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ISP local # no connect

by billzhills / August 2, 2004 11:07 PM PDT

M/B: AliM1541/ AMD k-6 400Mhz/ 128MB PC-100/ Award BIOS 3/12/99/ WIn98 SE/ IE 5.0./ WalMart connect ISP

I know that I need to download security up-dates and run spy-ware/virus scans.

I am the third tech to work on this system.
Problem: Modem will not connect to server at clients resident, error message "unable to establish connection"
At clients resident -
Uninstalled All network connections - reboot and allowed Windows to re-establish network connections.
No joy.

Un-installed modem and all network connectins - reboot - allowing windows to re-establish devices.
No joy

Used Extended call($.25) phone Number.
Joy on 1st attempt

Each of the local numbers cycled 3 times w/no joy. Extended number connected 1st attempt. This suggested the phone lines where the problem. Phone tech came out and claimed phone lines where ok and to uninstall and reinstall WalMart.

2nd trip
Un-install and re-install WalMart at resident, no joy
Several attempts, several different configurations in bps and buffers. Rebooting at each configuration change. Modem log reports No Carrier on each attempt.

Reset all settings to default and used extended phone number, joy on 1st attempt

Brought system to shop to download and install up-dates. For giggles and grins attempted to connect using local #, JOY on 1st attempt. Reset dial up sequence for 2nd local # to dial 1st, Joy.
Modem using default settings (default settings = no changes by human hands/factory defaults) that will not connect to local # at clients resident.

The poser is,
"Why will this modem connect here at the shop on a local # and not at the clients resident?"

Have ran Scandisk/ Disk Defrag/ Disk clean up on 1st visit. Running NAV 2003 now to be followed by Ad-Aware and Spy-Bot S&D.

NAV (fully updated) just finished, no virus starting
Ad-Award


Thanks
Bill

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Re: ISP local # no connect
by Kees Bakker / August 2, 2004 11:22 PM PDT
In reply to: ISP local # no connect

Experiments to do at customers location:
1. Dial number manually and listen to the bleeps. Walmart modem will be discontent with lack of meaningful communication and answer-bleeps, but that doesn't matter at all.
2. Try different (external) modem. They still do exist!
3. Try connecting with other computer (laptop?) with internal modem.
4. As #3, with same external modem as #2.

I suspect it's some problem with the specific Walmart modem/telephone line/client modem combination. So #2 should be succesfull.

Hope this helps.


Kees

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Re: ISP local # no connect
by jconner / August 3, 2004 12:46 AM PDT
In reply to: ISP local # no connect

It would seem that if you can connect at your office but not the residence it is not a modem issue. The only puzzling issue is why it would work on a different number except for which route it takes. Is this an old neighborhood (above ground or underground phone lines)? I presume this is straight dialup vs. DSL? Has this ever worked at the residence or a new install?

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Up date and post reply
by billzhills / August 3, 2004 1:47 AM PDT

Forgot two items:
U.S. Robotics V.92 modem and that system can be taken next door (50') and connect locally.

Ad-Aware found 3/Gator, 2/Web300, 2/Wnd Media Player and 1/Alexa
Spy-Bot S&D found 1/Alexa and 1/Win Media Player.


21 Security up-dates and 1 driver.
(I Know - Don't trust M/S on drivers)

jconner,
Older neighborhood, above ground lines.
Local Phone Co checked connective and certifed OK

Dial-up account that did work. Problem appears to have started when rain season started. This was the reason I had client have phone lines checked.

Kees,
I can hear modem handshake and attempt to sync with server.
Modem log at Dilaing ->
Send: ATDT#######<cr>
Recv: ATDT7780252<cr>
Recv <cr><lf>NO CARRIER<cr><lf>
Interpreted response: NO CARRIER
Hanging up the modem

I feel, and am seeing from you and jconner, that this is a line problem not modem and beyond my control.

Will be returning system to client this PM, fully up-dated and scaned, and will post results tomorrow.
Anything that comes to you or anybody else please let me know

Thanks, Bill

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Re: Up date and post reply
by Willy / August 3, 2004 2:07 AM PDT
In reply to: Up date and post reply

It sure seems like a telco problem. The telco people will only check up to the house, not necessarily inside, unless you pay for it. If the house box(outside) has a typical RJ-11 connector(newer ones do), connect there *DIRECTLY* using a long ext. telco line and connect to computer if you can, then try. That way, you eliminate all inside lines and if it connects, well the problem is inside wiring or any devices attached. Check them all and/or disconect devices like FAX, ID call box, etc..

good luck -----Willy Happy

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Up date
by billzhills / August 3, 2004 10:57 PM PDT
In reply to: ISP local # no connect

Morning...

Returned system to client last night, no resolution to dial up problem.

Created dial up connection using local number and received error message that "Computer you are trying to connect to did not answer".

Willy, Client claims that telco checked all wiring inside, out and down the road. Tried all your suggestions except long phone cord. (I'll have to build one) But I've discounted interior wiring in that we can connect using an extended call phone number. As for telco problem, yes, even tho they are in denial. In conversing with client last night this problem started at the beginning of our rainy season. And I wont know if this is the cause unit Oct/Nov. As of now I've gone as far as I can with this issue.

Wish to thank everbody for their help.

Bill

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My top contenders.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / August 3, 2004 11:11 PM PDT
In reply to: Up date

1. Modem is dead.

2. They tried to use the old CONNECTIOD.

3. The motherboard drivers were not installed. (Important thing that Microsoft doesn't do for you!)

4. The modem driver is out of date/not installed, etc... Usually interacts with item 3.

I've fixed these many times, but I have spare USB modems and know the motherboard driver issue inside and out.

Bob

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Re: My top contenders.
by billzhills / August 3, 2004 11:41 PM PDT
In reply to: My top contenders.

Bob,
I've seen the CONNECTIOD posted before but don't remember the details.

From your post it appears that removal and re-install of network protocols/application does not re-set CONNECTIOD.
If so how do I re-set CONNECTIOD?

Also looks like I'll have to add a USB Modem to my tool kit anlong w/phone cord.

Thanks, Bill

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Connectoids.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / August 3, 2004 11:48 PM PDT
In reply to: Re: My top contenders.
http://www.modemsite.com/56k/connectoid.asp shows them. A little known problem is that after you install modem drivers, IF you have problems, it's best to delete the connectoid and make a new one. I have found that editing one may or may not work.

Bob
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Re: Up date
by Bob__B / August 4, 2004 12:03 AM PDT
In reply to: Up date

If I am reading this correctly the machine functions at one location but not at another location.

WAG.
At the location it does not work the modem is seeing so much noise it can not function.

I have a USR harware modem, every time it connects it stores a variety of things that it found with that connection. (noise/snr/etc.)

With the use of a windows tool called HYPER-TERMINAL and a few AT commands I can read out what the modem has stored.

I used this tool to "show" TELCO that they had an issue, which they fixed, that was after they had assured me there was nothing wrong with my phone line.

I also found that running my phone line through my surge unit was not a good thing to do. (noise)

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Re: Up date
by Willy / August 4, 2004 12:05 AM PDT
In reply to: Up date

Wiring is riddled with alot of ifs, ands, and buts, so I check physically such stuff. Let's hope the telco person did so too. I look for corrision at small RJ boxes, loose wiring, unhook all devices, (cordless phones are problematic(iffy)) and finally make note of possible new home remodeling.

But, if rainy season, yes that can be a problem if the homeowners connection at the main box is low on the pole(push box) of the neighborhood. Techies don't want to reroute any wiring here if they don't have to, thus repeated calls are a must. But telco policy is to have best "voice" quality not necessarily "computer" quality connection.

If I didn't mention it, try a ISP noted V.90 supported number as V.92 may cause a problem for some modems even if configured right. -OR- just try another non- similar chipset modem. I hope this helps...

good luck -----Willy Happy

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Re: Up date
by billzhills / August 4, 2004 12:35 AM PDT
In reply to: Re: Up date

Thank you for the input.

Bob, WalMart does not use Windows DNS it sets up the dial-up connection like AOL. WalMart has been un-installed and re-installed. On re-install WalMart connected to server to locate phone numbers. This should have created new CONNECTIOD.

Bob B, Yes to connection at one location but not another using local phone number. Modem will connect using an extended ($.25) phone number at clients home but not a local one. Will break out the books on AT commands and see what they have to say.

Willy, You are where I am at with this issue. This is a nice town and phone service is OK untill the rainy season. Tried to send a Fax this AM and could not. Been raining steady for 4 days.

Again Thanks, Client is OK (sorta) and understands that we seeking a solution, but I'm now in the mind of letting this lay till things dry out.

Bill

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Re: Up date
by Bob__B / August 4, 2004 4:54 AM PDT
In reply to: Re: Up date

extended ($.25) phone number

I am not sure what that feature is I do not think I have such a thing.

I have noticed in my testing that if I connect to a modem via what I call long distance (paid) that there is less noise on the connection.

I am sure telco can explain why that is.

Good luck...

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Re: Up date
by billzhills / August 4, 2004 7:47 AM PDT
In reply to: Re: Up date

hey Bob B,

extended ($.25) phone number.
Sorry, should of laid this out better. This is Extended Calling Service a flat rate long distance feature provided in our area.

Possible that long distance lines have fewer junctions to cross and are newer lines creating less noise?

Thanks for the thoughts, Bill

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Re: Up date
by Kees Bakker / August 4, 2004 5:24 AM PDT
In reply to: Up date

Bill,

Well, I had (still have) a PC with a internal Winmodem, giving a shaky connection where it was (second floor, far from where the line entered the house). Connection difficult to get, and easy to lose. I remember walking through the house to disconnect phones, which more or less helped. Finally I bought an external (USB) modem and things were much, much better. I've got ADSL now, which is heaven, of course (and getting cheaper and cheaper here in Holland, starting at 10 $ a month for and always-on faster than dial-up connection).

You've proven all components OK. You can 1) phone Walmart from your shop, and 2) phone another site from clients home with this configuration. So PC and modem OK (#1) and connection from client OK (#2). So any problems must be caused by some ***** combination. NO CARRIER means that either the local modem doesn't see the carrier maintained by the ISP (too weak, noise, distortion by other equipment) or the ISP doesn't see the carrier maintained by your PC so shuts off, causing your PC to close the connection.

You can't influence anything outside the house. So all you can do is vary things inside the house: a direct cable or another computer/modem. Nothing directly to repair, only finding the working combination. And remember you've got a much stronger case against the telco if you've got, for example, a laptop being able to connect to Walmart 'everywhere' except at your clients home. And if you can find something that works, it works. So - whatever happens - it will help.

If supported by the telco or cable company, an ADSL or cable connection might be a good alternative for your client. Sometimes you have to give up. If ADSL is offered the telco might have some difficulty bringing it up, reading the above, but that's their problem.

Good luck,


Kees

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Re: Up date
by billzhills / August 4, 2004 8:11 AM PDT
In reply to: Re: Up date

Hi Kees,
ADSL at $10.00 per month and falling at prices, I may have to move.

WalMart Connect (ISP Provider) and a few others charge that much a month for dial-up accounts. Other ISP providers are between $20.00 to $25.00 per month. Cable and ADSL fall in the range of $30. to $40.00 each month.

In another post it was mentioned tha telco only worry about voice connectivity, not data. If their tests of the phone lines are within paramaters their is nothing wrong and they will point fingers at the computer tech or service proivder. As stated earlier I had the clients phone providers tech's check out the phone lines. My client ws told that everthing was OK with the phone lines and that the problem was with the computer. So I can carry a laptop, use AT commands, what ever and nothing will happen (sorry negative attuide).
I know that this issue lies with the phone lines outside the home. The client will have to wait for the dry season to connect locally or the telco to sneak a repair before this issue goes away. But I do appreciate the thoughs.

Bill

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