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IF a person didn't vote

They shouldn't complain?

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Reply to: IF a person didn't vote
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I agree....

....though some will say they didn't vote because all of the candidates sucked. I still think it's important to vote, even if you're not crazy about any of the candidates.

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You do not lose your First Amendment rights....

if you don't vote. There is no correlation between voting and complaining. Voting is NOT mandatory, thank God.

Most dictatorships have a very high percent of voter participation in their "elections".

I personally think that unless you understand and care about the issues you should not vote. It only dilutes the votes of those who are more engaged.

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I agree

If you don't care enough to also shouldn't care enough to complain

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No one said you lost your rights

You have a right to complain. You're just not in a position to.

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Why not?

Still sounds like you are trying to diminish the right to free speech.

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the sun goes up
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Not at all

Think of a business plan. If you had a chance to vote for or against it, but chose to abstain, you're really not in a position to gripe about the choice that won the vote. You have every right to, but you had a chance to express your preference and chose not to participate in that process.

Same for voting. If you don't like the direction the country is going in, then use the power of your vote to try to change it. If you opt not to do that, then (IMO) you are not in a position to keep complaining, EVEN THOUGH YOU STILL HAVE EVERY RIGHT TO DO SO.

Clear enough?

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Whatifyour complaint is...

that none of the candidates is worthy of y0ou vte amn teht ta syst

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Then write someone in...

even if it's yourself. Even a vote for yourself is a vote against the others and adds to the totality of votes against them. It makes a statement that we the people are not happy with our choices.

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Read my full reply

NOT voting adds to the totality of the NON vote as well, does it not? In some ways it says more.

Note, I'm talking theoretically here. I vote. But I reject the frankly mindless "wisdom" that if you don't vote you shouldn't/can't/have no rigt6to complain. Hogwash, IMO.

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I agree

I gave Mickey Mouse a vote in one race by write in this time.

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And that accomplished what?


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Made me feel better about the lack of choice in the race. It was one where a democrat was unopposed. Once in awhile they also publish some of the alternate write in names for a laugh or two.

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Not voting makes the same point...

and if enough people do it, gets noticed.

Better than a laugh.

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No it doesn't

All it says is that X percent of the people didn't vote. It says nothing about WHY they didn't vote. My wife almost didn't get to vote yesterday due to work. If she hadn't voted, all it would have said was that she was unable to.

If you're trying to make a statement, then voting for Mickey Mouse says a lot more than not voting at all.

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Not really

People that vote become part of the voting statistics, no shows don't. For any given election each candidate gets a percentage of the vote for them and the remainder of the vote is against them but the percentage adds up to 100%. That does not include people that don't vote and statistically their non-vote doesn't really say anything.

Imagine this, no one votes at all and we have no idea what anyone is for or against. Everyone shows up and votes for themself. Then we know 100% of the people is positively against the choices givens. Voting makes a positive statement, not voting doesn't say anything.

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If a lot of people don't voe in an election....

I guarantee some bright reporter(s) or analyst(s) will dig to find out WHY. Seem it before. Don't tell me it doesn't get noticed.

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Not only that

They publish the percentage of votes won even if it's votes for write ins. If an unopposed incumbent wins with 30% of the vote at least they know that the majority, 70% of the voters, doesn't agree with them. It's ashamed we get stuck with someone who's running no matter what. We really should be able to pick "none of the above" and get a new slate of choices sometimes.

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That would be okay with me...

but it's still voting.

There are good reasons to vote. There are also bad reasons to vote. Some people vote for someone because of the color of their skin or because it's "historic." They have every right to do so.

I contend there are also good reasons to not vote.

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"I contend there are also good reasons to not vote"

Well, my grandparents don't vote anymore, although I'm sure they would still like to.

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Well, my grandparents don't vote anymore,

Are you sure?

Were they from Chicago? Someone may be voting for them.

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Someone else might do the voting, but I can assure you it's not them. You should have let someone else trip over this first. Wink

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Arrrrggggh! I hit Preview...

or so I thought.

To continue, if your complaint is that participating in a corrupt electoral system only encourages more corruption,then it would be sheer hypocrisy to vote just for the sake of voting. I think you would be in a fine position to make such a complaint.

I really don't think there is any legitimate correlation between voting and expressing your opinion. Libertarian thinkers Murray Rothbard and Harry Browne among others have wri8tten extensively on why people shouldn't vote or run for office. I think they are in a position to voice their opinions.

I've heard the "if you don't vote you can't complain" meme in all its variations for decades. I think not much thought has gone into that assertion. That goes as well for the "get out there and vote" drives and the notion that voting is a "civic duty" or an "obligation."

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"if you don't vote you can't complain"

I said

They shouldn't complain.

Complain IF you must, but you shouldn't.

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I don't like the current system at all

But a vote against it is an action, a positive action for change. If you don't want to vote that's fine, just understand what I'm saying. If you don't like the system then join me and do something about it. Take action. If you don't want to help me do something about it, you don't want to take action, then don't subject me to your complaints about a system you won't help me change because I don't want to hear them.

Ideally, yeah, the tire's flat, pushing the car is hard but if you don't don't want to help us push then shut up about the flat tire already because we already know it's flat and we don't need someone too lazy to help to just do nothing but keep reminding us that it's flat.

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It's your opinion..

that voting is "taking action." Everyone is entitled to his opinion.

Maybe the action you are taking isn't really helping. Maybe pushing isn't the answer. Maybe some one has a better idea but you just told him to shut up, eh?

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If they want to complain that they don't like the way things are then they need to do something about what they don't like, like vote. If they don't want to do anything about it than sit there and complain then they should keep it to themselves because those of us trying to do something about it don't want to hear it from those that aren't.

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Not to mention that Voting is so easy to do.

Voting today, is about as easy, and similar, to going to McDonald's to eat. You walk in, stand in line for a short period, place your order, and leave.

How many people who go to a fast food joint on a daily basis, whine and complain about their local pols, and yet say it is too difficult to go vote?

Shame on those folks who take it for granted, what their forefathers fought for. Shame on them more... for not taking part in the least of their civic privileges.

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Ummm ...

Can we vote on that?


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