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General discussion

New antenna for HDTV ,Tom??

Feb 21, 2006 12:59PM PST

Tom, ATSC HDTV signals are plain transmitted over standard UHF freqs and you only need a standard UHF/VHF antenna to recieve these. Most of these "HDTV Antennas" are a waste of money. I've been using a standard UHF antenna here in the dallas area for the past 3 years pulling in signals with my MYHD card in my pc, recording HD signals to my hard drive and time-shifting away. All over a "COMPONENT" connection I might add. Happy

Strange enough, we have one channel (abc-wfaa) that actually is broadcasting on channel 9 in the VHF spectrum. Everything else is in the UHF. A lot of people are picking up the digital signals with a simple set-top antenna. There is nothing special about the antenna needed to pick up these signals.

Discussion is locked

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Could you tell me...
Feb 21, 2006 1:11PM PST

...How I could pull in HDTV with the bunny ears on my tv?

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From the way I understand it ...
Feb 21, 2006 1:48PM PST

... As long as your TV is HD ready, and the station is broadcasting in HD, you should just get it.

That's assuming that I understand it right.

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If I remember right
Feb 21, 2006 1:53PM PST

Part of this push is so that some of the broadcast spectrum gets freed up. If that is the case, wouldn't it mean that the new over-the-air signals operate in a different signal range? If so, that's why you would need a new antenna, as it would already be "calibrated" to pick up the right part of the spectrum to give you your TV goods. As said somewhere else, you can make your current antenna work, it's just not really worth the effort.

-Ryan

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Yeah, you're right ...
Feb 21, 2006 2:12PM PST

I completely spaced out about that. So, to correct myself, if I understand right, it would work currently, until the frequencies were changed in 2009. Then, either there would be new antennas (antennae?) made, or some kind of set-top converter box would be required to receive the digital signals.

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everything changes in 09 yet nothing changes
Feb 21, 2006 8:46PM PST

The ATSC digital signal uses the existing TV band - just less of it. Many areas will lose their VHF spectrum. UHF is getting capped lower. Already dropped from Ch83 to Ch69, I think it gets trimmed to the high 50s after the switch. This all works because (theoretically) the digital signals can be spaced closer - for instance a market can have signals on CH31, CH32 & Ch33 without them interfering. Once you lose the separation issue, 2/3 of the old UHF spectrum is more than adequate. So yeah, old TV antennas should work. They may just not work well, because the ATSC signal is REALLY fragile. I've used rabbit ears to get the signal. Of course with digital either it works perfectly or utterly fails. I've lost reception from trucks going by and people walking around the room - presumably causing the kind of subtle reflections that would barely be noticable with an NTSC signal.
Zenith/LG (the patentholder) has what seems to be the holy grail of ATSC recievers - the 5th Gen chipsets, that reportedly provide really robust reception, but as far as I know, it's not available in a STB, just built into really pricey sets... and 1 PC card which has varying reports of driver support.
Europe & Asia (and some mobile digital technologies) use a more robust modulation method (COFDM vs our 8VSB) but that's less about tech than the politics of Intellectual Property rights & who makes license fees, so this probably isn't the place to rant about that. Anyway, it's done, so rather than whine, we need to focus our energies on making this pig fly.
You can keep your old set (if you want DVD quality - but not HD), you MIGHT be able to use your existing antenna, but you may need to futz - a lot! All you really need is an ATSC tuner, and what's out there so far is really unimpressive. IMHO.

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Oh Well
Feb 21, 2006 3:12PM PST

It doesn't really matter anyways. My TV is only my alarm clock, I have it set to come on at a certain time, once I wake up, it goes off and its not on again, all day.

TOO many podcasts to listen to and too many video casts to watch.

But anyways, thanks for suggestions.

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Close but...
Feb 21, 2006 9:04PM PST

HD "Ready" only means that you are able to connect a HDTV receiver to it and be able to watch HD content. You still have to buy the receiver, or get one from your provider, (cable or satellite usually). So yes, with a regular antenna AND a HD receiver you can watch HD content on your HD Ready set, even after 09 because as someone else pointed out, it is the VHF spectrum that is getting released and the digital will all be on the existing UHF space.

HD "Ready" is one of the great gotchas of this whole mess. You buy a $2000 set and then find you have to shell out a few more hundres bucks to be able to actually GET HD content. I'm lucky being in the dallas area because we have lots of stations already broadcasting in digital/High Def. Then of course, there is the whole digital/but NOT High Def discussions...

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Hmmm ..
Feb 21, 2006 10:54PM PST

I had always thought that "HD ready" meant that you had to add some kind of receiver to get HD content (be it a STB or an antenna), and that a true "HD" TV already had a capable tuner built-in.

So, to make sure I understand correctly, you're saying that if I wanted to watch OTA HD content, I would need an antenna AND a STB receiver?

Man, that would suck. Sad

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No, you're right
Feb 22, 2006 2:20AM PST

If the tv is "HD" then it already has the receiver. I understood the first person was talking about HD "Ready", which, yes, it did suck to have to buy a reciever. 3 years ago they were in the $800 range so I settled on the MyHD card which lets me schedule and record HD to a hard drive for time shifting ala t*vo. You do still need an antenna though. I'm on the outskirts of the dallas metroples so I got the 90 mile range one from Radio Shack and put it up in the attic. Cost around $80 or so.

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Just re-read your question
Feb 22, 2006 2:22AM PST

Yes HD Ready means you need a receiver AND an antenna, unless you are really close to the broadcast tower. Happy The HD "Ready" set comes with neither. It's just ready for you to plug stuff into it and the screen is capable of showing the HD resolution. That's all that means.

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Soooo ...
Feb 22, 2006 2:59AM PST

... assuming I'm close to a tower, I could theoretically get away with just an amplified antenna?

Maybe I should do some research into this so I can better understand the difference. I'm still hoping that all I'll need is just an antenna. *keeping fingers crossed*

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Ok, I've got it now ...
Feb 22, 2006 5:17AM PST

From what I've found around the 'net, in order to watch HD content on my HD-ready TV (or HD monitor, as it can also be known as), I would need one of the following:

1. An HD cable box
2. An HD satellite box
3. An amplified antenna AND an HD receiver box

So, for me to watch HD content of any type, I would need some sort of STB.

For a TRUE HD television, all you need is an antenna or a cable to plug in the back of the TV, as it already has the capability to display and tune HD content.

Bummer for me.

-Terry

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Antenna selector
Feb 22, 2006 12:57PM PST

Go to www.antennaweb.org and type in your address. It will show you where the closest towers to you are and what size antenna you'll need to reach them. If you are near a major city you may luck out like I did. Otherwise, your best bet would be either cable or satellite. With all the digital channels I have around here, I have totally ditched cable and satellite!

And yes, you will need some sort of box to actually get the signal into the "monitor". I opted for a hidef PC Card which also allows me to time shift to the hard drive! It's about 9 gig an hour to capture so keep that in mind if you go that route.

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It depends
Feb 22, 2006 2:27AM PST

Well, it depends upon where you live, and what signals are being broadcast in HD. I was not expecting to be able to get anything except with an expensive antenna, but, just to try, I got some amplified rabbit ears. And, surprise! They worked. Not great, but its an 80% solution and I'm happy.

Go to
http://www.antennaweb.org and enter your address. It will tell you how far you are from stations, what you should be able to get, and what equipment you need.

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Yep
Feb 22, 2006 7:25AM PST

As I said on the podcast, you may need to tweak your old antenna to get it to work. The new antennas are configured for better reception. Sure I can plug VHF rabbit ears and get a signal, but it will pop in and out and it will be hard to point at the signal. An old circular UHF antenna would work even better because it's designed to pick up UHF. In fact you'll see some old UHF designs sold these days as HDTV antennas, but again they'r eharder to point.

I have the silver sensor which works really well. It's an indoor antenna
http://reviews.cnet.com/Silver_Sensor_Digital_HDTV_UHF_Indoor_Antenna_ZHDTV1/4505-6509_7-30471331.html
It retails for around $20 so it's not expensive. Great if you liv ein a city, won't do you much good too far away from the sources.

I haven't played with outdoor antennas much. Old outdoor antennas may work better at picking up digital signals.

Want to make the point that we're talking about antennas picking up digital broadcasts. All TV stations have to switch to digital broadcasts, they do not have to switch to high-def broadcasts. High-def is possible over a digital signal. Most broadcasters right now mix in HD and normal res digital content.

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Thanks Tom
Feb 22, 2006 1:03PM PST

You just had me worried on the podcast because it sounded to me like you were saying that you had to have one of the "special hdtv antennas" to receive the digital signals. I have seen these things marketed at extreamly high prices just because they slapped the HDTV on the side of the box. When it comes right down to it, it's just a standard UHF carrier which carries a digital signal.

To keep my neighbors happy my "outdoor" antenna is actually in my attic. Cuts out every now and then, but hey, the signal is free! Happy