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Need camcorder with audio input jack

To Boya84:

Regarding your reply (see below)
You seem to be convinced
by boya84 - 3/2/09 12:56 PM In reply to: Coming off the mixer by mrdallas1965
that coming off the board is how you will go. You can use splitters wherever you want. It will work to a point. If you are using wireless mics with 1/8" jacks, they are either REALLY good Sennheiser or Sony (pro grade) ENG wireless gear which use mini TRS connectors or cheap, low-end, consumer wireless lavs in FM or some other shared frequency.

If the wireless mics are getting to the board - and the board is feeding some PA speakers, I stand by the recommendation of not using the board. Just mic those PA speakers and don't worry about the rest of the stuff at the board.


Any recommendations as to adapaters that can be used to fit a TRS connector into the mic in on the camcorder?

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TRS connectors are like

In reply to: Need camcorder with audio input jack

XLR... three conductors rather than 2 (used by consumer-grade mics). This allows shielding in the cable to be protected from spurious electromagnetic and radio frequency interference.

So... you apparently don't like my recommendation to not record off the mains or use the AUX-out. Here's another method - presuming your mixer can do this, but since you still have not told us what it is, we have no idea... Use the mixer's headphone monitor. That is normally a 1/4" stereo jack. Radio Shack has 1/4" male stereo (plugs into the board's headphone jack) to two 1/4" female stereo jacks. The person recording gets to plug their headphones into one side, the camcorder is plugged into the other side with a 1/4" male (to the adapter on the board) to a 1/8" stereo (plugs into the camcorder).

This is NOT normal practice, but will be your easiest route out.

TEST THIS BEFORE THE EVENT to ensure the line signal does not over drive the camcorder audio in. If you are expecting to set up everything at the event and hope it magically works, you are setting yourself up for failure and no time to implement a contingency plan.

You still have not told us which audio mixer, which camcorder or which mics - manufacturer and model number are helpful. As well, since this is already being recorded offboard from the camcorder, it is unnecessary - Use the external recording. Import the audio from the external recording when the video is edited and mute the camcorder's audio. You are truly making this harder than it really is, unless there is more to this that you cannot or will not share.

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TRS connectors are like

In reply to: TRS connectors are like

The powered mixer is a Yamaha EMX 5000; the wireless mics are JocoPro VHF-3300. We do have some add'l mics that also have a TRS connectors. The only thing we wanted to prevent was any background noise (ie from the crowd) included on what was being picked up by the camcorder. That was the only reason we were looking an option other than putting a mic in front of the speakers.

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In reply to: TRS connectors are like

If the mics are in front of the speakers and pointing at the speakers, then the chances that they will get any crowd noise is low... You will get crowd noise if the crowd is between the mic and the speakers or if the mics are in front of the speakers pointing at the crowd.

Both the Yamaha EMX5000-12 and EMX5000-20 have two pre/post selectable monitor sends, one mono and two stereo outputs, so you have a choice without using any splitters. Or, as previously suggested, the headphone jack with a splitter if the sound person is using it. If the sound person is not using it, then no splitter needed.

And as also previously suggested, set it up and make it work well in advance of the event - so you have time to try something else if one method does not work.

I do not recommend splitting the mic jack feeding to the board and the camcorder.

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Just so we are clear

In reply to: Well...

Using a TRS connector with an adapter plugged into the Mic In on the camcorder and the other end be plugged into one of the various outputs - so that any mics connected to the mixer (inputs 1 -4), should get picked up by the camcorder...

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I am re-reading your post...

In reply to: Just so we are clear

What TRS adapter where? The outputs of that board do not specify TRS.

Sometimes the stereo outputs will be RCA... sometimes, the outputs will be XLR. So it will depend on what that board has...

That said, I still stand by the rest of my post and remove the mic-input split:

If you need a board feed, take a board feed. You already know I don't recommend this. But you have several options with that board.

If you insist on taking a board feed or otherwise touching the sound board, you MUST work with the person responsible for running the board BEFORE the event. Days or weeks before is preferable. You MUST test and verify that the camcorder is getting what it needs BEFORE the event. Days or weeks before is preferable.

Minutes or hours before is just asking for failure. You are currently on track to cause LOTS of unnecessary anxiety and may result in your not getting what you want.

You are making this way more difficult than it needs to be. Since you already told us that the audio is being recorded, just use that audio.[/]

I'll probably flag my own post for removal...

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The how to?

In reply to: I am re-reading your post...

It's not my intention to make this more difficult. The question I know have given your final comments, is how would I have the audio from the CD recorder added to the Camcorder & the DVD. To me that seems harder to accomplish than just having a mic plugged into the mic in on the camcorder.

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Most of the CD recorders

In reply to: The how to?

create MP3 or wav files. You won't add the audio to the camcorder. The "center of the world" is the edit process - the camcorder and CD recorder are merely feeding that.

The most difficult part will be synching the audio. At the event, when the sound person hits record, you hit record on the camcorder.

After importing the video from the camcorder to the computer and getting that into the video editor, insert the CD to the computer and copy the audio file to the computer editor. With the video edit project file open, drag the audio file to the audio track of the video editor. the start of the audio file and the start of the video file will be close... move the imported audio on the sound track until the echo goes away. Mute the audio that was imported with the video.

Export this video project to a high quality data file. Start a new video project and import this newly created video file. This is what you will edit for the final video project.

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Add'l Question

In reply to: Most of the CD recorders

I understand the reply below, but we haven't used a video editor or computer editor for any of our previous events. Any recommendations as to a particular program or software to use?

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You provide only unedited and no titles or credits?

In reply to: Add'l Question

Windows XP (SP2) or newer (including Vista) comes bundled with Moviemaker.

Mac OS9.2 or newer (including OSX) comes bundled with iMovie.

In one of your earlier posts, you said, "The venue is a small room (20 x 30) and we are using the equipment for recording cd's and dvd of church services."

Are you merely expecting that the DVD is produced by connecting the camcorder to a "direct to DVD burner" or are you expecting to transfer the video to the computer so a DVD authoring tool can be used? If you are going though the effort of doing the DVD authoring tool, there is not much of a back up step to use a video editor to clean it up.

I am still on the page of putting a mic in front of the PA speaker. 20 x 30 is not a large room. Do you already know the audio is bad if you used the camcorder mics? For someone so focused on getting the audio into the camcorder, you are not asking anything about the really important stuff... like lighting, camera placement, using white balance, tripod or other steadying device... does the room have a hard floor and walls (lots of echo) or does the room have carpeting on the floor or curtains on the walls? Why is is bad to hear the attendees?

Apparently, this audio and video stuff has been done before. Is audio the only problem?

And I came up with another option... get another wireless mic... one connects to the board as normal - the other connects to the camcorder... If you need multiple mics, how many? Using a portable mixer designed for use with a camcorder (and not one designed for use with a PA that is already tasked with doing two things - feeding the PA and feeding the CD recorder) is possible. juiceLink and BeachTek make good units.

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Audio Issues

In reply to: You provide only unedited and no titles or credits?

Yes the room is very small. Previous recordings were used with just the camcorder and recorded on a mini-disc. We use a copy machine and make copies to regular dvds from the mini-dics.

The issue we have faced is that the camcorders pick up attendees in the room. All we want to hear on the dvds is from the speaker.

The previous camcorder we used did not have a mic in, and therefore we returned it. We're looking to buy another but wanted to be sure the new one does what we want it to do. We a small church and therefore there is a limit on the cost we can spend on the camcorder.

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You have already established that the

In reply to: Audio Issues

audio from the camcorder is not acceptable which is why you want to change the way it is getting that audio. You had also mentioned that the audio is recorded separately. Is the audio from the audio recorder acceptable?

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Lack of Clarification

In reply to: You have already established that the

My apologies for the lack of clarification: We use a CD recorder for its intended purpose. This is what I meant when I spoke before about audio only, as we are only capturing/recording the speaker vs producing a DVD.
Recap: The two options proposed are (1) A mic in front of the speaker and going directly into the MIC IN on the camcorder and (2) Using a computer to sync up the audio & the DVD.

Now that you know we are using the CD recorder to capture the audio, is option 2 still viable? Or is another avenue we need to take?

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If it were me,

In reply to: You have already established that the

I would take the audio from the audio recorder - if you find that acceptable - remember, I have not heard it - and use it to replace the audio captured by the camcorder using a video editor on your computer.

No camcorder board mix needed, no discrete AUX-out connection needed for the camcorder, no cables or connections or y-cables or messing with picking a port on the board, no additional mic to pick up the PA (and the extension cable needed by that mic) and no being tied to a single spot with all the cables...

When you are confident with the single camera audio replacement, you can move to two or three camcorders shooting from different sides of the room (one in the center as the "safe shot" that ALWAYS has the wide angle stage and the other doing closeups) and editing a pretty nice project if you want to get into it.

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