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McCain now using the ''hate calls'' he

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what is false in the calls?

is it illegal?

what is the full message in these calls?

are the calls in the 2008 campaign: "hate calls"?

is that your definition or someone else?


one would need the full message to decide if what you are saying is accurate.

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Actually it does appear that some may be illegal
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/16/massive-rnc-robocall-may_n_135348.html

Several readers in Minnesota also reported receiving the call, which could be a violation of that state's laws. Explains Shaun Dakin, CEO & Founder of the National Political Do Not Contact Registry:

"Most robocalls are supposed to have two things, "paid for by X" and a phone number of the group making the call. Most do that. Now, that being said, there are some states that have their own robocall laws and they are much stricter. Minnesota pretty much bans robocalls entirely unless they are introduced by a human voice. And that pretty much never happens because it defeats the point."


As for their accuracy -- the stuff about Ayers is greatly exaggerated. Obama did not "work closely" with Ayers at any time. They served on the same board of a charitable foundation -- a board that also had several conservative members.

McCain remains friendly with G. Gordon Liddy by the way, a convicted felon. When confronted about it, McCain says that Liddy "served his time and paid his debt." Well, so did Ayers. And Liddy is still just as unapologetic about his past actions as Ayers has been. So this whole line of attack is a bit hypocritical if you ask me.
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I read the same

but I do not think the McCain campaign needs to or would go the illegal route. as this plot is thickening it could be Democratic operatives or make-believe to cast stones at the Republicans. the calls are being made somehow in any case.

bringing attention to Ayers is probably more effective than Liddy. I was in my 20s when they both made headlines. one of my best friends went to high school with Ayers in Glen Ellen, Il I believe. there goes my Presidential ambitions because I am a friend of one of Ayers' classmates.

the reason it may be more effective is that Obama is the 'unknown' in this race. McCain has a long public record. Liddy doesn't raise my eyebrow. I probably would not associate with Liddy myself.

and both camps are hypocritical; otherwise Liddy would not be dragged into the equation by the Obama campaign. let's call it hypopoliticral. these campaigns are run by tough guys and gals. you know the type: "move or get out of the way!"

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Josh, what debt DID Bill Ayers pay?

The answer: NONE!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers

By 1976 or 1977, with federal charges against both fugitives (ayers and Bernadine Dohrn) dropped due to prosecutorial misconduct...

Further research indicates that the FBI wanted to refile the charges, but by that time the Carter Administration had come to power and no one at the Department of Justice was interested in revisiting the case (surprise!).

This is NOT to excuse the very real misconduct that occurred in the era of Nixon and COINTELPRO; all I wish to point out is that Mr. Ayers wasn't even prosecuted.

"Paid his debts," my backside! If Mr. Ayers wishes to make proper amends, why not start by publicly AND privately apologizing to the families of those killed or injured by the Weather Underground's puerile attempt at revolution?

I'm sorry, I forgot; Mr Ayers told the New York Times in an interview that "we didn't do enough." I wonder if Mr. Ayers thought that the other terrorists who were active on the day of that interview's publication - September 11, 2001 (you might remember that date) - had done enough...

Spare me the nonsense, Josh; I know you're better than that.

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(NT) Wikipedia? Really? :-(
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You're right, he didn't do any time

However....

If Mr. Ayers wishes to make proper amends, why not start by publicly AND privately apologizing to the families of those killed or injured by the Weather Underground's puerile attempt at revolution?

That wouldn't take very long:

http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/obama/902213,CST-NWS-ayers18.article

Ayers, 63, spent 10 years as a fugitive in the 1970s when he was part of the "Weather Underground," an anti-Vietnam War group that protested U.S. policies by bombing the Pentagon, U.S. Capitol and a string of other government buildings. Nobody was hurt in the attacks by the defunct organization, which the FBI labeled a "domestic terrorist group."

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The difference is....

about a wide as a traffic ticket is from treason.

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So you're analogizing Liddy's crimes...

...to a traffic ticket? So if someone breaks into your house, you'd just expect him to be issued a citation?

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(NT) can you detail his crimes?
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Conspiracy, burglary and illegal wiretapping

He was sentenced to 20 years in prison, a sentence later commuted by Jimmy Carter.

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so, you have the Democrats to thank for that one.

That considered, hardly can blame McCain for also forgiving him?

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Forgiveness?

Is that what this is about? Anyone can forgive anyone else for anything. Obama can forgive Ayers for the things he did too, right?

Liddy has been unrepentant about his acts, as has Ayers. So why is the standard being applied to Ayers not being applied to Liddy?

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maybe because he was punished

and Ayers never was. Do feel Ayers should ever pay for his crimes against America? Do you feel Ayers has paid his "debt" to America? Do you feel Liddy didn't pay a "debt" for his crimes? Also can you distinquish between crimes of violence such as Ayers was associated with and a crime of burglary such as Liddy was involved with?

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So you have to be punished to be forgiven?

As in imprisonment? I guess that means you have not forgiven Richard Nixon.

Both men committed felonies. Both men are unrepentant about committing those felonies. So why is it OK for McCain to openly call Liddy a friend but not for Obama to have had a passing association with Ayers?

BTW I don't think either "association" matters as far as the election goes -- just wondering why one matters but the other doesn't to you.

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I can't believe you are STILL equating...

What Liddy did to what Ayers did. A whole different magnitude there.

Sad.

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I'm not equating what they did...

....although they did both commit acts that were intended to subvert our democracy.

They are both unrepentant felons. And again, I think BOTH are irrelevant to the election.

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Double wrong

Liddy's actions wer not intended to subvert our democracy. You are inflating it way beyonds what it was.

Ayers is VERY relevant to this election, no matter how much you guys try to sweep him under the carpet. I can't believe you could even think about voting for someone who was that close to a domestic terrorist. It's really stunning.

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Colin Powell disagrees with you, Ed

And I think I'll go along with thoughts expressed by the former Secretary of State and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs.

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I think you'll go along with thoughts....

that agree with your preconceptions regardless of rationality.

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That's hilarious coming from you

Really Ed, if Obama wins, are you gonna be OK?

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Why is it hilarious?

We both know if Powell had endorsed McCain you'd find reasons to disagree with him. You think you're fooling someone?

I'll be fine if Obama wins, but that is neither here nor there. I'll know I made the right decision. Question is, considering Obama's dodgy past and his associations with various not some wonderful people, how can you justify voting for him? Gotta really be holding your nose and doing back flips at theh same time.

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Hilarious (to me) coming from someone....

.....who still insists "lipstick on a pig" was a swipe at Sarah Palin's gender or that Palin would make a fine President if she had to take over on January 21, 2009. If she was a Democrat you'd be ripping her to pieces (justifiably) and you know it.

Yes, if Powell had endorsed McCain I would disagree. I would not be attacking Powell's character over it though, which is what is being done to him now.

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So the fact that I am not blind to reality...

bothers you? Anyway you mischaracterize what I was saying about the lipstick issue. It was not a swipe at her "gender". It was a swipe at HER. And I believe you know it was. No one is really so naive as to think it was just an innocent coincidence.

I have not attacked Powell's character. Why bring that up? It has nothing to do with me.

I notice you skipped over the issue of Obama's unfitness for office. Maybe the conscience will come through in the end.

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Nixon was punished.

He was driven from office. I know that's not enough in your book since you think he wasn't punished, but President Ford felt it had been enough.

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He didn't go to prison, James

That's what we were talking about.

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Ethics laws?

While Acorn is trying to steal the election? Get real! Obama showed his integrity when he welshed on a promise to accept financial limits on funding.

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Do you really expect Obama to keep his word?

Whatever it takes to get elected, or as socialist like to think of it, "seize power".

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Do you think...

Do you think that the media will investigate the taxes of Chris Shoff's chiropractic practice, like they did with Joe the Plumber?

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I give that a big...NOPE

'Chris the Chiropractor' does not have the same panache.

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What hate calls?

The article says "appears". Has McCain said he is making such calls?

Even if he were, they are clearly not hate calls. They are merely disseminating descriptive information.

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