BTW... the correct title is
The Medium is the Massage
Albeit the reason why it is that way is a typo occurred which was the publishers fault but wasn't caught before it went to press.
Interesting book. The pictures are a bit dated but the content itself is remarkably still applicable.
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General discussion
Every day makes it plainer that Goldwater was right ...
Some would argue that my concerns are not anything new, that Americans have always complained about an ?unfair? news media. Others would say the media have almost always been about entertainment more than news despite their protestations to the contrary. And as entertainment, it appears bad news drives out good, and ?if it bleeds it leads.? And in any case, a free press is one of the main planks upon which a free people must stand and whatever press we get, well that is what we get.
This may all be true, but I believe it does not address the point raised by this essay. To be a free nation we must be able to debate the great issues of the day. To do that, there must be at least some seriousness in the news media to cover issues intelligently and fairly. But when the press itself becomes destructive of, and undermines, often deliberately, this process, it is time to take notice and say ?enough!?
Thus, to the extent the news media becomes simply a public relations appendage of one political party or the other, or of one particular view, serious debate on issues is seriously impeded. Without such debate, sound decisions cannot be made by our political leaders that require the determined and sustained support of the American people.
Take for example the threat largely considered to be the main concern of the United States, a nuclear device exploding in an American city. Stopping such an attack will require a sustained fight that will require the effective use of both diplomacy and military force and the vigorous use of tools such as the Patriot Act and the NSA surveillance program. Failure to pursue all avenues will enable our enemies to buy the time necessary to bring their plans to fruition.
http://www.opinioneditorials.com/guestcontributors/phuessy_20070702.html
The NYT is arguably the worst of the lot although the Washington Post and LA Times are not far behind.
Discussion is locked
31 - 60 of 59 Posts
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...... 3 major TV networks, radio (not talk) , several influential newspapers, several news magazines, several influential columnists and political cartoonists.
The media today includes 4 major TV networks, a lot of talk radio, a few mews magazines, a few influential newspapers, a bunch of 24/7 news channels, internet news sites like the one that was cited in the article, and blogs. We can even watch Congress at work on CSPAN.
Sure, advertising dollars make or break most of them. And they struggle to be the first to break a story. Add to that the Woodward/Berstein syndrome which makes reporters want to break the next big one.
Big newspapers used to be owned by families. I think they have now merged. The Murdock ones might be an exception. Editorial policy is set by the owners.
We used to have a morning paper and an afternoon paper. Each had a different editorial policy. That was good as it gave readers a broad picture.
IMO, we tend to favor the media policies with which we agree and can be prone slough off those we don't.
However, I feel lucky to live in a free country that has a free press. I recall how the people in the USSR got only what the government wanted them to know. And how some brave souls tuned into Radio Free Europe to hear more.
Our military has fought and died so we can be free to make choices, and not be bound to one voice.
God Bless America!
Angeline
Speakeasy Moderator
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you got pretty much the SAME news reported in all and for the most part it wasn't too slanted - slant and interpretation was saved for the editorial pages, NOT the front page (and yes, we did tend to prefer those who were more in line with our own thoughts and ideals on those editorial pages).
News reporters and their editors were also a bit more concerned with national security although even then liberties were being taken (but not by responsible reporters). National Security isn't much of a concern any longer as can be testified to by several recent articles broke by the NYT.
Yellow Journalism was still mostly an aberration, not standard practice.
This is exactly why Goldwatter said what he did - even then the trend was noticeable.
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I call the tabloids "yellow journalism". I am quite aware of the transgressions that have been made by some main stream reporters, including plagiarism.
What I have seen is an eroding of ethics (including work ethics) that has permeated various aspects of our society in general. Though the main stream media may not have been immune, at least I find it more accountable to its readers/listeners than the internet "news" sites and blogs. Those have no oversight, yet are as protected by the First Amendment as the mains stream.
I don't think Mr. Goldwater would find his party today bears much resemblance to the one he loved,
One of his wisest quotes:
?To disagree, one doesn't have to be disagreeable.?
Angeline
Speakeasy Moderator
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are contemplating the undeniable truth of Goldwater's statement - a truth demonstrated daily in MSM:
?We?ll be fine unless the media kills us?. When asked to elaborate, the pilot and one-time Presidential candidate explained the media?s lack of any sense of history. News had given way to a hysterical view of the world where the sky was always falling. America could never do anything right, and ?it??whatever daily crisis was news?was usually our fault. On top of which, the press had a fixation on finding an excuse for much of what our enemies did.
I understand why some specific persons have attempted to divert this to a political discussion but am surprised that you did so.
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I would say that this comment applies doubly so to right wing news outlets who spend a great deal of their time devoted to predicting death and destruction because someone publicly discussed matters of national concern. The original op/ed piece could even be said to fall into this trend.
Look, I often see issues that I believe needed to be treated with more discretion than they are. I admit this is true. However, the government has been documented in incidents where it paid journalists to influence their readers and even promote government programs in the guise of being a real "news" story. Is this thread really mourning the death of journalistic integrity or just those times that the press doesn't work in the governments interest?
To complain that some people here on SE have turned this into a political discussion is less than candid. The original op/ed piece you linked to takes the press to task for working against the government but disguises it in a patriotic and moralistic appeal. This, IMO, was a political thread from the beginning. That's just my opinion though so discard it if you wish.
I will say this though. The press acts as a journalistic watch dog. Yes, it often behaves badly and sometimes destructively as well. However, our government, and indeed our society, has benefited repeatedly from the press disclosing the ugly little truths we would prefer to ignore. Yes, there is a lot of dreck that we are willingly spoon fed by the third estate but every once in a while they also are pretty successful in the role of being our conscience. I may not agree with all of the op/ed piece being discussed... but it does give food for thought and that is one of the real functions of the press.
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"publicly discussed matters of national concern" could be directly attributed to their deaths and maiming.
Until you have been there and have some actual first hand experience you might want to keep your lip zipped because your inane remarks are profoundly offensive -- on the order of spitting on a service member and/or throwing trash at them.
There was a reason for the "loose lips sink ships" posters and the reason is no less valid today than it was then.
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Sorry Edward, but if you fought for all of our rights (and I'm not doubting you did) then you can't very well tell me that I can only use those rights - such as the freedom to express my thoughts - if I have met certain requirements or endured certain experiences. That's not what the USA is about.
Long story short, I have served my community more than most can claim to, and been under fire as well, although not while in the military... but I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you. You disagree with me and that's fine.
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neither you nor anyone else has any "right" to say or do anything that endangers others. Think supreme Court and their decision of shouting FIRE in crowded buildings.
Your social work experience in no way, shape, or form equates to active military service (whether under fire or not).
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... but then again... I don't use my years of service to justify telling someone to shut up.
I run into a lot of very opinionated people during my daily business. However, I learned during my stint doing sales that you don't talk about politics, religion, nor ask an overweight woman" when is the baby due" for fear of placing one's head squarely where the sun don't shine. Consequently I keep my mouth shut much of the day, even when someone asks for an opinion.
The one thing else that I don't do? Tell people they have no right to speak their mind. What I said before did not fall into the categories of endangering others or come close to shouting "fire". Consequently my opinions don't come anywhere close to the Supreme Court's oversight you seem to be suggesting they fall under.
Complain all you want to about the threat we face and the threat the press presents to national security. My feelings are you are both right and also very wrong. The press does run it's mouth in an effort to scoop the competition when things would be better left unsaid. The press also repeats everything the government says as well. Government statements that, in hind sight, were designed to culture a climate of fear and garner unwavering support for questionable strategies.
I respect people who are or were in the military for what they did. That doesn't mean they have a franchise on telling people what they can and can not say. My opinions have been repeated publicly by retired military and intelligence officers. Does that make me or them right because we share the same opinions? Of course not.
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spew offensive garbage and that somehow you were in service to the country rather than for your private gain.
Be honest if you can't be right.
What I said before did not fall into the categories of endangering others or come close to shouting "fire".
What you "said" would have created a disturbance and caused you bodily harm had you the courage to say it to the face of ANYONE who had been in the position and seen the results. That pretty much equates to shouting "fire" in inappropriate circumstances.
It was OFFENSIVE, you KNOW it was OFFENSIVE and nothing more should have been necessary to be said. Loose lips sink ships, the walls have ears, and you never know who is overhearing what you say.
Some "opinions" are like the nether end of the alimentary canal that "everyone" also has and should only be displayed in the same manner - it is a matter of couth.
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"Some "opinions" are like the nether end of the alimentary canal that "everyone" also has and should only be displayed in the same manner - it is a matter of couth."
And you are the master of couth?
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... for agreeing with you Edward. I have said twice now that the press should be more discrete. I guess my saying that the press is also useful in preserving our rights is what you find so offensive. Or is it the part where I said the press is also used by the government to disseminate their agenda?
As for the part about anyone who had been there and seen the results would cause me bodily harm? I have both family and friends who have been there. I have family who is there right now. Their experiences and their opinions have helped to shape my opinions.
Fact is, if I am wrong I am more than happy to listen to your persuasive arguments. Telling me to shut up, that I have no right to speak, and to be physically afraid for speaking my mind is not very persuasive.
Yeah, you think I'm a loud mouth idiot. Fine, I get it.
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He(goldwater)also said, ?You don't have to be straight to be in the military; you just have to be able to shoot straight.? A few years before his death he went so far as to address the right wing, "Do not associate my name with anything you do. You are extremists, and you've hurt the Republican Party much more than the Democrats have."
more libertarian than conservative it seems
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I busted my wrist (4 pieces) back in feb and have been one-handed until recently. I see you have certain folks hooked on grimbonics, I have enjoyed watching you making them writhe. keep it up, good exercise for the 'sticks & stones' herd.
TGFM(thank gov for medicare). my misadventure cost 33k, yikes!! 13k for the implant alone (must be made from unobtanium). saw non-medical version at home depot for $14.05. SS has been very good to me. entitlements are a savior when the chips are down. excellent use of my taxes. beats the heck out of tossing them in a desert wind. of course thank you for your contributions. I will send an x-ray for a dollar.
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I will assume that when you said third estate you meant to say fourth estate.
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for their lives. A big question is what form will survive in the long run, and will they be able to continue in their political roles.
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it was reported that over 90% (about 92, I think but cannot provide link evidence) of news media persons who gave political money to presidential candidates in the last election supported one specific party. The presidential vote, for all practical purposes, was split nearly evenly. Make your own judgment as to which direction this might have caused any political sway. It could be argued either way...that they were almost successful in installing their candidate or contributed to his defeat.
Hope this isn't considered TOS material. No opinions expressed here. 
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he wouldn't be on theirs.
In a 1988 interview on Larry King's radio show, Goldwater was asked if he thought the U.S. Government was withholding UFO evidence; he replied "Yes, I do." He added:
I certainly believe in aliens in space. They may not look like us, but I have very strong feelings that they have advanced beyond our mental capabilities....I think some highly secret government UFO investigations are going on that we don't know about ? and probably never will unless the Air Force discloses them."
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funding for SETI? He seems to think there's someone 'out there' who may send a message. Not that different than this alleged Goldwater 'quote'.
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indeed withholding evidence of UFOs and had many other secret projects going on back in 1988 as well as earlier and later?
You likely will not like the link but everything on it is verifiable through other searches and sources.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1498038/posts
link from the above:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/wicked.htm
Now, before launching a diatribe I strongly suggest you take a moment to look up the word EVIDENCE and familiarize yourself with what it represents.
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nothing like reading through a chronology of paranoidal/meglamaniacal SNAFUS is there....
The Monroe Institute trained the government viewers from Ft. Meade in out of body experiences. Courtney Brown also went through this training, which involves using the Institute's Hemisync tapes. These tapes, which work by using a binural beat to entrain brain waves, caused Brown to feel that he left his body and communicated with aliens.
little green men my ***
.,
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