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I'm rather surprised that no one has jumped on

by Steven Haninger / May 10, 2012 7:51 AM PDT

the president's sudden change of position on the issue of gay marriage. I can't say whether or not this was sincere and heart felt or a strategic move after a polling to see what affect it would have on the election. I'd not be surprised if this was his thinking all along but that it had been withheld until he and his advisers felt the climate was right.

As for gay persons who want to have wedding ceremonies, I'd say let them do it. It won't affect me as the union won't be what I believe to fit the definition of marriage anyway. It will just be a renamed civil union and sanctioned in a secular sense only. No big deal, IMO.

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re: strategic move after a polling
by grimgraphix / May 10, 2012 10:12 AM PDT

Do you mean this kind of poling?

North Carolina just voted to constitutionally outlaw gay marriage.

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In North Carolina you can legally marry your first cousin
by Josh K / May 12, 2012 10:29 PM PDT

Just not your GAY first cousin. In fact more states allow incestuous marriages than allow gay ones.

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I believe they follow the Jewish proscription on that

which limits it to the second cousin, not first. Have a link to that about first cousins?

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According to Wikipedia
by Diana Forum moderator / May 13, 2012 11:12 AM PDT
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Must have been part of Reconstruction by the North
by James Denison / May 13, 2012 1:49 PM PDT
In reply to: According to Wikipedia

Other states up northeast where "marry your cousin" is accepted.

Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Washington DC, Maryland, Massachusetts, Vermont,

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I don't know why you noted New york
by JP Bill / May 13, 2012 8:46 PM PDT

Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Washington DC, Maryland, Massachusetts, Vermont,

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It doesn't matter which states they are
by Josh K / May 13, 2012 11:28 PM PDT

The point is that you can marry your first cousin in more places than you can marry someone of your same gender, and that there are states that don't seem to have a problem with incest but have a problem with gay marriage.

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RE: It doesn't matter which states they are
by JP Bill / May 14, 2012 1:00 AM PDT

That's right...I agree...that's why I was commenting on James highlighting New York, the state he lives in is also on the list...why not highlight his state.

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(NT) Next week: Biden and Obama get married.
by James Denison / May 10, 2012 7:38 PM PDT
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Royal wedding last year and now this
by JP Bill / May 13, 2012 10:05 PM PDT

What a time to be alive.

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The fish don't know he's wet....
by Tony Holmes / May 10, 2012 7:26 PM PDT

It's a tactic to stir up controversy about anything he can to divert attention away from his abysmal economic record and the $5T he's added to our debt.

He thinks if he just can keep from talking about it,people will forget.

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It's worked so far
by James Denison / May 10, 2012 7:44 PM PDT

And when that fails, always blame Bush.

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I think you're giving Biden too much credit
by Josh K / May 10, 2012 9:56 PM PDT

My guess is that Obama felt that way all along but played it safe during the '08 race. Would he have "come out" had Biden not outed him? He says yes but that may just be damage control at work.

I think I saw a poll that said around 53% of those polled thought gay marriage was just fine. Perhaps Obama felt more comfortable taking a clear position on it with those numbers.

I wonder if Romney will take credit for this too. Wink

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well, he was for it, before he was against it.
by grimgraphix / May 11, 2012 12:45 AM PDT

You know what I find hilarious was that flip flopping was a war cry for the republicans just a few years ago... and know they seem to have decided that such behavior is OK.

I guess the republicans flip flopped on the issue. LOL ... not that the dems are any better.

I'm voting for "none of the above" this fall.

sigh.

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That's an idea
by James Denison / May 11, 2012 7:00 AM PDT

Go to the beach and sell Obama "flip flops" to the beach goers.

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RE: Obama "flip flops"
by JP Bill / May 12, 2012 1:07 PM PDT
In reply to: That's an idea
This guy thinks Romney should have a piece of THAT pie


In contrast, Mr. Romney's changing positions are framed as raising character questions over his apparent lack of a core set of beliefs - other than those needed to secure the Republican leadership nomination and the White House.

The 'flip-flop' label will be thrown around by both the Obama and Romney campaigns throughout 2012 for the simple reason that it has become a catch-all if a politician is seen as pandering to the public and switching positions when it is politically expedient.
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we can get 2 sets
by James Denison / May 12, 2012 1:22 PM PDT
In reply to: RE: Obama "flip flops"

blue flip flops and red flip flops. Congress can be the sand.

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The Audacity Of Perversion
by James Denison / May 11, 2012 7:09 AM PDT

Obama's next book?

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It's hard to keep up with
by James Denison / May 10, 2012 7:38 PM PDT

all his vacillations. Or is that flagellations? Wink

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Biden's comment may have brought him out
by Steven Haninger / May 10, 2012 8:35 PM PDT

earlier than he wished. I am rather surprised at how long he's held back as his earlier stance didn't seem to fit his full agenda. I see him as a master manipulator as that's what a community organizer would train to be and pass along to his students. It's all about finding a means to an end. I could see Obama, as do many successful politicians, wanting to hold this revelation as a trump card to be played if and when it was needed. Perhaps Biden has forced it out early as not playing it would have caused him to need to reaffirm his earlier stated conviction and lose the card altogether.

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Here's MY scenario
by JP Bill / May 10, 2012 8:41 PM PDT

Biden makes a (planned)slip and brings up gay marriage, Obama agrees, THEN a story about Romney holding a gay student down and cutting his hair 50 years ago comes out.

Coincidence?...I think not.

ALL part of the big picture.

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Ahh, yes...election season
by Steven Haninger / May 10, 2012 9:26 PM PDT
In reply to: Here's MY scenario

Plenty of fun for all as long as they don't take it seriously. Wink

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The sad thing is....
by Josh K / May 10, 2012 9:56 PM PDT
In reply to: Here's MY scenario

.....there are plenty of people who would willingly believe stories like that.

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No doubt....
by JP Bill / May 11, 2012 12:26 AM PDT
In reply to: The sad thing is....

Just remember...you heard it here first Devil

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gay student?
by James Denison / May 11, 2012 7:05 AM PDT
In reply to: Here's MY scenario

Surfers, Ivy Leaguers and Hippies. The "surfer" groups in the 60's were the more likely to shave or crop a hippie's hair. Ivy leaguers were not above doing it too. "Girlie boys" with long hair, the "dead heads" or "pot heads" and other such nomers were targets in the 60's. I still remember Beatle records being burnt in Alabama. I always got a crewcut or flatop before visiting any Alabama cousins back then during the summer.

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Master Manipulator
by James Denison / May 11, 2012 7:01 AM PDT

Another name for accomplished Liar.

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(NT) in other words, your average politician.
by grimgraphix / May 11, 2012 3:32 PM PDT
In reply to: Master Manipulator
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Looks like the first results are coming in
by Steven Haninger / May 10, 2012 11:45 PM PDT
All smiles and cashing in

I'm sure this was a risk but probably a well thought out one. He may be sacrificing a very strong and loyal but financially weak voting base but capturing one that's better healed.
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Here was my take on all this
by TONI H / May 11, 2012 2:07 AM PDT

Clooney's event wasn't raising enough money in Clooney's opinion....Biden makes a well-timed 'slip'....BO stays quiet for a few days waiting to see the reaction and saw what happened with NC, then 'comes clean' about his 'evolution' (with Dems is 'evolution' with Reps is 'flip-flopping'), and surprise, surprise, not only is Clooney now getting money hand over fist for THAT campaign party, but RICKY MARTINEZ, who came out of the closet a few years ago and is openly gay now, is ALSO having a fund-raiser for BO that supposedly nobody knew anything about but will now have tons of cash coming thru the door because BO will be attending THAT party tonite.

The liberal media is making a "historical" huge deal out of this.......conservatives would have never voted for BO anyhow, independents are looking at this issue not being a deal breaker, but they realize that the majority of the country/States have already voted against same-sex marriages (including California and most New England states), blacks won't particularly use this as a game-changer even tho most don't support the issue, Latinos may see this as a game-changer because he not only hasn't done anything about the illegal immigrant issue with the Dream Act but now he's slapping them in the face with this because most are conservative within their personal family lives. Latinos may not vote Republican but they might just stay away from the voting booths out of spite and anger....and most are Catholic so the war on religion is also an issue for them....that makes three strikes against a base he desperately needs.

I personally think he's done more damage to himself than he's going to be prepared for because the gay community still will be left with a State decision and vote rather than a Constitutional Amendment that they might have hoped for with him. This was a money-making political move that has alienated a much larger base in the long run.

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