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One of the many (NON Bush) reasons Fannie failed

by critic411 / September 18, 2008 11:15 AM PDT
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my father
by dirtyrich / September 18, 2008 9:24 PM PDT

has worked for the Dept of Housing and Urban Development for most of his adult life and pretty much has been predicting this for the past ten years because he's seen, on the ground level, the problems that have been building up.

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Yep !!
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 9:27 PM PDT
In reply to: my father

President Bush wanted massive reforms in 2003, but the Democrats stopped it.

One doesn't have to look far to see the Clinton/Democrat/Obama connection in this mess.

But alas, the MSM is silent once again.

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I fail to see the connection with Obama.
by Kees Bakker / September 18, 2008 9:36 PM PDT
In reply to: Yep !!

After all, he's only member of the Senate since January 2005, and not involved in the 2003 decisions.
How far (back) do you look to see the connection? And what connection exactly?

Kees

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Maybe you should read more
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 9:49 PM PDT

Who ran Fannie and is on Obama's team?

Do please keep cuurrent

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(NT) Too far for me without explanation.
by Kees Bakker / September 18, 2008 9:54 PM PDT
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Connections...
by J. Vega / September 19, 2008 3:00 AM PDT

Connections with Obama? Look into the past actions of Franklin D. Raines and James A. Johnson, and then note their duties in the Obama campaign.

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I love those conspiracy theories.
by Kees Bakker / September 18, 2008 9:52 PM PDT
In reply to: Yep !!

The Democrates blocked a necessary reform in 2003, because they knew it would cause a crisis in 2008, so they could win the presidency back in the resulting economic mess, chaos and discord.

Kees

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(NT) What idiot said that?
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 9:53 PM PDT
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See, I'm learning.
by Kees Bakker / September 18, 2008 9:55 PM PDT
In reply to: What idiot said that?

That's what I called retorics 101. Attacking somebody on something he didn't say, but maybe could have said.
A very instructive forum, this.

Kees

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BULL FLOP!
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 9:58 PM PDT
In reply to: See, I'm learning.

Show me where ANYONE said anything about a conspiracy.

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That's not what was said
by EdHannigan / September 18, 2008 10:06 PM PDT

It's not a conspiracy theory. The Dems DID block needed regulation for their own purposes. They were warned that it could lead to a disaster. They ignored the warnings. It (among other factors, but that was the root factor) did lead to a disaster. End of story.

The "Conspiracy Theory " is a product of your imagination.

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Re: conspiracy
by Kees Bakker / September 18, 2008 10:11 PM PDT

Blocking something for your own (undisclosed) purposes knowing it will lead to a disaster, that's a good script for any movie. Why not call it a conspiracy?

Kees

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Consequences not conspiracy
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 10:17 PM PDT
In reply to: Re: conspiracy

New word of the day for you

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Pay attention!
by EdHannigan / September 18, 2008 10:18 PM PDT
In reply to: Re: conspiracy
No one said they did it because they knew it would lead to a disaster. No one. They were warned and pooh-poohed the warnings.

Never attribute to evil that which can be explained by stupidity.

They did it because they wanted money to be really loose for lower income families,. There's votes in them there hills.

It's all a matter of public record. Not really disputable. Fannie/Freddie was very tight with the Dems. Why do you think they gave so much money to Obama, Kerry, Dodd, et al.?

I think you are beyond your depth here.
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Never attribute
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 10:28 PM PDT
In reply to: Pay attention!

to evil that which can be explained by stupidity

I like that.

Is it coyrighted?

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Attributed to Napoleon...
by EdHannigan / September 18, 2008 10:37 PM PDT
In reply to: Never attribute

There are variations in wording and who supposedly said it. Some say "incompetence" instead of "stupidity".

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Ahhh !!
by critic411 / September 18, 2008 10:42 PM PDT

I see
Thanks

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So then, Kees...
by J. Vega / September 19, 2008 2:56 AM PDT
In reply to: Re: conspiracy

So then, Kees, would the actions of Barney Frank fit your definition of conspiracy? Hey, if you're going to try to gen up conspiracies, why exclude him.

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Why bother to try and win an election?
by JP Bill / September 18, 2008 10:25 PM PDT
In reply to: Yep !!

Weren't the Republicans in control of The House of Representatives for the last 8 years?

Weren't the Republicans in control of The Senate UNTIL 2006?

"In control" for 6 of the last 8 years.

"Not in control" for the last 2

BUT

President Bush wanted massive reforms in 2003, but the Democrats stopped it.

What happened to the 3 years between 2003 and 2006 when Republicans were in control in The House of Representatives and The Senate?

And I asked this question before

When do YOU think a leader should take responsibility for what goes on in their tenure?

Or is it always the other guys fault?

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Are you claiming it never happened?
by EdHannigan / September 18, 2008 10:49 PM PDT

Legislation can be blocked by the minority party. It happens all the time. People do not always vote in lockstep.

The President can't sign legislation taht doesn't pass. He's not the king. He doesn't always get what he wants.

Sounds more like you are making excuses for the Democrats. I'm not putting ALL the blame on the Democrats (or even the government), but they deserve a huge share of it.

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RE: People do not always vote in lockstep.
by JP Bill / September 18, 2008 10:54 PM PDT

When Republicans don't vote with Republicans can't you also say they blocked it?

Then perhaps

The Democrats blocked it

is not the correct phrase.

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No.
by EdHannigan / September 18, 2008 10:58 PM PDT
The Democrats blocked it is the correct phrase. So they sucked in a couple of "Independents" or Republicans. Still their bad.

There are leaders and positions taken by parties. Making lame excuses for them won't fly.
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Making lame excuses for them won't fly.
by JP Bill / September 18, 2008 11:05 PM PDT
In reply to: No.

Then don't try.

If an opposition party votes against something that's not unusual (some would say it's expected)

When a member of your own party votes against something (a party position) THEY are the ones that are responsible.

Blaming the other guy is a "lame excuse"

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That's just ridiculous.
by EdHannigan / September 18, 2008 11:11 PM PDT

When whole bunch of Dems do something they are not responsible... but when a couple of Republicans go along, THEY are the guilty ones.

Okay, not riding any mre.

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(NT) Good i was getting dizzy
by JP Bill / September 18, 2008 11:19 PM PDT
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One of the things that happened...
by J. Vega / September 19, 2008 3:14 AM PDT

One of the things that happened was Barny Frank, acting as Chairman of the House Financial Services Committee. He didn't like the plan to create a new agency within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. He said "These two entities, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, are not facing any kind of financial crisis.".
One person, in a powerful position of a powerful committee, can block something.

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