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Mexico slams proposal to send U.S. troops to guard border

by Mark5019 / May 25, 2005 2:44 AM PDT

A Mexican official said Monday his government "absolutely and emphatically" rejects militarizing the border, in response to a report by a U.S. congressional caucus claiming that 36,000 National Guard troops posted on the border could stop undocumented migration.

Responding to a 33-page report, written by investigators for the Congressional Immigration Reform Caucus and cited by the Washington Times, Assistant Interior Secretary Geronimo Gutierrez said it "didn't seem to be a very intelligent way" to handle the problem.


not intelegent lol seems to me if there stopped its very inteligent.

http://kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=3385297

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You know...
by C1ay / May 25, 2005 2:56 AM PDT

I really don't mind the mexicans that much. Here in Atlanta they do a lot of jobs no one else wants to do and that helps keep prices down. I don't mean that they're doing bad or nasty jobs either. My closest McDonald's is about 98% mexican. I can remember when I wouldn't go there because there would only be two people working and you couldn't get your food for 15 or 20 minutes. Now the service is there and the prices are stable. I also see them doing a lot of labor jobs on construction sites that job foremen have a hard time filling.

What I do mind is everyone else that would use the mexican border to access the country because it is so easy to get across. Terrorists can easily use that border to put us in harm's way. As a libertarian I am inclined to favor open borders but terrorism is changing they way I feel about it.

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Clay, remember when we pointed with pride to having the
by Dave Konkel [Moderator] / May 25, 2005 3:06 AM PDT
In reply to: You know...

longest undefended borders in the world? The terrorists have already won -- their goal was to destroy the American way of life, and in terms of the easiy-going, open society that existed in August 2001, that way of life no longer exists. Sadly, we did most of the dirty work for them, completely ignoring Ben Franklin's warning about the inverse relationship between liberty and security.

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

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Even if so
by Roger NC / May 25, 2005 3:25 AM PDT
having the longest undefended borders in the world? The terrorists have already won -- their goal was to destroy the American way of life, and in terms of the easiy-going, open society that existed in August 2001, that way of life no longer exists.

So we should ignore undocumented border crossings of all types? Come on Dave, we all know that's irresponsible. Heck, even without Islamic extremists declaration of war on the US, there are plenty that used the unguarded border to hurt the USA.

Sadly, you can only have an unguarded border if the people on both sides aren't that interested in taking from the other.

And the real problem here isn't Mexican's perse (even if I rather have more documented work visas rather than illegal undocumented workers). It's those that would use them to disguise others, spys, bombers, poisoners, terrorists of all stripes.

Sadly, we did most of the dirty work for them, ...

Maybe so, and some of the rules are a bit too much, some are too little. What would you rather we do? just beg them to let us live in peace?

Yes, it's changed, and probably not all for the better. But we could hardly ignore it like we did after all the other attacks agaist the USA (first Towers bombing, embassies around the world, the USS Cole).

Basically we're at war, a guerilla war perhaps in nature, but they declared war on the USA. Do you expect not to have differences during such a conflict? unfortunately it may last much longer than a war of countries, since a shadow empire is harder to hit than a geographical based government.

JMO

Roger

click here to email semods4@yahoo.com
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Hi, Roger.
by Dave Konkel [Moderator] / May 25, 2005 3:35 AM PDT
In reply to: Even if so

I think there's a happy medium -- it's definitely not an easy question. And I think that those Americans who dislike foreigners are using security concerns as an argument to achieve what they previously couldn't. But mainly I'm lamenting a society changed forever, and not at all for the better, IMCO.

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

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Yes changed forever
by Roger NC / May 25, 2005 3:48 AM PDT
In reply to: Hi, Roger.
But mainly I'm lamenting a society changed forever, and not at all for the better, IMCO.


I'm sure everyone that died, injured or had family and friends killed or injured on 9/11 will agree.

And the same for those in Afganistan, Iraq, the USS Cole, embassy bombings, I'm sure they'd agree changed forever, and not for the best.

Sadly, while you and I are much responsible for our lives, we've not always got a choice about how others will affect us. Given a choice between a "less open" society, and the destruction of more USA property and loss of US citizen lives, over and over, rather than not trying something because it may not be the best approach, I may well fall back on the idea of doing something even if it's wrong.

Sometimes you have to consider, debate, and plan. Sometimes you have to act, even if later you have to apologize and figure out the best you can to fix mistakes.

Passive resistance only succeeds if the opponent has moral objections to unoppose slaughter. As great a man as Ghandi was, his passive reistance would have meant little to an enemy force headed by a Hitler or Stalin.

I fear the Islamic extremists (along with others less numerous probably) would not hesitate in the least to destroy the USA completely by any method they could. From physical destruction by bombs, germ warfare, or poison gas to complete collapse of our economy and supersturcture by any means possible, they want us destroyed, not just withdrawn from anywhere.

Beating the swords into plowshares only works when everyone does it. I'm exempting the expected by many Earthly reign by the Son of God, or other dieties actually taking day to day charge.

Otherwise, it's a sad fact that the earth the meek shall inherit is 6 foot of soil over them.

JMO

Roger

click here to email semods4@yahoo.com
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well make it harder for them but
by Mark5019 / May 25, 2005 3:59 AM PDT
In reply to: Hi, Roger.

you dont want the gov. to act tough do you heaven forbid we stopped the flow of illeagles plus maybe stop worse?

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Something else to remember
by Angeline Booher / May 26, 2005 12:50 AM PDT

There was a lot of concern expressed about illegals long before 9/11, and also about those who employed them, and the sweat shops. They were said to be a drain on resources for services, such as schools and medical care, for a long time.

Illegal trafficking by professionals who charge a tidy sum to get them across, then abandon them in the desert has gone on for years.

I agree with Clay re: their work ethic. One worked on my house. I encouraged him to learn English. (Which, BTW, I wish all would do.) I admit to feeling sorry for a people who were victims of generations of corrupt governments.

I also agree that changes became necessary after 9/11.

Angeline


click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

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Canadian Bacon.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / May 25, 2005 3:30 AM PDT

Hmm, what would be the movie title for the other border?

Bob

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(NT) (NT) Mexican jumping beans?
by Dave Konkel [Moderator] / May 25, 2005 3:36 AM PDT
In reply to: Canadian Bacon.
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(NT) (NT) hot tamale?
by Mark5019 / May 25, 2005 3:59 AM PDT
In reply to: Canadian Bacon.
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Let's see, we hate Blacks because
by Jerry562 / May 25, 2005 3:52 AM PDT

they are lazy and won't work, we hate Mexicans because they take all our jobs and work too cheap, right?

Exactly what is the correct amount of work a man should do, and how much should he charge so the racists can sleep well at night?

If you lived in Mexico, you would want a better life here too, I know I would. By coming here, Mexicans don't want to hurt us, they want to share this wonderful country. Most all of them are Catholic, if you want to exclude someone, find a people who have been raised to think they will go to heaven if they kill Americans and keep their butts away from me and mine.

Mexicans agree with us, our government is way better than theirs. Here is my plan, Put some Mexicans to work, hire Mexicans to line the border on their side of the line and keep the borders secure and not let anyone cross. They work way cheaper than our servicemen, think about, no due process, no juries, just beat or kill the people trying to cross. We'd save a fortune.

Does the government have a suggestion box, I'd like a piece of what that would save us.

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if the people enter legally no probs
by Mark5019 / May 25, 2005 4:00 AM PDT

but to come here make money and not pay taxes is ok with you?

not me let them stay in mexico then

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Well I agree the sheer numbers
by Jerry562 / May 25, 2005 10:08 AM PDT

coming in are beyond what we can absorb and not feel the pinch, we need to set our government right first.

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(NT) (NT) You're kidding, right?
by Dan McC / May 25, 2005 4:34 AM PDT
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(NT) (NT) About what?
by Jerry562 / May 25, 2005 10:09 AM PDT
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About your plan to
by Dan McC / May 25, 2005 11:27 PM PDT
In reply to: (NT) About what?

organize a mercenary force to place at US borders in foreign countries.

Dan

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a mercenary force ???
by jonah jones / May 26, 2005 1:23 AM PDT
In reply to: About your plan to

i didn't read it that way dan....

what is wrong with offering the mexican government 38,000x$x per month for the mexicans to guard the mexican border?

keep mexican illegals OUT and allow mexican legals IN....


.

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A very sad choice of words, I figure.
by caktus / May 25, 2005 6:03 AM PDT

When will we speak of folks as folks rather than Mexican's, Black?s, or any discriminatory label?

We have our slums and Government of 'not' the people as well.

What should being "Catholic" have to do with it?

Of all people's the mission of some is to hurt others.
______________________________________________________

"no due process, no juries, just beat or kill the people"

Don't we have more of that than we can handle as it is?

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My reply, hope you understand.
by Jerry562 / May 25, 2005 10:23 AM PDT

A very sad choice of words, I figure.

(Blacks and Mexicans (and a lot worse) are terms used everyday. I don't get your point.)

When will we speak of folks as folks rather than Mexican's, Black?s, or any discriminatory label?

(Guarding the border to keep folks out was never mentioned, keeping Mexicans out was the point I was replying to.)

We have our slums and Government of 'not' the people as well.

(Sorry, I don't understand that statement. Are you saying that Americans are crossing the border into Mexico?)

What should being "Catholic" have to do with it?

(As I mentioned, Catholics are the polar opposite to people that were raised to believe that killing Americans will get them 44 virgins in heaven.)

Of all people's the mission of some is to hurt others.

(Who is doing that? Me? What did I do?)
______________________________________________________

"no due process, no juries, just beat or kill the people"

Don't we have more of that than we can handle as it is?

(Give me a break, that is what their government would do, I never said we would. Get a grip, we take pregnant illegals into our hospitals in Brownsville, TX and aid them with $500,00.00+ difficult childbirths at taxpayers expense, and send welfare checks to their Mexican address when the American citizens mother takes the baby home.)

You got the wrong guy if you are looking to blame someone.

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RE: What did I do?
by caktus / May 25, 2005 2:56 PM PDT

''we hate Blacks''
''we hate Mexicans''

Just think these were a poor choice of words regarding ''we''.
______________________________________________________

''Sorry, I don't understand''

Sorry, by
''If you lived in Mexico, you would want a better life here too'' and ''no due process, no juries, just beat or kill the people'' figured you were infering that Mexico is just slum with no scence of sevility.

As for the reference to religion I figure it's well passed time we learn to not worry about what others wish to believe and concern our selves with what individuals 'do'. I figure the most prevelent reason religions exist is simply to divide and conquer one another.

And as for ''What did I do?'' Voiced some sarcasm as we all do. I was pretty sure you didn't mean alot of that stuff litterally.

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I am very sorry that some people
by Jerry562 / May 25, 2005 8:42 PM PDT
In reply to: RE: What did I do?

couldn't follow my post in support of the Mexicans desire for a better life, and my admission that I would want more for my family too. I could start writing a few grades lower and use smaller words on this list.

I intentionally used ''we hate Blacks''
''we hate Mexicans'' to setup the criticism for the racists comments I've heard many times. You can see that? Amazing, blinded by PC or what? I am supportive of the problems of Mexico.

As far as it being a wonderful country, how about President Fox coming up with a solution to the problem, it's his people that are bailing out of the country, and he doesn't want to arm the border or want us to do it. He could come up with a plan to upgrade the lifestyle of his people.

-------- You said ---------
As for the reference to religion I figure it's well passed time we learn to not worry about what others wish to believe and concern our selves with what individuals 'do'.
--------

So you think that people that were brainwashed since birth to believe that American should be killed to gain favors in heaven make equally good citizens as Mexican Catholics looking for a better life? Amazing.. Absolutely amazing. What the terrorists do is kill men, women and children. What mexicans do is work hard for little money.

I'm logging off this conference permanently because of views and confusion like yours, and attacks on me when I'm supporting the problems of the Mexican people and you are so confused you have me being the bad guy. Absolutely amazing how confused some of you are.

Picture me waving Bye-bye on your level.

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