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Mary Cheney + Lesbian Lover = Baby. Miracle???

by James Denison / December 7, 2006 1:26 AM PST

Hardly a miracle, but more like a travesty for the child as it grows up in such a "union".

Conservative leaders voiced dismay Wednesday at news that Mary Cheney, the lesbian daughter of **** Cheney, is pregnant, while a gay-rights group said the vice president faces "a lifetime of sleepless nights" for serving in an administration that has opposed recognition of same-sex couples.(more at link)

Mary Cheney, 37, and her partner of 15 years, Heather Poe, 45, are expecting a baby in late spring, said Lea Anne McBride, a spokeswoman for the vice president.

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better to be in a loveing famially
by Mark5019 / December 7, 2006 3:30 AM PST

then some of these batter children from the so caled norm

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They've been together for 15 years....
by Josh K / December 7, 2006 4:40 AM PST

....which is a lot longer than many male-female marriages last. It sounds like this child will be raised in a loving, stable home, which is a better deal than a lot of children of straight couples get.

The one and only time I ever felt any empathy towards **** Cheney was during a town-hall discussion in which he was asked to defend Bush's views on gay marriage in light of the fact that he had a gay daughter. Cheney stood by the President, as is his job, but you could see how much it pained him to do it.

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The sad questions of a child
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 5:30 AM PST

yes, it could be any child without a known father, but just imagine
the feelings of the child asking them as she or he sees other children
being hugged by their fathers, or having a daddy to be there in elementary
school on Dad's Day.

Do I have a daddy?
Where is my daddy?
Does my daddy love me?
Can I see my daddy?
Why doesn't my daddy come see me?
Does my daddy know about me?
Other children say you can't be born without a daddy, is that true?
Where did you meet my daddy?
Did my daddy leave you?
Did my daddy marry a different mommy?
Does my daddy have other children?
Does my daddy see his other children?
Why can't my daddy come see me too?
Why does other Mommy get mad I ask about Daddy?
Why do I have two mommies?
Which mommy's tummy was I in?
Are you my real mommy?
Mean little Joey said I might marry my brother. Do I have a brother?
I wish my daddy loved me.
If I can't have a daddy, I hate daddies.
Can I "marry" my best girlfriend when I grow up too?
My friend is so lucky. She has a daddy.
I wish I had a daddy too.

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You make it sound like no child was ever
by Diana Forum moderator / December 7, 2006 5:41 AM PST

raised by a single mother caused by death or divorce.

Are you saying that Kim's daughters are going to be ruined because he isn't there for them?

All these questions can be answered. Having raised two boys by myself, I know that most dads don't get to elementary school. Most are moms.


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ruined , no...confused, yes
by jonah jones / December 7, 2006 7:39 PM PST

"well dear, that lady over there is your daddy" or "no dear, you don't have a daddy, but you do have two mummys"


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Can't agree with you on this one Jonah. At some point,
by Ziks511 / December 8, 2006 2:48 AM PST

fairly early, they'll have to explain that there are two Mummys because they love each other and that's just how things turned out. More important is that the child is loved by both, and that the child sees that both parents love each other.

We're way past the 20's when my father was told that the early death of his father was a judgement from God by the Presbyterian minister, or even the 50's when my wife's family had a hard time because their father died young too. They were raised by a mother who worked 2 jobs most of the time, and a Grandmother. My wife was about 15 months when he died, of colon cancer. Think there's a link between that event and my wife being an endoscopist, cause I sure do?

And a lot of kids on the Kibbutz are raised almost communally, and that doesn't seem to hurt them.


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(NT) your comparing 'day-care' with lesbian couples....
by jonah jones / December 8, 2006 12:19 PM PST
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A little history lesson, James
by TONI H / December 7, 2006 6:32 AM PST

My father was a drunk who beat my mother regularly...he sexually abused my older sister....he picked drunken fights in bars just to prove how tough he was (he wasn't and got his a.. kicked regularly along with his head kicked in a number of times).

My sisters and I grew up as Catholics...took all the sacraments, etc. We lived in a very Catholic neighborhood. Once my mother divorced my father and he stopped even coming to see us girls, the neighbors refused to let their kids play with those 'dirty Catholics' because my MOTHER went against the church laws and got out of the marriage. It was OK with the church and those neighbors though that my dad was like he was as long as he was on the 'scene' and 'in the picture'.

Every question you asked in your post are questions that every single child abandoned by/deserted by their fathers or had their fathers die in a war, a car accident, or by sickness asks when they are small. After a while, they actually KNOW the answer and they don't need to ask anymore.....but none of those kids ever die or are forever traumatized by that knowledge, James. Kids are tougher and more resilient than you give them credit for....and reason is because the parent they have left gives them the love they need and that covers the 'gray' areas better than anything else.

At least in some cases, they won't grow up to be 'just like their father' when that father's daily behavior is influencing their judgment and beliefs into adulthood, just to satisfy YOUR requirment that 'daddy' should be around.

Get a grip on reality......


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Grip on reality
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 6:38 AM PST

The grip on reality is to realize that one bad situation does not justify
nor give adequate defense to another. We do not decide one situation is
OK because we can find one that may be worse. There is an ideal of course
and everything lesser situation is unfortunate, and some are and should be

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since when is being raised
by Mark5019 / December 7, 2006 6:42 AM PST
In reply to: Grip on reality

by 2 people whom love you
no wonder the world sucks closed mind and bigitory

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The right kind of bigotry
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 6:47 AM PST

If being right means being called a bigot, we should all go there.
Better it is to be considered a righteous bigot than a perverted sinner.
Truth is, those who endorse such "unions" and then toss out words like
bigot, don't recognize their own bigotry against doing and living what's
right, against God himself too.

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(NT) I am bigoted against self-righteous bigots
by Diana Forum moderator / December 7, 2006 6:51 AM PST
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Me too!
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 6:55 AM PST

I prefer the truly righteous ones.

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The problem is.....
by Angeline Booher / December 7, 2006 7:24 AM PST
In reply to: Me too!
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(NT) Hear! hear!
by Dan McC / December 7, 2006 10:20 PM PST
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and then look at yourself
by Mark5019 / December 7, 2006 7:26 AM PST

better a child loved by 2 in your so called sin

then a chil beaten by your proper couple

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Why always twist it in that manner?
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 7:30 AM PST

Why always point to something also bad in order to try and justify another
wrong? Almost without exception, when it comes to the subject of illicit sex
and homosexual encounters, the first thing someone does is try to use
any improper heterosexual actions to justify the error they wish others to
endorse. Constantly they try to justify one wrong with another. I see it as
a very telling sign that in their heart they also know they are wrong.

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There are good and bad parents of all
by Diana Forum moderator / December 7, 2006 7:45 AM PST

sexual orientations. I don't think it makes that much difference.

What is important is whether the couple want and will love and care for the children. The rest is irrelevant.


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(NT) I totally agree !
by Angeline Booher / December 7, 2006 7:59 AM PST
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why condemn all the homosexuals
by Mark5019 / December 7, 2006 8:43 AM PST

i think your a homophob

not trying to be nasty but you seem to be so fast to condemn these people are you that insecure in your Man hood? i mean James your perfectly safe you know.

but you rather ignore the facts of child beatings, and exploitation by "heterosexuals". if these people can raise a child and show love

who the hell do you think you are your not god

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I take it you are Athiest?
by John.Wilkinson / December 7, 2006 1:05 PM PST

Why so quick to condemn? Because God condemns homosexuality. This is the case with most religions, ranging from Roman Catholics to Orthadox Jews to Sikhs. To accept and even encourage homosexuality is to go against God. I do not claim to be God, but I do claim to stand by him and gollow his word. If that makes me an insecure bigot then so be it, but this insecure bigot is going to heaven to be with God, not feel his wrath.


The opinions expressed above are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET.

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As I mentioned to James
by TONI H / December 7, 2006 8:44 PM PST

"but this insecure bigot is going to heaven to be with God, not feel his wrath."

The radical Muslims/Islams who are killing any and all democratic western-believer and their own fellow man/woman/child any way they can are using exactly the same 'excuse' for their behavior and attitudes. They are using religion to excuse it, John.

Which group do you think will get to heaven in the long run first since both groups don't practice Christianity or peaceful attitudes toward their fellowman?

Nobody said you had to support or condone Cheney's lifestyle...I do believe though that she and others like her have the right to live in peace without YOUR wrath (or James' or others like him). Everyone, everywhere has that right and we will ALL answer to God (no matter what that entity is called by each individual). Until then, it's not for you to decide who's worthy, any more than it's up to radicals in other parts of the world to decide our fate and existence worthiness either and try to use religion to do it.


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Granted, but...
by John.Wilkinson / December 8, 2006 1:53 AM PST

I do not approve of all the violence, be it the terrorist attacks 'in the name of Allah' or a group of guys beating a homosexual in a dark alley 'in the name of God.' The Ten Commandments forbid the murder of others, and Jesus taught peace to his followers, not violence. Thus, neither group is 'in the right,' regardless of how they attempt to twist the words of God, and both groups will be punished on Judgement Day. However, the violent actions of radical and extremist groups do NOT make the lifestyles of homosexuals any less sinful.

Now, I too believe that all individuals have the right to live in peace. Ideally I would prefer it all to remain out of the public eye. I would not have to see headlines of homosexual unions, parades down the city streets, etc, which I find to be sickening and sacreligious. At the same time, though, there would not be editorials publicly bashing them, threat letters, and violent attacks against them. In short, I would greatly prefer it if they simply stayed 'in the closet,' keeping their personal beliefs to themselves. The moment I try to go to work and find the city street blocked by a 'gay pride parade' with them professing their beliefs I have every right to pronounce my beliefs, condemning them as God and the Bible does. If they want me to keep that behind closed doors THEN SO SHOULD THEY. There shall NOT be a double-standad there.


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No doubt all bigots think....
by Josh K / December 7, 2006 10:19 PM PST

...their particular bigotry is "right" or they would try to change their thinking.

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Okay Mark !!! Sorry I missed this on my first pass.Right on.
by Ziks511 / December 8, 2006 9:52 AM PST

As you say, the only issue is commitment to the child, and one another in order to offer a stable environment.


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Bad Situation?
by TONI H / December 7, 2006 6:52 AM PST
In reply to: Grip on reality

Who are you to decide that raising a child in that environment makes it a bad situation and that Cheney has no right to have a child? If we were to go back through your personal family history and discovered something distasteful to us personally, would we have the right to take your children from you because we decided that YOUR environment was a bad situation? Or would/should you be excused because you are heterosexual and 'on the scene'? Cheney is NOT doing anything criminal, so where's the problem, other than in your own head?

I'm not justifying her situation...I'm saying she has a RIGHT to it, just as much as you have a right to yours. She appears to have a relationship that's a hell of a lot more stable and steady than a number of male/female couples have. More power to her and her partner. They don't seem to be as hung up on YOUR relationship as you are with THEIRS.


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What would help
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 7:03 AM PST
In reply to: Bad Situation?

What would help would be law banning sperm donor banks outright. Anyone
not married but wishing to conceive can do it the old fashioned way or
forego it. We need laws that require the father of each child to be registered
and when one reaches an age where they might become sexually active, they
should be able to discover who their father is, and who their half siblings
are. The latter could avoid the situation of accidental incest, and beside the
moral considerations of such, the genetic weakening caused by inbreeding.
Of course there would still be those situations where the father was not
known, but I believe there's a responsibility to provide children with
the knowledge of their genetic background and familial origins.

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What stone age are you living in, James?
by TONI H / December 7, 2006 7:13 AM PST
In reply to: What would help

Your knuckle dragging is showing badly.......

"The old fashioned way" is the ONLY way you would have women without husbands be able to have children????? But then you wouldn't have a problem with her running the risk of STD's, that could conceivably then be passed on to the baby itself???? But then again, that would be HER fault for wanting to have a child out of wedlock and NOT the man's fault for passing that STD along in the first place, right?

Your solution sounds a little bit on the "it's so easy a caveman could do it" side........

I don't believe that every man who fathers a child via sperm bank should be registered so that some child later in life could knock on his door; however, I DO believe that every sperm bank donor should give a complete medical history that can be verified by the bank before donating so THAT information can be given to the prospective mother for medical reasons ONLY. They don't need familial origins or genetic backgrounds....that would be cause for bigotry down the future road when it's not necessary.


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Oh yeah....
by TONI H / December 7, 2006 7:15 AM PST

the chances of 'accidental incest' regarding sperm donor children is nearly non-existent.....whereas DELIBERATE incest shows up in heterosexual relationships a whole HELL of a lot....and yet you advocate THOSE relationships heavily.


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Trauma speaking
by James Denison / December 7, 2006 7:26 AM PST
In reply to: Oh yeah....

I can understand the situation you faced growing up may have traumatized you
and even had an effect in your later life on how you relate to men in general.
Why then can't you see the trauma caused to those forced to grow up in
a homosexual household? I do not advocate heterosexual relationships heavily,
rather I endorse them exclusively, and recognize them as the only acceptable
form of "union" that should ever exist.

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