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Resolved Question

Gateway PC will not boot if floppy drive is connected

Nov 28, 2011 4:39PM PST

I have an old Gateway mini-tower, model # MFATXSTL ELP 500L-2, manufacture date 12/22/2011.

Was running two days ago, when it suddenly shut down ten minutes after startup, power-on yielded yellow power button light (steady yellow), no beep codes, no monitor display.

Did the usual, reseated the memory cards, video card, rechecked molex connections and reseated.

Noticed when computer should have been running POST, floppy drive light did not come on. CD-ROM drive lights both flashed. fans for PSU and CPU ran, green light on motherboard.

Removed power lead to floppy drive, and system completed POST, reset BIOS to current date and time (put in a new CMOS battery just prior) and was able to boot to Ubuntu Linux 10.0.04 LTS.

System specs:

P4 1.5 gHz, 512 GB RAM, AGP 4x nvidia MX 200 card, integrated sound, integrated network card. Use a PS2 mouse and USB keyboard.

Was running this system and detailing steps to troubleshoot here when system froze completely. Forced shutdown gave green power button but did not complete POST as no video came up.

Now using another system to complete and finish this post.

Digital voltmeter with all power leads to peripheral drives disconnected showed 11.758 volts to mains, and 3.784 volts to floppy drive. Is this right? I did not check the main power to the motherboard.

I'm thinking the PSU is degraded, and will no longer supply enough current and wattage to run the system continuously anymore. System ran for about 40 minutes today before it locked up.

System was running two IDE HDD, two CD-ROM. Second HDD is used to backup data on the primary drive.

Also noticed when forced shutdown is made, system does not shut down immediately when it should be running POST as it usually does only two or three seconds in. It acts as if the OS is loaded when it cannot be after such a short time.

Appreciate any help

Discussion is locked

mchainmchain has chosen the best answer to their question. View answer

Best Answer

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The 3.784 is a clue.
Nov 28, 2011 5:03PM PST

All "drives" such as floppy, HDD, and optical usually have +12V and +5V and 3.784 is well outside a generous 10% tolerance.

At 10 years old, we are well past the usual 5 year design life so consider some new PSU but only after inspecting all boards for BAD CAPS. BAD CAPS on google.com gives you the story, pictures and what to look for.
Bob

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Yeah, thought so too...
Nov 29, 2011 12:53AM PST

Mr. Proffitt and Willy,

Wasn't aware of the 10% tolerance rule. Thank you for that.

I have a PSU exact size and form factor (unusual for it's day, as some/most were proprietary) rated to run a P4 1.5, albeit a different mb, lying around the house from a tossed neighbor's system.

That system had bad sectors on the primary HDD, hence the NTLoader error. Was running Win2000.

There is a 'test' button on the defective PSU. What does it test??? I assume one would push it in/hold it down to test.

Just out of curiosity, are POST cards available at retail shops?

No bad caps. Know what they look like, what to look for. Thanks.

BTW, system has been randomly not completing POST for the last three months now. System is run six or seven times a month anyway as I am the primary user and I do not have either system networked together in a home network on a DSL connection, so I must move connections from one pc to the other to run them. The Dell I use is the primary.

The Gateway is a dual boot system with Linux and Win98SE on it, primarily to run M$ Office Professional 2000 using Win98SE. Win98SE runs just fine even though it was never designed to run a P4 processor.

Willy, I will install a new floppy drive as these are relatively inexpensive. I did disable the floppy in BIOS to ensure the system would boot. BIOS build date is 1/9/1999! As it is used so little, I think it worth putting in the other PSU for now.

Another typo....(Sorry, it was late....) 512 MB RAM, BTW...

Thanks again.

mchainmchain

XP Home Edition SP 3,P4 2.8, 2 GB RAM

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As I have no document on the PSU test button.
Nov 29, 2011 1:07AM PST

I have no answer. No part number, maker, link means I can't look for it

Those POST cards are pretty useless. What good does it do you to see the North Bridge Chip failed when you can't replace that? For the price of said card we can find another motherboard.

The 10% is not a rule, it's just a handy guideline to know when it's out of bounds. The real spec is over at Intel.com if folk want it. But I find easy to remember to be easy to remember.
Bob

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Parting advise
Nov 29, 2011 3:31AM PST

Just be aware that "bad caps" are also in the PSU, something not readily seen until taken apart. On top of that a bad cap can be one that's "dried out" literally void of the electrolytic fluid it needs and/or has degraded. Your observations are tell-tale signs of a bad PSU, but you got your $ worth in a 10yr. system.

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USB FLOPPY
Nov 29, 2011 3:41AM PST

Got one. Maybe two!

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Answer
Sorry, that was a typo...
Nov 28, 2011 4:58PM PST

Manufacture date is 12/22/2001.

Sorry 'bout that.

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Answer
Wear & tear
Nov 28, 2011 10:52PM PST

It seems when you unplugged the FD, it basically had enough power to boot-up. At 2001 build date, its seen better days. While you have the voltmeter, check everything. Overall, simply swap out the PSU for better one if you want to keep the PC going. I would seriously think of a new PC or newer one(used, too) as 2001 build, there's bound to be other issues as time progresses. For now, unless you have a need for FD drive, then live w/o it unitl repairs are done or leave it out entirely later.

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Re Wear & Tear
Dec 2, 2011 7:04AM PST

Willy,

Okay, I replaced the PSU with one with exactly the same wattage output (160 watts minimum, 350 watts max) and got the machine running again, albeit for only about four hours. Froze once again, and forced shutdown and got the yellow power light once more.

Purchased an new PSU 480 watt output, and that one went dead (temporarily) after only one hour. If I turn it on now, power light is green, and system boots into linux.

Looks as if this is a heat related issue, at CPU maybe? Both the CPU fan and PSU fans are running, but so quiet it is hard to hear. Maybe the CPU fan is bad, or running too slowly?

System is clean of dust.

Also noticed when the case was open before third PSU failure, that the AGP 4x card, a nvidia M20 was running hot enough that I could barely smell it, but no smoke. Card felt warm to the touch. Card does not have a GPU heat sink fan installed, nor does it have a heat sink of any kind installed.. Card does run without any apparent problems. HDD's and CD-ROM's were not connected at the time.

I show 12.52 volts and 5.25 volts at mains and 5.25 volts at floppy connection with the brand new unit, but this was before the PSU failure just now. Will check again and report back

I am saving the HDD's to get the files off of them later

As it is, I am not throwing any more money at it, but would like to have the troubleshooting experience for the future should this ever come up again.

What to look for?

XP Home Edition SP3 P4 2.8 2 GB RAM