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General discussion

Is this part of Missile Defense?

Apr 7, 2005 2:02PM PDT
U.S. postpones rocket test

ST. JOHN'S, Nfld. (CP) - The U.S. Defence Department's plans to launch a rocket over the North Atlantic were postponed indefinitely Thursday amid concerns in Newfoundland that falling debris could hit offshore oil platforms.

Newfoundland Premier Danny Williams said he was stunned when he learned spent booster rockets from a Titan IV rocket, which was to be launched early Monday from Cape Canaveral, Fla., were expected to fall within 25 kilometres of the Hibernia platform.

Col. Stefano Boccino, of the U.S. Air Force Space Command at Cape Canaveral, said the launch was postponed because of mechanical problems with ground support equipment.

When asked if the missile's trajectory was an issue, he said: "Right now we don't have an answer to that. I believe that will be readdressed once a new launch date is confirmed."

"I don't think the Americans were aware, or had really thought it through, as to how close this was to the Hibernia platform," Williams said following two urgent phone conversations with McLellan and a call to Frank McKenna, Canada's ambassador to the United States.

"Why would they drop a piece of space debris out of the sky and take a chance that it happens to be 15 miles in the right spot? If it's off, it could obviously have very serious consequences."

Each rocket booster weighs more than 10,000 kilograms, he said.

There are 234 crew aboard the Hibernia platform, which is about 315 kilometres southeast of St. John's.


The oil rig was lucky that they had "mechanical problems" before the booster (possibly)landed on the rig.

Discussion is locked

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(NT) (NT) navy seals to the rescue:)
Apr 9, 2005 4:09AM PDT
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nor do we club baby seals your such an non whimpy kind
Apr 9, 2005 4:08AM PDT

but we still will protect our northern neighbor as your country welcomes deserters seems thats a great way to keep strongHappy

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That's enough, ice-bear-joe !
Apr 9, 2005 4:45AM PDT

You have made yourself perfectly clear. We know your opinion of the US. You have not been prevented from saying it.

If you were old enough to have been around when the A-Bombs were dropped, you were also old enough to know that there were military forces from other countries that were fighting in the Pacific. Many of them were forced into death marches, slave labor, barbaric executions, and "medical" experiments.

If you were old enough you remember the invasion of China, and the slaughter of innocents. You could remember that a group of American pilots formed the Flying Tigers to try to help save at least some Chinese lives.

You could also remember that committing suicide was the choice of the enemy rather than surrender. And that young men of the enemy felt honored to crash their planes onto our ships. IMO, there is a difference is being willing to die for your country than in willing to die for the Emperor, who was viewed as a god, not a Head of State.

So please restrain your venomous comments.

Angeline


click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

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Sorry Angeline
Apr 9, 2005 5:14AM PDT

but with so many posters coming on here with so little regard for so many men working our oil rigs i get a littles pissed.
They make remarks without knowing the facts.Its not if the rocket fails, its the boosters that are sure to fall and your government says it will fall 15 miles from the oil rigs.This is cutting it a little to close and my government would shut down the rigs and unman them if given time.thier regard for life outweights any money that would be lost,which would be millions.
Shouldnt we be given notice in time to do something about this?Ok are you also one that say to hell with them they are not american??
Now shouldnt your government have given us a warning

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Nobody....
Apr 9, 2005 7:00AM PDT

... here is privy to all official communications between our respective governmental agencies.

Have your officials alerted the oil rigs? Or are they waiting for the US to issue one?

I know our off-shore rigs have evacuation plans in place for approaching streoms.

What bugs me is that you choose to assume that the US will do anything regardless of the lives of others that are not our own.

Angeline


click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

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More cheese.......
Apr 9, 2005 2:04AM PDT

with that old whine?

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and when other countries get over run
Apr 9, 2005 2:30AM PDT

the usa saves the day go help your queen she needs help

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Obviously you don't
Apr 9, 2005 3:57AM PDT

Lets save this post for the next time Rob denies that anyone here hates Americans. The statement that Americans have no concern for human life outside the US is vile bigotry.

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Lets look at this rationally now
Apr 9, 2005 4:07AM PDT

With all th rockerts that are launched from Canaveral every year the chances are probably far better that a rocket's guidance system will fail on launch and the beast will turn over and crash in Miami or another populated area. Are you worried about that?

This is hysterical political posturing; nothing nore.

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a rocket's guidance system will fail
Apr 9, 2005 4:40AM PDT

This is not about the rockets guidance system.

This is about gravity and the booster rocket that is jettisoned from the main body of the rocket.

There is no control of where the booster lands. And I doubt that there is any control of the rocket after it leaves the launch pad.

Other than being able to destroy the rocket if it goes off course.

They can control the satelite after it is in space, but not the rocket in earth's atmosphere.

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No, it's about
Apr 9, 2005 4:49AM PDT

something falling out of the sky and whether or not it's likely to hit something on the ground. Doesn't matter what the cause of the thing falling is. That's all.

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Edh one question only
Apr 9, 2005 5:28AM PDT

If you had wife and kids in a house and the government told you that the rocket booters were going to fall within 15 miles of your home would you all stay in house and hope for the best?
The weather has a lot to do with things just falling and 15 MILES.Think about it>

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If there was a one in a trillion chance...
Apr 9, 2005 6:36AM PDT

that it would fall on my house, yes.

Would you live near a highway? The chance that and 18-wheeler will come barreling through your living room is much better than one in a trillion. Live near an airport? A nuclear power plant? Earthquake fault?
Mudslide area? Flood zone?

But reacting hysterically is perhaps excusable. People used to think an eclipse meant the end of the world was happening.

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Most unreasonable
Apr 9, 2005 8:30AM PDT

If there was a one in a trillion chance.
The biggest crock I ever heard.
I live near an airport and have'nt a care in the world about being hit by falling objects or missles falling on me.
If I was told a rocket was going to drop boosters that they have no control over and could hit within 15 miles of where I was I would sure get the hell out of there.
You would also your just playing mr. tough guy.
Just where do you get your 1 in a trillion chance in a case like that.So many replies from people who dont get the facts,dont understand or just dont give a dam.

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Read the story at the link
Apr 9, 2005 9:03AM PDT

The scientists were quoted as saying it was a trillion to one chance. I didn't make it up. Maybe they are lying. Maybe it's a conspiracy!

You live near an airport? Do you have any idea how often objects fall from airliners taking off? It's not uncommon. And of course every so often the whole plane comes down in a neighborhood.

Not playing tough; exercising common sense.

Masao Doi, a spokesman for U.S. Air Force Space Command ...said the command compiles extensive safety risk calculations on all trajectories and devises an impact safety "box"...nside that box, the chance of personal injury from impact is one in a million, Doi said. Outside the box, he said, there is a one-in-a-trillion chance of impact.

"The Hibernia platform is one mile outside the impact box,"


By all means, get the facts before posting.

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Response
Apr 9, 2005 1:04PM PDT

second schedule for Wed Apr 13 now Sun Apr 17

Three technical delays in two weeks, but they know "exactly" where the booster will land.

U.S. air force delays rocket launch

U.S. air force officers have again delayed the launch of a surveillance satellite that has been cause for concern among Canadian politicians and oil companies. For unspecified "technical reasons, the Americans have postponed the firing of the rocket until April 17," said Alex Swann, a spokesman for Public Safety Minister Anne McLellan.

The U.S. officers announced the decision to Canadian federal and provincial officials, as well as oil executives, at a meeting Saturday in Dartmouth, N.S.

There are concerns that pieces of space junk from the rocket could damage drilling rigs in waters off Newfoundland.


The Hibernia platform is one mile outside the impact box,"

When I was in the miltary, they wouldn't let anyone stand downrange, of somebody that was shooting a weapon, even if the impact box (target) was 20 or 40 feet away. (not that I would stand there)

Why's that? A bullet is more controlled than a booster rocket tumbling out of the sky.

Perhaps because accidents happen.

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(NT) (NT) the skys falling lol
Apr 9, 2005 1:26PM PDT
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Sigh
Apr 9, 2005 1:27PM PDT

Yes, read the story. Please.

Three technical delays in two weeks, but they know "exactly" where the booster will land.

Where exactly do they say "exactly?"

The Air Force gave a risk assessment. The risk is miniscule, almost nonexistent. This is the very definition of a non-issue. And yet politicians are panicking and blowing millions of dollars because of it. And we know who they will be blaming for that loss.

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Right there
Apr 9, 2005 1:50PM PDT

The risk is miniscule, almost nonexistent.

one in a million, and one in a billion or trillion(not sure which term they used and I'm not going to look it up)

All these terms mean that they know "exactly".

Perhaps I should say they know "exactly" where it won't land. (on the oil rig)

Reply if you want, to but I'm not responding any more on this subject until after the launch or another re-schedule of the launch.

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just remember you have to duck and run
Apr 9, 2005 1:58PM PDT

yelling the sky is falling Grin

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I won't
Apr 9, 2005 2:00PM PDT

post a link to the Shuttle explosion over Texas

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O.K. then...
Apr 9, 2005 2:25PM PDT

O.K. then, let's consider the odds of a hit on a specific taget in those terms of probability.
Instead of a specific oil rig, let's substitute a specific building in that path. What are the odds of a of a space shuttle breaking up and having a piece of it hit the Dallas City Hall?

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you never will have to worry about
Apr 9, 2005 2:33PM PDT

a Canadian shuttle takes courage to explore outer space
so as to your comment about our astronaughts shows your crudeness.

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That's my point
Apr 9, 2005 2:40PM PDT

YOU should not make remarks about "the sky is falling", "got your hard hat on" and "Duck and run" as YOU should realize that accidents do happen, and objects do fall out of the sky sometimes with very serious consequences.

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i dont worry about it
Apr 9, 2005 11:25PM PDT

as your the one whining about it not me.

so if your that concerned watch the sky as then you can run and hideGrin

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Fine, don't respond
Apr 9, 2005 9:20PM PDT

There was no reason to bring it up in the first place. It's a non-issue.

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Well Pancho, it looks like you hit the...
Apr 9, 2005 11:30AM PDT

...nail right on the head.

"So many replies from people who dont get the facts,dont understand or just dont give a dam."

...And you're one of them

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(NT) (NT) jack hes got all the facts there just all the wrong one
Apr 9, 2005 11:56AM PDT
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I just had to check...
Apr 9, 2005 2:08PM PDT

As somebody mentioned the odds I just had to check to get an idea of the object in question. A SRM booster module of that rocket in 10 feet x 113 feet. "Worst case senario" would be for a booster to hit broadside (110 feet facing surface).
Then it hit me, I dare say that various aircraft overfly that platform all the time (what a handy known navigation "fix") and aircraft big enough to go that far out would tend to be bigger than 10 feet x 113 feet. But I can't remember seeing a "hoo-rah" about the danger of a hit if one of them lost control and came down. But of course a lot of those aircraft would not be U.S. aircraft, so that would mess up the criticize the U.S. routine.

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Response
Apr 9, 2005 2:30PM PDT

It's possible, but not likely, an aircraft would fall out of the sky.

It's definite that the booster rocket WILL fall out of the sky.