Speakeasy forum

Rant

OWS and NYPD destroyed jobs

by TONI H / December 17, 2011 10:50 PM PST

OWS started it and the NYPD nailed the coffin shut...hope they're both proud of what they did.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/12/15/milk-street-cafe-closes-after-losing-business-during-occupy-wall-street-protests/

This is from a week or more ago when there was still time for the NYPD to turn it around and they refused. NYPD, Police Commissioner, Mayor??? Who gave the order to destroy this business?

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/01/milk-street-cafe-possibly-shutting-its-doors-for-good-due-to-occupy-owner-says/

Discussion is locked
You are posting a reply to: OWS and NYPD destroyed jobs
The posting of advertisements, profanity, or personal attacks is prohibited. Please refer to our CNET Forums policies for details. All submitted content is subject to our Terms of Use.
Track this discussion and email me when there are updates

If you're asking for technical help, please be sure to include all your system info, including operating system, model number, and any other specifics related to the problem. Also please exercise your best judgment when posting in the forums--revealing personal information such as your e-mail address, telephone number, and address is not recommended.

You are reporting the following post: OWS and NYPD destroyed jobs
This post has been flagged and will be reviewed by our staff. Thank you for helping us maintain CNET's great community.
Sorry, there was a problem flagging this post. Please try again now or at a later time.
If you believe this post is offensive or violates the CNET Forums' Usage policies, you can report it below (this will not automatically remove the post). Once reported, our moderators will be notified and the post will be reviewed.
Collapse -
Scroll down to the comment in the CBS story
by Josh K / December 17, 2011 11:17 PM PST
More importantly however is the fact that HE'S LYING. That particular
block he's on (which I know VERY well) was barely affected by the
barricades. And the amount of pedestrian traffic there is insane. Not to
mention that this could be cleared up even faster by simply looking at
the reviews on Yelp.com. The restaurant has 2 stars, and the only reason
it's that high is because there's a handful of reviews from either
before (!) or on the day it opened. Basically everyone else shredded
them.
So really what we have is a crappy restaurant that failed, and an
owner who is taking it out on people who clearly had nothing to do with
it. And a whole lot of people buying his BS as if it was gospel.


If this commentator is telling the truth, the place just wasn't very well liked and the protests several blocks away had little or nothing to do with the failure of the business.
Collapse -
So either
by TONI H / December 17, 2011 11:56 PM PST

the business owner is lying or the commentator is lying.....any possibility that the commentator is part of the OWS sympathizers.

Since the company was only six months old, and already had 21 employees, no matter what the preliminary reviews were, the OWS crowd and then the barricades for the last three months of his business life didn't help him possibly do better and succeed. All new businesses take time to get off the ground, Josh, and the OWS and the refusal by the NYPD to remove the barricades didn't help any at all.

However, this is a quote from the owner: >>>Epstein says he leased the space on Wall Street because it was next to a pedestrian plaza - and his was the only restaurant along that plaza.>>>

If you look at the picture, it appears that there WERE customers in the place at some point in time (perhaps when it first opened), but if it was in a prime location and was the only restaurant along that plaza, even crappy reviews as it first opened would have benefited the owner in order to help him make changes that would have created a better business....that's what reviews generally do for new businesses.

Unfortunately, this particular business was doomed from the git-go thanks to the OWS and the NYPD and it wasn't the owner's fault. You also have to wonder if this wasn't political in nature in order to force this business out and let another come in that involves chronyism since the barricades COULD have been removed to accommodate the owner. Where did that refusal come from and why?

Collapse -
A lot of startups fail
by James Denison / December 18, 2011 2:34 AM PST
In reply to: So either

In fact the majority of them do within the first year. It might be the OWS had some negative effect, but is this the only failure near that location?

Collapse -
It's hard to say...
by J. Vega / December 18, 2011 2:39 AM PST
In reply to: So either

It's hard to say what would have happened to the restaurant if OWS had not taken place.
Another reply mentions it's rating on Yelp, but there was urban spoon .com where 88% of the people said that they liked it in their voting survey. As it had not been open very long, conclusions based on either of those ratings might not be of much value.

Collapse -
Crappy reviews help business?
by Josh K / December 18, 2011 9:50 PM PST
In reply to: So either

Really?

The restaurant had been open for six months, which means it opened (and started getting crappy reviews) before OWS began.

And now you're suggesting that there was some kind of organized plot to shut this place down? LOL.

Collapse -
(NT) more incidental than organized.
by James Denison / December 18, 2011 10:02 PM PST
Collapse -
Explain then
by Josh K / December 18, 2011 10:04 PM PST

What would be the motive for someone to have this particular business shut down and replaced with something else?

Collapse -
who said motive was involved
by James Denison / December 18, 2011 10:08 PM PST
In reply to: Explain then

"incidental" means without motive, not real intention to create the result.

Collapse -
Good, then....
by Josh K / December 18, 2011 10:27 PM PST

.....you don't buy Toni's tinfoil hat conspiracy theory either.

Collapse -
By your own statement
by TONI H / December 19, 2011 4:43 AM PST
In reply to: Good, then....

earlier up in the thread, Josh, you said that the restaurant was 'blocks' away from the OWS...I'm still wondering why, then, the barracade was put up if that's the case, and why the NYPD refused to take it down. SOMEBODY had to give that order to leave it up....if the restaurant wasn't directly being affected by the OWS 'blocks' away, why wasn't the barracade allowed to be removed? Call that 'tinfoil hat' thinking, but there IS a reason this particular restaurant was 'forced' to close down...either it WAS in a prime location or it wasn't. Since you live in NY, can YOU find out why the barracade wasn't removed so the restaurant could have possibly saved itself?

Collapse -
So let's see....
by Josh K / December 19, 2011 5:25 AM PST
In reply to: By your own statement

The NYPD, in collaboration with the Mayor's Office, conspired to run this guy off the block so they could..................what, exactly?

And it wasn't "my own statement," Toni. I was quoting from a comment at the bottom of your linked article. That quote also says that the store owner is lying or exaggerating about the barricades in an attempt to blame OWS and/or the police for his business failing.

Though I live in NYC, it's not a small town. I can't just poke my head into the police chief's office and ask what happened.

In an earlier post you made mention of the photo of the cafe. Look at that picture carefully. Everyone is dressed in summer clothes. That picture was probably taken the day the place opened, or maybe even before (as a promotional shot).

Collapse -
RE: WAS in a prime location or it wasn't.
by JP Bill / December 19, 2011 5:41 AM PST
In reply to: By your own statement

Location, location, location....

Customers, customers, customers....

If you only have one...you're dead.

Collapse -
RE: blocks away, why, then, the barracade was put up
by JP Bill / December 19, 2011 5:44 AM PST
In reply to: By your own statement

You know what it's like in NYC...you don't just reroute traffic for one block...you have to do some major detours.

Collapse -
No
by TONI H / December 19, 2011 4:35 AM PST

They were open only three months when the OWS basically shut them down....if they got bad reviews during their first three months, they would have had time to fix the issues that got the bad reviews and perhaps reversed it and stayed open. The OWS and NYPD killed them off before they got that chance.

And, yes, crappy reviews DO have that kind of effect on new businesses...it's called constructive criticism, and most businesses take that seriously enough to do something about it if they want to succeed.

Collapse -
The very first sentence in your link....
by Josh K / December 19, 2011 5:42 AM PST
In reply to: No

....is "Six months after opening a popular eatery on Wall Street, the owner is closing its doors for good on Thursday."

You can keep shouting that it was OWS's fault, but there are a LOT Of businesses in that area, many of which are closer to the protest site than this one was, and they're not shutting down.

I just looked up the cafe, by the way, and it was ON WALL STREET, right in the heart of the brokerage houses. That street is extremely crowded every single day (even when trading isn't going on, lots of tourists), and the barricades in question were set up for two reasons:

1. Anti-terror measures put in place after 9/11
2. To keep the OWS protesters off of Wall Street itself

The commenter was right -- there is no way the barricades could have impeded that place's ability to draw customers. I know the area pretty well too. In fact, if anything the barricades should have helped business because they made it more difficult for the brokers to leave the street to go elsewhere for lunch.

Read the reviews -- they are scathing. Slow service, excessively high prices, etc. I bet word got around quickly to avoid this place.

http://www.yelp.com/biz/milk-street-cafe-manhattan

Collapse -
RE: Bad reviews....
by JP Bill / December 19, 2011 5:46 AM PST
In reply to: No

That's why there are no prisoners in the prison in your area?

Collapse -
NYPD nailed the coffin shut..
by JP Bill / December 18, 2011 3:44 AM PST

That'll teach him...Next time a cop asks a restaurant for a free donut...

You didn't mention Obama and the Dems having a fund raising that caused the restaurants demise?

Collapse -
There are other businesses complaining of losses.
by James Denison / December 18, 2011 8:58 AM PST
Here's a few.

Other businesses in the area have lost a combined total of roughly half a million dollars. Various business owners explained the sight of the protestors organizing in the area and marching up and down the sidewalks intimidates potential customers and deters many people from making any purchases. One employee from Pret A Manger, a coffee and sandwich shop, complained that protestors organize impromptu meetings in their establishment, forcing workers to stay late for hours past closing time. The manager of a local Chinese resturant reported seeing dirty clothes all over the bathroom floors. Last week, the owner of Panini & Co. Breads told the Post that she and her employees have been threatened and harassed by members of OWS, and have been causing general mayhem inside the establishment. The final straw came about two weeks ago, when the demonstrators broke a bathroom sink, flooding the shop, and clogged the toilet setting her back $3,000 in damages. Cafe Health World has also complained about the protestors.

In Oakland, Three Businesses Leave, others suffer.

The impact of the urban encampment has been very negative, says Paul Junge, public policy director for the Oakland Metropolitan Chamber of Commerce. Three businesses with commitments to new leases in the downtown area, which would have brought in some 350 jobs, backed out of their agreements in the past three weeks, he says. We are aware of dozens of small businesses in and around Frank Ogawa Plaza where the tents are, reporting 40 to 50 percent losses in the past three or four weeks, including clothing stores, coffee shops, and conference spaces, Mr. Junge says. People don't like walking around down there, it makes them nervous ... they are taking their business elsewhere. The Bodegas, coffee shops, food trucks, restaurants ... These people are not part of the 'elite' or '1 percent'," she says via e-mail. "They're simply trying to earn a living and are seeing a significant portion of their customer base being blocked from entering their premises for fear of being caught up in a chaotic situation they don't really understand.
Popular Forums
icon
Computer Newbies 10,686 discussions
icon
Computer Help 54,365 discussions
icon
Laptops 21,181 discussions
icon
Networking & Wireless 16,313 discussions
icon
Phones 17,137 discussions
icon
Security 31,287 discussions
icon
TVs & Home Theaters 22,101 discussions
icon
Windows 7 8,164 discussions
icon
Windows 10 2,657 discussions

CNET FORUMS TOP DISCUSSION

Help, my PC with Windows 10 won't shut down properly

Since upgrading to Windows 10 my computer won't shut down properly. I use the menu button shutdown and the screen goes blank, but the system does not fully shut down. The only way to get it to shut down is to hold the physical power button down till it shuts down. Any suggestions?