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General discussion

How feasible is it to use XP after Microsoft stops support?

Jun 7, 2013 9:10AM PDT
Question:

How feasible is it to use Windows XP after Microsoft stops supporting it?


After reading the sad news that Windows XP support is going to be discontinued by Microsoft, I'm wondering how feasible would it be for me to continue using Windows XP after the support ends? If I have a firewall and antivirus and antispyware software that's not made by Microsoft, should I be worried about my security using XP given that I won't be getting any more XP security updates and patches? Are there any other concerns I should be thinking about besides security? I'm sure I'm not the only one wondering about this. Please advise. Thanks.

-- Submitted by: John T.

Discussion is locked

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Microsoft Security Updates?????
Jun 17, 2013 8:20PM PDT

In reading through all the posts, I see a lot of concerns for Security updates and recommendations for upgrading the operating system to Windows 7 and Windows 8 because of this. Not that I disagree with this in theory, but I am just not seeing this as a real benefit in real life and on the streets. I am seeing just as many, if not more, Infected Windows 7 computers as I do Windows XP machines. Yes, when Windows 7 first came out, I had very few infected machines but once it was out for awhile they started streaming in. So for me, I just don't see not getting security updates from Microsoft as a real concern for the average computer user as long as you have a good, updated Internet Security program installed and you are using a good up-to-date browser like Firefox or Chrome. Updating Java and Flash player is also a must, so until these are no longer available for XP, I still don't see a real concern for using Windows XP for several more years.

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interested
Jun 24, 2013 4:06AM PDT

Hi Dana,

I am a fellow IT pro and consultant and I enjoy and appreciate your postings on this forum. A sentence from your recent post intrigued me:

"I still have many Windows ME, 2000, 98 and 95 computers that continue to work just fine. I don't use them for any Internet access and do not install any new software on them."

So what exactly DO you use them for?

Regards,
Craig
myComputerGuy, inc.

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What a question!
Jun 24, 2013 4:50PM PDT

Are you that young or you simply don't remember the days when computers were NOT connected to the Internet? They were used for various tasks, such as: writing documents, accounting, database editing and administration, desktop publishing. Mind you! Not connected to Internet does NOT mean necessarily NOT connected to a network (LAN).
So? What's with that question? Most of us who use computers to make a living don't have the time to loiter on the Internet all day long... We really have things to do with those computers!

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No problem
Jun 7, 2013 10:57PM PDT

I still have XP and won't be updating it with any newer Microsoft OS. I have had updates turned off for years now. I do have a great firewall and antivirus (which I do keep updated.) I also have Xubuntu installed alongside it and most often boot into it. For most things Xubuntu works fine, but if there's something such as an Office document that's picky and HAS to be used on Windows, I can boot to XP and have no problems. With my firewall, when booted to XP I can simply "click" to lock out the network (including the internet.) If you're technically adept, you can keep your XP installation in a virtual machine inside Linux.
It does take some getting used to a new OS, but it's well worth it. A new Linux OS makes much more sense than buying a new copy of Windows 7 or 8, which may not run on older hardware, and takes more getting used to than most Linux distros. If you have any Android devices you are already using Linux. Most internet servers run on it, as well.
It's definitely the wave of the future, and all for free. Plus, you can always find a distro that runs on old hardware, or simply boot from CD or USB (if supported.)

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As with most questions, the answer is...It depends.
Jun 8, 2013 7:42PM PDT

It depends on if this is your only PC or one that is used for specific applications(s).
It depends on if you use this PC to browse the Internet or if this is a standalone computer.
It depends if you plan on installing new software, upgrading hardware or if you are happy with what you have.
It depends when you plan to get a newer PC with a supported OS

The plain truth is that at some point, unless this computer is dedicated for a specific function for use with the already installed software, you are going to need to upgrade your computer. It's a sign that other components of your PC are also aging. If you are not using the Internet, not planning on adding new software and not planning on upgrading any hardware, you could be perfectly fine using your XP based computer. At least until something costly breaks.

On the other hand, even if this is not your primary computer, you probably use the Internet and may very well want or need something a little faster with more storage, RAM, or something compatible with new software on the market. It's time to start looking for something newer and faster. While it may not be urgent, you should take this as a warning that your "workhorse" may soon have to be put to pasture.

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Perfectly feasible, but very unsafe
Jun 9, 2013 7:05AM PDT

Microsoft will STOP offering ANY update. This will also mean no more security updates at all.
While you use third party security solutions, you'll be left whide open to any vulnerability affecting Windows itself and it's components.

Those vulnerability may allow some exploits to effectively disable your firewall, antivirus and antispywares.

If it's for a computer that NEVER connect to the internet, it's not an isue.
If the computer access, even if very rarely, the internet, you are asking for trouble.

There is also the isue of updating your applications and security components. Eventualy, maybe soon, you won't be able to find any that can still run on Windows XP. Think about it, how many newer application can still run on Windows 98, even if the hardware was not an isue?

If you don't want, or can't (the computer can't run Windows 7), upgrade your computer to Windows 7, you should look at replacing Windows by Linux.

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You would be very surprised.
Jun 14, 2013 11:35AM PDT

Firstly you will be surprised how many people use a PC simply to perform tasks that do not require the internet. Especially people of older years that, perhaps, bought a cheap .386 or .486 running windows 3.1. They found it cheaper then a word processor or electric typewriter and with a dot pin printer they could write, to them. simply wonderful letters which they would then use the long-trusted Royal Mail (which may get lost now and then but was immune to virus.... unless you sneezed on the letter when you put it in the envelope !) and post it.
Some had Win98/ME/XP but it made no difference... they either had no interest in the internet.. no access to it, or, didn't have a phone line... especially in the countryside.
I've upgraded many a computer for folk with no interest in the internet.
Windows8 was designed primarily for the mobile phone but Microsoft, as usual, made it an upgrade for Windows7 to grab the extra revenue. Look how much less expensive it is? Point made? I think so.
I installed a beta copy sent by Microsoft to me as I am a member and also Microsoft certified (in many ways LOL) and a holder of a MEDL. It lasted 2 days for me when I installed it on a computer I keep handy in the room my grandkids use when they stay over. Flattened the hard drive, restored the MBR and re-installed win7.
I'm thinking Microsoft have lost the plot. One cannot do things with a mobile phone that can be done with a PC/Laptop.

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sorry
Jun 14, 2013 11:39AM PDT

I forgot the wonderful Win95 !

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Or...
Jun 17, 2013 11:32PM PDT

"(which may get lost now and then but was immune to virus.... unless you sneezed on the letter when you put it in the envelope !)"

or laced it with weaponized anthrax.

I don't know about dot pin printers but starting with the 300dpi laser printer I would have been happy to send a letter from it anywhere, or a resume.

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XP v The newest OS from Microsoft
Jun 14, 2013 12:19PM PDT

I read the replies to this question and have to disagree with almost all of them. Hardware and software will almost always be available for XP. Hardware and software is still available for WinME so there isn't anything to worry about there.

As far a security issues go, remember the newer the OS is the fewer hackers are going after older OS's. There is no worry about XP on the internet, those that do worry so much are for the most part overly paranoid.

I still run Windows 3.11 on a DOS 6.22 machine, a P-III running at 1.2mhz with a 256meg ATI all-in-wonder card and 256meg of RAM installed. I wish I had this machine back with I was knee deep in programming!! The machine sees the whole 256meg installed, although I do have the last version of QEMM installed, and although there were no DOS drivers for the ATI, I found some generic ATI drivers that give me the resolution to run windows in a high res VGA mode.

Now if I can keep an old DOS machine going all these years there will be no problem keeping a good XP machine going.

eBay can be a good friend for older computers, but look at garage sales and flea markets for good deals on older boxes. Good to have a spare motherboard or two, some extra memory, and a couple 250gig hard drives. One other option is that if you do have a floppy drive then opt for one of the dual drive setups, a 1.44/1.2meg combo drives. They are easy to install and one cable will give you both drives as an 'A' & 'B'.

To conclude, stay with the XP, it will last you for years and if you can, look for spare parts to have just in case of any failures, it will last you a good 15 to 20 years down the line.

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True enough, BUUUT.....
Jun 15, 2013 9:43AM PDT

I get the distinct impression that the OP is not technically sophisticated.

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What is your point?
Jun 15, 2013 6:07PM PDT

Other than insulting someone for no reason, why did you even post? If the poster wants to know how to keep his XP machine, there is no reason to assume he isn't willing to learn. How in the world do you suppose those of us who are "technically sophisticated" got that way? We sure weren't born with the knowledge. Let people answer the question, for crying out loud. That's why it was asked.

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@4Denise: My Apologies
Jun 16, 2013 10:21AM PDT

It was not my intent to seem rude, snide and insulting. I'm sorry.

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No problem
Jun 16, 2013 5:09PM PDT

But I'm not the one you possibly insulted. I hope the original poster sees your reply!

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Extremely... with a caveat.
Jun 14, 2013 12:33PM PDT

OK. My previous box was a pre-loved OEM which came with XP on it, but no (for obvious reasons) CD. The first thing I did was upgrade to W2K Pro and install SP4 and Rollup 1. This was back in 2004.

W2K served me well and properly until 2011, when the box itself developed senile dementia. So, with tears in my eyes I discovered that no current chipset would support my beloved W2K Sad and I was forced to convert (I cannot say "upgrade") to W7.

{rant} W2K is Microsoft's best ever OS and it's a damn shame they abandoned it! {/rant}

So, yes WXP will serve you untill your box dies, then it won't work on the new box. Don't worry overmuch about the patches etc: I ran W2K without updates of any kind for 7 years and suffered no ill effects. Ummm... yes I did have to upgrade Visual Studio a couple of times, but that's all.

So go for it!

Gordon.

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A NEED TO GET A MESSAGE THROUGH TO MICROSOFT
Jun 14, 2013 12:47PM PDT

While all the problems the XP users will face in the upcoming years trying to continue using likely the best OS Microsoft had produced to this date have already been addressed, what to really do about it has not

Windows 7 wasn't exactly a success based on it's short life as the 'pushed system' and '8', whether Microsoft will ever admit it or not, was never written for normal PC use - it is bulky , cumbersome (ugly) and aimed at tablets and not PC's --- us keyboard users don't need all the 'touchscreen & virtual keyboard options' that bloat 8 to a unwieldy monstrosity ... it is why XP users want to hang on.

I for one will not buy a current PC as they all come pre-loaded with Win 8 and why pay for something I have no intention of using and must battle to get rid off . I , personally am seriously looking at Linux or Apple as OS for my next PC , something I actually need. I need a new PC (mine old) / Laptop (mine dying) , not a tablet, not a convertible but a real computer high speed - high memory unit with real hard drives, CD/DVD and a real keyboard and as far as PC/desktop a unit which I can adapt and modify to my needs. What I don't need is some overgrown , jack of all trades, master of none Operating system that wants to also be the replacement for my kitchen sink.

What Microsoft needs to learn, and it only will do so if we, the people that pay so they can exist tell them publicly, is that we are not all the same. Our needs are not all the same and our computers are not all the same and while 8 may well be great (used very, very loosely), it is a waste of space and hindering functionality on PC's and people that need 'real specific applications' and what we need, want and demand is that we , the customers, get what we need and not just what Microsoft wants to shove down our throats and just maybe they need to think about separate systems along parallel paths. And actually some of us have Desktops, Laptops & Tablets each with a specific purpose they are used for with specific needs for each and specific programs for each. Yes that may allow the end users to show Microsoft what they want and prefer, something they really don't want (this kind of makes me think of the ORIGINAL McIntosh commercial) and may have 3rd party programs write more for one than the other (which again reminds me of that commercial as MS would just as soon not have any 3rd party programs to exist), though with current programing languages and shared 'libraries' a mute point as one basic written program can be encoded from there to fit any OS

We need to get through to 'Big Easy' that ether they start caring about us, or we'll pursue other options and leave them out in the cold -- Apple has drifted 'our way', Linux has become more and more mainstream and supported by almost all software/hardware companies by now and even for Tablets, Microsoft may find the other 'open system' , Linux based 'Android' giving us options. Microsoft watch out, I can't speak for the rest here, but as for me, I am ready to bail out once XP becomes too difficult to use (I followed if from it's NT roots).

And at least that is my two cents worth

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Feasible, I don't know... necessary, yes.
Jun 14, 2013 12:47PM PDT

When I had to replace my dead laptop, the replacement came with Windows 7. That took care of any concern about issues with XP; or so I thought. A program to help me re-learn Biblical Greek requires XP and a 32-bit system. I'll probably pick up a cheap used laptop with XP (a local shop has a few really good deals) and it will be used only for that one program. With that being the only use, I still don't think I'll have to worry about any issues with XP.

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Why not upgrade to Win 7 Pro & get XP Mode?
Jun 14, 2013 1:06PM PDT

If you invest $90 to upgrade your Windows 7 to the Professional version, you can get the free XP mode which runs very well as a started task under Windows 7. Then your XP programs will run fine as long as you don't need to play games with high speed graphics. Works for me. As an alternative you could use the Oracle Virtual Box and install a licensed version of XP under that. There's no need for you to spend money on a laptop you don't need.

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Why not upgrade to Win 7 Pro & get XP Mode?
Jun 14, 2013 10:44PM PDT

Easy answer. You offered no solution that does not cost $$$ to retain the same capability that we have already paid for. If for no other reason than general principles we should resist the pressure to 'upgrade' unless doing so provides NEW features of value to us. Frankly, it wouldn't bother me if Microsoft disappeared from the face of the Earth.

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Not as easy as you say
Jun 14, 2013 11:49PM PDT

I have already done a lot of research, including with Microsoft, the manufacturer (or maybe I should say the now owner company) of the discontinued software, and a number of computer shops. The responses I keep getting are the same: Even with upgrading to 7 Professional with the XP mode, the software won't run. It's been tried; it's been tested; it failed! So my options are to spend $90 for an upgrade that won't do what I need, or to spend $90 to pick up an used laptop (with XP already installed) that will allow me to run the software.

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(NT) Oracle Virtual Box is free
Jun 15, 2013 12:04AM PDT
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Will Oracle do the trick?
Jun 17, 2013 12:31PM PDT

The problem as I understand it is the whole 32-bit vs. 64-bit issue. I kept getting messages that the program wouldn't run because it was 32-bit, or that it wasn't compatible with my hardware. Will Oracle overcome that problem? Maybe I download it tomorrow and see if it works.

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Virtual Box Bombed on Installation
Jun 19, 2013 8:56AM PDT

I attempted to download OVB, but part way through the installation got the message: "Installation failed! Error: The Windows Installer Service could not be accessed. This can occur if the Windows Installer is not correctly installed. Contact your support personnel for assistance."

Since I'm not having trouble downloading and installing anything else, I am assuming the problem is with the Virtual Box Installer.

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I installed it under 64 bit Windows 8
Jun 19, 2013 9:40AM PDT

I installed it under 64 bit Windows 8 a couple of months ago and had no problems. I had 4 GB of RAM on that PC. It was slow (because my Core 2 Duo E6500 didn't have current features), but it worked just fine for me. According to their web site at
https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch01.html#hostossupport it supports the following host computers:
Windows hosts:

Windows XP, all service packs (32-bit)

Windows Server 2003 (32-bit)

Windows Vista (32-bit and 64-bit[1]).

Windows Server 2008 (32-bit and 64-bit)

Windows 7 (32-bit and 64-bit)

Windows 8 (32-bit and 64-bit)

Windows Server 2012 (64-bit)
Since I had no problems, I didn't use the Virtual Box forums, but you could check them out at
https://forums.virtualbox.org/
`
Good luck.

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Run multiple!
Jun 14, 2013 12:54PM PDT

I have XP and 7 on one machine and XP and 8 on another.

On my main machine I have 2 drives--Win 7 on a 64GB SSD and a 1TB with 2 partitions--XP on a 66GB partition and the rest for data.

Originally the machine was running XP on an 80GB PATA and data on 500GB drive.

The other machine has XP on a removable 40GB PATA, Win8 on a 64GB SSD and the old 500GB for data.

The machines do not dual boot. I normally use Win7/8. If I need to use XP, when booting I enter setup, set the XP as the boot drive and reboot.

I have had crashes of the Win 7 and Win 8 that required complete reinstalls. (Do not rely on Acronis backups for recovering a boot disk!) With data on a separate drive it was annoying but the data was fine.

Other benefits of this approach are repurposing older hardware and minimal upgrade costs. The original upgrades (before the SSD's) were just the cost of Win 7/8 and re-using old 40/80GB disks. And when there is a major crash ... hey, I've got a fully operational computer with all my data just by booting from the other OS.

On the other hand, I have been experimenting virtualization with Oracle's free Virtualbox. I keep the 40GB XP disk because it has a number of decade-old programs I need rarely that don't have free upgrades and won't work under Win 7/8. At some point I'll probably virtualize that. EaseUS Todo Backup Workstation can do P2V and has a fully functional 15-day trial version. (Buy through CNet to get for $32 instead of 39 through their website. Search for Todo Backup Free.)

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I use Acronis...
Jun 14, 2013 1:20PM PDT

And you are right about not trusting it, unless you have set your system up without that annoying extra partition that is now automatically installed unless you take steps to prevent it.

I won't go into how to set up a Windows 7 machine to use one partition for the entire system, as it should, but it can be done. Once that is done, Acronis True Image works great for restoring the system boot drive.

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Re restoring from Acronis
Jun 14, 2013 2:21PM PDT

Over about the past 18 months I have had four crashes on two machines, the last one a week ago. Twice the Acronis backups worked, twice they didn't. For the most recent one I had 3 backups, one from January, one from March and one after the crash. None of them would install to the SSD (which caused the crash and had to be replaced). They all installed to an 80GB PATA -- but then wouldn't actually work (BSOD). The images all mounted, they all verified, I could open files, etc. -- but they wouldn't actually restore the disk.

And, of course, I wasted an entire day trying variations in the hope of not having to reinstall everything. What ticks me off most is that the most recent one is a spare computer. All it had was Win8 and some utilities! 18GB total!

I haven't seen any problem with data drives, but I would never again rely on Acronis for a boot drive. Just too risky and unreliable.

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I had one problem...
Jun 15, 2013 5:53AM PDT

and it was with a pre-installed OS. When I install the OS, I eliminate that dual partition for the system.

What I had trouble with is exactly what you described. The system was there, but it wouldn't boot. After the restore, I ran the original Windows install disk and did a repair. It worked then. I had replaced the hard drive.

I am not fond of the newer versions of Acronis True Image. They have made it too complicated. I would still be using my old Acronis True Image 8 if the software could see SATA drives. I have been able to make it work for me, though.

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Disk Imaging Caveats
Jun 16, 2013 7:35AM PDT

I have used only Acronis most of the time. But paragon, macrium and todo are also appear to be good choices. I have not thoroughly tested them, and hopefully will not have to.

There are several caveats:

1. Never make an image with the windows running. You may not get any error message during backup, but when you restore that image, it will be a useless because files that were open (system files being used by the windows) during the backup, were not copied.

I am not sure if the newer versions have remedied this problem but, as a rule, I backup and restore an image only after booting from a rescue CD.

2. Having multiple partitions on a disk should not cause any problem. Rather, most trouble free restore is done from the image that was stored on the single (same) drive in a cpu, in another partition. Of course, it should be copied to external HD or a DVD for safety.

3. Always watch which partition you are backing up or restoring. Most boxes come with a small hidden (no drive letter) boot partition. This partition will be seen by the imaging program as the 'C' drive and thus, your 'C' drive will be restored as 'D' drive. This is fine - if - the image of 'C' (system partition) was created as if it was the 'D' drive. In other words, restore should not be changing the drive letter.

4. Having multiple drives within a box, even plugging in a flash drive, can create problem. The imaging program often sees the second drive (or the flash drive) as 'D' drive and thus, it changes the drive letter of original partition 'D' (on your hard drive) to 'E' etc. This alteration of the drive letters can make the restored image un-bootable, particularly if you had dual boot.

5. A newer version is not always better. I was restoring my daughter's image of 'C' drive. Acronis True Image 2013 was going to change it to 'D'. But True Image 2011 completed the restore process without changing the original drive letter and thus, I was able to avert this error.

6. Of course, if your system partition (drive 'C') is still a single partition that occupies most of your original HD then, you should not be dabbling with adult games of image creation and image restoration. If you do, disaster is just waiting to happen, even if your entire data was stored on a second drive.

I have discussed this earlier, and also above (#2) why partitioning your drive should be the first step.

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The problem is not having multiple partitions
Jun 16, 2013 9:13AM PDT

The problem is the additional partition (called "system") that is installed automatically, if you allow it. It is part of the system, but it is not drive C. This means that your system consists of two partitions, not one. One of them is invisible. The solution to this is to reinstall the OS in a way that forces the entire system to be placed on a single partition. The instructions are available in a book called "Windows 7 Annoyances." I'm sure it is also available somewhere online.

As for your assumption that I don't know what I'm doing, I am far more knowledgeable than you suppose. You are talking about basics. I am well beyond basics. If you do not know that Windows 7 installs an additional, invisible system partition then you are not one to be instructing anyone about backup and restore.