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General discussion

Poll: When did you switch over to a Mac?

Aug 15, 2008 5:58AM PDT

When did you switch over to a Mac?

-- I just switched recently. (How is it working out for you? Any regrets?)
-- 6 months ago (How is it working out for you?)
-- 12 months ago (How is it working out for you?)
-- 1-2 years ago (How is it working out for you?)
-- 2-5 years ago (How is it working out for you?)
-- 6-10 years ago (How is it working out for you?)
-- My first computer was an Apple and I'm still an Apple user. (What was your first Apple computer?)
-- Still contemplating on switching to a Mac. (What's holding you back?)
-- I will never switch to a Mac. (Please tell us why.)

Discussion is locked

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I switched and will not go back!
Aug 17, 2008 12:45PM PDT

I have been an IT consultant for over 20 years and cut my teeth on MS DOS. I was an expert on DOS, OS/2 Windows, and NT and have the certifications to prove it. I have always been a Microsoft Premier Partner and worked closely with them. I have been to all the early adopter kool-aid sessions in Redmond and drank liberally from the Microsoft pitcher. I was a PC fanatic and like many of the posts you will read the PC vs Mac issue was a religious one for me. I was one of those Mac haters who thought that they were used by the really nerdy folks mostly for playing games and programming in Basic (after all the Apple IIe did little more than that. In the late 80s I took a look at what I think then was the Mac IIx, a big white box with a nice color monitor but still not ready for business computing (but it did have one heck of a game called Crystal Quest). Finally Windows XP and all the problems I have had, combined with the miserable Vista update, prompted me to take another look at the Mac platform. My daughter needed a laptop and she wanted a Mac so we bought a Macbook. She loves it. About 3 months later I picked up a Mac Mini off of eBay and have never looked back. I have no less than 15 windows boxes in the house and all but one are piled in a corner for the next round of donations. The one that is actually up and running is doing nothing more than network storage.

Yes indeed, PCs are half the price of a Mac but the Mac works, does not have to be re-booted once a day, and even on eBay these things hold their value! And the biggest plus is that these ARE ready for center stage in a business environment!!!

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i won't b/c
Aug 17, 2008 12:54PM PDT

They are overpriced for the power. The ratio is about 4:1.

I can build a linux multimedia powerhouse for a fraction (1/4) the cost of a mac. There will be more power and more windows compatibility.

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I'm going to add more info to this thread
Aug 17, 2008 2:17PM PDT

I would like to point out some things:

First off: Macs are not that much expensive when compared to comparable PCs. Just because Macs are more expensive than some PCs does not mean that they are "worse". Granted, Macs may be more expensive in some cases, but with AppleCare, you get what you paid for: a good machine with quality service for 3 years. If you are on a budget, and you only need a certain amount of computing performance, then go with a low-end PC with Vista Home Premium. But if you want a good machine that will last for several years, and you want an easy-to-use GUI, go to your nearest Apple Store and look at the Macs.

Second: Macs are known for their longevity. I use an iMac G4, nearing 6 years of age, and it runs Leopard, the latest version of Apple's operating system. Can your 6-year-old PC run Vista Ultimate? Most likely not. There are many, many Macs out there that are quite old, but still work for everyday use. I've seen reports of people using PowerBook G3s for their main laptops. The PowerBook G3s where sold from the late nineties through the year 2000. 8 year old Macs (or older) that run Tiger are still in use. That's quite a feat. Plus, the G3 PowerBooks supported two batteries, and the CPU could be swapped for a faster G4. Those were very upgradeable and capable machines. If you considered switching to a Mac, take this into consideration. A new Intel Mac should last well over the 3 year warranty provided by AppleCare. These new machines won't be obsolete for awhile.

Third: expandability. Unless you get a Mac Pro, then no, you won't have a lot of choices for upgrades and expansions should you buy a Mac. This isn't a bad thing though. You can go in and change out the RAM on most Macs with no problem, and you can easily replace a hard drive on the consumer MacBooks. Most Macs are not expandable, but they were not meant to be. The whole point is to plug it in, turn it on, and use it. And for most people, this is fine. Unless you use your computer for gaming, this isn't really a problem.

Fourth: compatibility. Macs are compatible with almost everything. You can run Boot Camp or virtual machines to use multiple operating systems, and many native OS X programs work well with Windows. Macs have fewer compatibility issues today partly because of Apple's switch to Intel processors. Working across multiple platforms isn't as much of a hassle as it used to be. Apple has MobileMe, and Microsoft has Exchange. Using one of these services can bridge everything together even more.

Macs are fantastic computers. Whether you are working on media projects or regular work tasks, OS X shines. But Windows is still a good operating system. Vista may not be perfect, but I have used it for a little while now, and it works well enough, so long as your hardware is current and powerful enough. I actually think Microsoft made some good improvements over XP with Vista. Some of the changes in the system mimic certain features that OS X has had. It's good to see that Microsoft is working on its own versions of these things. I approve of Vista, but it's just not the same as OS X. Vista is an acquired taste at best, but that's just for me. I am a longtime Windows user and more recently, a Mac user; opinions will vary. Just be sure that you don't go around bashing the other system. You don't have to like either one, but you should at least keep an open mind.

-BMF

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iMac 6 months new user and still learning
Aug 18, 2008 12:50AM PDT

I have been using PC's since the 80's. I decided to venture into the Apple world and have been very satisfied with my decision. Really the only item I disliked about the daily use of the PC's is the antivirus software the I had to use to protect it. They are resource hogs! I could not decide between the imac 2.4 with 24" screen and the MacBook, so I bought both. I ended up liking the imac more for my use. Some items come to my attention:
1) I really like the power and ease of use of Windows Explorer and it has taken an effort to get use to Finder.
2) I used the Adobe Photoshop with Windows, very ease to use, while iPhoto is included with OS X which is a plus. I have a hardtime with having events and duplicating the photos in my photos folder. There may be a better way and may not be neccessary to have duplicates, but have not found it yet.
3) Outlook is very powerful, easy to use, and backup, still getting use to Apple mail but I like it.
4) Windows Explorer is fine; I found Safari a better browser for my use. I really like using the bookmarks and tabs.
5) There are some older PC programs I still like to use, so I purchased VMWare. VMWare really works well, no problems at all, even using one MSDOS finacial (MYM) program written in the 80's.
6) MobileME seems to a very useful tool and I use it often between my iMac, iPhone, and PC at work to sync my data and store and retrieve files.
7) Task Manager for Windows and Activity Manager for OS x are both excellent, use them often to monitor.
Cool I could go on, but I will stop here.

To sum all, I am really happy with the iMac, the OS X operating system, VMWare, and the OS X bundled programs. I have just purchased an iPhone, it is the best!

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a couple of applications I'd recommend
Aug 18, 2008 3:38AM PDT

You might try Pathfinder which gives an alternative to Finder (there are several other applications as well; which you like best will depend on your taste and needs).

The one program I definitely liked better than Mail was Entourage (from Microsoft Office); but last year, I updated without first reading the READ-ME and it wiped out all my data, which I was never able to get back (this was before I had TIME MACHINE. That was such a major setback that I gave up on Entourage.

For photos, a very useful application is GraphicConverter; I've been using it for a long time and have always found it well worth the price (reasonable). I suspect it will also ressemble more what you are used to on your PC.

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iphoto
Aug 18, 2008 9:59AM PDT

2) I used the Adobe Photoshop with Windows, very ease to use, while iPhoto is included with OS X which is a plus. I have a hardtime with having events and duplicating the photos in my photos folder. There may be a better way and may not be neccessary to have duplicates, but have not found it yet.

There is no duplication of photos in iPhoto unless you create them yourself.
The Library (top level) contains two items. Events and Photo's. Your collection of photo's are arranged by event, either date, place, title, GPS, just about any way you want.
Your Photo's are all the photos that are in the library. They appear in Events because Events is a kind of super Album. The photo's in each of them are not duplicates of each other, just the one photo being made available in different places.

P

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Graphic Converter
Aug 18, 2008 4:58PM PDT

An application I've always found useful in Graphic Converter. You might take a look.

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I already have Graphic Converter
Aug 18, 2008 9:51PM PDT

but it does not address the question that I answered.

I will agree however, that it is a handy utility to have

P

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Bullish
Aug 18, 2008 1:10AM PDT

I teach at a graphic arts / design college and we are very bullish on Mac.

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Never Switched
Aug 18, 2008 3:35AM PDT

I purchased my first MAC in 1985--a MAC 512 with two 800K drives. I was completing a doctorate and needed a machine that I could plug in and and immediately use. The MAC did not necessitate a course or workshop in order to navigate it and get writing. In '85, Microsoft Word 1.0 had just come out and I began the dissertation drafts on that. Since then, I have done three books--all on MAC; my wife has done seven novels--all on MAC. At one time, I was the lone MAC user in our music department, crunching words in WORD and notes in Professional Composer and since '85 have been joined by at least a dozen more who find the Windows environment cumbersome and unfriendly. The MAC is more stable, has the necessary software available, and is reliable. In over 20 years of MAC use, I have experienced trouble only twice: a lightning strike that zapped some stuff and one power supply that failed. Certainly a great machine!

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Mac just works
Aug 18, 2008 6:19AM PDT

For me, Mac just works. I'm a college student and use both a MacBook and iMac on a daily basis. Why did I switch to a Mac? Because my PC (HP brand, bought in March of 2007) crashed twice in three months for no reason what-so-ever. Tried calling technical support- BAD idea. They can't help you.
In college, I open and create Word documents daily. I have no compatibility issues with saving my documents for PC readers to see. I actually have an advantage over my PC classmates- I can open files my teacher incorrectly saves on Vista that my classmates cannot. They all come to me for answers.
I have had no issues with either of my computers, and absolutely love them. They work great with several running applications, they are clean and fast, and everything is so easy to do. The iMac with an all-in-one system is great. It's power packed by only one cord and takes up very little space.
Sure, it takes a little bit of getting used to the Mac OS. But, once you see how it's done it's so easy and intuitive you will wonder why PC's do it differently. One thing I really enjoyed about my computer was that when I took it out of the box and turned it on- it's ready to go. You don't have all the free trial software on your computer that you have to uninstall, or any of that junk. It's just clean and happy.
My sister was a person stuck on a PC. After using my computer a few times, she recently purchased an iMac. She was a little frustrated at first- several things are different (such as how you copy and paste, etc.) but after a few days she loves her Mac and is never going back.
I'm not saying PC's are bad, I just greatly prefer a Mac any day.
I recommend visiting a Mac store (not a Best Buy or other places that carry Mac's, the staff most likely will not know how to help you as well as people in Mac stores). They have all of their computers up for you to try, and tons of friendly and knowledgeable people ready to answer your questions and walk you through the process.
If you are looking for hundreds of software programs - especially games - get a PC.
Otherwise, a Mac is a great computer, and the support is awesome. I've never had a major problem to deal with them, but I visit the guys at the Genius Bar in the Mac store with little questions, and they always point me in the right direction.
Making the switch is not as hard as it may seem - and if you are open to a Mac, you will not regret it in the future.

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2-5 years ago (I love it)
Aug 18, 2008 4:50PM PDT

Started out on Panther and now working on Tiger.

I love the work flow of a mac. I don't have to worry about folders and files losing a path. I don't spend hours on security issues. I don't have to worry about lost dlls, corrupted files, etc. etc.

I do miss some programs that don't have mac versions so I keep a windows tower around just in case.

I do resent apple refusing to put out a user upgradable tower version of the iMac.

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Mac Switch
Aug 19, 2008 7:01AM PDT

The first computer ever to walk into the front door of my house was an Apple not a Mac and it was before the pull down window option ever existed. My son was about in 7th grade at the U of C Lab Schools and the school had just gotten some Apple computers. He is now 42 years old and we are all still die hard Apple/Mac fans.

PC, NEVER!

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My first computer was an Apple
Aug 20, 2008 12:38AM PDT

My first computer was an Apple and I'm still an Apple user. My first Apple computer was one of the first Powerbooks. The people who said they will never switch to a Mac need to be more open if they have never tried one. All Windows (including Vista) is just a very poor copy of Apple's software. But also PCs are more expensive. The PC equivalents of my $1400 iMac cost between $2000 and $2700.

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Because you didn't ask...
Aug 20, 2008 2:51AM PDT

I started with a Mac (liked it--loved Pagemaker.)

Used Macs and PCs at work.

Now use only PCs - love them AND Vista!

I doubt I will ever switch back to Apple/Macs.

Morisot

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Switched over 2 years ago.
Aug 20, 2008 5:53PM PDT

I'm a PC user, still have an Acer Aspire running Windows XP. It's my office laptop. I bought a Macbook a couple of years ago for personal use. Works fantastic. No blue screens like on my current Acer of the same age. Windows is probably telling me to re-format the thing to fix the thigs that cause the problems i guess. But that's the hassle right there. For normal everyday stuff like surfing, emails and Office functions, how can you go wrong with the Mac? It's not that expensive either, contrary to what some people say. Compare it to a top of the line brand like Toshiba or Lenovo or maybe even HP and Compaq and you will see that the Macbook is quite affordable given the security, ease of use and worry free everything, for me it's hard to beat.

On my office PC laptop, i always update my anti-virus and then scan at least once a week and check my anti-spy to FEEL safe. Then there's the slowdowns and hangs that will eventually make you restart the freaking thing, not to mention defragmenting the ****** to keep it running or rather walking consistently. That's such a chore! Nothing like that on a Mac.

Actually, you don't even need to shut down or restart the Mac. My Macbook has only been shut down maybe twice this year. Twice this year. Can't think of doing that on a PC 'coz every now and then it slows down or something that you need to at least restart it. Pain in the a$$. Really. Comparing it to a worry free Mac. I even leave the Macbook running weeks on end downloading P2P stuff (pardon me), without ever shutting down or restarting. No errors, nothing. You can even do several things in the background and it's still fine. No glitch. Pretty darn good.

For more complex PC type of requirement, OBVIOUSLY you need a PC..... then again, you can run Windows on an Intel Mac and you'd have any Windows OS running better than it would on a PC. That's what you call having the best of both worlds. If you have to do PC-only programs then push a button and you switch to Windows XP or Vista just like that. After the PC-only application and you would want to switch to a more secure environment and just surf and chat, or download stuff, push a button and in seconds you are back on a Mac OS X environment. How easy is that? Very. That's my opinion, ok? I'm a person who uses both a PC and a Mac and i really believe that for regular stuff that i mentioned above that the Mac wins by a mile.

When the new Macbooks come out, we're ditching the office Acers and will upgrade to a Mac, buy MS Office for the Mac, install it and work in peace. At the end of the day we want something very reliable, dependable, worry free, hang-free and virus free. A PC can't give me that....a Mac can.

Peace out!

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hype
Aug 20, 2008 9:37PM PDT

Never owned a mac and never plan on doing so.

The first computers that I used were macs, but that was so long ago. I grew up on PC's and just became accustomed to it.

My girlfriend has a MacBook, which I use from time to time, and I honestly can't see myself owning one. It gives me so many headaches just from daily use. The one biggest peeve of mine about macs are their keyboards. I seriously dislike the individual spaced out keys because I always seem to hit between the keys and miss the stroke.

I have to give credit to macs for their awesome media software though. I find that I can do a lot of things with a PC just as easily though with enough effort; so I still wouldn't bother with a mac.

I currently own a thinkpad and absolutely love it btw. I especially love the keyboard.

Call me a hater, but I think macbooks and most Apple products are over-hyped with a pretty exterior. Apple products are pretty pricey for what they offer. Just my opinion though.

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The more powerful MacBook Pros
Aug 21, 2008 7:41AM PDT

have a different keyboard than the standard, consumer MacBooks. They are what some think to be high-quality keyboards. Personally, I think its okay, but not too great. I like the space out keys on the other Apple keyboards. Easy to type on. Macs are not over-hyped. If you make real comparisons to similar Windows counterparts, you will find that Macs are competitively priced. Apple products last longer than many PCs.

Apple offers quite a lot in my opinion. Great compatibility, good hardware, and long term value. And, OS X is easy to use. You say that you can do similar things on a PC with enough effort. Effort is the key word there. With OS X, you don't need effort. With a Mac, you can actually use and enjoy the computer, where Windows does not necessarily provide the same experience. Just my take.

-BMF

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I don't view you as a "hater"
Aug 22, 2008 1:40AM PDT

At least you have valid, personal reasons for your preference. The "haters" are the ones who just go to mac forums to slam macs because they don't like the adverts or the fanboys or a dozen other superficial reasons.

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Never never never.
Aug 21, 2008 10:33AM PDT

Why would I want to buy a toaster from a company that specifies what color my toaster would be, what kind of bread I had to buy, how dark I could toast it, what kind of spread I had to put on it, and whether I had to eat the crust? And then The company also tells me that the appearance of the toaster was more important than how the toaster worked. Then the company tells me I had to pay more than $200 for the two-slice toaster? That is the business model that Apple offers with its products. I am supposedto feel the pleasure for that?

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Going with the "toaster" comparison...
Aug 22, 2008 1:47AM PDT

... Why are you so concerned about what the toaster looks like ? Isn't it more important for the toaster to make toast you like ? Apple owners - for the most part - like the "toast" our computers make. If I were you, I would just be thankful you have a choice of "toaster" making companies to choose from.

Wink

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"toaster" comparison...
Aug 22, 2008 2:29AM PDT

All toasters make toast, what it looks like is part of it. I don't want a white toaster, the second is price, if you're choosing between the a $25 and $75 that's a factor too.

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I don't really care what the toaster looks like.
Aug 22, 2008 10:38PM PDT

I want it to toast, to be relatively easier to use, and to be a reasonable price. I want to be allowed to have a GE as a refrigerator, a Black and Decker for my toaster, and a Mr. Coffee for a coffee pot. I don't want to have to have all the same brand appliances, and I want to be able to choose the price I am going to pay. Who sets the price for Apple products? Is there a reasonable degree of competition? Oops - ask Franklin Computers.

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toaster
Aug 23, 2008 4:33AM PDT

Which does leave me firmly in the clutches of Microsoft or Linux, if I want to be able to use any kind of toaster I want.

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Please remember one thing...
Aug 25, 2008 1:42AM PDT

Microsoft does not make computers, nor does Linux... so when you talk about the large variety available for your PC using pleasure... you are actually talking about thousands of vendors putting out good (and some not so good) products for your computing needs.

Apple may not have the variety or the lowest prices, but that is because they make the whole product from the hardware to the OS to much of the software. The product they produce seems to fit the needs of many people and those ranks are growing as people become dissatisfied with the hardware versus software conflicts that comes from so many vendors putting out products that don't always work together well.

The whole point is that you seem to want variety and low prices. I want headache free, ease of use. Apple has done this for me, more than almost any PC I have ever owned... except for a 10 year old Compaq Presario running windows 98se which still runs great. I'm running over 4 years now, with a iBook G4 and have had nothing more than a hard drive failure (they do wear out when the see 3 to 5 hours of use a day). I have never had the OS crash. In the same time, I have had 2 windows machines that have monthly issues and have nickel and dimed with expense after expense (hardware, software, security programs, annual updates to virus libraries) to the point where I could have bought a new mac.

Macs are not perfect by any means. Apple needs to put out a mid priced tower comparable to the iMac, but other than this, their products have fit my needs, despite their slightly higher prices.

BTW... I am not an iPod user. iPods are a completely different part of apple as far as I am concerned. I have no need to listen to music everywhere I go and I don't need to be part of the fashion statement that an iPod makes. I do have a 2 gig Sansa, which I use in my car radio's AUX connection, since it is much more convenient than a stack of CD's. It could be a bit easier to use with iTunes, but I get by anyway.

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I can understand all you say without agreeing. . .
Aug 25, 2008 4:39AM PDT

or they would not have to overcharge for their software. Apple can overcharge on both, and since the company does not (by its own business model of monopoly by legal action) have to worry about competition, they don't have to worry about their product. The difficulties of MS and Linux to deal with other hardware is a feature Apple doesn't have to worry about. Not because they offer better software, necessarily, but they don't have to deal with other companies.

I am not an iPod user either, but my daughter has found that her 2005 Ford will play MP3 discs, so she doesn't have to worry about her CDs or her player interfacing with the car's CD player.

I have had hard drives fail also, but not until they have hit 2 - 3 years of 24 hours a day use. Had I paid $2500 for my laptop had had the drive crash after a few years of a few hours a day, I would consider long and hard before I bought something else from that maker. I have had many cars, but bought a single Jeep that required a new motor after 55,000 miles. Be assured I will not buy another Jeep.

I would like to comment on the very polished writing you sent - not too many of these discussions use language well, and so many of the post one reads are just attacking the author! Nice job!

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(NT) Thanks and same back at ya... :-)
Aug 26, 2008 3:53AM PDT
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Monopoly, eh?
Aug 26, 2008 8:39AM PDT

I find it hard to consider Apple a monopoly. Sure, they create and sell their own operating system, and yes, they do not license it out to other PC manufacturers, but that isn't the same. Apple makes all of its products, and if they make both the hardware and software for a specific platform, it is their decision to keep it as closed as it is. I mean, if you ran a restaurant, and you made both your sandwiches and you fries, you shouldn't have to share it with competing restaurants. They make it, so they shouldn't be required to allow others to sell it on different hardware. However, it's different if an individual puts OS X on his own PC at home.

It is because of their choice to keep their system to themselves that allows them to provide a better experience for their customers. The benefits of having less hardware to run and test are big here, like you suggest. Now this could be a reason why Apple may "overcharge" for its products. But, when I got a Mac, I found that comparable machines of similar performance and components cost either the same or more. Plus, they offered Windows, which was what I was trying to get away from. Can you get cheaper PCs? Yes. Are they the same as a Mac? In most cases no.

However, I find that the Mac Mini is overpriced for its current configurations, and the Apple Cinema Displays are even older and more expensive. Both products supposedly are fantastic products, but the Mini is overpriced compared to its competitors and similar displays can be bought at lower base prices than the ACDs. Now granted, I still think they are nice machines, but in my opinion, they are not practical for some users.

I have had my MacBook Pro and a 6-month-old external drive replaced at Apple. My original Mac was defective out-of-the-box; I merely did not take action until my problems with it became unbearable. I couldn't work with it online at all. So, Apple replaced it with a brand new one and I haven't had any problems since. The hard drive? My old iMac G4 fried it with its FireWire port, which isn't too surprising. The G4 is running Leopard and FireWire isn't always consistent. The drive still worked, I think, but the enclosure cables and whatnot were dead. Luckily, the Genius I spoke with was very helpful and let me take a new one home to replace it. Good support. I think it is good to investigate and try to work out these types of problems with the vendors/manufacturers until the issue is solved. And with companies like Apple, who really do have good products, it is worth it. For some, it may not be a good idea to continue business with them, like your problem with your Jeep.

Just adding my own thoughts to this part of the thread.

-BMF

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Overpriced AND monopolistic
Aug 26, 2008 11:51AM PDT

I'm sorry, but nothing you said in Apple's defense would not have been introduced in the Ma Bell breakup arguments. They wanted to offer the service, the hardware, and prevent anyone else from doing the same. If Microsoft wanted to start making computers, how long before they would have another court case? Five minutes?

Sorry, you didn't offer any arguments that didn't reinforce the claim that Apple is monopolistic. Steve was just not as good at it as Bill was.

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I meant that Apple is not a monopoly
Aug 27, 2008 9:58AM PDT

I was trying to point out that Apple isn't a monopoly, not the other way around. I don't think Steve is trying to position Apple as a monopoly anyway.

If they want to prevent others from doing the same, then why not? And if Microsoft wanted to make their own hardware, I think they would do so with the help of some of their vendors anyway. I think everyone learned a thing or two from the Xbox 360 hardware problems. At least, they should have. Microsoft is the ring leader for all of the other PC manufacturers, and if they wanted to put out their own unique machine, I'm sure they could get away with it if they choose. I could be wrong, but that's how I see that issue.

Apple won't be a monopoly for a while, if they ever evolve in that direction. As long as their increasing market-share and user base don't interfere with their product quality and customer support, I will be fine. We shall see.

-BMF