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General discussion

Help that Image Stabilization Provides

Feb 14, 2006 10:18AM PST

I am upgrading from a Cannon S110 and an OptioS 3Mp. The Optio has been a DISSASTER in low light. But I find the Cannon a little big and it is OLD (4 years).

I am interested in Image Stabilization from Panasonic Cameras. I had a SD550 and returned it because of the gold color. Now I am deciding if I should get a camera with Image Stabilization because I do a lot of traveling and have had HUGE problems in low light.

Specifically the situations where I have been having trouble taking shots are: Dark Gothic Churches, Fireworks, Going out at night in dark bars, and Disney Land specifically the Electric Light Show Parade. I don?t use a tripod and won't.

Any suggestions? Is Image Stabilization useful or is it just a gimmick?

Discussion is locked

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Image Stabilization
Feb 14, 2006 11:13AM PST

Most people expect too much from a camera when it comes to low light situations.

All cameras need a certain level of light to produce a properly exposed photo.

They need this exact same amount of light, whether is is day or night.

The camera has three ways of controlling light:
Aperture (f-stop)
ISO setting
Shutter Speed

If you camera has a lens rated at f2.8
that is the maximum setting for letting in light.

In a very low light situation, the camera will:
set the aperture to its maximum (f2.Cool.
set the ISO setting at its maximum (usually 400).
then adjust the shutter speed to stay open long enought to collect that exact amount of light.

This usually results in setting a very slow shutter speed (maybe even a second or more).
You can not hand hold a camera for one second without moving the camera, which results in blurred photos.

It is recommended that you do not hand hold a camera with the shutter speed slower than 1/60th of a second.
If you have image stabilization, you can successfully hand hold at 1/30th of a second. Anything slower than that is iffy.

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You could buy a camera with a brighter lens (say f2.0), that would add twice as much light as the f2.8

Currently the only small camera with a f2.0 lens is the Canon G6 ($550).

You could buy a camera with higher ISO settings (say 3200). That would be doubling the amount of light, three times.

Most small camera sensors produce too much noise to go above ISO 400.

Fujifilm has developed a sensor that can go up to ISO 1600 with acceptable noise levels.

It is on these cameras:
Z2, F10, F11, S5200, S9000

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You can buy a DSLR (digital single lens reflex) camera with a f1.8 lens, ISO 3200. This will function better in low light situations. The price would start at about $900.

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You can use the camera you have now, if you use a tripod, because the solution is to not let the camera or the subject move when you are taking the photo.

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Image stabilization is more useful when you are hand holding a camera while using a long optical zoom lens, such as 10X. It is a little helpful in low light situations.

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ok..
Feb 14, 2006 12:11PM PST

Ok I understand that but some of the shots I described there is enough light but the problem is speed. For example fireworks and the disney electrical parrade. I get big lines of color because the things are mooving. So I need shorter shutter speed. Yet a higher ISO is longer shutter speed. Thus I am hopiong that Image Stabilization might substitute for the object staying still.

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A higher ISO allows a faster shutter speed. As with film, it
Feb 14, 2006 2:34PM PST

means the camera is more sensitive to light. Therefore, shutter speed can be increased.

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Shutter Speed
Feb 15, 2006 12:47AM PST

The only way to get more shutter speed is to increase the aperture or ISO settings.

If these are at maximum you cannot increase shutter speed.

Image Stabilization does not help with motion blur (people or things moving). It is for preventing camera blur (the camera is moved during the shot).

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I would think that you should be able to get a decent shot of the Disney electrical parade or a fireworks show.

If you are using a point-and-shoot camera, it is quite likely that the camera is not adjusting to the conditions. Some camera have scene modes, such as fireworks, show, action, landscape, etc.

These are helpful in getting a little control of the camera. But they go not guarantee that the camera is choosing the best settings.

You should choose a camera that has manual controls such as shutter priority, aperture priority, program mode, and manual control.

This lets you choose the best settings for the photo situation.

For the electrical parade you could set the ISO to maximum (probably 400) and then choose a shutter priority mode with the shutter set at 1/100th of a second. Then the camera will select the appropriate aperture setting. If there is not enough light for that setting, the camera will warn you. But I would take the shot anyway and check the results.

A good low priced camera with manual controls is the Canon A520, which sells for under $200.

A better choice would be the Canon A610, which sells for about $275.


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Re: Canon A610
Feb 21, 2006 12:03AM PST

Does the A610 actually have image stabilization? Because they have it listed in the camera's specifications in the Apple.com store but I didn't see it discussed in the CNet review.

If this camera doesn't have IS, is it at least pretty insensitive to camera movement?

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Canon A610
Feb 21, 2006 8:00AM PST

The Canon A610 does not have image stabilization.

You seldom need image stabilization for normal shooting unless you are using a long lens (10X, 12X)camera.

If you have a camera zoomed out to 10X, any camera movement is multiplied by 10. That is why so many long lens cameras have image stabilization.

The next time you are in a camera store that lets you get your hands on the camera, pick up a 12X camera and make sure that image stabilization is turned off.
Zoom out to 12X and aim at an object far away. You will see the object dancing all over the LCD. Like a tap dancer on a bed of lava.

Cameras with a zoom or 3X or 4X usually do not benefit much from image stabilization.

Fast shutter speeds also help reduce the problem of camera movement. Any shot that requires a shutter speed of less than 1/60th of a second should not be hand held. Image stabilization will help for shutter speeds of 1/30th of a second. A speed that Sony chooses a lot for flash photos.

The A610 is no more insensitive to camera movement than most other cameras of its size and weight.

A larger and heavier camera is easier to hold steady.

Here are a few tips to reduce camera movement:
1. Use the viewfinder instead of the LCD.
When you use the viewfinder, make sure that the camera touches your face. You head is steadier than two outstreatched arms.

2. Learn to lean against solid objects like posts, trees, walls, etc.

3. In low light situations, set the camera on a table or other solid flat surface.

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The camera companies are starting to move toward larger ISO settings, as they find new ways to build sensors that produce less noise.

This helps low light situations and camera shake by allowing the camera to select a faster shutter speed.

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OK... here's the deal...
Feb 17, 2006 3:42AM PST

As a previous responder stated, image stabilization (referred to as "IS") is not what you need for the results you're looking for. I have a WONDERFUL telephoto lens with IS and I love it, but it won't do what you describe. If a salesperson tells you otherwise then he is lying or misinformed.

If you're trying to stop the SUBJECT'S motion under low-light conditions (night-time parade, ballet recital, concert), then all of your choices really boil down to one thing: money. What you're trying to do is rather difficult to achieve without spending some serious dough. Your best bet is to use an SLR with either...

(a) some very "fast" (e.g. large-aperture) lenses or
(b) a powerful hand-held flash unit or
(c) both.

When I say fast lenses, I'm talking 2.8 at the very least. 2.0 would be better and anything larger becomes VERY expensive or is simply not manufactured.

Correctly using an off-camera flash unit is beyond the scope of this response.

Cranking-up the ISO as high as reasonably possible will help a lot, BUT you must be prepared for the grain and noise in the final image. It's a trade-off.

Opening to aperture to the widest setting will also help a lot, but don't expect much depth of field unless you're using a wider-angle lens. A setting of f/2.0 on a 100 mm lens has a razor-thin depth of field. Not what you want for photographing a parade.

As for the fireworks, well, that can be a bit easier... try this: First, buy a tripod. Sorry, but you're gonna need it. Now, set your ISO nice and low (100 or 200 maybe). Now, close-down your aperture a bit, like maybe 5.6 or smaller. This is going against everything you've been taught for low-light shooting. At this point, you're probably thinking "is this guy nuts?".

With the camera mounted on the tripod, point it at the sky where the fireworks WILL be (in a moment). Set the drive mode to "delay" or "timer" (to prevet shaking the camera when you press the shutter button) and set the shutter to several seconds (notice that you'll have to be in Manual mode for all of this, by the way). Make sure the focus is at infinity. Press the button, sit back, and watch the fireworks. Lather, rinse, repeat.

The aperture and ISO are so low that the black sky will remain black, since there isn't enough ambient light to "expose" the sensor. The fireworks, on the other hand, are usually bright enough to expose just fine. And your result will be a nice black sky with beautiful fireworks. Check your resluts and make small ajustments as necessary.

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Any camera with f stop less than f2.8 & Image stabilization?
Feb 18, 2006 1:03AM PST

Thank you

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hmmm ok thanks
Feb 18, 2006 7:36AM PST

Ok thanks, I guess I get the picture. Pretty much that you are SOL unless you go SLR. (which I'm not willing to do) so ok.