Home audio and video: Premium vs. generic cables

Derek, good question! If you are buying retail from a "Big Box" store such as Best Buy, Circuit City, CompUSA, etc., or even from the "No Box" big OL sites such as Amazon, CDW, Buy.com, Crutchfield, etc., you may find some good loss leader prices on screens or components, but you will find that these sellers make fantastic markups on accessories such as cables.

My rules on the whole purchase experience:

1) Never buy a large item on line (ie, HD Screen or home theater system without doing thorough research) and without the opportunity to return an on-line purchase (freight free) or to your local big-box site so you don't have to go through the expense and bs of shipping, lost time without product, etc. BTW, if you can return it locally, you probably paid your state's sales tax on it already even though you might have gotten a better purchase price on line.

2) If you are buying any hi-tech item on line or locally try to use a credit card that doubles the life of the mfgr's warranty plus (most AMEX and many MC/Visa/Disc Gold/Platinum cards - read the fine print).

For instance, let's say I buy a $3000 50" lcd tv at Costco, pay for it with my Costco Amex Business card, and on my way to the car, the set falls off my cart and is broken, I am immediately covered on accidental breakage from AMEX. Plus, I have two years warranty rather than the 1 year mfgr warranty, plus 30 days "no questions asked" return privledges to Costco, even if bought on line, plus a 7x24 800- line to call ("Concierge") if I have any operational/installation questions, along with 30-day price protection if Costco lowers their price on that item. Worth paying sales tax, you bet! (you will notice that I'm kind of biased to Costco).

3) Now to specifically address your cables question. Use your computer to search for the accessory items you need with a shopping service such as CNet Shopper or your own favorite site. Virtually no home installations for HD/home theater systems need Monster brand quality cables. A 6" shielded HDMI cable that costs $12 on line with no sales tax and perhaps free shipping performs exactly the same as the $65 or more cable your local retailer might have tried to charge you! Just make sure that you understand the quality that different types of connections offer, and then get the appropriate cable.

Analog or digital doesn't matter, although if you are putting in a $15,000 total installation and hiring an expert to install it, you don't need to care about the $$$, just do what the expert recommends (don't we wish).

Enjoy your experience and save the $$$.

i would say just get cheap things, theres no point in spending 100 bucks for 3 feet of HDMI cable when you can go on a website and find a knockoff brand with 10 feet of cable for 30 bucks...it doesnt really make a difference what brand of cord you have, which cord it is does though. HDMI is the most popular these days, so if your looking for something i would get that, but you dont need name brand cables. www.newegg.com has some great cheap cables for you to buy

There is a middle ground here. The $100 cables often do provide very slightly better performance, but most people don't have the finely-tuned discrimination to tell the difference. On the other hand, the dirt-cheap cables from the dollar store will have sloppy, high-resistance connectors and will possibly cause trouble down the road. Look for modestly priced cables with gold-plated connectors, preferably with outer (ground) connectors that form a solid circle for maximum contact and better shielding.

You first need to decide if you are going to pursue the pinnacle of perfection, or whether you just want to kick back with a beer and enjoy your movies or sound. As one who has been in both places over the years, I say give the $100 cable a pass.

By the way read "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance". Read it over again until you GET IT!

There are a few schools of thought on the matter as to which cables are the "best" for high def. I have been installing cable and satellite systems for about 10 years and have heard and seen all the arguments for and against the "right" cables for high def. The fact is, it all boils down to your input. If you have an old fashioned antennae ("rabbit ears"), your input signal is going to be from the airwaves, and the picture, no matter what you use to connect the antennae to the tv, is going to be as clear as the signal is. Now high def tv's can fine tune the signal for the most part, but your overall picture quality is going to only be as good as your input. Component cables are "the norm" as they provide a good connection from whatever set top box you are using (cable box, satellite, tivo, etc.) but they do have drawbacks.....since its more of a direct connection, any analog signals (regular over the air) are going to look grainy. HDMI cables are the more expensive approach to connecting but the only advantage they give you is one cable rather than the five that component cables use. S-video cables are for video only and so you would still need to connect audio somehow, wether it be rca cables, digital audio cable or whatever.
Now as far as which ones are better than the others, cost of the cables is relevant to their overall level of service, but as I stated before, its all about what the original signal is as to what shows up on the screen. If you have, or going to get, high definition provided by your cable or satellite company, they usually will provide you a mid-grade component cable, so you don't need to purchase anything for the settop hookup at all. If its cable, then they should also connect the box with coaxial cable as well, for the analog channels, that way the "graininess" that you gewt with component or hdmi or dvi cables isn't an issue; you just have to change inputs on your tv when viewing "non-digital" channels.
Finally I would suggest NOT hooking up a set top box that carries local, digital and high def channels with an hdmi or dvi cable. The reason is the box is set to change formats depending on what the input is (480dpi, 720 etc.) what tends to happen with the hdmi or dvi hookups with the format being changed is that the picture or sound will sometimes "drop-out" and the only way to get it back is to reboot the system.....hdmi and dvi cables are primarily made for a consistant dpi output, such as a dvd player or pc output.....since those are always going to be about the same resolution, those types of cables should be used for those components that are not going to change resolution. Its not a universal truth but I have seen it happen enough times that I suggest not even considering the hdmi or dvi option when hooking up a cable/sattelite set top box.

To summarize, the type of cable you connect with depends on what your input is, the cost of the cable is relevant to its overall quality but isn't as important as what type, if you are getting or already have high def cable or sattelite, your cable/satellite company will usually supply the necessary cables for you.

You are talking about HDMI? There are many different makers. You
must be aware of the hype. Cables must conform to the standard.So be
Watchful when some one offers a cable for $100 dollars. Another for
$25. That cable must conform to the standard. The rest is marketing.

For decades vendors have been peddling ridiculously expensive cables to hi-end audio people with the promise of letting the listener hear nuancecs that would be missed using inexpensive (but good quality) cable or wire from Radio Shack or Home Depot or etc. There are true believers among the buyers for the stuff that swear they can hear differences among wires...but they can only do it if they know which wire they are listening through at any given time. If a comparison listening test is done double-blind, so they can't tell the type of wire in use, they can't hear a difference. They want to believe there are differences so badly, that they come up with psychobable reasons about stress of the double-blind test that prevents them from telling the differences. And if you point out how silly that is to them, they get really angry. The flame wars still go on in rec.audio.opinion news group.

HD audio and video cables are exactly the same situation, except with digital communication the lack of importance of expensive cables is even greater. All you ever need to buy is wire or cable from a competent supplier that is appropriate to the task at hand. (You don't use 75 ohm co-ax for speaker wire and you don't use speaker wire for digital signal, etc.)

Finally, the why of the pressure you get at places like Best Buy to get the expensive stuff (Monster, for example) is that it very high profit (the highest margins of anything the typical store sells) and the fact that some vendors have generous incentive programs to reward top sellers of their stuff. I remember long ago hearing about how Monster would regularly fly the top sales people of their product to the founder's expensive home where they would be entertained with wheel time in his fleet of very expensive sports cars.

Don't fall for it. Buy the cheapest appropriate stuff you can find from a manufacturer like Belkin and spend the money you save on software (DVD's, CD's).

In answer to yuor question, having worked for a a reputable A/V company, I know a little about cables. Ultimately, they do make a difference, and if you are willing to spend a lot of money on good kit, then it's not economical to use the suplied cables. But, in answer to your question, once you get past a certain amount of money (25-30 GBPounds/50-60 USD) the increase in cost does not always match the increase in definition or clarity. $100 cables? In my opinion, they won't make that much difference. The best way to find out is to get the salesperson to use different cables on in-store equipment or see if they will let you trial different ones!

There is controversy surrounding the older S-Video, DVI and the new HDMI standard for use between your display and source (set top box or satellite receiver) with respect to what is "best." Or better. DVI is HDMI minus the audio interconnects. S-Video is no longer acceptable. Yes, new cable technologies are coming on the market regularly. Some users, like myself, still prefer to use the older standard "component video," which too, has a controversy surrounding it.

I have seen and heard substantial differences in performance between video AND audio cables (as a former reviewer for a high end audio publication.) The rule is, one needs to spend more to get performance...but not always much more. A good component video cable will likely outperform -- in fine systems -- even a good HDMI, though the newer technologies I speak of that incorporate EMI and noise suppression have made significant leaps to close the gaps and possibly surpass component video.

There are good technical reasons why some interconnects perform better than others, however in the cable business the manufacturers provide "White Papers" to explain theirs that more resemble sorcery than science. Yet it IS science, not advertisement, that proves a cable's mettle.

Whether you choose HDMI or component video, do experiment WITH BOTH. Buy with return privileges and see for yourself. Also consider that unless your audio is held in the digital domain from source to your amplifiers, digital cables will not, and cannot sound as good as discrete audio cables specifically designed for the purpose.

And have no doubt about it, your sound (audio) is as, if not more important to your enjoyment of a film, or sport, as your video setup!

But first, do have your hi def set, whenever possible, calibrated by an ISF certified technician to get the correct black and white levels...and the correct grays. You cannot have accurate and natural color rendition if you do not have correct grays, blacks and whites. On the other hand, some later model hi def sets can be adjusted by the user to come close enough if the user uses common sense. Remember to reduce contrast and brightness first!

Finally, DO read the publications that are at the forefront of the science, The Perfect Vision and Home Theater Magazine.

Why some cables are more expensive

In addition to my answer above Derek, I'll add issues of psychology.

A man's credentials as a technician, reviewer, installer, or years in the industry do not matter. His REAL experience listening and viewing interconnects DO matter.

If the man is set in his views that either he always will hear or see differences or improvements between cables, than it is his psychology, and not reality, speaking. And if he tells you that there are no differences between audio and video interconnects, it is the same.

A Chevy will get you there. So will a Ferrari. If you can't afford a Ferrari you will, sometimes, actually believe that there is NO reason to spend $200,000 for a Ferrari, or that the improvements you see, feel, or believe regarding the quality of one over the other, does not warrant the higher price. In the case of a car, one can say we are talking values, not value. There is a huge distinction between one's values, and the objective value of the subject matter.

Objectively, as well as subjectively, many people have an huge investment in their belief systems. Objectively and subjectively, in the highest quality systems -- as in a high quality microscope -- one can hear and see dramatic differences between interconnects. But not always...just most of the time.

There are levels of qualitative improvements between cables that can be repeatedly demonstrated to anyone with an open mind.

If a man has never heard, let's say (and I'll choose one lesser known but a very competitive and successful brand) NORDOST video or audio cables, one can actually continue to believe that his Best Buy cables...even by a major well known manufacturer -- is good enough, or the best. For example, a Nordost component video interconnect, if I remember correctly, costs about $500. To many it is insanely priced.

So the way I see it....I mean "see" it....is that is is 10% of the price of your $5000 large screen TV. Or about 15% of your $3500 large screen TV. What if I told you that it can improve your picture quality 30%? Even after calibration!

You'd probably not believe me and believe the gents on this post who -- never having experienced it for themselves -- tell you to just go ahead and buy the $19 cables.

No I say. Order the high priced spread with return privileges...see for yourself...and improve your enjoyment of the hobby.

The fact is, meeting the specs is NOT enough. The impedance terminations of these cables are critical. Close enough is not enough.

The sad truth about quality is that it costs money. There are no free lunches, no free health care, no free drugs. Someone has to pay for all of those. There are consequences to be paid for short cuts to quality (your Ferrari will beat the pants off your Chevy and the girl sitting next to you just may be hotter than the one sitting next to the guy in the Chevy...) All steaks do not taste the same; all suits do not feel the same, nor fit the same; all amplifiers do not sound the same; all hi def TV displays do not have the same quality of video processing.

All cables do not have the same performance because in fact they do not have the same transmission capability...

...because we cannot measure all things. We, well, some of us, just believe that we can. And it is what you have not yet measured that makes the difference...especially if someone has measured and identified what makes the important differences. Ferrari has. But it costs money to give you the F-048's performance. Sorry, but reality does not care what we think...only what is.

When I bought my LG LCD TV I also bought $150.00 HDMI cable so I could enjoy the 1080i. As it turns out the(RCA)cables provided with my digital service (which were FREE) is what the cable guy said he recommends (I also bought an $18.00 pair at Walmart for my Surround sound/DVD system). They come equipped with GOLD connectors for better quality just like the $150.00 ones. After trying the HDMI cable anyway (which I later returned) I saw that the difference in quality DID NOT warrant $150.00 when there are not enough channels in HD yet anyway.

Having worked in the sound & video industry since long before the advent of HDTV (let's just say that the average projector was several hundred pounds in those days), cables have always been a dirty little secret for the retail side of the business.

The primary reason that you are aske about cables is that the salesman can make more of a commission on that $100 cable than he does off of the HDTV on which you just spent $1500 or more. Profit margins on TVs have gotten very small, and may only be a couple of percentage points at most. On the other hand, the cable that you are paying $100 to buy costs the store about $15 to purchase.

Now for the question of quality... There are some differences in the quality of cable, connectors, and construction, but not enough to justify the large cost differential in most cases. RG6 Quad Shield cable is probably your best choice for coaxial digital connections, but chances are that the cable itself all comes from the same source for both the cheap cable and the expensive one. More important that choosing the "best" cable is choosing the RIGHT cable. 110-Ohm? 75-Ohm? 50-Ohm? All have their appropriate uses, but the bast way to choose is by looking at the suggested applications on the package or website description. When it comes to connectors, more expensive is not always better, just go for something that has a sturdy look and feel. Gold is not necessarily better than nickel, unless you have some very long cable runs (or are looking at an oscilloscope). Your best bet is to match the metal on the connector on the TV itself. Basic electrical principles tell you that like metals will always make a better connection than unlike ones.

With regard to HD signals, digital is a different world from analogue, when it comes to signal loss. Analogue signals degrade over distance, and will provide some image even if you are below the optimal threshold. Consider being able to pick up a radio station from several hundred miles away... It may have alot of static, but it is still there. Digital signals require a signal above the threshold to function, so if the signal drops below a distance limit, you get nothing. That is why your satellite TV goes out during periods of extreme weather rather than just delivering a snowy picture. The same is true for the signal between your Blu Ray DVD player and your HDTV. If You can see a picture, you are above the threshold, and a "better" cable will likely make no discernible difference. Just determine your connection in order of quality.... HDMI is better than YPbPr (Component Video), and these are the only true HD connection types readily available today. DVI-D is the same, and interchangeable with HDMI with a simple adapter. You may have some may have some issues with HDCP using an older set with DVI-D and not HMDI, but that is another issue.

All in all, don't buy the expensive cables that the sales person tells you are "the best" ones out there, as they are only "the best" source of revenue for him. Those thicker brand M cables are typically nothing more than a few extra layers of rubber on the same conductor used by everyone else. At the same time, don't necessarily buy the cheapest cables either, as these are sometimes very flimsy and won't last for repeated use. Buy the least expensive ones with a quality construction and solid feel. Ask to see one out of the package... If they won't do it, go somewhere that will.

If you are buying a HDTV be sure it has at least one HDMI plugin. Be sure to spend the extra $70.00 to $100.00 on a HDMI cable because it is as different as night and day. You already spent good money so don't blow it with cheep cables. Also get a copy of "Toy Story" and use the set-up to tune your new HDTV. You can also go on line and get set-up DVD's for tuning your picture.

I've been building sound systems of all types for over 40 years, including many for top musical performers and Disney. It seems like this question never goes away, but here's what I know from experience: Save your money.

Use large enough gauge speaker wire to get the job done. Low oxygen copper is some better, so a good, 16 gauge wire designed for speakers is best. I'm talking about home theaters with $500 a piece speakers and up, here. Unless you have some really good speakers, however, 16 gauge lamp cord from the hardware store will do. Using a larger size makes no difference you can hear, so don't bother. Larger gauge wire will have a little less power loss, but your amp has plenty of power to spare unless you have to run it wide open to get loud enough.

As for audio hookup cables, I've tested everything from cheapies to sterling silver wire with gold plated connectors. You want one that has good, reliable connectors and decent size wire, but beyond that it's just not going to matter. A $15 hookup cable is going to "sound" just like a $100 one. That is to say, we can't hear the difference in A/B blind tests using a dozen experienced engineers and musicians. Fiber optical cable is always the best way to go if the equipment has that capability. Even though these cables range from a few dollars to over a hundred, they all produce the same results. The principal difference is in the strength of the outer jacket and connectors. If you're hooking up a home theater and it's just going to sit there on a shelf, most any F.O. cable will do.

Video cables get a little more complicated, however. Size matters. You need a real, coaxial cable whether you are using component ("RGB") or composite (the yellow jack). You can spot real coax because it's only a little smaller than the coaxial cable from the wall to your cable box or satellite receiver.

HDMI is the new, "one size fits all" attempt at the home theater version of a computer's USB cable. It will someday allow two-way communication between the various components in a system, but we just aren't there yet with the components or the protocol. The standard keeps changing, and some reputable manufacturers have stopped putting these on their equipment because of this. HDMI is more about the convenience of a single cable to carry both audio and hi def video than any real improvement in quality, and the cost is high. I'd stick with component video and fiber optics for now.

Consider this. The hardest thing is to change energy from one form to another. Since virtually all audio and video is now digital, the only real challenge is to convert the signal into something we can see or hear. Spend your money on the very best video display and loudspeakers you can afford, and don't get all hung up over a bunch of wire that nobody's even going to see if you install it correctly.

Derek, from my experience your immediate response was the correct one. Companies manufacturing these goods have a vested interested in you. If you like their goods & they want you to be a satisfied customer, they will provide the best leads that there are. If you are satisfied this time around, then that is what they want, as you are more likely to come back again. The shop assistant is only interested in his commission for selling items which are not really rquired. Yours Aye, Roy

Copper is copper, that is, there is no scientific basis for the claims of high price cables.These high price cables have been the biggest swingle ever. Stick with the cheap ones.