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General discussion

Poll: Most Americans Support NSA's Efforts

May 11, 2006 11:31PM PDT

A majority of Americans initially support a controversial National Security Agency program to collect information on telephone calls made in the United States in an effort to identify and investigate potential terrorist threats, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll.

The new survey found that 63 percent of Americans said they found the NSA program to be an acceptable way to investigate terrorism, including 44 percent who strongly endorsed the effort. Another 35 percent said the program was unacceptable, which included 24 percent who strongly objected to it.

A slightly larger majority--66 percent--said they would not be bothered if NSA collected records of personal calls they had made, the poll found.

Underlying those views is the belief that the need to investigate terrorism outweighs privacy concerns. According to the poll, 65 percent of those interviewed said it was more important to investigate potential terrorist threats "even if it intrudes on privacy." Three in 10--31 percent--said it was more important for the federal government not to intrude on personal privacy, even if that limits its ability to investigate possible terrorist threats.

Half--51 percent--approved of the way President Bush was handling privacy matters.

The survey results reflect initial public reaction to the NSA program. Those views that could change or deepen as more details about the effort become known over the next few days.

USA Today disclosed in its Thursday editions the existence of the massive do


glad most people relize whats needed to be secure, not the minority here in SE seems there so so wrong to be outraged!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/12/AR2006051200375_pf.html

Discussion is locked

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Re: glad most people realize whats needed to be secure
May 11, 2006 11:52PM PDT

If most people realize, and "know what is good for the country"

How come

By a 56 percent to 42 percent margin, Americans said it was appropriate for the news media to have disclosed the existence of this secret government program.

What good is a spy program if everybody knows about it?

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I agree. Whoever leaked this should be...
May 12, 2006 12:13AM PDT

hanged from the highest pine tree that can be found in the State of Vermont.

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(NT) (NT) You're in the 42%, (+/- 5%) minority
May 12, 2006 12:16AM PDT
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(NT) (NT) I DON'T CARE.
May 12, 2006 12:18AM PDT
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(NT) (NT) Rockefeller is not from VT
May 12, 2006 9:45AM PDT
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I was thinking Pat Leaky...
May 12, 2006 10:08AM PDT

but maybe you're right.

Didn't get the latest memo from "the pack".

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SSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!!
May 13, 2006 10:35PM PDT

Don't let them know about..................

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Which is my constant
May 12, 2006 12:14AM PDT

argument about the public being too well informed about government issues.......

TONI

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The citizenry had no RIGHT to be informed of
May 13, 2006 10:49PM PDT

the NSA activities. That's why Congress gets informed of the activities so THEY can fix abuses privately. Not to leak it for political gain

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63% of the people can be wrong.
May 12, 2006 2:35AM PDT

And they are.

Dan

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As can the 37% of the minority
May 12, 2006 4:01AM PDT

of which you are part of.....can you imagine your chagrin if you should EVER have to admit that you WERE wrong?

We'll both have to wait for history to be written one way or the other now won't we?

TONI

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(NT) (NT) No they aren't. You are the one who is wrong.
May 12, 2006 9:35AM PDT
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Who That Be Peepin? In My Bedroom Window?
May 12, 2006 6:10PM PDT
''According to the poll, 65 percent of those interviewed said it was more important to investigate potential terrorist threats even if it ?intrudes on privacy?.''

Like the eagerness of folks to spend OPM [Other People?s Money], I expect the 65% who say they are willing to let the government intrude on privacy mean OPP [Other People?s Privacy] and not their privacy. JP Cool
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(NT) (NT) There's no intrusion on privacy in this.
May 12, 2006 8:30PM PDT
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(NT) (NT) There's a strawman peeping in JP's bedroom window!
May 12, 2006 8:43PM PDT
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Gee, Toto, I don?t Think We?re in Kansas Anymore
May 13, 2006 4:50AM PDT
?Among the government's most closely guarded secrets, the quality of pictures NGA [National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency] receives from classified satellites is believed to far exceed the one-meter resolution available commercially. That means they can take a satellite ?snapshot? from high above the atmosphere that is crisply detailed down to one meter level, which is 3.3 feet.?

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20060513/D8HIRAK80.html

Maybe that straw man is peeping into Evie's boudoir window.

http://www.matttaylor.com/public/Graphics_4/214_homeBackYard1.jpg
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(NT) (NT) Golly, Togo, I don't think we're in reality any more.
May 13, 2006 11:21AM PDT
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I'm one of those "Other People" and
May 13, 2006 5:43AM PDT

if they want to spy on me, it's okay. I mentioned before that I would gladly give up some of my privacy rights to protect our country more than has been done. What would YOU sacrifice for country? Or are you one of the "Other people" who let "other people" do the protecting for you (such as our military) but only if you can quarterback YOUR way?

TONI

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From The Air, On And Below The Ocean, On Land And From Space
May 13, 2006 7:48AM PDT
??are you one of the ?Other people? who let ?other people? do the protecting for you (such as our military) but only if you can quarterback YOUR way??

No, I?m one of the ''Other People'' who volunteered and put in three combat tours ''quarterbacking'' in the Vietnam War zone. I, solemnly swore to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; I bore and continue to bear true faith and allegiance to the same. I took and continue to take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations or purpose of evasion; and I will well and faithfully continue to discharge the duties of that office.

FOURTH AMENDMENT - U.S. Constitution: The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

http://www.lectlaw.com/def/f081.htm

As I stated elsewhere, The U.S. was founded upon the principle that the State exists to serve each Citizen, not the other way around. I really like that and would like to keep it operating that way.

Some how, I and others managed to fight and win the Cold War [from the air, on and below the ocean, on land and from space], and brought down The Wall without getting mega-tonnage nuked into nuclear winter or giving up ''essential liberty'' to obtain a little ''temporary safety'' in the doing.

The threat of Mutually Assured Destruction did not cause us to blink first. Therefore, you will have to excuse me, but the global threat of a few pounds of C4 wired to a cell phone activated detonator does not give me the urge to run the Bill of Rights and the Constitution thorough the shredder.
JP Cool
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but were not talking c4
May 13, 2006 8:03AM PDT

try biologicals, dirty bombs
and i fought 2 tours nam.
i didnt lose friends there to be over run because of mealy mouthed fools who never did squat( not refering to you)
some memebers here run ther mouths off about how bad it is here why they stay beats me if they hate it so much why stay, i know why because we protect them allow the the priviledge of liveing here.

to bad they havent earned it.

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He served 3 tours
May 13, 2006 11:01AM PDT

and STILL you didn't find something to ''nice'' to say to him

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So?
May 13, 2006 11:20AM PDT

He was making the point that there's more to the terrorist threat than a bomb here or there. Think airliners ramming into skyscrapers. It could happen.

And the Constitution is not violated with this. It's not a privacy issue. The issue is the security of the country that enables your comfortable existence.

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ed jps a foreigner not
May 13, 2006 1:08PM PDT

not an americanHappy

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jp read it again i said wasnt refering to him
May 13, 2006 1:07PM PDT

" didnt lose friends there to be over run because of mealy mouthed fools who never did squat( not refering to you)"

but take your time read it again.
no where was i dissing him he served alot here havent and they think they have more knowledge then the troops.

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Believe It Or Not I?m With You, e-Hootchmate
May 13, 2006 10:13PM PDT

I recognize the threat of ?biologicals, dirty bombs? you point out, but my concern for their threat is a measured one as I sit and wait for the Iraqi WMDs to showup. I also recognize that folks, like Osama and his 40 Thieves, will always be envious of America and Americans and seek to do us harm. After all, envy is one of the seven deadly sins. I do not fear folks like Osama nor any of those who share his beliefs. Theirs is a fatally flawed philosophy, and they will eventually self-destruct because of it.

I am more concerned that their flawed philosophy, like the ?biologicals, dirty bombs? you refer to, will work to infect, contaminate and irreparably alter our American way of life for the worse. JP Cool

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well i can understand your concerns but
May 14, 2006 12:29AM PDT

as to wmds Iran's on the Virge of making a nuke how long b4 they sell/give it to there fellow "peace full" Muslims?
and Saddam had gas look at the Kurds.

i rather be over cautious then to say were sorry we didnt think those calls ment anythingSad

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The Fourth Amendment is not an issue here
May 13, 2006 8:44AM PDT

The 1979 SCOTUS clearly found that there is NO more reasonable presumption of privacy in the phone numbers you dial or calls you receive than their is in your actions on a busy city street.

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Re: Fourth Amendment issues
May 13, 2006 11:36AM PDT

I am aware of the 1979 SCOTUS findings on the presumption of privacy regarding phone numbers, but the SCOTUS is not and has not always been infallible when it comes to interpreting the Constitution.

Recall that slavery was the SCOTUS approved law of the land for many years. So was segregation. So was genocide against Native Americans. So was Japanese-American interment camps.

Blanket searches are unreasonable, however 'evenhanded' they may be, in the traditional criminal law enforcement context. See, e.g., Ybarra v. Illinois, 444 U.S. 85, 91-2, 92 n.4 ('79) (invalidating a blanket patdown search of all patrons in a tavern, even though there was probable cause to search the bartender and the premises). The ill that the Fourth Amendment prevents is not merely the arbitrariness of police discretion to single out individuals for attention, but also the unwarranted domination and control of the citizenry through fear of baseless but 'evenhanded' general police searches.

Fourth Amendment protects the 'right of the people to be secure in their persons . . . against unreasonable searches and seizures.' The essence of that protection is a prohibition against some modes of law enforcement because the cost of police intrusion into personal liberty is too high, even though the intrusion undoubtedly would result in an enormous boon to the public if the efficient apprehension of criminals were the sole criterion to be considered. 'The easiest course for [law enforcement] officials is not always one that our Constitution allows them to take.' Wolfish, 441 U.S. at 595 (Stevens, dissenting).


As for me personally, Evie, a straighter arrow never coursed through the Fabulous Fifties, If-It-Feels-Good-Do-It-Sixties, Synthetic Seventies, Go-Go Eighties, Dot.com Nineties and on into the New Millennium. As a result, I have been responsible for scores of NSA Analysts nodding off at their workstations for many decades now. I never have believed I was above the law, nor have I ever believed that the law was above me. I respect the law and will accept no less then the law respecting me. JP Cool

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You flatter yourself
May 13, 2006 11:57AM PDT

The NSA barely has the resources to check out every suspicous pattern that may emerge. It hardly has time for the rest. The SCOTUS is not always right, but it is on this. After all, the phone companies sell your info to lots of people with your "consent" -- the government is just another one interested in the info.