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General discussion

Nikon D70(s) vs. Canon EOS 20D

May 29, 2005 1:17AM PDT

I was all set to buy the Canon EOS 20D when a local photo pro told me I was nuts unless I already had a bunch of Canon lenses. He said the Nikon takes better pictures despite the two fewer MPs and that the selection and quality of lenses is much better for the Nikon (I already have 6 Nikon lenses but they are the older AI-Nikkor series for the 35mm F3.) What do you think? The Canon will run about $1,900 with the medium quality (not L-series) EF-S 17-85mm lens. The Nikon is $1,000 less including the inexpensive lens that comes with the "kit." That leaves $1,000 for more lenses.

Discussion is locked

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He's wrong. The D70 competes with the Rebel. It compares
May 29, 2005 7:54AM PDT

unfavorably to the 20D. Also, Nikon is encrypting their raw files, and their raw file software is an extra cost item. Canon's software is included with the camera, and they are not encrypting. Encryption can block things like Photoshop from working with the raw image files. That is a BIG negative.

The 2 megapixel boost in image size is more significant than it looks, and the speed and low light advantages are significant.

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Huh???
Jun 14, 2005 11:05PM PDT

Don't know where you're getting your info, but you're mostly wrong on your post.

The encryption issue applies to the D2X and D2Hs, not the D70. The D70 DOES have it's own software for accessing and transferring pictures to your PC.

Secondly, I had no problems whatsoever opening D70's NEF files directly with Photoshop. The Canon 20D's proprietary format (CR2) on the other hand would NOT open in Photoshop (7).

The 2 Megapixel boost is NOT more significant than it looks. In terms of linear resolution, the amount gained by another 2 MP's is negligible.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/20dd70.htm

The fps speed and higher ISO speeds (up to 3200 ISO) on the Canon ARE a big plus, if you need to shoot in very low light, or shoot very fast moving subjects multiple times.

Please be sure you post accurate information.

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You need to spend a little more time in the literature.
Jun 15, 2005 7:21AM PDT

I am not totally sure about the raw software, but reliable sources say Nikon is using encryption AND charging extra for the software.

The Canon raw format opens just fine with the Adobe plug-in in Photoshop CS and CS2. Since I had already moved to CS before using raw files, I cannot speak to version 7. Have you downloaded the latest plug-in from Canon? The first ones I downloaded were Betas on Adobes part. BTW, all raw files are proprietary. That is why Adobe is advocating a common format (DNG if I recall correctly). In other words, Nikon's NEF files are also proprietary, and Adobe is not getting great cooperation from Nikon. That is the word in the professional community of which I am a part.

Finally, the additional 2 megs ARE more significant than they look. That comes from the literature. I have posted some of the reasons for that elsewhere if you want to do a search. I don't have time to look it up right now.

I make every effort to post accurate info. Please do a little more research.

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PS: It was Adobe people commenting on the difficulty
Jun 15, 2005 8:09AM PDT

of working with Nikon's raw format because of Nikon's unwillingness to disclose information. Apparently, Canon is far more cooperative. This subject came up in a presentation on CS2. Other sources have talked about Nikon encryption.

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No comparison
May 31, 2005 6:29PM PDT

Canon 20D beats Nikon D70s in most aspect. It has the much-lower noise level when shooting in the dimmer light condition, more megapixels for enlargement, and etc. I've been using it for months and still feel that Nikon cameras are currently far behind Canon regard the technology. I'd say that even Canon EOS Rebel XT outperforms Nikon D70s. Choose wisely !

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Depends On Your Wallet
Jun 10, 2005 11:59AM PDT

First off, I've tried all three and it really breaks down to how much you want to spend in terms of the D70 and 20D. Of course the 20D should perform better. With a decent lense (not the one supplied with it) it will run you about a $2,000, or a grand more than the Nikon. You could have two D70's with good stock lenses for the price of one 20D. Let's compare Apples to Apples here.

Now, dollar for dollar, and what you get with the D70, if money is an issue, it beats the 20D hands down. You're getting a $300 dollar, top shelf lense with a camera that's capable of shooting terrific pictures. The menu system and overall build of the camera is just shy of the D20, and beats the pants off of the Digital Rebel XT.

Someone mentioned the Canon Digital Rebel XT in the company of these two cameras which is a laugh. Sure, the picture quality stands on its own with the DR XT, but the ergonomics and overall function of the camera is a joke. It looks and is built like a high end point and shoot. You have to have a small woman's hands to comfortably fit the camera and the provided lense is plastic and ridiculous. I'm not sure what Canon was thinking in this regard, as men are the primary target market of this camera. In addition, I'm paying almost a grand for a camera and get a less than $100 lense. That makes sense.

If you have the money, buy the D20, as it is capable of taking awesome pictures, especially in low light conditions, and it built very well. Just get ready to justify in your mind spending the extra grand, when you could just as easily buy a D70, and outfit yourself with some pretty nice lenses.

Either way, I'm sure you'll pick a winner as they will all satisfy their target customer.

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Canon only charges you $100 for the lens that comes with the
Jun 10, 2005 10:55PM PDT

20D. If you don't want it, you can buy the camera without it. Reviewers say that it is surprisingly good for its price. The D70 competes with the Rebel and recent reviews say the XT is beating it. If you expect to shoot with a DSLR, you should expect to buy some lenses. If you don't, perhaps a point and shoot would be a better choice. The 'extra' $1,000 is misleading as a comparison, and those 'extras' like the 20D's low light ability are worth far more than you seem to realize.

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Commission?
Jun 11, 2005 6:55AM PDT

there might be a higher margin on the nikon's. sales guys who are comissioned will say wierd things to get u to buy. its the only way they can put food on their tables.

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Here we go again
Jun 14, 2005 11:11PM PDT

Of course you can buy the body only, but why would you want to?

CMVSM is right, and his post was dead on. The price for a 20D with a decent lens is about 2 grand. The D70 is half that with a nice lens. Sure you should "expect to buy some lenses", that's why you have an extra grand to splurge. And what do you mean the "extra" $1,000" is misleading?

Gotta say kiddpeat, your posts are mostly worthless.

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Canon
Jun 15, 2005 12:50AM PDT

Basically, kiddpeat is saying that the Canon Digital Rebel XT is cheaper than the Nikon D70 and is beating it in sales per week. The Canon Digital Rebel XT is much more popular and it has gotten many great reviews. The Nikon D70 also has gotten good reviews, but it all depends on how much you are willing to spend on a digital camera.

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Duh! Maybe because you don't want to spend the $100 on
Jun 15, 2005 7:26AM PDT

the lens if you are not going to use it?

The reviews I've seen say that the $100 lens IS decent. I didn't buy it, but reviewers aren't knocking it either.

You sound like a Nikon bigot. You're the first I've seen. Oh well, such is the world.

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Size does matter!!
Jun 18, 2005 1:05AM PDT

Two megapixels is two megapixels bigger images. If you rally want to see which one takes better pictures why don't you just bring a Compact Flash card to the store and take 4 or 5 shots with each cam, don't forget to include a macro shot, and see which shots look better on your pc? Real life comparison always beats word of mouth. I own both a nikon and a canon and both take spectacular images, canon's menus are easier to navigate. My adivice is to take them for a test drive!! Let us know which one you chose!!