Nighttime fire performance video camcorder?

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What sort of

by boya84 Aug 9, 2007 9:33AM PDT

"nighttime fire performances" are you talking about? If you are referring to something along the lines of the South Pacific type fire dances and you expect the camera to stay on the dancer and their torch, I would suggest that this environment is not what I would consider low-light. The torches are relatively bright. If, however, you were to try and focus on someone standing 10 feet (or more) away from the dancer/torch, then that *would* be lowlight.

If you are referring to some other sort of "nighttime fire performances" that uses less than brightly burning torches, then I would need to understand what that is in order to decide whether the brightness of that torch actually constitutes "low light". If this is what you are looking for, $400 is not going to get you very far.

"Decent audio" is a relative term. You will need to learn to use the manual audio controls. If the music is for the South Pacific type fire dances and if you have ever attended a show, you will know that there are certain very soft passages (usually at the start) and VERY LOUD passages (middle and end). The camcorder's auto audio level circuit will have issues dealing with that dynamic range. The loud portions will likely sound muddy and the soft portions will have a whooshing sound characteristic of the auto audio leveling circuit trying to do its job. When you are in manual audio mode, the whosshing will likely go away - and you need to turn down the level when the drums get going.

An external mic is preferable, but the only camcorder in your $ range, I think, that allows for an external mic jack is the Canon ZR800...

The built-in Sony "SuperNightShot" will drop into a green/white monochromatic mode - but only when you flip that switch. Not recommended for any use...

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video fire poi

by yummiliciousness Aug 9, 2007 10:15PM PDT

This is filming myself and my partner doing fire poi and fire staff.

We are usually in VERY dark location - a deserted beach far away from artifical light sources. Sometimes we have a bit of moonlight, often none at all.

The person doing the video will be 15 ft away.

The $400 is a max upper limit, we are looking for the best we can get for this.

BTW, I am a photographer by profession, but have no experience in video.

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I'll try again...

by boya84 Aug 9, 2007 11:41PM PDT

You could be in zero light. But when you light the torches, they are your light source. You are no longer in zero light unless you are pointing at something other than the dancer with the lit torch. The torch is your light and if they are what I *think* they are, they are pretty bright and provide just enough light when within about a foot or two of an object. You will not be in "moonlight". You will not be in lowlight. You will be lit by the torches. That said, if the torches are not lit, you will not be in torchlight - and you WILL be in a lowlight situation.

What you are asking for: Good low light imaging, decent audio, etc for $400 is like asking for a $50 camera to have a bayonet or screw mount so you can attach a huge telephoto lens and take 12 megapixel stills... you aren't going to find much to meet that criteria. For all intents, $400 is an entry level camcorder. Also note that most camcorders built-in mics are not very good. An external mic is strongly recommended.

Check out camcorderinfo.com (ratings) and identify the lowest Lux rating out there. I expect it will be in the 4-8 range. Other suggestions: DO NOT consider DVD based camcorders. Too much compression - editing is painful. Hard drive based are OK... but again, compression issues. MiniDV tape continues to offer the highest quality video available. Transfer is by FireWire - so your computer needs a FireWire (iLink/IEEE1394 - all the same) port.

Panasonic PV-GS320
Canon ZR-800/830/850
Sony DCR HC38

The only one with an external mic jack is the Canon ZR800.

And there will be some - not a lot, but some - graininess with any of these. Keep the torch light in the frame and you will reduce the chance of graininess. Get the camera closer than 15 feet. Use a tripod. Get extra high capacity rechargable batteries. Get a sturdy case. Keep sand and salt water (any water, for that matter) away from the camera.

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Bummer

by yummiliciousness Aug 10, 2007 12:47AM PDT

Oh bummer... so I guess since we don't have more than $400 we should just give up on the idea of filming our performance alltogether. That sucks.

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thanks

by yummiliciousness Aug 10, 2007 12:52AM PDT

Actually - I think I'll get the Panasonic PV-GS320. Maybe it won't be fantastic, but I think for out purposes it will do.

Thank you for your help and suggestions.

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so... let us know if you post...

by boya84 Aug 10, 2007 1:13AM PDT

Here is "sort of" an example of what I mean by the difference in shooting low light and being in low light...

http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=7810481

The venue was very dark, but the lights on the stage were enough. Also, the piano player vocalist (Monica) had a single PAR64 can pointed at her from a pretty good distannce (20-25 feet?). I know this is probably a little brighter than a torch, but at that distance - with the red gel, not by much. The torches you dance with will be brighter because they give off yellow light and will be closer to the performer. Had I pointed the camera into the unlit crowd, it would have gotten very grainy... because there's nothing providing light on the crowd. The Panny you are considering will likely be OK... Not "excellent", but OK... You might consider taking another look at the Lux ratings... I think the Sony's is lower... (5 compared to .

I am from Hawaii... and can appreciate what you want to do with the torch dances... There was a teacher at the school I attended and he did Samoan sword and fire dances in Waikiki when he wasn't at school...

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