Formating Hard Drive Many Times

Hi Grif,

You talk of using registry cleaners but how do you think it correlates with formatting?
I am not professional but as a layman who uses PC very regularly and spends 2 hrs a week to maintain it, I don't understand how registry cleaners can avoid someone planning to reformat hard drive, it will only clean junk in registry, isn't it?

Please explain.

OK probably not essential for all those people who are whizzes at cleaning up the registry. But for us humble folk, after 6 months of useage the RAM becomes loaded with all sort junk which is very difficult to identify especially as XP uses at least double the number of processes as 98 did. And who knows whats booting up alongside your normal startup processes. Instead of going through the rigmarole of cleaning out every possible junk folder, registery entry and trying to identify which of your windows processes are necessary i backup to dvd-rw the following folders:

- My Documents (which includes any programs/updates ive downloaded as well as mp3s, etc )
- Favorites
- Any configs/save files for games currently installed

Might remember something else in a few days but that essentially covers everything i need for a clean reinstall of windows which takes all in all 2 hours (15 mins to backup, 30-45 minutes to format, 30 minutes to install windows, 10 minutes to reintroduce backed up files) and obviously a little longer to reinstall whichever programs you were running.

And there you go, a computer that runs as fast as the day you bought it (until it starts accummulating junk again). I dont beleive you can every get to this level of performance again through simple maintenance without reinstallation. The only drawback to this method is forgetting to backup something but I dont think it takes any longer than a full-on maintenance run (defrag, antivirus, spyware, registry, etc).

So back to the original point, i would also like to know if there are any detrimental effects to reformatting your hard drive.

...but Reformatting is NOT essential maintenance. It's a personal choice and for most, it's more work to reformat the computer than to deal with normal simple computer maintenance.

First: RAM doesn't become loaded with junk...hard drives and registries can, but not Randam Access Memory.

Second: It doesn't damage the hard drive to reformat the drive even if the user decides to format it monthly, but the question still is there...Why?.

From start to finish, the description of your reinstall will probably take you 3 to 5 hours, probably more, to get everything back up and running correctly. (NOT 2 hours as you have described) Although you can place an XP CD in the drive and get it formatted and reinstalled in a couple of hours, you can't do a whole lot with just a basic operating system. First, assuming your time estimates are correct for your reinstall...(for most users backup and reintroduction times are probably quite a bit greater than the time estimates you have given), in almost ALL cases, reinstalling the necessary programs, updating those programs such as Office utility programs, finding and installing new drivers for all your hardware, antivirus installations and updates, antispyware installations and updates and specifically installing all "Critical" Windows Updates can take hours.

Other types of reformats and reinstalls, such as using a "ghosted" drive copy can go much quicker than the method you have described, but in those cases, the user needs to keep the ghost copy maintained. That takes time in order to keep the ghost current.

Especially with Windows XP which doesn't appear to show major performance benefits by cleaning out the registry, it's easier and quicker to occasionally clean out Temp files, other junks files, and run Error Checking/Chkdsk and Defrag occasionally. Defrags and Chkdsk don't take me ANY time at all as I do them at periods when the machine isn't being used, lunch, dinner, etc. Cleaning out Temp and junk files takes less than 30 seconds every couple of days. AS LONG AS there's nothing damaging the operating system like corrupted files or viruses, etc., it's just extra work. And in my case, my computers STILL run as fast as the day I bought them. Generally Faster, because I usually install more RAM after purchase.

As I stated above, each person has their own personal choice about these things so have fun with your computer however you want to run it.

Hope this helps.

Grif

I have never found any reason to reformat any of my XP PCs, performance is constant, I run timing tests every so often. Before I retired I was a software engineer. At my last two jobs, CSC and Verizon I used Windows PCs exclusively. The only time any PC had the OS reinstalled was when either it was junked or sometimes when given to a new user. Do you think companies with tens of thousands of PC have either the time or resources to reinstalling the OS ever set time period?

I couldn't live without a decent registry cleaner.

I still reinstall Windows more often than most, but that's a different story.

While constantly installing, patching, updating, and hacking games, my registry cleaner finds at least 50 bad keys a day. Some days produce over 200. If I let those accumulate over a period of time, I would think it would lead to a slowdown.

Every install of Windows produces hundreds of bad keys. Never fails. That's just from the install and updates. I know because I reinstall XP in about 2-4 PC's a week. I also always install RegSeeker to clean up afterward.

Every file I download to desktop leaves a ''key'' behind when I move it to a folder, or erase it. That's one small example of how they build up.

Anyway, RegSeeker is free. No deceptive ''trial'', just free. Try it, I guarantee you'll be amazed the first time you run it. Google "Regseeker".

I always make a folder on C:\Program Files, and open it to there. That will keep the backup files with it, when they're made. I also right-click the .exe and ''Pin to Startup''.

I couldn't live without it.

whats the difference between writing the drive to zeros and reformating. Is writing to zeros better if so how do you do that?

Some people claim that normal formatting, especially quick format leaves behind traces of the old install and files. Some have speculated that some virus' may survive and come back to rehaunt. I don't give a lot of credence to the latter, but I recommend writing all zeros to eliminate any ''hidden'' partitions, or anything else that can stay behind. Makes the drive fresh.

For some time companies like Compaq and Emachines stored necessary restore files on a kind of hidden partition that can be accessed by the restore disc. I guess they didn't want to hand out full OS discs in order to save money, or to cut down on piracy. What a headache! It causes all kinds of HD capacity errors, especially when installing Linux for dual-boot. It also made it almost impossible to reinstall Windows for the average person.

That's where these HD utilities come in handy. There are actually many out there, but I've been using Western Digital's GWscan. I downloaded it, installed to floppy, and set my PC's to ''Boot to Floppy''.

The program runs before Windows loads. It allows you to scan for errors and bad sectors, not to mention rewriting to zeros. Nice program. Get it from Gateway here:

http://support.gateway.com/support/drivers/search.asp?param=gwscan&st=kw

Oh, somehow my floppy turned out non-bootable so I boot on a Win98 startup, or a WinXP DOS startup floppy. When it gets to the A:\ prompt, I switch discs and type in ''GWSCAN''. I've been doing this for about 3 years.

Thanks I'll try that next time I need to reformat

quick formatting is sufficient for new hardrives, or if u know there aren't any bad sectors on the disk.

A full format is recommended if u want to be sure EVERYTHING is gone so personal data/emails etc. u don't want the hd's new owner to find out about. It's not someth normal ppl can do, but tech experts can use the right tools to dig up info that was cleared using only quick format b/c technically, the info is still there.

If your computer is bogged down by junk delete everything you don't need and defrag.

When you install and reinstall applications, there is ALWAYS a bunch of files left behind. If not try it: install Windows, write down the Hard Drive's used space, install and reinstall severelal applications and there will be less space left on the drive. Even if "System Restore" is disabled. And if you delete files manually, conflicts will start to occurr. Plus, my reformatting method (already mentioned) is a totally automated task which can be done in just a few hours while full manual restore plus the additional software may take days to complete.

I came back to this string to see the same chant about never having to reinstall Windows. God, you guys are lucky! Maybe you are all ''light users'' compared to me.

I can only dream about running an install for more than a few months. Maybe I'm a heavy user, I never thought about it that way.

Here's what my PC's are used for;

Gaming. Tons of games. Some are so vast, they come on DVD. Many also take 4-5 CD's to load them. Far Cry, Halo, Battlefield 1942 & Vietnam, Half-Life 1&2, Doom 2&3, Call of Duty, Ghost Recon, Unreal Tournament 2004, Painkiller, many Star Wars games, the list goes into 3 digits. Then there are the patches and cracks for each game. I often hack the registry or config files for different results. My main 2 comps have ''The Claw'' controllers for lan gaming first-person shooters. I do this mostly for the kids.

Next is television. The main PC is running a high graphics 21'' Sony Trinitron monitor, and a Sony VPH 1252 CRT projector that shoots a 10' picture on the wall. I record and watch TV through a tuner card, (no VCR). You've never SEEN your desktop until it is 10 feet wide!

DVD. I also play DVD's on the wall with the Dolby 5.1 patched through my home theatre receiver, (although I have 5.1 speakers at the desktop). Crap, I just checked to find 8 media players in this machine! I am also currently testing various software for making backups of movies through my Dual-Layer burner.

Digital video editing is quite a demanding task to learn, and takes a lot of different programs to convert the different formats, let alone authoring. I have at least 5 different editing programs, and about 6 video conversion ones. And I'm just a beginner.

Audio. I'm trying to turn my 1000 CD's over to MP3 to store and access. BIG TASK! I suffered a major setback when my year-old Maxtor D: drive crashed, taking everything with it. Funny, I had to reinstate my boot.ini files to get Windows to load from C: after that. Anyway, more programs for audio format conversion, enhancement, etc.

Photo format conversion, editing, printing.., takes about 8-10 programs.

Internet security through Mozilla Firefox, Ad-aware, Spybot S&D, Spyware Blaster, Stinger AVP, CCleaner, and more.

Normal computer usage (for me), requires many minute enhancements. I eliminate the recycle bin and use Eraser, and Spybot's Shredder. Zip files (and many others), go through Power Archiver. Get Diz opens what Power Archiver doesn't (except PDF which goes to Acrobat). Instead of saving web pages, I simply use Snagit to capture it as a JPG, or TIF image. I mentioned earlier my belief in a good registry cleaner.

The list of programs I use is quite extensive.

All I've mentioned doesn't even cover many aspects, such as 3-D viewing through stereoptic glasses.

This is NOT too much crap for a computer, this is what I use. This is what I do.

I only dream of the day I can ''Skip merrily through the fields'' with Windows running for years in the background. Error free.

I forgot to say that I maintain about 50 computers with 1 client, (biggest real estate dealer here), and constantly repair, buy, and sell in my spare time, while remodeling homes as an independent contractor. And I never touched a mouse or keyboard until 3 years ago.

...every 3 months as you mentioned earlier, you're doing nothing but reformatting and reinstalling constantly...You've been advocating that all computers need to be reformatted frequently because the performance is improved dramatically in doing so...It's your choice...but I think maybe you're in a habit that may not be necessary...Still, different strokes....

By the way, your personal computer setup and use isn't much different than many others use.

Have fun formatting and reinstalling... over and over and over.

Grif

I mentioned the 50 corporate PC's to qualify the fact that I'm not just a simple user, and assume much responsibility.

I've only had to reformat a few of those boxes, due to virus' that got through the ''bundled'' AVP's.

Through my buy, repair, and sell hobby, I almost always reformat. Sometimes a few a week.

Anyway, back to my original point.

I listed many of the programs and functions I personally use because something always inevitably goes wrong.

Trust me, I wouldn't reformat if I had a choice. It will take over a week to get this box back to where it is now.

Many might read this thinking that I just don't know what I'm doing. Well, there are at least 200 local people (A+ Certs, instructors, networking contractors, business owners, etc.) who would argue against that belief. Not to mention almost 3 active years on help forums with much praise for my contributions.

I did reformat my secondary PC unnecessarily about 2 weeks ago. This is a common example of the things I go through;

I purchased a 512mb stick from a place that tests it for compatibility (northbridge and CPU) before shipping. No go, RMA'd, 2 weeks later, new chip. Works!
Few weeks later BOOM! Errors and crashes, with the constant dreaded ''Send error report''.

Now starts the fun.

Day after day (in my spare time) I'm testing, downloading more diagnostics, more testing, Googling, CPU burn-in, Memtest burn-in, removing hardware, reinstalling drivers, removing software, you name it.
OK, time to reinstall XP. Hours later it seems fine until Bam! Thought XP updates might be the problem.
Reinstall again without updates. No dice.
Time to swap hardware that I didn't try yet, before buying a new mainboard. Pulled the memory (which passed all diagnostics), and installed a stick that is said to NOT be compatible.

Not only did it work, but it's still running in there. Now I'll RMA for refund, get 1gig of PQI from Newegg, and be happy.

That's just my latest scenario. That was a hardware problem, they are usually an unrepairable XP problem. Between XP and 98 I've had too many to remember.

I fix at least 98% of all problems, but sooner or later comes along that stubborn one that I give up on after days of struggling. Reinstall XP and everything's fine for the next 3 to 6 months.

Hi Brianstech

You said :
"OK, time to reinstall XP. Hours later it seems fine until Bam! Thought XP updates might be the problem."

And in fact I think you are true. I used to run Windows Update in the background so it did all its updating task and so on but I ended up seeing that they ate up my hard drive and didn't do any good to my PC they only messed things up more than what they where. My recomendation: Stay with Windows XP SP1 and disable windows update. I can tell for sure that SP1 is much more stable than SP2. Simply get yourself a decent Antivirus and Firewall and you shouldn't experience any security risk. I've never downloaded ANYTHING with Windows Update, except for SP1 because the early version of XP did not support USB2.0. In fact I maybe will be updating to SP2 but only because it supports "RAW Thumbnailer" and "RAW Viewer" for my digital SLR camera so that I can view my HQ CR2 files with Window's Picture and Fax Viewer.

I am like you I always end up reformatting due to problems I can't solve (or for performance push) and I think I will be doing so very soon yet my HD is almost full and Windows takes almost 4 to 5 minutes to load whilst it takes only 1 minute 20 seconds when it is reformatted.

By the way, if you want to avoid all this work of reformatting you can read my post "Reformatting is OK" in this same forum. It may help, tell me if it did so.


Samuel.

Samuel, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one with problems that lead to reformatting.

I also used to make a separate partition for more ''permanent'' files. Now I use a decent sized HD (usually 80gb) for Windows, then a secondary (120gb) for My Documents. I do that mostly for video files that take up almost 2 gigs an hour. I've got enough hard drives to set up RAIDs, but don't feel the need.

I recently had a secondary HD thrash and lost more data than I'll ever recover from. I added DVD backup to my regimen.

Now on to SP2. The wholesale XP Pro discs I bought have it integrated. With the Home editions I use, I always do ALL updates, including SP2. I don't really know SP1 to compare, and never really see the problems that I've heard of so much with SP2. I was running 98SE and dabbling in Linux because I thought XP was "Highway Robbery" to buy retail for my homebuilt. We had 2 brand name computers here running XP SP1. I used and repaired them, but never used them constantly.
I also serviced many corporate XP Pro computers (while learning) and never became as familiar as with 98.

Well, about 6 months ago one of our home XP boxes crashed bad. The problem is somewhat rare, and has NO permanent fix. I was astounded! I decided to use the XP COA on the side of my case to install XP and study it in depth it while repairing the problem one.
The sticker I'm refering to is on a VPR Matrix (my secondary PC) that I bought without a HD, CPU, and RAM for $31 on eBay.

I then purchased many wholesale XP Pros, and installed one in my primary PC (the others are for customers). I studied it, and in no time I was ''hacking all the crap'' out of it. I haven't found the time yet to throw in a couple of 20gb's for Win98/XP dual boot. Then I'll be able to play my old games also.

I like XP and would also enjoy running it for years uninterrupted. I wish it were that easy.