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General discussion

From Homeland Secuity....OOPS!

Sep 19, 2016 12:26PM PDT
More than 800 mistakenly granted citizenship

I forget whom, but didn't one of our presidential candidates call for halt to immigration from certain places until we could figure out what's going on and put measures into place to prevent this kind of thing? Of course anyone who'd advocate that sort of policy is both deplorable and unredeemable.

Discussion is locked

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If that was a prison warden
Sep 20, 2016 5:44AM PDT

....and he "accidentally" let 800 prisoners out of jail, where do you think he'd be right now? Everyone of these 800 are also now criminals.

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RE: If that was a prison warden
Sep 20, 2016 6:11AM PDT

prison wardens release prisoners on their own initiative?

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NT - you don't know the answer to that?
Sep 20, 2016 7:31AM PDT

NT

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Since you didn't give an answer.....
Sep 20, 2016 7:47AM PDT

I take it you don't....So I'll tell you...

NO...they don't release prisoners "on their own initiative."...

YOU asked

"accidentally" let 800 prisoners out of jail,

give an example of how the warden "accidentally" released prisoners, did he forget to lock the door when he went home for the night?

You compare America to a "prison"?

I can't recall many cases of people entering a prison illegally.

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so dense
Sep 20, 2016 1:56PM PDT

they were leaving the "prison" when they came here illegally, and that's what makes them also a criminal here as well. Even if the analogy isn't a perfect fit, and few ever are, it describes accurately the same situation of letting potentially dangerous people loose into our population with all the same rights as generations of citizens and their children and grandchildren and great grandchildren have. Rights such illegals should not have.

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RE:with all the same rights as generations of citizens
Sep 20, 2016 7:54PM PDT
with all the same rights as generations of citizens and their children and grandchildren and great grandchildren have.


You're the guy that thinks even people that enter the country legally have to be there for 3 generations before they are "American Citizens".

RE:they were leaving the "prison" when they came here illegally,

They were?...I thought in YOUR scenario

If that was a prison warden ....and he "accidentally" let 800 prisoners out of jail, where do you think he'd be right now?
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"Citizen" should be more than a designation
Sep 22, 2016 6:25AM PDT

It should be heritage also, something that's sadly lacking in our government's current understanding of what makes one a true "citizen" of a nation. The principle is also iterated in Bible, Deuteronomy chapter 23:7-8. How can someone who doesn't speak the language, hasn't grown up in the country, still clings to things of their former homeland, be called or considered a "citizen"? In truth, they can't, and the belief they can, is ridiculously stupid. They may become a "legal" citizen, but they are NOT a citizen, although hopefully their grandchildren will have properly assimilated into our society.

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Any comment on the OP?
Sep 20, 2016 2:58PM PDT

Are you OK with letting 800+ slip through due to administrative oversight? Any corrective action needed to prevent this or is 800 too small to worry about?

Maybe you'd consider addressing the originally posted topic rather than taking other peoples responses to task. A novel idea...Yes? Give it a shot.

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Re:Any comment on the OP?
Sep 20, 2016 7:43PM PDT

Not much point locking the barn door AFTER the horses have left the barn,

Any corrective action needed to prevent this?

Prevent something that has already happened?

the wayback machine I referred to.

put measures into place to prevent this kind of thing?


From YOUR link

NOW consistently add digital fingerprint records of immigrants whom agents encountered until 2010.

Since 2010 "measures" are in place....

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Corrective action needed "after the horse leaves the barn".
Sep 21, 2016 1:39AM PDT

You suggested better fingerprinting would already take care of this but didn't my OP mention a corrective action someone has already suggested beyond that? That suggestion would be to lock the barn until we're sure no rogue horses would be stabled there. I'm not suggesting that I'm in full agreement with that specific suggestion he made but it seems that pausing and thinking things through more thoroughly in the beginning might alleviate the need to rely on hindsight later. We can do crisis management or we can do better preparation up front. Which is the better? You tell me.

If the objective is to prevent harm to American citizens, how much harm is tolerable before we take action? I'd say, if a few American lives spent are worth the sacrifice, let that sacrifice be made and/or felt by these politicians.

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Stupid statement that....
Sep 22, 2016 6:26AM PDT

....anything that has already happened thereby legitimizes it, so that it can't be reversed. Reversal can also happen, and once done, your concept will legitimize, even if you and others would reject that concept then.

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Someone (formerly) from DHS
Sep 20, 2016 6:21AM PDT

was on Fox&Friends this morning and cited a law that can be used to reverse their citizenship and deport them, but not until a new president takes over in January since this administration will absolutely do nothing about it now..........because as 'citizens', even fraudulently, they are eligible to vote in November. One is already a cop, two are working at airports, and I think one is a security guard. Oh, goody........voter fraud, here we come.

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RE:voter fraud, here we come.
Sep 20, 2016 7:25AM PDT

I'll bet TheRUMP would like to get some of THAT action.

The gap was created because older, paper records were never added to fingerprint databases created by both the now-defunct Immigration and Naturalization Service and the FBI in the 1990s. ICE, the DHS agency responsible for finding and deporting immigrants living in the country illegally, didn't consistently add digital fingerprint records of immigrants whom agents encountered until 2010.

It's too bad no one has perfected time travel....Go back in time and correct errors.

Another opportunity for TheRUMP to ask for Obama's "fingerprint/footprint" on his birth certificate?

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Funny how you should mention
Sep 20, 2016 9:14AM PDT

the "1990's"..........Not only did Clinton's IMS and FBI not add those fingerprints to the database, but BC actually 'accidentally' ALSO made citizens out of those ready for deportation just in time for his second election. Coincidence that it should happen again just in time for another Dem needing voters? I hardly think so.......

Don't you EVER get sick of how corrupt this particular administration has proven itself to be over and over and over and over in such pukingly provocative fashion and with such blatant, 'the bird' finger regularity?

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Re: Funny how you should mention the "1990's".
Sep 20, 2016 10:12AM PDT

Something else is "funny"............ YOU didn't mention 2001 - 2009......... GW BUSH

BC was a nincompoop?...and GWBush (even after 9/11) didn't do the "correct thing"....HE had 8 years same as Bill Clinton to "do the right thing"...but, did HE do it?...OH NO!

Did GW Bush need the votes?

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RE:didn't consistently add digital fingerprint records
Sep 20, 2016 10:34AM PDT
didn't consistently add digital fingerprint records of immigrants whom agents encountered until 2010.

Obama take office in Jan 2009....in 2010 they consistently add digital fingerprint records of immigrants whom agents encountered

Can I have an "AMEN"?
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After 2010 they stopped taking
Sep 20, 2016 10:57AM PDT

PAPER fingerprints.....they were all digital after that time, but DHS never transferred the older paper type over to digital. Maybe they were too busy trying to stop all the attacks on our turf that have happened on BO's dime (none happened during GWB) and they didn't have the time to spend transferring them over.

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RE: attacks on our turf
Sep 20, 2016 12:01PM PDT
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Yes, I recognize your ALZ
Sep 20, 2016 2:20PM PDT

The Towers wouldn't have been attacked if BC had acted on the two or more chances he had to kill OBL (and add up all of the attacks, including the Towers and the USS Cole, that happened under BC that were totally ignored by him..........under GWB (less than 8 months into his term), we didn't have any MORE attacks, big or small. Is that better for you? Now start counting up ALL of the attacks that have occurred under BO's "we're safer now" two terms........

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So now it's
Sep 20, 2016 7:16PM PDT
we didn't have any MORE attacks, AFTER the BIGGEST attack happened under the careful watch of GW Bush.

But he was only there for 8 months when the attack happened?

So exactly when does the POTUS start taking responsibility for Commander In Chief?

Elected in Nov...sworn in January.......2 1/2 months after elected? 1 year after elected?

How Much Is George W. Bush Responsible for 9/11?

It’s not simply a question of whether he could have stopped the devastation—that’s unknowable. But did he do all he could given the various warnings that al-Qaeda was planning a major attack somewhere on US territory, most likely New York or Washington? The unpleasant, almost unbearable conclusion—one that was not to be discussed within the political realm—is that in the face of numerous warnings of an impending attack, Bush did nothing.

Osama bin Laden was already a wanted man when the Bush administration took office. The Clinton administration had identified him as the prime suspect in the 1998 bombings of two US embassies in Africa, and it took a few steps to capture or kill him that came to naught. Outgoing Clinton officials warned the incoming administration about al-Qaeda, but the repeated and more specific warnings by Richard Clarke, who stayed on from one administration to the next as the chief terrorism adviser, were ignored. In a White House meeting on July 5, 2001, Clarke said, “Something really spectacular is going to happen here, and it’s going to happen soon.” By this time top Bush officials regarded Clarke as a pain, who kept going on about terrorist plots against the US.
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Those warnings
Sep 21, 2016 8:14AM PDT

have already been proven to be 'non-specific' and GUESSING where an attack would happen wasn't much help so that 'protections' could be in place ahead of time. There was plenty of chatter ahead of time regarding the multiple attacks that happened under BC and, again, they were 'non-specific' so even BC couldn't stop them from happening.......BUT they DID know WHO was responsible and DID NOTHING so all those 'test attacks' with NO response made them even bolder. BC had 8 YEARS to stop OBL....GWB had less than 8 MONTHS and he's still being blamed by the left. Would you be blaming GORE if he had won instead and the Towers came down on HIS watch in 8 months? I seriously doubt it........the left would find a reason not to as usual. You probably would have done the same thing BO has been doing.......blame it on Climate Change, or their bad jobs, or their economy, or whatever else you find handy. I am not going to rehash crap with you.

Get to the topic at hand.......800+ illegally/'mistakenly' given citizenship rather than deportation because SURPRISE, they LIED and gave phony names on their applications. New fingerprints that couldn't be matched to previous records, but with a phony name, they wouldn't have been on any other 'get them out of here' lists. It only proves that they lie in order to keep beating our systems and we've been too stupid to keep up with even that possibility because we are so PC that we need to trust in order to keep pushing a REALLY STUPID agenda, and they ARE going to vote in 45+ days and those votes won't be nullified even though we know now all of their names, real and imagined. THAT'S even STUPIDER that lying under oath to become a 'citizen' is acceptable to the left.

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RE: they ARE going to vote in 45+ days
Sep 21, 2016 11:37AM PDT

Already laying the groundwork for a lose are we?

TheRUMP is also whining about something that hasn't happened yet.


Did you hear TheRUMP loves to spend OPM?

Other Peoples Money....IF he gets elected...the "Other People" will be the taxpayer.

they were 'non-specific' so even BC couldn't stop them from happening.

AND

The Towers wouldn't have been attacked if BC had acted on the two or more chances he had to kill OBL


EVEN Bill couldn't "stop them" AND HE didn't act?

Are you OK Toni? I think you are the one rehashing "crap".

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Let's get on the "wayback machine"
Sep 20, 2016 12:21PM PDT
How Much Is George W. Bush Responsible for 9/11?

And then along came Donald Trump, to whom “political correctness” is a relic of an antiquated, stuffy, political system he’s determined to overwhelm. In an interview on October 16, he violated the longstanding taboo by saying, “When you talk about George Bush—I mean, say what you want, the World Trade Center came down during his time.”
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Pardoning criminals
Sep 20, 2016 10:10AM PDT

seems to be a longstanding tradition with our presidents during their final days in office. We know that our current president takes issue with the number of persons in prison for non-violent offenses...particularly, drug abuse. I could wonder if a mass release of such offenders will announced toward the end of his presidency but I wouldn't want to suggest political gains would come from this. Gerald Ford probably holds the record for most number of pardons by offering amnesty to 50K draft dodgers. Maybe Obama will try to eclipse that record?

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RE:Maybe Obama will try to eclipse that record?
Sep 20, 2016 12:45PM PDT

Isn't it too late for Obama? He would have to do something like that long before his last day in office?

On this day in 1977, President Jimmy Carter, in his first day in office, fulfilled a campaign promise by granting unconditional pardons to hundreds of thousands of men who had evaded the draft during the Vietnam War by fleeing the country or by failing to register.

Carter made a promise during the election campaign...he won the election.....he did what he said he would...he's a man of his word?

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Looks to be correct
Sep 20, 2016 1:06PM PDT

Good job, Jimmy. You annihilated Ford's previous record for forgiving law breakers. You must be proud for what you did for your party.

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RE:You must be proud for what you did for your party.
Sep 20, 2016 1:15PM PDT

AND the majority of the people that voted him into office...It's called democracy.

One side wins...the other side complains and learns to live with it.

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So one side wins
Sep 20, 2016 1:41PM PDT

and the objective is to win and not to necessarily do what's right. Or maybe what's right is to make sure you win regardless of the cost or harm done to the original spirit behind the country's founding. I get it now. One must win no matter who objects or gets hurt.

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RE:objective is to win
Sep 20, 2016 7:28PM PDT
objective is to win and not to necessarily do what's right.

"RIGHT" in the eyes of the majority of the voters?

Yes.....The objective is to win and do what you said you would do.

IF/WHEN a majority of the voters agree.....that's the way it goes.
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I'm not sure that winning is th objective of the majority
Sep 21, 2016 1:49AM PDT

of the voters anymore. I think that objective is moving toward finding leadership that does the least harm. We don't see much in the way of political ads touting the good that will come from electing someone. We aren't encouraged to vote for a person but against another. This eliminates the need for politicians to create a positive image of themselves. It goes something like this;

"Vote for me because I'm less of a jerk than my opponent".