Paris? Wow! Maybe the difference is that Clinton faked out his draft board with ROTC.
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Paris? Wow! Maybe the difference is that Clinton faked out his draft board with ROTC.
Hi, KP.
Kerry never claimed to have volunteered for the Army -- but he did Volunteer for VietNam, while Bush checked the "no foreign posting" box.
-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com
The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!
Who would you prefer to have as a buddy? Of course we know also that President Bush volunteered for that safe, comfy job of fighter pilot.
Here's a link to the actual article by Samuel Z. Goldhaber that was published in the Harvard Crimson.
Quite an interesting read, Link: http://www.thecrimson.com/article.aspx?ref=352185
And here's a portion of that article. Truly frightening to think that this is the Dem nominee:
Kerry said that the United Nations should have control over most of our foreign military operations. "I'm an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through the world only at the directive of the United Nations." (emphasis mine)
So sez John "I'm an internationalist" Kerry. As I've said before, this November we have two choices: you can vote for an American, or a Massachusetts leftist.
DE
JFK, he did something else just like his hero that never has received any notice--he purposely disobeyed orders.
"One time Kerry was ordered to destroy a Viet Cong village but disobeyed orders and suggested that the Navy Command simply send in a Psychological Warfare team to be friend the villagers with food, hospital supplies, and better educational facilities."
This was a known VC Ville, and any food or hospital supplies provided to such ALWAYS found their way into the use of the VC cadre sustaining their fight. Aid and Comfort...
'He does not feel there would be a massive slaughter of American, sympathizers once the United States pulled out (of Vietnam).' - As I recall, they didn't do all that well.
'Kerry said that the United Nations should have control over most of our foreign military operations. "I'm an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through the world only at the directive of the United Nations."' - the troops should love this one.
'Kerry wants "to almost eliminate CIA activity. The CIA is fighting its own war in Laos and nobody seems to care." He also favors a negative income tax and keeping unemployment at a very low level, "even if it means selective economic controls."' - so much for warnings about 9/11 and WMD
'In the summer of 1962, Kerry worked for Ted Kennedy, who was then making his first Senate bid.' - Maybe Teddy will yet be President (by proxy)
Not sure how this is meant relative to keeping unemployment low? paying people who are out of work? what?
Supporting some sort of UN authority is one thing, the following I find disturbing-
"...United Nations should have control over most of our foreign military operations. "I'm an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through the world only at the directive of the United Nations." "
Even supporting UN decisions with troops involved in multinational peace keeping forces doesn't mean we have to let the UN direct where our troops go. The world IMO isn't ready yet for a world government with it's own military force, and that is what this amounts to having.
I also realize this was all in 1970, however, he seems to be presently supporting the same ideas.
RogerNC
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com
the UN wanted troops in the US? What if they didn't like Kerry's policies.
One thing's for sure. I sure wouldn't want to be in the military.
Stepped in the mud or.... something!
I see a severe case of "buyer's remorse" coming along for this one. First it was almost Dean as the nominee, and now this one? Pitiful, absolutely pitiful....
More leftist than Ted Kennedy. And there's more, lots lots more....
Their best chance would have been with Lieberman. Granted, he's damaged goods ever since he prostituted himself when running with Gore, but I think he failed primarily because he was relatively conservative and there's no conservative/rational wing remaining in the leftist party. So they're a thing of the past, not to be taken seriously anymore. If I was a democrat I'd be contributing to Nader and campaigning for him right now.
DE
Makes ya wonder why, if Bush is SOOOOOOOO bad and could be so easily defeated (where IS that mainstream anyway??!! LOL), the Dems couldn't do any better than a Senator who hasn't even shown leadership in that body for a Candidate.
Evie ![]()
What's the big deal, Del? To me, the disctinction is still clear -- the politically connected Bush was let out of the Guard 9 months early to attend Harvard B-school; Kerry, lacking such pull, had his request denied and so went off to war and became a hero.
-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com
The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!
.
And later an ELECTED President of the United States!
8 months early to a cushy job as an aide to an Admiral in the Pentagon for incurring three "wounds" (two of which were very minor scratches most of us ignored and kept soldiering).
He did not become a "hero" as silver stars were handed out to junior officers like candy and it is difficult to find many who did not receive one.
While I will not call him a coward, I will state that he lacked cojones and contrived to leave the theater as soon as possible and for grounds he would most likely have disapproved for his own gunner.
6 month early discharge from his Navy Service. The Same Admiral he had been an aide for approved the request.
Dave, Bush put out his service and medical records. Where are Kerry's records? I'd like to see the details of those wounds.
Dave, it's like that Harvard Crimson article that just hit the spotlight, these things are now in "play", and won't go away.
You can yell Bush, Bush, Bush until you're blue in the face, Dave, that won't deflect or or prevent the Where's Kerry's info question or the questions raised by that article.
It's not the official medical records, but Urban Legends Reference Pages: Politics (Service Mettle) does give some information about the wounds and the medals.
I cannot make any informed comment about how these wounds compare to those of other Purple Heart recipients or whether other sailors took advantage of the Navy policy regarding 3 purple hearts. I also do not know whether any of the other service branches have/had similar policies.
I'm missing something here, Bill. The story said, "Although there was no hard-and-fast rule, U.S. military procedure generally allowed any serviceman who received three Purple Hearts to request reassignment away from a combat zone, so Kerry talked to Commodore Charles F. Horne, an administrative official and commander of the coastal squadron in which he served. Four days after Kerry took his third hit of shrapnel, Horne forwarded a request on Kerry's behalf to the Navy Bureau of Personnel asking that Kerry be reassigned to "duty as a personal aide in Boston, New York, or Washington, D.C.".
Kerry talked to Commodore Horne about a transfer to U.S. duty before he had that qualifying 3rd purple heart, or did I miss something?
The site may be guilty of bad writing, but the way that they wrote it makes it sound like he went to Horme to inquire about a transfer before he had that third, qualifying, purple heart. After, I could understand, but before raised my eyebrows.
being put up for the purple heart, and receiving official conferring of the purple heart?
Just asking as I don't have military experience, much less experience in such things in a combat area like Vietnam.
Reading your post, then the article again, made me wonder if he went to confirm the eligibility before the third wound too. But while thinking about the situation, wondered if he might have gone to get it 'lined out' between getting the third wound and official confirmation of receit of third purple heart?
RogerNC
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com
Snopes also mentions PCF 94 and Kerry but the Department of the Navy would probably be surprised as his PCF command was 66. The Frederick Alan Short, GMG3 mentioned was gunner on PCF 66
Edward Robert "Tedd" Peck, LTJG, OinC of PCF 94 would likely also have been upset had he known he had Kerry aboard as supercargo.
The Navy thinks Kerry was riding PCF 66 out of An Thoi during the period 10/68-4/69
Snope's "proofs" are not necessarilly as well researched and "true" as they would have one believe.
Edward, I've noticed a couple of questionable "rulings" at that site myself in the past. Sometimes I'm surprised by something that they don't cover in their subjects.
BTW, Edward, did you notice that they bought the he threw his ribbons excuse for the "boomerang medals" situation and then mentioned his testifying before the Senate? Remember, those ribbons were on his fatigues that he wore in the pictures of that event. Oops, Snopes.
Note how easily he ended his service early.
The more it should be clear to those not decided absolutely to hate one position or the other that these things are similair enough to suspect that neither was unusual procedure at the time.
And as such, while background on candidates is important, it's also necessary to keep in mind how long ago such was, and what has been the history of each right up till now.
I really don't see how any accusation of Bush being connected varies much from Kerry acheiving his early transfer and personally suspect that such was quite common during Vietnam for those that could.
Busy left guard early to go to school, Kerry got out of Vietnam early. Both worked the rules to get what they wanted. Shrug. Kerry volunteered after not getting a year's deferral.
I don't see that volunteering in itself makes him that great. It also doesn't mean a lot he applied for a year's delay, even if he hoped Vietnam might be winding down before he went into service.
Sorry, but I think both sides are exaggerating to paint the other evil.
RogerNC
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com