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General discussion

Do system optimizers/fixer utilities cause more problems than they solve?

Jan 20, 2012 8:25AM PST
Question:

Do PC system optimizers/fixer utilities cause more problems than they solve?

I am a 68-year-old ex-pat American living in England as the spouse of
a British citizen. As someone who has used a personal computer for 10
years but knows virtually nothing about technical matters, I am
vulnerable to all sorts of computer fix-it promotions and products,
among them The Ultimate Troubleshooter, System Mechanic, and Advanced
System Care.

I recently paid a professional to solve a problem I was
having with my Windows XP system, and when he had finished I
discovered he had intentionally removed all these products, saying
they were unnecessary and caused more problems than they solved. I
was frankly embarrassed that I had apparently been taken in by
advertising claims, and did not challenge his actions. (I have called
on this man's expertise before and respect his knowledge, since it is
obviously superior to my own. He has a number of small businesses in
the community as clients, but will also make home visits to people
like me who cannot transport their computers to another location for
repair.)

I don't like to think I'm being given bad advice, but I've spent a good
deal of money on the software I mentioned, believing the claims as
to their validity. I would appreciate your opinion regarding this situation.

- Submitted by C. R. Tate

Discussion is locked

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Do PC system optimizers/fixer utilities cause more problems
Jan 21, 2012 12:57AM PST

I am also 68 years old and I do not have any professional knowledge about the computer hardware.However when I faced similar problem with my PC with win xp operating system loaded with cleaning soft wears (FREE not paid) my mechanic advised me to increase the memory of PC.He also advised me to replace the HD with higher capacity and if possible upgrade operating system to win 7. I have done that and now there is no problem with my PC,though I have loaded many soft wears which are freely available on Cnet.
So it appears that there is a problem with your PC memory .Also verify that there is sufficient space on C drive.

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Utility program conflicts
Jan 21, 2012 1:07AM PST

Mr Tate:
I can understand your frustration because I went through the same thing. Ultimately, most utility programs are very beneficial but some, in my opinion are better than others. You even mentioned one that I do like and that is the Advanced Care. The biggest propblem that you will encounter, as I did, is that programs will conflict with one another. If you install one utility and then another, you probably will have problems. They usually tell you that you must disable or uninstall similar programs before installing theirs. And do not believe everything that pops up on your computer. My daughter had a pop up that said that her computer was infected and she became alarmed. I told her not to worry as I new that the anti-virus program was protecting the computer. Sometimes these utilities do do not recognize certain programs and the utilities will consider them a virus. Being wary is a good idea but do not jump into everything that might be out there. If something does not seem to work properly, uninstall it.

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Beware on online System Fixers!
Jan 21, 2012 1:45AM PST

The online and downloadable system fixers, registry cleaners and optimizers are often thinly veiled malware sites. Stay Away. The most I use is Norton's 360 for Viruses and online protection, then I also use it to optimize my system. Have faith in your Tech. He's correct on this one. I'm running Windows 7... so far pretty good. An much better than XP

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All system tweakers are not the same
Jan 21, 2012 2:45AM PST

C R Tate doesn't tell us how well his/her computer has worked since the service guy reconfigured it the way he finds easiest to work with. Well, let's hope. The answer to the question in the Tate post is that some system tweakers are better than others. On the dark side, some cause trouble deliberately, usually by way of free appraisals offered online. Those that the user calls up from the Web and that then send a grim report of what's been found, are probably bogus. If they haven't actively put malware onto the user's hard disk driver -- some do -- they've certainly put terror into the potential buyer's mind. Needless terror, in many cases. ,.

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Troubleshooting apps
Jan 21, 2012 3:10AM PST

I find most of these applications are only useful if you know how to interpret the reports they generate.
In other words if you do not have the required knowledge to fix your hardware of software problems, these tools are generally not very helpful.
I do not agree with the technician removing the software without notifying you first but I agree in having it removed as it probably did not help much in your case.

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Beware too much "optimizing"
Jan 21, 2012 4:02AM PST

Some years back I purchased an optimizing program that caused me more problems than help. It messed with several of my installed software programs including Diskeeper. When I contacted the tech support people at Diskeeper the first question they asked was had I used an optimizing program on my computer. I confessed that I had and the nice young man explained to me that some of these programs are very aggressive about what they disable or remove in the quest for speed. They can and do cause all kinds of problems for already installed programs.

As far as being for or against the use of cleanup programs, I am a middle of the roader. I like CCleaner and Autoruns. I have never experienced any problems with either one of these free programs. I also use the full version of Diskeeper and I really like it. Again I have never experienced any problems caused by Diskeeper. The one I do watch rather carefully is what loads and runs when I turn on my computer. That is what Autoruns is for. It is a small, free app which will show you what starts up and runs each time you turn on your computer. Autoruns will allow you to turn off programs that you don't want to run at startup. If you are not sure just what a particular item in the Autoruns startup window is, look it up on the internet and determine whether or not you want to turn it off.

Beware the programs that after scanning your computer claim to have found thousands of registry errors. Allowing these programs to "fix" your computer can lead to the blue (XP) or black (Windows 7) screen of death. In extreme cases you will have to format your hard drive to correct the problems created by "over" optimizing.

Before installing any optimizing program do some research. Get onto the internet and read what other people have to say about the program you are considering. Make sure to look at independent reviews and not those posted by the company wanting to sell you their software. CNET is a good place to start.

And finally remember this, your computer's efficiency is determined, for the most part, by your hardware (processor and motherboard) and, when you are on the web, the speed of your internet connection. Optimizing programs cannot fundamentally change these things but they cause some real problems when they try.

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Revisiting the 7 Ps
Jan 21, 2012 5:07AM PST

Hi C.R.,

The following link was my response for a similar question on CNET Forums from last year. It seems it was well reviewed so I'm re-posting it for you here.

http://forums.cnet.com/7726-6138_102-5177020.html?tag=posts;msg5176902

I really don't believe much has changed since then. You should note that when I reload a system, I check with the customer to see what programs they want to keep. If they want programs that I don't think will help, I advise them accordingly. I've yet to run into a customer who has insisted that I reinstall software that I advised against, but it's their call.

For what it's worth, I agree with your computer repair professional regarding the installation of unnecessary system cleaners. In general, it's been my experience that if a computer's performance has become degraded to the point that the owner believes a "System Cleaning" is in order, I do a quick check in MSCONFIG and Task Manager to see what's running (Start-up Programs and Services), and if I don't find a culprit there I recommend a reload. If you are diligent about keeping your data backed up, a reload is often faster than trying to track down the problem to begin with.

Hope this helps.

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system optimyzers
Jan 21, 2012 5:49AM PST

You can trust System mechanic 10 +. After 2 years , every PC need reinstall OS .

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what tools to use on a PC
Jan 21, 2012 11:36AM PST

I have changed my thoughts on this issue over the years. I once was a big believer in paid for utilities. The ended after I got one (with "Mechanic" in the name) and discovered that when I used it to do a cleanup and fix on my system that the main effect was to remove all my printer drivers. I also once paid for things like defrag utilities, but found that I had to pay larger and larger fees as HD size pushed me from 'home' to 'pro' licenses. And I used to pay for 3rd party firewalls and AV products until I discovered that even with big improvements their main effect was to take fast systems and make them slow.

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He did the right thing
Jan 21, 2012 7:09PM PST

I'm a 37 year old computer professional currently working in software development and have been using PCs for approximately the last 17 years and computers in general since I was 8. At the current time at my house I have about 20 operating systems that I keep up to date in fully operational order on my network (6 physical machines - 4 desktops and 2 laptops) plus about a dozen virtual machines (XP, XP 64-bit, Vista 32-bit and 64-bit, and Windows 7 32-bit and 64-bit). The machine I am typing this on now is one such virtual machine. Other than anti-virus software (where I swear by Avast) I have never needed any additional software for optimizing or fixing my PCs and I cannot personally see any need for such programs, so I think your repair man was on the money. Eliminating unnecessary software is one way to optimize your system.

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Optimizers are not optimal.
Jan 21, 2012 10:59PM PST

For the most part optimizer and fixit utilities are not worth spending money on. This is NOT anit-virus or malware removers but the registry cleaners and tweakers that get advertised in pop-ups and banner ads on-line.

With a number of years of experience in computer servicing, incuding business and home user, I've yet to see any of them that actually are worth the charges. Especially since fixing what they can break can be costly, technical service is not cheap.

You seem to have found a reliable technician, that you are comfortable with, and if so relying on his ability is proper. Like finding a mechanic for your car, or a dentist you like, as long as the knowledge and expertise are there, building a personal connection is important.

Accept his opinions, but make an effort to do your own research to a level that you are comfortable with. That being said, self education in computers is always on-going and every user should make at least some effort to increase his/her own knowledge about the system they use.

You are on the right track, and the CNET forums and sites are an excellent place to graze for knowledge, you can pick out the parts that interest you, at a level you can understand, and then follow up with increasing depth and complexity almost painlessly.

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Optimizers
Jan 22, 2012 2:15AM PST

Absolutely YES! Much more trouble than they are worth in the long run.

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Some Optimizers Work; Others Cause More Problems
Jan 22, 2012 7:11AM PST

I don't mean to be cryptic, but in the 30 years I've been using PCs and the nearly 20 I've been building them, I've found that some system optimizers really do work well and others are too aggressive, resulting in damaged systems.

The two key optimizers that do work very well are Registry Booster (now in version 2012 and inexpensive) and Little Registry Cleaner (freeware). Using both of them I've been able to keep our four computers running smoothly, as well as those of a slew of clients. I use both because each finds registry errors the other doesn't. The folks at Registry Booster are actually pretty darned honest. One year I called to find out if a new version was much of a change from the one I owned and they actually said, "No, wait for the next version which will be a significant improvement." And it was (much faster scans; background registry scan on a schedule with notification there are repairs to be made).

Every other registry cleaner I've ever tried has caused nothing but problems by being too aggressive -- and these include some that the tech industry press reviews favorably. Utilities like System Mechanic (since version 6) have been a disaster. I've found Norton Utilities to be way too aggressive -- although the newer versions may be better like Norton Internet Security which rebounded a few years ago after years of poor bloated performance.

I've found the following optimizers to work reasonably well, if you are very judicious in what you let them do:
WinUtlities, MZ 7 Optimizer, and TweakNow PowerPack 2011. But I stress that you've got to have a pretty good idea what it is each tweak or repair does and be very judicious in which tweaks and repairs you make with them.

But generally I've found that using Registry Booster and Little Registry Cleaner, plus routinely deleting the temporary files every day before shutting down works well. (I set the environmental variables to place all temporary files in c:\Temp rather than scattering them among 3 or 4 locations).

There may be some new optimizing utilities that work well, but I haven't seen them yet.

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Broadsword vs Scalpel:
Jan 22, 2012 10:27AM PST

I personally have used Advanced SystemCare, and its one of the best optimizers I've run across. I can't vouch for the other two. But I will say this: Having all these tools running in the background is certainly unnecessary. I know that unless you change it in settings, all three of these products run at start up and remain in the background, there's really no point in doing that. These tools like to monitor your actions and make recommendations, but really I would only use them on a situational basis.

Now some of the features in Advanced SystemCare I purposely don't use. In fact, at work, we don't use such tools at all. We have 1 modo at my job as a computer repair technician, and that's to treat every unit as if they are unique. Its analogous to a cut with a broadsword vs a slice with a scalpel: You have less of a chance cutting something you may actually use. I had one instance where Advanced SystemCare disabled my ability to use remote access programs on one computer, and for that reason, I no longer touch the Startup services optimization feature.

I unfortunately cannot look at the current state of your computer, so I cannot jump to any conclusions. BUT, sometimes maintaining a fast computer means to minimize the use of such broadsword programs from running in both the foreground and background.

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He acted properly
Jan 22, 2012 11:09PM PST

Unless you know what you are doing these applications can surely cause more harm than good. But then if you knew what you were doing you may not need them in the first place. I confess that I sometimes load up a program to point out something I may have missed or to do something automatically that I was just too lazy to step through myself, but do most people need them, Na.

Here's a quote form a commercial that I just love "Viruses can cause permanent damage to your computer", Say what?! Permanent damage? Not a chance.

Here's what you need to do rather than invest in these questionable programs. Back up all your data on a regular basis. I'm not saying buy any fancy program or subscription, just:

1 copy your important documents and photos to CDs, DVDs, thumb drives or an external drive, also if you downloaded any programs make sure you have a copy of the setup programs. Be sure you have any activation codes you may need, they may have been e-mailed to you.

2 Next make sure you have ALL the install media for your programs (like MS Office) along with any license or activation keys

3 Make sure you have the Restore Disks for your machine, you may need to make these yourself or they may have come with the machine. For help see "Lost your Windows discs? How to get replacement media, legally" posted in ZD Net by Ed Bott on Jan 5th 2012.

Should your computer start to go flakey:

WARNING: Everything on the computer will go away when you do this!!!

1 make sure all 3 steps are up to date
2 recover your PC using the restore CDs
3 Reinstall your programs

Make sure Windows update is working and that you have a virus program running, Microsoft MSE is good and it's free.

It will take your PC a few days to get all the service packs up to date but your computer will run like the day it was new.

If you follow those three steps you can do more to keep your machine running than by buying any of those programs.

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You are never too old to learn.
Jan 23, 2012 4:52AM PST

I am a 71 yr. old great grandfather. My grand children call me for computer advice, why? Because I have taught myself. It is not that difficult. Like owning a car or truck, you don't have to be a certified mechanic to maintain that expensive equipment. Same with computers. I use CC cleaner, SuperAntispy and Norton. The only one I have to pay for is the Norton. There are many free programs that can help you maintain and or repair your computer. Go to Cnet and search for free programs, it the program does not work for you then remove it. I have replaced hard drives, added memory, upgraded video cars....I do a little on line research and learn what to do first.

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My own experience? The optimizers DO cause more problems!
Jan 23, 2012 10:07AM PST

Oh the headaches I've had from believing and trying these optimizer and fixer utilities. NEVER again! The only third party software I use is ccleaner, which does a fantastic job of cleaning out browser cached files and temp files. It's a simple program that does exactly what it says it does.

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Two birds with one stone.
Jan 25, 2012 7:42AM PST
I have been using Norton 360 pretty much since it came out a few years ago. It is not only a excellent program for blocking and stopping Virus, Malware and all the bad stuff. but also has a PC tuneup feature that works great. I set it to run 3 days a week at 3AM and forget about it. It does the registry cleanup, file cleanup and a few other features. I do have CCcleaner on my computer and ran it once, but it didn't find anything. The Norton360, unlike a few years back leaves a very small footprint and doesn't slow the computer down. I am lucky because my ISP provides with Norton 360v5 at no cost. As far as other 3rd party optimizer programs go, they are just a waist of money and can cause problems.
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Optimisers don't work 2
Jan 26, 2012 2:23PM PST

You can tell by the way someone is putting thumbs down on
every negative response without a justification, we have and "optimiser"
employee reading these.Well here are some facts I'd like to see rebutted:

1. As pointed out by others, no matter
what you do with an optimiser, sooner or later you will either need to put up
with a lousy system or re-format your drive. Windows will fail an optimiser can't prevent it.

2. Windows has 2 billion lines of code, DO
YOU REALLY THINK IF THEY COULD SOLVE THE PROBLEM OF SYSTEM DEGRADATION BY
PUTTING IN A REGISTRY OPTIMISER RUNNING IN THE BACKGROUND THEY WOULDN'T ADD THE
EXTRA FEW LINES OF CODE? They don't because it offers no value.

3. As pointed out, if you get an optimiser
and it shows you 200 errors it will warn you to do every change at your own
risk and (knowing you won't read the details) encourages a backup of changes so
you can undo errors.
And undoing errors, that doesn't
always work.
What happens if you do have to undo?
Are you going to reboot 200 times to test each recommendation or just let your $50 investment become a dud?
The fact is, to be responsible, you
need to read all the comments and research them on the internet i.e. if you do
an optimise properly, you will spend more time researching the information that
re-formatting your drive and re-installing.

4. The most likely item to improve speed
will be the "tweaks". This is where the real trouble starts. People don't write
down every tweak. They can't tell what's a good tweak for them and what's not
and the optimiser comments are generalised i.e. not necessarily applicable to
you and your system.

You make a tweak, find out it fails
and unless you've carefully recorded each tweak, you're going to end up needing
to re-format your drive. And even if you recorder your tweaks, don't think just
un-checking the tweak is going to restore it to the original, it's not always
that easy. Programmes using your tweak may be disabled and turning it back on
isn't going to re-enable them (especially if you run a registry clean).

5. Finally, you've paid $50 so your going
to convince yourself it's done some good. Don't believe it. Time your system
before and after and see. I've had several hundred "found" registry and other
errors I've cleaned with "the CNet and other recommended "Best on the market 5
star optimiser" and the (timed) before
and after boot and shut down hasn't improved by 1 second.
I actually listed out observable and undeniable errors to
the people at System Mechanic such as the "cleaning" shutting down and
reconfiguring programmes (tested several times following system re-installs)
and I got no reply. They were the worst but every one I tried failed.
Your best option is to find the quickest way to reinstall Windows and byte by byte partition copying is that method.

Note: This post was edited by its original author to move html from copying and pasting on 01/27/2012 at 10:03 AM PT

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Utilites,some work some dont
Jan 27, 2012 9:46AM PST

yes.if Microsoft,presuming you are running their os,was so dull as to leave their O/S with so many vulnerabilities that it takes third party developers to cure their problems we would have seen thousands of court cases.
DONT install junk.keep a back up of your clean install,back up important files and reinstall the O/S if you have a problem.Simple Innit

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Utilities some work some don't
Jan 29, 2012 11:47AM PST

Correct. You don't spend 9 billion+ per annum on R & D and ignore a major, correctable, fault. (Any one notice Microsoft added Windows Defender for viruses and malware but not a more simple registry cleaner?)

I use Paragon to create a backup of my OS. 20 minutes (tops 1 hour after updating if necessary) and I have a brand new OS installed with all my programmes and settings exactly as I want them and I know the registry is perfect.

You're right, "don't install junk" but, with an OS backup, if you can't resist and make a mistake, you don't have to live with a lousy and incomplete uninstall and a botched registry your optimiser can't fix, just reinstall your backup and your "mistake" never existed.

I don't see why people don't do this. I used to spend 2 days every 6 months re-formatting my hard drive and starting from scratch. For the last 3 years I've spent about 18 hours on it (including 20 minutes each time to back up) and I have a completely new and fresh install every three months which never needs optimising.

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Do system optimizers/fixer utilities cause more problems tha
Jan 27, 2012 9:46AM PST

No System optimisers are terrible as they are to aggressive.The technican this person engaged should have said before hand that the programs were no good and asked to remove them and explained the reason he thought they should be removed.If you have bought these programs from a reputable software firm you should be able to download the program again and reinstall.

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System optimizers/fixer utilities cause problems?
Jan 27, 2012 10:04AM PST

Absolutely! Not only can they cause problems, so can non-Microsoft anti-virus (e.g. Norton) programs. Windows is
packaged with more than adquate utilities to keep your machine humming.

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Norton!
Jan 29, 2012 12:02PM PST

I don't know if it's improved (I've not touched it for over a decade) but I found Norton was more like a virus than a virus preventer.

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(NT) Norton 360 -beta-
Jan 30, 2012 7:40AM PST
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Find a different Tech guy
Jan 27, 2012 10:42AM PST

I cant advise on what utilities to use, each to their own, but as a user of 12 pc years experience and married to a tech I would like to say that any techie who just takes out the programs he wants to without consultation first is best avoided. They are acting in their own best interests and to their own agenda which is to have you go running at the smallest thing that goes wrong.. Thats how they make their money.
You need a tech who will consult you and give you the options first and let you make the decision about software on your pc, especially since you have paid for it, and their time and services. I am sure many techs will vehemently dissagree with me, and thats ok, each to their own. I dont care how many companies or rich people a tech has as a customer, if he doesnt respect me, or my computer and the way I have it configured then he wouldnt be allowed near my pc. Think of it as a trip to the doctors for an operation, you would want ALL the details before the surgeon went near you, your pc, 'personal computer' is no different.

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Toolwiz Time Freeze
Jan 27, 2012 12:05PM PST

Before I install any program , now, I turn on Timefreeze, Though, if the program requires a restart, all the changes will reversed. Its a pretty good way to check programs out that dont need a restart.
Above anything else, BEFORE you buy or install any program, research it !
Win XP, will require a format every 6 months, if you do a lot of trying of programs then uninstalling them.

If speed is your problem, then, the quickest fix of the lot can be just a change of hard drive types, get a SSD this will fix the speed.

Re-install Win XP onto the SSD and create an image so you can put it back on if your system gets out of control and your wanting to use these fix it programs, put the image back on and just put the ones that you use most of all.
Oh and Back up your Pics and Docs , Bookmarks email addresses and email settings before you do anything Happy

Or upgrade windows 7 ultimate, best move I made Happy

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PC System Optimizers
Jan 27, 2012 2:18PM PST

Well I'm a 66 year old American and I've tried about all the Optimizers out there over the decades. About 6 years ago I finally settled in on IOLO's System Mechanic. I still try different ones once in a great while but still prefer System Mechanic. I'm a heavy computer user, no gaming though, and have gotten myself into many jams buy deleting things, the wrong things the wrong way. Up until about a year ago I had a friend that was a computer professional that solved the really bad jams for me but for more minor problems System Mechanic has served me well. It's also a good utility to learn from. One very good thing about System Mechanic, I think anyway, is the fact that it isn't one of those programs that is so aggressive that it does do more harm than good. I have had that happen a few times with other programs. System Mechanic tends to play on the safe side while still doing a good enough job to most likely solve your problem(s). I run the program, in one form or another, once a day to keep things running smooth. As with any program though, one should spend the time to read about it's features and get a handle on things before diving headlong into it. Also, it is a very smart thing to make a system image before adding any new program to your computer or taking one out just in case something isn't compatible or Mr. Murphy is looking over your should as he does so often here, now you can recover from the problem. Also, as with any program you want to make sure you keep the program(s) updated. System Mechanic has always been a must have program that has worked well for me and keeps me coming back. None of these types of programs will solve a major problem but will give you your money's worth and teach you a few things about computers to boot. If that repair man took it out I'd say put it back in, it won't hurt and will most likely help you one day. Best of luck and I hhope I've helped.

A.D.N.

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I'll give you more content..
Jan 27, 2012 6:17PM PST

I'll pretend like anyone acknowledges this..

Yes they do by minimizing threads, cpu clock cycles, and RAM. The big problem is that companies like IObit contract their developers and rarely do functional patches(bug fixes and feature refinements). They also do as little research on registry and filesystem cleaning as possible hence why you get so many bugs..

I use ccleaner because they do research, and only do high-level registry cleaning(no type or class keys like ASC and TU). They also don't kill services or low-level filesystem operations.

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Acknowledged
Jan 27, 2012 6:28PM PST

and Thank You. Happy

Mark