latest windows computers?

If you want to have some fun, go to this page and search for the word "port". You won't find "forward" on it, and one instance of "trigger". Reading it would be of interest too. In fact, when combined with encryption of the data before sending, it remains one of the most secure methods of communication between two people today, other than both endpoint users being known, but I'd bet in today's world if the govt was tapping someone's phone lines they'd have to drag some dinosaur who remembered using from a backroom to deal with it, but maybe not, it might still be popular among some users who want to avoid internet surveillance. In fact, most dialup modems came with software for both data and fax transmissions across phone lines.
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corrected link
May 10, 2015 12:00AM PDT
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more fun
May 10, 2015 12:15AM PDT

Here's the epitome of port forwarding and every router with NAT does it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_address_translation

the router acts as a server, it receives the information back from a website which was requested by a user on the LAN, but the website sees the router IP address only, not the internal LAN IP address of the user. The router then forwards the requested information to the internal IP address for the user who requested it.

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Thanks man but i wouldnt be on here if wiki didnt make sense
May 10, 2015 6:42PM PDT
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No.
May 10, 2015 7:50PM PDT

It's the other way around: port triggering is an extension of port forwarding. It's dynamic (run-time) in stead of static (configure-time).

Kees

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same much as I told you above
May 11, 2015 4:50AM PDT

incoming requests trigger a server or router to forward your request to some resource behind it. It acts sort of like a firewall, allowing certain ports open, certain ones closed.So, a server can be set so that if a particular port gets a request, that triggers it to forward the request to the resource.

If you turn on a light switch, you trigger it to turn on the light, since the electricity is then forwarded to it.

Is English not your first language? If not, then a trigger is most often associated with a gun. Pull the trigger, forward a bullet.

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To James. About trigger.
May 11, 2015 6:22AM PDT

In this specific case, the trigger comes from the LAN to tell the router about the expected answer to forward, not from the WAN. The links are quite clear about that.

Kees

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Me too about the configuring.
May 6, 2015 11:18PM PDT

My last 4 routers worked fine without setting up any port triggers or forwarding. Kees is spot on. To continue you need to answer what he asked.
Bob

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Thanks but..
May 7, 2015 10:21AM PDT

I asked my former teacher on the phone today and I'm not sure I'm going to create an argument here or even an angry group disagreeing with him so this is what he said Port triggering and Port Forwarding is a requirement if you plan to connect to a server or a homemade website that is made from scratch with hardly no help from any Internet related companies that does most or all the work for you, So Port Triggering is metaphorically speaking is like going to the door (aka the internet) and knocking to see if one can get in once you get through the door (aka the internet) and out and it keeps going then that situation becomes Port Forwarding so usually your Internet related companies does most or all the work for you so he said In other words he said its either you that does the Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own to connect to some servers or some websites or its either the internet related companies that does most or all the work for you. Now back to me so my theory as of right now is correct me if I'm wrong but I think it all depends on what kind of router you have because I do notice that there is some routers that don't come with Port Triggering but only comes with Port Forwarding and If you're lucky your router comes with both visible options (Port Forwarding and Port Triggering) that the user can manipulate thru the GUI of the router. And I think the only time you have to use Port Triggering and Port Forwarding is if some important internet related company or companies that give you services on certain things don't have any index record of that server or homemade website server or an application on a server that you're trying to connect to then I think that's where It's needed where you have to do that Port triggering and Port Forwarding on your own I'm not sure if you guys will agree with my recent theory I'm just trying to make sure I get the right understanding because a lot of sources make it complicated to understand or unclear or rarely even mentioned on google search results so here's the evidence clues to my theory

Router with Port Forwarding and Port Triggering options

http://cdn5.howtogeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/netgear.png

Router with only Port Forwarding

https://wiki.vuze.com/mediawiki/images/e/e4/TypicalPortForwardingSetup.png

Anything internet related on the computer requires ports look at the section, what are some commonly used ports

http://portforward.com/help/portforwarding.htm

The difference between Port Forwarding and Port Triggering

http://www.linksys.com/us/support-article?articleNum=132863

Details I added to make more sense of this in a easier way

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bz628-7_lKPXWDZmeVlZSVg5cFU/edit?pli=1

And if you look at the synonym of the key word triggering in the two word combination term (Port Triggering) you begin to notice that the synonym of triggering is start here's the link

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/triggering?s=t

And the synonym for start is beginning here's the link

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/start

So obviously Port Triggering form the article that I just linked in this replay will start and end half way of the process and Port Forwarding will end the other half of the process and I feel like you need these two to be able to connect to any server or website server and I feel like it would be you only that will have to do this to connect to some web servers that the internet related companies that you rely on most of the time doing your work for you that you paid them to do for you will not be able to do this because they lack the index of that secret server well
I feel like my theory of Port triggering and Port Forwarding is correct please correct me if I'm wrong and be honest with me if you feel like I'm still misunderstanding this ok thank you

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Duplicate posting?
May 7, 2015 10:26AM PDT

Why?

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...
May 7, 2015 10:29AM PDT

So was my teacher right

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There is no one right solution.
May 7, 2015 10:32AM PDT

I can solve the server issue with the DMZ or port forwarding. I prefer the port forwarding (still wonder why the triggers.) But as you can imagine some folk are new to networking and need an instant simple fix till our tech can get on scene.
Bob

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I think he's talking about
May 7, 2015 12:24PM PDT

Remote Administration and using VPN tunneling to access resources on a home computer or server.

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this part is simple
May 7, 2015 12:43PM PDT

port forwarding and port triggering is ONLY done (the settings made) on computers running server software, or a router, which router in truth is also a type of limited server. If you are contacting computers over which you don't have administrator control, then the only thing you need be concerned with is the port you are supposed to contact it on and the protocol used for that port. Web browsers connect to web servers on port 80 for http access.

Here are the common port numbers used

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_%28computer_networking%29

Here's a comprehensive list of port numbers

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_TCP_and_UDP_port_numbers

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Everybody here is confused.
May 12, 2015 9:56PM PDT

Somehow, the server entered into the question. But I'm rather sure the OP didn't mean a server.
Better forget about the whole discussion, until you need to trigger a port yourself. Probably, that's never.

Kees

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ROFL!
May 14, 2015 7:26AM PDT

"garbage in, garbage out", let's go smack his teacher.... Wink Devil

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Answer
Next time, tell what setup you need.
May 7, 2015 12:18PM PDT

Later in this thread you wrote about a web server behind your router. It's a shame your top post didn't ask how to do that.